Felger and Mazz - Creating False Naratives one day at a time
- Thread starter HomeBrew1901
- Start date
I love how Felger is touting his NBA lottery prediction. Like, dude, this is literally like me telling you I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10 and you going around to people saying, "I know it's 6, you watch."
Although it suddenly occurs to me that he is the kind of person to actually believe there is a conspiracy to give it to LA or Boston. You know, cause we've had so much luck in past lotteries.
Although it suddenly occurs to me that he is the kind of person to actually believe there is a conspiracy to give it to LA or Boston. You know, cause we've had so much luck in past lotteries.
NortheasternPJ said:
Shot in the dark guess would be a re-air of Sports Sunday on CSNNE, which ran at the bottom of the hour every hour from 5AM-10AM.
if Boston gets a top 3 lottery pick they will keep it and K Love wants the Lakers or Knicks to me he is just a better verion of David Lee plays no D wants to jack up 3's
here my lottery picks
1 L A Lakers Because of kobe the NBA wants him in the playoffs for his last 2 years
2 Utah Parker is a mormon 75 percent of Utah are mormons
3 Bucks could be 2
4 76ers
I think Boston will be 5 or 6
here my lottery picks
1 L A Lakers Because of kobe the NBA wants him in the playoffs for his last 2 years
2 Utah Parker is a mormon 75 percent of Utah are mormons
3 Bucks could be 2
4 76ers
I think Boston will be 5 or 6
Tried to flip on for the first time in weeks(outside of listening to Cam Neely interview via ipod), and I almost made it a minute.
In that short time I got
- Ainge might be lying all year about this draft being overrated so if he doesn't land in top 3, he can trade into top 3.
Absurd. No one in the top 3 is trading out anyway, but if for some reason they did it wouldn't be because they heard Danny Ainge say the draft is overrated.
- If Ainge keeps his pick instead of trading it, he's proved that he's a liar because he said the draft is overrated.
Even more absurd. I guess saying a draft is overrated means there can't be a single player available that he likes when his pick is on the board.
Aaaaaaaaand click.
Just horrendous radio. Be a while before I check in again.
Bummed what this show has become for me. I went from being thrilled to having a better alternative to WEEI, to now instead of forcing WEEI to raise their game the SportsHub has lowered theirs' and become just as lazy as their competitors. Just sucks.
In that short time I got
- Ainge might be lying all year about this draft being overrated so if he doesn't land in top 3, he can trade into top 3.
Absurd. No one in the top 3 is trading out anyway, but if for some reason they did it wouldn't be because they heard Danny Ainge say the draft is overrated.
- If Ainge keeps his pick instead of trading it, he's proved that he's a liar because he said the draft is overrated.
Even more absurd. I guess saying a draft is overrated means there can't be a single player available that he likes when his pick is on the board.
Aaaaaaaaand click.
Just horrendous radio. Be a while before I check in again.
Bummed what this show has become for me. I went from being thrilled to having a better alternative to WEEI, to now instead of forcing WEEI to raise their game the SportsHub has lowered theirs' and become just as lazy as their competitors. Just sucks.
I was listening when the Drew signing was announced and "baseball expert" Tony Mazz said this signing showed the Sox had lost faith in Bogaerts. It took Wiggy to point out the obvious that the move had more to do with 3b than X.
Felger caught on immediately that Wiggy was right but I'm not sure Mazz ever really got it.
Felger caught on immediately that Wiggy was right but I'm not sure Mazz ever really got it.
So the only way to prove he's not a liar is to trade down, and then he becomes Bill Belichick?mcpickl said:
This is brutal listening right now. Felger and Maxwell keep arguing opposite sides of the potential Love trade and NBA player movement and they both sound idiotic.
Sparky Lyle said:
Manny was notorious for being among the first to the park and constantly working while he was there...work outs, hitting in the cage, hitting off the tee, watching video of himself hitting. The guy might have been a flake defensively and a flake off the field, but when it came to his hitting, he was obsessive. Often referred to as a hitting savant...and an idiot savant.
Sparky Lyle said:
Manny was well known to be one of the first guys at the park, watching a ton of tape, cages. Etc Etc.
Damn, was beat to it.
What does it matter what kind of individual he is? Do you know him personally? You know rumor and you know second-hand information. None of this is material to what Manny Ramirez meant to your life from 2001-2008.
John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
I know this wasn't directed at me but I'd rather have guys on the team that don't push down elderly people and force their way out of town to shoot for a better contract. I think most people would.
Billy lanny's take on the Manny / Jack McCormick incident is fantastic.
"What would you do if it was your father?" "My father would have gotten his tickets for him cause its his job."
"What would you do if it was your father?" "My father would have gotten his tickets for him cause its his job."
Aaron Hernadez is a terrible individual. Manny is a spoiled brat. Totally different.
And I'll take someone who pushes an old guy on my team if they can hit like Manny could.
And I'll take someone who pushes an old guy on my team if they can hit like Manny could.
Manny apologized, McCormack accepted his apology. What more do you want? People make errors in judgement all the time.
Ted Williams was a bit of an asshole. Larry Bird got into a bar fight the night before a playoff game and has a daughter from a previous marriage that he doesn't acknowledge (or didn't -- I have no idea what the relationship is these days). Jordan, Babe Ruth, Magic all have/had flaws which wouldn't get them invited to the Vatican for canonization.
It doesn't matter though because these people are athletes, nothing more. Why is it that a man who can crush a 95 MPH fastball also has to be St. Francis of Assisi? Why do we expect this out of athletes but not from politicians, actors or other walks of life?
And further more, we only know a small fraction of what these people are like in "real life". I bet that if you look hard enough, the guy who you think is a solid citizen was a jerk to someone. When Manny smoked that KRod pitch in the playoffs a few years back, I didn't care about Manny the man, I cared about Manny the Ref Sock.
Ted Williams was a bit of an asshole. Larry Bird got into a bar fight the night before a playoff game and has a daughter from a previous marriage that he doesn't acknowledge (or didn't -- I have no idea what the relationship is these days). Jordan, Babe Ruth, Magic all have/had flaws which wouldn't get them invited to the Vatican for canonization.
It doesn't matter though because these people are athletes, nothing more. Why is it that a man who can crush a 95 MPH fastball also has to be St. Francis of Assisi? Why do we expect this out of athletes but not from politicians, actors or other walks of life?
And further more, we only know a small fraction of what these people are like in "real life". I bet that if you look hard enough, the guy who you think is a solid citizen was a jerk to someone. When Manny smoked that KRod pitch in the playoffs a few years back, I didn't care about Manny the man, I cared about Manny the Ref Sock.
John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
"It doesn't matter" is an opinion and I don't know why it's so hard to understand that some people don't agree with that statement. Also, if it doesn't matter why do you feel it's necessary to point out that he apologized? It doesn't matter, remember? Is there a line? Does it bother you that a pitcher on the Rays raped a woman?
I'm not even saying I don't like Manny. I'd just like him more if he wasn't such an asshole.
John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
I know that Manny quit on his team in 2008. He felt that he could get one more large contract, except that the Red Sox held two one-year options for 2009/10 and he was determined to get out of those options. In the end, he got his way, with a trade to LA predicated on the fact that they wouldn't pick up the options. He went on to produce more in the last two months of 2008 than he had in the first four months with the Sox. The Sox went on to lose 4-3 in the ALCS vs the Rays.
F'k Manny Ramirez. I couldn't watch the ceremonies because of that asshole. I'm glad he's found Jesus, but I bet Jesus isn't too happy about it.
You let your hatred of Manny prevent you from watching the ceremony. So in essence Manny won!
John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
I can see hating Manny after it came out that he slapped his wife, but the reality is the people who get up in arms about about him hated him way before that and care WAY more about steroids, Jack Mccormick, "quitting", etc, than they do alleged domestic violence, which is quite sad. But if you were a legit Manny fan and gave him the benefit of the doubt on everything or just didn't care, and then you heard about the domestic incident and decided you were no longer a fan, I can't fault anyone for that. I'm torn on it myself. And even if he believes every word of what he's saying about religion right now, that means he''s incapable of ever hitting his wife again? Sorry, doesn't work that way. Religious people can be pieces of shit just as easily as the rest of us.
Two things here:
1. The Tampa Bay Rays aren't my team. So, no I'm not invested in what their relief pitcher does. But if you want to play this game, no, if Manny Ramirez forcefully put his penis in another woman's vagina without her consent, I wouldn't be down with that. Happy?
2. Seriously. You're equating what Manny did with raping a woman? Really?
I understand that people don't agree with my statement, I just happen to think it's dumb. Whether Manny apologized or not is immaterial to me because I am under no pretense that because you can regularly hit a ball 400 feet that means you need to be a good person. Manny might be a dick, I don't know because I don't hang out with him (and neither do you) nor do I care because most athletes seem to be dicks IRL. If I didn't root for ballplayers because they do, say, think things different from me, I wouldn't be a sports fan. Because I'm an adult, I've learned to compartmentalize.
Right. Because Manny Ramirez is the first athlete to shoot his way out of town. No one, certainly not St. Wayne Gretzky, ever has done that before in the history of professional athletics. And the guy that they received in return for Manny, Jay Ray Bay, had a pretty decent two months 293/370/527 with nine home runs. The Red Sox ran into a very good Tampa Bay team, there was no shame in losing to them.
That's a stupid, silly reason for not watching a really cool event. I'm glad that you showed Manny. BTW, when you were sitting next to your protest buddies Cafardo, Shaughnessy and Callahan, which one farts the most. I bet it's Cafardo (Ca-FART-o!) but I bet Callahan rips some good ones. I'm right, aren't I?
And Jesus Montero plays in Seattle, though I believe he's on the DL. Did him and Manny have a fight?
I won't click on Mazz's piece because I think it's an embarrassment. He watched that ceremony and chose to write a piece slamming Manny. That's just pathetic and it looks even worse when you compare it to the pieces written by Finn and Edes. He and some of his buddies in the press dislike Manny Ramirez. I think we all grasped that concept years ago.
John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
I never realized Gretzky "shot his way out of town." I guess I forgot the part where he faked a knee injury during a pennant race, and then when he went for an MRI, forgot what knee was "injured." And I erased from my mind the time Gretzky had an open shot on goal and purposely fanned on the puck.
In fact Gretzky was traded in the off-season, where a cash-strapped owner got $15 million cash and 4 or 5 1st round picks. Gretzky never quit on his team, he wanted to go to LA, and was not about to agree to an extension of his contract, and the Edmonton owner needed cash. A deal was made and both player and owner gave each other an out for PR purposes.
Now find me a significant player who quit like Manny Ramirez. His conduct runs counter to a tenent of my belief system. When a rich man fails to honor his contract and then intentionally tries to sabotage the agreement, he's an a-hole. End of story. Jesus has torgive him, but I don't.
But I understand the reverence fanboys and pink-hats have for their Manny, which is why I didn't bring up the point in the Sox 10th Anniversary thread on the main board, and why I didn't bring it up until after the event. I know the deal with most fans. Manny will always be celebrated in Boston, by many, because he was a great hitter. If he'd been a mediocre hitter he'd be remembered as a bad man. When Lackey was dealing with a bum elbow, many fans saw him as an asshole and a clubhouse cancer. Since Lackey rehabbed from his elbow surgery and he's pitching well, fans notice the change in Lackey as a person and how he's now a mentor to young players, no longer a clubhouse pariah. Beckett used to "Josh Effin' Beckett" when he was one of the best in the league, but once his performance fell off a cliff, his coarse, taciturn manner turned his perception into being an a-hole and a terrible influence in the clubhouse. I have news for you; neither Lackey or Beckett changed off the field, it's just that the fans' perception changed because of their performance on the field.
WenZink said:
Fuck this with a hammer. I categorically reject the idea that only part-time or fairweather fans can have reverence for Manny.
"Real" fans can have reverence for Manny because we've never seen a RH hitter like him. "Real" fans can appreciate his maddening ways in concert with his sublime hitting and understand that the full picture of Manny will always be a complicated one. You don't, by the mere dint of your personal distaste for Manny, get to claim the moral high ground for yourself. No fucking way.
Get over yourself.
Good. Now that you've got that nailed down,
I dont know why you're renting space to people to live in your belief system, but it's a free country.
Is your belief system limited to rich men who do this?
Sometimes we cheer for a-holes. Probably a whole lot more often than we realize. Sometimes, they act like a-holes on the field. Most of the time they don't. But cheering for their past accomplishments on the field is just that. I didn't cheer Jason Varitek because I was thinking, "hey, Casanova, when you dump *this* wife, my sister is single."
People make mistakes. People mature.
I never really thought that Manny Ramirez was crushing baseballs because of *me.*
.351/.467/.622, 2 HR, 8 RBI, 8 R
That's Manny's line in his last 10 games in a Boston uniform. That's not the line put up by a guy who quit and "sabotaged" the team. If they hold on to him at the deadline and he finishes 2008 in Boston, "knee-gate" is just another comedic Manny-being-Manny blip along side "Manny is back and he's back BIG" and dinner with Enrique Wilson.
That's Manny's line in his last 10 games in a Boston uniform. That's not the line put up by a guy who quit and "sabotaged" the team. If they hold on to him at the deadline and he finishes 2008 in Boston, "knee-gate" is just another comedic Manny-being-Manny blip along side "Manny is back and he's back BIG" and dinner with Enrique Wilson.
WenZink said:
Seriously?
Manny was a great fucking baseball player and I tremendously enjoyed watching him hit a baseball as a member of the Boston Red Sox. It doesn't have to be more complicated than that.
The fact that people like yourself who take themselves so seriously that a spat between a baseball player and the team he plays for could somehow be incorporated into your entire belief system only makes me love him more.
Red(s)HawksFan said:
And you know, as a guy who loved seeing Manny play, I understand full well that some of his actions may have been just about enough after 7 1/2 years. I get it, it's entirely reasonable that everyone involved with the Red Sox was tired of him. IIRC his last series with the team was at home against the Angels and the team just sleep-walked through it, with Lackey taking a no-hitter into the 9th. I mean, I get it, they decided on a divorce.
But 10 years later, don't fucking tell me that I'm just an ignorant pink hat if I enjoyed seeing the guy at Fenway again this week, that I remembered his many positive contributions to the club fondly, that as we all get older it becomes easier to get past some of the less happy moments of his tenure here. I believe that's called "maturity."
Red(s)HawksFan said:
That was also SIX years ago. I'd like to think I've changed in the last 6 years.
But it doesn't work that way. In today's climate of "I'm more morally outraged than you are. No I am. No I am" Manny Ramirez and Aaron Hernadez are the same guy.
It's telling that the predictable pricks in the media have all lined up to tell us what horrid people we are for enjoying Manny's return the other night. Mazz, as noted in this thread. CHB had a lovely foot-stamping article about it in today's Globe; his sulkiness is so pure it's hilarious. D&C, naturally. I mean...the very worst, most miserable public assholes in the media are all grumping around about this....you really sure you wanna throw your hat in the ring with the likes of them?
Our own Buffalo Head said this on FB and I agree wholeheartedly: it's OK if some of us embrace what happened on Wed. night without irony or cynicism.
Our own Buffalo Head said this on FB and I agree wholeheartedly: it's OK if some of us embrace what happened on Wed. night without irony or cynicism.
Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
Ironically -- as it relates to Manny -- Mazz, CHB, D&C are also examples of people who *never* change, learn or grow, regardless of external circumstances or their own experiences. And if the D&C thread was accurate, they ascribe that particular strain of abject immaturity (never changing, learning or growing) to all members of the human race.
joe dokes said:
Exactly.
Tangentially, Bruce Allen over at BSMW has an excellent front page column today on this topic. He's focusing on a Minihane article, but that article essentially parrot's CHB's and Mazz' articles, and Bruce rebuts some of the assertions these guys have made about the ceremony Wed night. Well worth a read.
Gretzky told Pocklington that he wanted to be traded. He only wanted to be traded to a team on the West Coast where his wife could pursue her acting career. Wayne Gretzky essentially told the Oilers that he is going to be a King next year and you better get the best deal you can or things are going to suck for you next year. So Glen Sather had to deal with one team and hoped that he got the best deal, without using other teams as leverage against Los Angeles to drive up the price of Gretzky.
And I have zero problem with Gretzky doing this, BTW. If you and your wife don't want to spend the rest of your lives in Edmonton, Alberta, you should be able to go somewhere else. Same with Manny, things were done in Boston six years ago. And as other posters have pointed out, he didn't "quit" on the team. He actually played pretty damn well.
What did he do to you, personally, that requires YOUR forgiveness? You sound like a spurned lover.
BTW, your "End of Story" needs an addendum.
Stop it. You sound insane, but you do have part of the point. Manny was a great hitter and his on-field exploits should be celebrated. You are aware that he didn't murder or rape anyone, right?
No. He wouldn't be remembered at all.
No. They were reviled because they stunk. I don't care what they do in their off-season or away from the field. I really don't.
John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
Why should I stop it? Is your head about to explode because I don't worship at the altar of Manny Ramirez? To criticize him is some sort of blasphemy in your eyes?
As I said earlier, I get it. I understand the "requirements" of being a "true fan." I just don't agree with them.
Exactly. One could even make the point that it was the Red Sox who quit on Manny.Red(s)HawksFan said:
I also love the talk about how he was an awful teammate. Mazz brought this up yesterday too. Yeah. They sure looked like they hated him all those years. Beetle asked him which teammate he had issues with.
He said he had a dustup with Youks. 'Cause he wasn't a miserable surly guy at all.
He said something about Schilling. The only thing I remember about Schilling is them sitting on the bench next to each other and Manny laughing about Curt looking over his notes.
I think that was all he could stammer out.
We get it. He didn't give you quotes. So you still hold a grudge 7 years later. Awesome. You're a tribute to your profession.
WenZink said:
Sure you do. Because if there's anything at all that this forum symbolizes, it's the "'requirements' of being a 'true fan.'" (and official citizenship in RedSoxNation.)
I think everyone here gets why people might feel discomfort/distaste/disagreement with Manny's role in the ceremony the other night, even if, for most here, those feelings were overshadowed by appreciation for his on-field accomplishments. But when you ascribe your opinions to a) your own moral superiority and b) everyone else's "true fandom," "pink hattedness," and "worshipping at the altar" -- all terms which I assume you know are insults -- you sound like a jerk.
The problem isn't that Masserotti or Shaughnessy or anyone else doesn't think Manny deserving; I disagree with that, but I get it. The problem is that they can't (and you can't, it seems), express that view without insulting the people who don't see it the same way.