The Incredible Hülk Returns, 2023 F1 Season

Dahabenzapple2

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Watched Drive to Survive earlier this year and now F1 my favorite thing.

Never ever watched my whole life and now love it / especially the qualifying
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Watched Drive to Survive earlier this year and now F1 my favorite thing.

Never ever watched my whole life and now love it / especially the qualifying
Yeah, DTS --> F1 viewership and Queen's Gambit --> chess interest, have both been pretty interesting.

I think what DTS really helped capture for those of us (I'm like you) who were unfamiliar with the sport is the importance of the battles off the podium, and the intense competition all up and down the grid.

This year especially, it's kind of hard to hang in there and watch Max go two tenths under as the last car to cross the line in Q3 every week if that's all you care about. Understanding the battles that go on between the lower teams and, this year, watching the competition for second best team has been pretty compelling.
 

Dahabenzapple2

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Yeah, DTS --> F1 viewership and Queen's Gambit --> chess interest, have both been pretty interesting.

I think what DTS really helped capture for those of us (I'm like you) who were unfamiliar with the sport is the importance of the battles off the podium, and the intense competition all up and down the grid.

This year especially, it's kind of hard to hang in there and watch Max go two tenths under as the last car to cross the line in Q3 every week if that's all you care about. Understanding the battles that go on between the lower teams and, this year, watching the competition for second best team has been pretty compelling.
Also loved the features on the leaders of the teams. Toto, Horner, etc. Just like I’m fascinated with coaching. Like this past week with McLaren. So cool to see the upgrades which gives us hope there could be some battles with Max by the end of the season. I like Lando Norris. Great attitude. Love Albon & Oco as well.

As long as it isn’t from Lewis Hamilton. I’m a much bigger fan of George Russell.
 

Nick Kaufman

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De Vries is also 28. Even if you give him a couple of years to improve, he's going to turn 30 and then start declining. Having said that Red Bull also have a very short leash too. Temperamentally, i am in favor of giving people time instead of giving them a short time & the corresponding pressure to succeed of else.
 

Nick Kaufman

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He's historically good. Top 5 driver all time.

Do note that most recent drivers are on the whole far better drivers than the ones in the 60s and 70s because they 've started driving at an earlier age and had had far more opportunity to practice due to more races and aids like simulators.
 

tmracht

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For the long time followers

How is Alonso so great when he turns 42 on 7/29?

He’s SO much better than Lance Stroll
He is so freaking cerebral as well. It's not just the driving skills (which are still top notch) but listen to him on the onboard radio if you have F1TV. He'll recommend settings changes for his car and Lance's. He'll make predictions about things laps before they occur. You could make the case from the cockpit he's a better race engineer than anyone in the Ferrari garage.

Another thing if you're new is that so much of F1 is things that may seem inconsequential but are critical. Conserving tires isn't something that pops out at you in the telemetry or anything but the fact Alonso can defend, attack or just be a jerk when needed (watch him battle Lewis it's mesmerizing View: https://youtu.be/xLPeamWfJY4
).

And I'm not even really an Alonso fan but he's so good.
 

SocrManiac

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That's an awfully low bar to clear. EVERY driver on the current grid is so much better than Lance Stroll. He has a seat because his father owns the team.

But yes, Alonso is also a historic, generational talent.
Isn't this where somebody argues about how good Stroll is in wet weather because he qualified P2 that time?
 

Dahabenzapple2

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That's an awfully low bar to clear. EVERY driver on the current grid is so much better than Lance Stroll. He has a seat because his father owns the team.

But yes, Alonso is also a historic, generational talent.
Logan Sargent also seems like he is not ready
 

Nick Kaufman

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It feels like every single weekend Mercedes are shit during free practice with Hamilton complaining that the car doesn't feel good only to have a good showing on race day. This time they grabbed pole, though to be fair, this track must be suiting them since Russel also had a surprise pole there last year.

Ferrari are shit once again while McLaren seem to be the real deal.
 

kfoss99

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McLaren looks to be making the constructor's podium look interesting for the end of the year.
 

mattquinley

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Hell of a start by Max from the dirty side of the grid, and by both McLarens.

What the hell were Ferrari thinking, bottling up Sainz on softs behind Leclerc on medium tires? Or did Leclerc ignore team orders?

Nice job by Ricciardo to recover from getting knocked off track on lap 1 to finish where he started.
 

mikeot

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LOL Norris accidently destroyed Verstappen's trophy (actually a ceramic vase) during the champagne celebration.
 

Nick Kaufman

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At this point, being a Ferrari fan is make me understand how it feels being a Lions or a Jets fan or what have you. Relentless emphasis on finding new ways to screw it up.
 

kfoss99

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Wtf, Perez? He might have just lost his place with Red Bull today.
I like to root for Perez. He's terrible in inclement weather. I don't think this means he's out, but a showing like this in the Gran Prix will hurt him a lot.

McLaren looks for real. Red Bull needs him on podiums and defending for Max.
 

mattquinley

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Wtf, Perez? He might have just lost his place with Red Bull today.
I like to root for Perez. He's terrible in inclement weather. I don't think this means he's out, but a showing like this in the Gran Prix will hurt him a lot.

McLaren looks for real. Red Bull needs him on podiums and defending for Max.
Did I watch a different race? Lewis and Perez had a side by side battle going, Lewis hit Perez and holed his sidepod. When Red Bull realized the extent of the damage they retired the car. I don’t see how that was in any way Sergio’s fault.
 

Nick Kaufman

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I wrote as I was watching and it wasn’t clear that Perez had any damage as he was getting passed by a number of people.

However, my guess still is that the fact Hamilton was close to that rocket of a car won’t sit well with Helmut Marco. Perhaps if Perez does well in todays race…
 

Silverdude2167

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How about for every race in a row you win, you move back one place on the starting grid?

I want to see how far back Max can start and still win. 18th? 19th?
 

mikeot

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Max and Red Bull clearly in a league of their own, once again. The competion now is between Aston, McLaren and la Scuderia for the also-rans.
 

Nick Kaufman

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Ok, here's an idea:

Let's divide F1 season into two halves. 12 races each. Or maybe 16 races + 8 races.

First part of the season, same as now. However, after we crown a constructor champion, the winning team supplies all 20 drivers with the winning car. Then we get a second championship fight to figure out the best driver.

There are some kinks to iron out with what kind of supporting personnel the rest of the drivers get or how much of the winning team's know how the other teams steal. Perhaps if this can't be figured out, the drivers just drive a spec car. Maybe the driver's championship on same equipment turns out to be as boring as the regular championship. I do suspect however that drivers are going to find an edge by fiddling with their setups and maybe some will separate themselves from the rest just by being better in this part of the sport. We are also going to get a far better image of the true driving pecking order. Again, I suspect it won't be radically different than it looks today, but I think you could get a couple of upsets. Maybe Hulkenberg is a top 5 driver that had shitty machinery or Hamilton is just above average, that sort of thing. Either way, it's going to help solve a lot of the debates about which driver is the best.
 

mattquinley

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Ok, here's an idea:

Let's divide F1 season into two halves. 12 races each. Or maybe 16 races + 8 races.

First part of the season, same as now. However, after we crown a constructor champion, the winning team supplies all 20 drivers with the winning car. Then we get a second championship fight to figure out the best driver.

There are some kinks to iron out with what kind of supporting personnel the rest of the drivers get or how much of the winning team's know how the other teams steal. Perhaps if this can't be figured out, the drivers just drive a spec car. Maybe the driver's championship on same equipment turns out to be as boring as the regular championship. I do suspect however that drivers are going to find an edge by fiddling with their setups and maybe some will separate themselves from the rest just by being better in this part of the sport. We are also going to get a far better image of the true driving pecking order. Again, I suspect it won't be radically different than it looks today, but I think you could get a couple of upsets. Maybe Hulkenberg is a top 5 driver that had shitty machinery or Hamilton is just above average, that sort of thing. Either way, it's going to help solve a lot of the debates about which driver is the best.
Interesting concept, but I have no idea how you would manage that from a financial and manufacturing capacity standpoint. The teams are all set up to supply 2 cars through the season and you want to multiply that 10 fold? Not to mention, how fast would they have to build all those tubs, wings, suspension components, etc.?

You'd also basically be giving Adrian Newey's genius away to the rest of the field, which seems inappropriate.

Also, I've always believed that one reason the "#1" driver at most teams is consistently faster than the #2 is that the car is fundamentally designed around the #1's driving style. The #2 can use setup to tweak the chassis more to their liking, but ultimately the car will be fastest using the #1 driver's preferences. I don't think handing the Red Bull to most of the other drivers would result in all that much change at the front as it's designed around Max. There would also have to be some kind of testing period to let the drivers and crews acclimate themselves to the different machinery.
 

Average Reds

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You'd also basically be giving Adrian Newey's genius away to the rest of the field, which seems inappropriate.
I remember reading back around 2000 that Newey was the only designer who resisted the move to CAD. It's apparently still the case, as all innovations are hand-drawn by Newey before being turned over to the design team to implement.

https://www.marca.com/en/f1/2022/02/28/621d42d9ca4741ae568b4569.html

Newey is simply a freak-of-nature design genius. (And yes, his genius is only one reason that the scenario that @Nick Kaufman suggested will not come to pass. Though it is an interesting idea.)
 

Nick Kaufman

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Ok, how about giving them spec cars and forcing teams to use them on sprint races? That could work and it could be expanded if it's successful.
 

Nick Kaufman

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And indycar series, but partly. I understand that part of F1's concept is car development, so you can't abandon that as the core of the sport. But you can offer a few twists here and there, no?
 

Nick Kaufman

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Another idea would be to do a random drawing for the car to be driven. Everyone gets to see how they fare in a Haas!

EDIT: Or maybe instead of the no1 team providing their car, the team that finished last does so. Who gives a shit about the proprietary secrets of the last team. Plus added incentive to try everything to finish 9th in the championship!
 

cgori

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Another idea would be to do a random drawing for the car to be driven. Everyone gets to see how they fare in a Haas!

EDIT: Or maybe instead of the no1 team providing their car, the team that finished last does so. Who gives a shit about the proprietary secrets of the last team. Plus added incentive to try everything to finish 9th in the championship!
I actually think you should just randomize who gets to drive which car by drawing lots for some race, just jumble it all up. Hamilton in an Alpine, Alonso in a Williams, Max in a Ferrari, etc.
 

Nick Kaufman

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Ah, that's a good one too!

Plus you do a special reality show with the drivers interacting with their new team.
 

Silverdude2167

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Well, that was a very fun start to the race.

I think next season they should set up sprinklers around the track and they get turned on by random # generators.
Random rain makes the races so much more interesting.
 

Nick Kaufman

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Well, that was a very fun start to the race.

I think next season they should set up sprinklers around the track and they get turned on by random # generators.
Random rain makes the races so much more interesting.
that was an actual Bernie Ecclestone idea.
 

tmracht

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10 in a row is amazing no matter the dominance. So many things need to go perfect for that, look at Yuki today.

Ferrari nearly bottling a podium is peak Ferrari. Lewis made the right choice as did George just going bowling and letting the penalties not matter. They gotta figure out how to make that not the norm.
 

tmracht

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At least they gave him some penalty points but man ruin Oscars chance to get points and just take off clear of everyone is quite hard to find the right penalty for a top car.