I just don't know how enticing future picks are when the team will be landing AD and he may re-sign. He's not KG or Paul Pierce. He's very much in his prime.
I have to imagine Masai is thinking this way. He's already all-in with Kawhi. Is there a deal around Siakam that would even get them in the conversation?Let's say you're a team that is good, but not likely to win the title this season (like Philly, Houston, Portland, etc.). The fact that AD is under contract until next summer means you could give up good assets now and still get two stabs at winning a title before he bails. That has to be an attractive gambit for teams that are desperate to get in that mix without any other obvious routes to do so. They should and could give up packages that blow away the Lakers pu-pu platter. Even if New Orleans wants to pull the plug now and not this summer (which is a bad idea IMO) I still don't think LA is the front-runner.
Only if they think they can re-sign him. The Hawks, for example, would not even bother trying.Some team is going to land the #1 pick on lottery night. That team will become a player for Davis instantaneously.
True, same with Orlando. But a team like the Knicks or even the Suns would.Only if they think they can re-sign him. The Hawks, for example, would not even bother trying.
I'd be pretty happy to get a bunch of Houston picks 4+ years out. A lot of bad things can happen for them in that time, and you'd be taking away their ability to use those picks to avoid having the bad things happen.Yeah, on reflection, Houston/Capela+picks doesn’t really make sense, since:
(1) The picks will suck;
(2) Demps probably won’t want to help out their de facto regional rival;
(3) Morey is annoying;
(4) Capela, productive and efficient as he is, isn’t the type of star you can really sell tickets with (you ideally want a guy who can dribble, shoot, and/or pass);
(5) They can probably do better, and the same deal (basically, anything Demps wants except Harden) will almost certainly be on the table this summer.
I’m fairly sure Morey has been bugging him, though.
Maybe, but very few GMs have that sort of job security. That's a deal that gets most GMs fired and some other GM reaps the benefits of all the extra picks.I'd be pretty happy to get a bunch of Houston picks 4+ years out. A lot of bad things can happen for them in that time, and you'd be taking away their ability to use those picks to avoid having the bad things happen.
Yes, I mentioned earlier in the thread that Demps isn't doing this deal.Maybe, but very few GMs have that sort of job security. That's a deal that gets most GMs fired and some other GM reaps the benefits of all the extra picks.
I give LA a 0% chance of acquiring Davis in the next 10 days and a decided underdog to be the Pelicans trading partner this summer for some of the reasons that you list......primarily the Lakers being in the WC and Demps/NO salty about LeBron's public comments last month.All the reasons why NOLA won't deal AD to LA in the next 10 days:
1. Magic likes to tamper and gloat about it, that rubs small market teams the wrong way
2. LeBron was accused of recruiting AD earlier this season, that rubs small market teams the wrong way
3. Big market teams like the Lakers and their fans act entitled, that rubs small market teams the wrong way
4. I live in LA and I'm getting sick and tired about how freaking nice its here. Yes, it's 70 and sunny BUT these players are on the road during the season and can live anywhere they want during the offseason (Garnett- Malibu). The taxes are huge and making your home here less than 6 months a year can save a player huge $$$.
5. Ball can't shoot, Ingram can barely shoot and Hart/Kuzma are old
6. Laker picks will be in the back of the first round
7. Lakers reside in the Western Conference, where NOLA resides
8. The Celtics have better assets and reside in the Eastern Conf
9. Paul George and Kawhi all said "LA only" and NBA teams called their bluff
10. NOLA gets to see the draft picks/order this Summer
11. Lakers desperately want AD now to compete for Western Conf supremacy this season. Did I mention they have rubbed NOLA the wrong way?
I doubt Demps even answers the phone about AD for the next month. NOLA will just sit back and let the bidding begin this summer.
TomAto, tomato. My point was that NBA players aren't looking to save a few dollars in taxes by not wanting to own property in California when even out-of-town players buy houses there.Kawhi bought a home in San Diego, not LA.
You generally pay state income taxes based on where your money is earned. A Lakers player pays much more in income taxes than say a Spurs or Heat player because at least half of the Lakers player’s salary is subject to CA income tax. Where you have a home is largely irrelevant to a pro athlete’s situation, and CA property taxes are in the bottom half of the country.TomAto, tomato. My point was that NBA players aren't looking to save a few dollars in taxes by not wanting to own property in California when even out-of-town players buy houses there.
Yikes, Kawhi bought that home last week. What are the odds he re-signs with Toronto now?TomAto, tomato. My point was that NBA players aren't looking to save a few dollars in taxes by not wanting to own property in California when even out-of-town players buy houses there.
You realize he was born, went to college in, and has lived the great majority of his life in Southern California, right?Yikes, Kawhi bought that home last week. What are the odds he re-signs with Toronto now?
Rancho Santa Fe is 2hrs drive to Staples, maybe Kawhi just uses the home in the off-season and makes it his future retirement spot?
Still, that would make me nervous if I'm the Raptors
yea, I think everyone on this board realizes that...but how many times has the notoriously frugal Kawhi* plunked down $13,000,000 for a house in SoCal, in a contract year, when he's been pretty explicit about his desire to play in LA?You realize he was born, went to college in, and has lived the great majority of his life in Southern California, right?
For a max player that is ~100K.You generally pay state income taxes based on where your money is earned. A Lakers player pays much more in income taxes
I understand it; and the way the NBA is set up, such behavior is incentivized. But if I had season tickets, and they don't trade him and then just sit him, I'd be pissed. Instead of complaining about NFL officials' calls, maybe Louisiana legislators should voice their concerns over how a fucktillionaire owner is pissing away taxpayer money (which I assume was given away to the team at some point, because it always is).If AD does not get traded, he will likely be shut down...
Marc SteinVerified account @TheSteinLine
If no trade materializes between now and the Feb. 7 buzzer, with the playoffs essentially out of reach, New Orleans has much more incentive to keep Anthony Davis shelved in the name of protecting its prized trade asset rather than playing him. As does Davis himself
Yup. Real raw deal for the fans but nothing will happen. Not like anyone cares but fantasy owners will be whining too.I understand it; and the way the NBA is set up, such behavior is incentivized. But if I had season tickets, and they don't trade him and then just sit him, I'd be pissed. Instead of complaining about NFL officials' calls, maybe Louisiana legislators should voice their concerns over how a fucktillionaire owner is pissing away taxpayer money (which I assume was given away to the team at some point, because it always is).
? California has a top marginal rate of 13.3%, which kicks in around $1M. An athlete making $30M/year for a CA team would have a roughly $4M tax bill.For a max player that is ~100K.
Not nothing, but not the consideration people are thinking it is.
As stated earlier on this page, NBA players and all athletes (as well as people earning money in different states than they live) pay taxes where they earn their money. So the taxes would be on 15 MM not 30 MM and thus the bill would be 2 MM. Of course, if I'm a player I consider how this balances out with increased endorsement opportunity. I expect the math for most would be CA endorsement boost >>>> any place other than NY (which also has an income tax alas not as hefty)? California has a top marginal rate of 13.3%, which kicks in around $1M. An athlete making $30M/year for a CA team would have a roughly $4M tax bill.
It's clearly not a deciding factor for lots of guys, but it's very substantial.
The problem with doing this is 1) no Kyrie makes AD less likely to stay, and 2) a Rozier, Smart, Tatum, Horford, AD lineup is not beating GSW this yearIf Demps wants talent more than picks, Raptors can make an offer that far surpasses any Lakers offer: Valenciunas, Siakam, Anunoby, VanVleet. Toronto would have its big three, plus Ibaka. And if Toronto gets Davis, maybe Kawhi decides to stay, at least for another year on a 1+1 deal.
That's a nightmare scenario for the Celtics, which is why Ainge has to be considering moving Kyrie and trading for Davis now.
Where can Ainge move Kyrie? Who will give up anything of value for him, knowing he is a serious flight risk in ~ four months.If Demps wants talent more than picks, Raptors can make an offer that far surpasses any Lakers offer: Valenciunas, Siakam, Anunoby, VanVleet. Toronto would have its big three, plus Ibaka. And if Toronto gets Davis, maybe Kawhi decides to stay, at least for another year on a 1+1 deal.
That's a nightmare scenario for the Celtics, which is why Ainge has to be considering moving Kyrie and trading for Davis now.
Am I the only one who would be kind of happy if the Raptors got Davis and he stuck around? Just because it means the Lakers don't get him?If Demps wants talent more than picks, Raptors can make an offer that far surpasses any Lakers offer: Valenciunas, Siakam, Anunoby, VanVleet. Toronto would have its big three, plus Ibaka. And if Toronto gets Davis, maybe Kawhi decides to stay, at least for another year on a 1+1 deal.
That's a nightmare scenario for the Celtics, which is why Ainge has to be considering moving Kyrie and trading for Davis now.
I know why they would be doing it, but it's a joke and I hate it. Sitting a healthy player for months on end is a stain on the NBA.If AD does not get traded, he will likely be shut down...
Marc SteinVerified account @TheSteinLine
If no trade materializes between now and the Feb. 7 buzzer, with the playoffs essentially out of reach, New Orleans has much more incentive to keep Anthony Davis shelved in the name of protecting its prized trade asset rather than playing him. As does Davis himself
Why would Memphis or Charlotte want Kyrie? And if they do, what would they trade for him? Neither makes any sense as a potential Irving destination imho.If AD comes next week, Tatum will likely be gone along with Kyrie. The Pelicans would have no interest in a Kyrie rental, but Memphis might or Charlotte might, in exchange for Conley or Walker.
It's not a move I would make (I'm not trading Tatum, period), but Ainge may make it, especially if it's the only way to keep AD out of Toronto.
It's a little less than two months, post All-Star break (assuming that's about when he'd normally return from his finger injury), but agreed.I know why they would be doing it, but it's a joke and I hate it. Sitting a healthy player for months on end is a stain on the NBA.
See, I think that would be hilarious to watch and was hoping to see the awkwardness. This would rob us of that.It's a little less than two months, post All-Star break (assuming that's about when he'd normally return from his finger injury), but agreed.
On the other hand, it would also be kinda weird if he played those two months as a lame duck, with his teamates looking on him as a turncoat, and him disincentivized to play defense, or set good screens, or dive after balls, or do anything else that might increase his risk of injury (like, you know, make the playoffs).
Siakam is a really good player, and that offer beats most proposed Lakers' offers.If Demps wants talent more than picks, Raptors can make an offer that far surpasses any Lakers offer: Valenciunas, Siakam, Anunoby, VanVleet. Toronto would have its big three, plus Ibaka. And if Toronto gets Davis, maybe Kawhi decides to stay, at least for another year on a 1+1 deal.
That's a nightmare scenario for the Celtics, which is why Ainge has to be considering moving Kyrie and trading for Davis now.
On Boston:"As the NBA trade deadline looms within a week, the Lakers' immediate pursuit of All-Star forward Anthony Davis is fraught with innumerable obstacles -- including the fact that Pelicans general manager Dell Demps has yet to return a call to Lakers GM Rob Pelinka, league sources told ESPN.
The sluggish response time is perhaps a message that New Orleans places some responsibility onto the Lakers for Davis' trade request, or perhaps an indication to Davis and his agent Rich Paul of Klutch Sports that the franchise doesn't plan to easily acquiesce on a trade request to partner with LeBron James.
"As of now, the Pelicans see no reason to deliver Davis to the Lakers in a deal with a full season left on his contract -- never mind do it on a timeline that benefits mostly the objectives of Los Angeles and Davis."
"New Orleans officials are prepared to play the long game on Davis' future, embarking on an uncomfortable, if not combative process that could extend months beyond next Thursday's trade deadline."
"Demps is picking up his phone and returning calls -- just not from the Lakers, sources said. From Paul George to Leonard to Davis, the Lakers front office is growing accustomed to icy receptions from teams enduring All-Star trade demands with a full year left on their contracts.
With trade rumors swirling, the Lakers' Brandon Ingram scored a career-high 36 points in Tuesday's loss to the 76ers.
New Orleans owner Gayle Benson is enthusiastically carrying the small market banner, pushing back on any planned superstar union of James and Davis in the NBA's glamour market.
If Davis wants to be a Laker, the Pelicans' mantra so far is simply: Feel free to join L.A. as a free agent in 2020 -- and potentially punt on the 2019-20 season, with LeBron at age 35, to keep the requisite cap space open."
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25892346/new-orleans-pelicans-gm-dell-demps-returned-call-los-angeles-lakers-gm-anthony-davis"Teams interested in trading for Davis -- including the Boston Celtics -- are in full fact-finding mode and the intel coming back is this, sources tell ESPN: Davis' plan is to treat any trade destination as a one-year stop -- except, of course, the Lakers. Teams are learning that Davis' stated intention will be to play the season elsewhere if traded outside of the Lakers, but move to the Lakers as a free agent in 2020.
With Boston prohibited from trading for Davis this season, going to the Lakers presents Davis a chance to make something of this 2018-19 season. The Celtics and other suitors are curious as to whether the potential Lakers-or-bust stance softens once the deadline passes, sources said."
The stance of Davis and his camp toward Boston is linked to their view of Kyrie Irving's future, sources said. Davis and his camp no longer believe that Irving is a sure bet to re-sign with the Celtics this summer, and that's the primary reason they insist on clumping Boston with a similar message to the 28 other teams: Buyer beware on a trade for Davis."
"Boston is remaining outwardly fearless in its pursuit of Davis, with word delivered to New Orleans: Hold onto Davis past the trade deadline, get into the offseason and we're armed to give you the best possible return on this generational talent.
Boston remains confident in Irving re-signing, even if they don't acquire Davis before free agency. But whatever happens between now and then, whatever issues might threaten to topple Irving's preseason commitment to an extension, the Celtics believe the acquisition of Davis will soothe them all. Boston believes this: Getting Davis probably clinches an Irving commitment.
For now, the Celtics are unconvinced that Davis would be willing to walk out on a championship core with Boston for the Lakers. Boston's done a tremendous amount of research on Davis, especially intense in the past 18 months, league sources said.
The Pelicans are aware the Celtics are preparing a massive offer for Davis if he remains on their roster past the trade deadline. The Celtics cannot acquire him now unless they trade Irving due to an obscure rule that prohibits any team from trading for a second player working under a designated rookie maximum extension. Irving and Davis are both playing under such deals now. Irving can -- and almost certainly will -- opt out of his contract on July 1.
The most pressing question for Boston is whether they could acquire Davis without including Jayson Tatum in the deal. If the Celtics get the chance, Boston will be able to offer any or all of: Jaylen Brown, Gordon Hayward, Marcus Smart, Terry Rozier (though Rozier would have to agree to a sign-and-trade, raising thorny cap complications), their own first-round picks, Sacramento's first-round pick, a Memphis future first-round pick (top-eight protected this season, top-six protected in 2020, and unprotected in 2021) and a lottery-protected LA Clippers first-rounder that converts to a 2022 second-round pick if the Clippers miss the playoffs both this season and next.
Above all else, Boston wants to keep Tatum. Going forward with a Big Three of Irving-Davis-Tatum -- and filling in the gaps around them as needed -- is probably their ideal scenario. If Boston feels it is necessary to hold off any Lakers coup, they can tell the Pelicans they will likely include Tatum in Davis trade talks in July.
That's risky, though. If Boston promises that in absolute terms, the Pelicans would expect the Celtics to hold to that assurance. Welching would damage Boston's league-wide credibility in a way that could take years to repair."
"As long as ominous backchannel warnings don't give Ainge pause, the Celtics believe they could convince Davis to stay long-term, clinching Irving's future in New England.
Still, there are scenarios that concern Boston. For instance, the Celtics could disappoint in the postseason. The Knicks could win the draft lottery, and enter the offseason with the one trade asset that tops Tatum: the NBA draft's No. 1 pick, and the chance to select Duke's Zion Williamson.
If that isn't enough, the Knicks could add Kevin Knox to their offer and hope that acquiring Davis would entice a second star free agent to join him. Irving would be on their short list of such players, and the Knicks armed with Davis and enough cap room for Irving, stand as one the only Irving threats that would unnerve Boston."
Based on that, all AD needs is some assurance from Irving and then the Celtics seem like a more long-term player.The stance of Davis and his camp toward Boston is linked to their view of Kyrie Irving's future, sources said. Davis and his camp no longer believe that Irving is a sure bet to re-sign with the Celtics this summer, and that's the primary reason they insist on clumping Boston with a similar message to the 28 other teams: Buyer beware on a trade for Davis."
LOL, I always mute the announcers. I wish there was a way to turn them off while still hearing the crowd noise. I have nothing against Gorman, but the rest of them are just annoying. I enjoy Scal on his Sirius XM show with Frank Isola, but I find his commentary at Celtics games to be nothing special.Kemba Walker is reputed to love it in Charlotte and wants to stay there. Scal must've talked about this for 5 minutes on last night's broadcast.
You can absolutely smell the desperation of Davis' "camp". Nice try with the Kyrie stuff.
And she's also in a pissed off mood right now because of the Saints. The timing of this couldn't be worse for LA. LeBron and Paul took a shot but they're not going to get anywhere with their blatant attempt at tampering. AD isn't getting traded before the deadline. My only real concern now is the draft lottery making a team like New York more viable to New Orleans.Of course AD's camp is claiming Kyrie isn't a sure bet to re-up with Boston. AD's camp is the de facto GM of the Lakers, in new agent Rich Paul and Klutch(Lebron) Sports. Hopefully, New Orleans' owner will be so pissed at the tampering that they never entertain an offer from the Lakers. If Davis has to play out his contract and go to free agency, it can cost him up to $82 million in guaranteed salary. If Klutch makes it that the Lakers are the only market for AD, and Mrs Benson gets stubborn, Davis could be mothballed for a season and a half, or more likely a one year rental. Gayle Benson has a reported net worth of $2.7 billion. and the Pels are the red headed stepchild of her assets. She's known as tough and stubborn.
There should be at least half the owners in Adam Silver's ear over this situation. For the good of the game, he should prohibit Davis from ever going to the Lakers after this clear case of tampering. I don't think the CBA allows him to prohibit Davis from signing there as a FA, but there is precedent for him to block a trade.