Looked like an honest but tactical error - his burn-in to his start box seemed late and his back end got a bit sideways so when he went in he was crooked and missed his line by a few inches at most. But that's Alonso for you.
The Incredible Hülk Returns, 2023 F1 Season
- Thread starter Beomoose
- Start date
Forgive my F1 newbie question. In today’s race it looked like some cars got to use DRS and others (Hamilton for one) did not. Why was that? Max was passing cars like they were standing still in DRS areas and the other cars didn’t have it.
Each area where the rear wing can be opened, aka a DRS Zone, has a detection area just before. At this point, if the car following is less than a second behind it will be allowed to activate DRS in the DRS Zone. Here’s a quick primer from an American source: https://jalopnik.com/motorsport-explained-drs-zones-in-formula-one-1848735539
Red Bull have the most effective drag reduction on the grid right now, in addition to having the best overall car. Most drivers didn’t bother fighting Max as he zipped past because they knew it would only eat their tires and compromise their race.
Red Bull have the most effective drag reduction on the grid right now, in addition to having the best overall car. Most drivers didn’t bother fighting Max as he zipped past because they knew it would only eat their tires and compromise their race.
The stewards originally ruled that, due to the rear jack touching the car prior to the five seconds having elapsed, the penalty had not been served correctly.
It was clear to us that the substratum of the original decision, namely the representation of there being an agreement, was called into question by the new evidence.
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.breaking-fernando-alonsos-saudi-arabian-grand-prix-podium-reinstated-after.1QaHGAtZu9W5k6nYsnR1id.html
It was a tiki taka call IMO. Russel himself said that Alonso deserved 3d place.
Here’s another. What’s up with the battery? Some guys are charging battery to make a pass. Others are saving battery. Does it provide some kind of extra boost?
Yes the battery provides extra horsepower. And it's harvested from two different sources, one is the car's breaking energy and the other its turbo system. That extra horsepower can only be deployed for 30 seconds or so and it takes a while to charge it, so drivers try to be strategic about its deployment (i.e. when they want to overtake someone or defend someone and neither part is a lost cause).
Sorry for another dumb question. but do they also use the battery at strategic points in qualifying runs?
None of these are dumb questions at all, @reggiecleveland, @Bongorific.
Chain bear is another easy format to understand some of the simpler concepts.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnByDRKO9JA
- Basics of the Hybrid Power Unit, its changed a bit since 2016, but a pretty good video still.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fh2P_VztnU
- Why DRS is involved at all
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rz8ZNIPrtYs
- How F1 Cars Use Energy
As an aside do we wanna talk about feeder series too? Theo...not so great weekend for Sauber Academy.
Chain bear is another easy format to understand some of the simpler concepts.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnByDRKO9JA
- Basics of the Hybrid Power Unit, its changed a bit since 2016, but a pretty good video still.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fh2P_VztnU
- Why DRS is involved at all
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rz8ZNIPrtYs
- How F1 Cars Use Energy
As an aside do we wanna talk about feeder series too? Theo...not so great weekend for Sauber Academy.
Doesn’t feel like it’s gonna be a fun season, unfortunately. Red Bull looks untouchable.
I respect Alonso as a driver, Though prefer him as an agent of chaos, rather than a driver to root for. I guess if Stroll Strolls his way through some more races, causing safety cars and other stuff, Fernando could eventually go after dad’s boy.
Is the most competitive group going to be Alonso, the 2 Mercs and the Ferraris?
I think we have had a real loss of personality the past few years - Kimi, Ricciardo and Vettel are fun people to root for and even against.
I still have little to no opionion of some of the other drivers, even those who have been around for a few years. We need some new oddballs.
I respect Alonso as a driver, Though prefer him as an agent of chaos, rather than a driver to root for. I guess if Stroll Strolls his way through some more races, causing safety cars and other stuff, Fernando could eventually go after dad’s boy.
Is the most competitive group going to be Alonso, the 2 Mercs and the Ferraris?
I think we have had a real loss of personality the past few years - Kimi, Ricciardo and Vettel are fun people to root for and even against.
I still have little to no opionion of some of the other drivers, even those who have been around for a few years. We need some new oddballs.
Well we still got Yuki he's a character. I miss peak Yuki and Gasioso.
I think there's Stroll vs the Mercs, Ferrari vs Disappointment.
I think Haas Alpha and Alfa will be a fun scramble for P10 on weekends one of the top 5 teams lose a spot.
Race pace from F1data is showing:
RB >>>> Aston > Merc >> Ferrari =? Alpine
https://www.f1dataanalytics.com/blog/2023-saudi-arabia-grand-prix-race-data-analysis
Hamilton on the alternate strategy makes this chart a little off. But gives a nice little stratosphere visualization.
I think there's Stroll vs the Mercs, Ferrari vs Disappointment.
I think Haas Alpha and Alfa will be a fun scramble for P10 on weekends one of the top 5 teams lose a spot.
Race pace from F1data is showing:
RB >>>> Aston > Merc >> Ferrari =? Alpine
https://www.f1dataanalytics.com/blog/2023-saudi-arabia-grand-prix-race-data-analysis
Hamilton on the alternate strategy makes this chart a little off. But gives a nice little stratosphere visualization.
I suspect the McLaren car maybe a papaya piece of shit. Woof.
What we now don’t know is if it’s just the car, or if Norris doesn’t have the thing that seems to make a championship-quality driver.
What we now don’t know is if it’s just the car, or if Norris doesn’t have the thing that seems to make a championship-quality driver.
It’s a bummer couple of years. I like McLaren. American principal. Norris and Riccardo were a very likable pairing last year. I really like the car livery fwiw. They’ve just disappointed.
I actually think by letter of the rule everything after the final red flag made sense. The issue is there was no need for that red flag at the end, that was obviously just because race control didn’t want the race to end under safety car.
There was also probably no need for the red flag when Albon crashed either so I can definitely see why George is upset.
There was also probably no need for the red flag when Albon crashed either so I can definitely see why George is upset.
It could be interesting if Perez puts a scare into Verstappen. It doesn't seem like Max will take that well.
From interviews it sounds like Max’s fire is already out. If Sergio can rekindle it we’ll at least have that to watch.
It's a shame that Ferrari has no race pace. Sharl is killing it in one lap. Merc has to be so embarrassed that a customer team is punking them. De Vries is a step down from Goatifi, not a phrase I'd ever have imagined. Yuki better than Gasly is also a look. Outside the top 2 the story lines are quite good. But the top 2 being 30 seconds adrift is tough coming off the drama of 2021.
If Max wins he will be fine. He has had his way every race for about 10 months so not used to dealing with adversity. I understand why he hates the sprint though.
I find it interesting there appears to be no mention on the F1 website of the near-disaster on pit lane when FIA personnel and dozens of others were allowed into a live pit lane before the end of the race. Ocon came in for his mandatory pit stop as he was starting his final lap and was greeted by a wall of people right in the middle of the travel lane. It's on Sky Sports, Autoweek, and several other 3rd party sites but the FIA appears to have thoroughly sanitized their own.
The stewards released their report and that was basically it from what I've seen.
View: https://i.imgur.com/Y6er66d.jpg
View: https://i.imgur.com/Y6er66d.jpg
Or anything for the Red Bull mechanics who were first, reportedly running across and climbing the fence, which is now not allowed?
Somewhat interesting race so far spoiled per usual by the fact that the Red Bulls are rockets.
Alonso just complimented an overtake by Stroll that he presumably saw on the giant TV matrixes. His turn from a mercurial, cantankerous old man to an almost obsequiious, supporting mentor is so transparent, that if I were the Strolls, I would be feeling mocked every time he said a nice thing.
Alonso just complimented an overtake by Stroll that he presumably saw on the giant TV matrixes. His turn from a mercurial, cantankerous old man to an almost obsequiious, supporting mentor is so transparent, that if I were the Strolls, I would be feeling mocked every time he said a nice thing.
I know Monaco is the worst track for racing, since there's no passing. I love it, though, for the setting, history, pomp and circumstance. And when it falls on Memorial Day weekend, it's the greatest race day - with the Indy 500 and Coca-Cola 600.
But I hate this Miami track and the Saudi Arabia track.
How about now? He was just in a bad mood having to the sprint, etc.
It is getting bring though with just one team having a chance.
Is it the track that’s the problem, though? As you say, the problem with Monaco is that there is almost nowhere to overtake. That’s not true for Miami - you can overtake on Turn 1 and Turn 11, and theoretically Turn 17 although that seemed to happen more last year than this year.
The track I’m really skeptical about is Las Vegas. Hopefully I’m wrong but it looks like a less exciting version of Baku. Not expecting a ton of overtaking on that one - of course, RB and Max will have won their championships well before that race this year anyway.
This weekend's race is cancelled due to extreme, deadly flooding in the region.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-cancels-emilia-romagna-gp-due-to-weather-emergency/10470445/
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-cancels-emilia-romagna-gp-due-to-weather-emergency/10470445/
I'm thinking about going to the Las Vegas GP. It's super expensive and there are no great options for non-grand stand seating and at the moment all tickets are being sold as 4 day tickets. Thursday is practice 1 and 2, Friday is Practice 3 and qualification. Saturday is the race. (Wednesday is opening ceremonies.)
I was thinking that I don't really need a 4 day ticket, and they are crazy expensive. Starting times already are going to challenge my bedtime so I don't really think I care about the Thursday practices. It looks as though there won't really be any opportunity to move around and see the race from multiple vantage points. There is only one track side general admission area, which is about half-way around the loop near some turns and an interesting chicane. All the rest of the tickets are grandstands. It's hard to find single-day tickets at this point, but I have a feeling that's going to change as the race gets closer and I also have a feeling that prices cannot stay in the crazy range they are in now.
I think my idea would be to try to find a Friday ticket for the last practice and qualification that is in the grandstands near the grid. This is the most expensive area, but I'm hoping that I can eventually find a one day ticket. But for the race I don't need to be near the grid. I was thinking of getting some grandstand somewhere else along the circuit. Anyone have thoughts? Maybe on the strip or near an interesting turn or something. I think I could save some money doing it that way.
Or maybe is being near the grid on race day really the best place to be? I don't really care, I don't think, if I miss Verstappen doing backflips after the race.
I was thinking that I don't really need a 4 day ticket, and they are crazy expensive. Starting times already are going to challenge my bedtime so I don't really think I care about the Thursday practices. It looks as though there won't really be any opportunity to move around and see the race from multiple vantage points. There is only one track side general admission area, which is about half-way around the loop near some turns and an interesting chicane. All the rest of the tickets are grandstands. It's hard to find single-day tickets at this point, but I have a feeling that's going to change as the race gets closer and I also have a feeling that prices cannot stay in the crazy range they are in now.
I think my idea would be to try to find a Friday ticket for the last practice and qualification that is in the grandstands near the grid. This is the most expensive area, but I'm hoping that I can eventually find a one day ticket. But for the race I don't need to be near the grid. I was thinking of getting some grandstand somewhere else along the circuit. Anyone have thoughts? Maybe on the strip or near an interesting turn or something. I think I could save some money doing it that way.
Or maybe is being near the grid on race day really the best place to be? I don't really care, I don't think, if I miss Verstappen doing backflips after the race.
I think going to that race is a good way to throw away money, like Miami last year. There will be plenty of tickets next year Splash on a VIP package to Circuit of the Americas for the same amount.
Yeah, I think 2024 will be easier. But I still have a feeling that ticket prices are going to drop. Just the way that they are selling tickets makes it pretty clear they are trying to goose demand. I can already get a grid ticket for the last practice and qualifying for about $800, and my guess is it goes down from there. Then I just need a race ticket.
Anyway, for me, it has some advantages over COA. It's a city track, which seems fun. No three hour slog to get out there. It's Vegas. And I can drive there and back. I booked a hotel early using Hilton points, which I have more than I can use. I have a bunch of friends going too, some who live there -- so I think overall it would be a pretty good time.
I haven't followed F1 long enough to develop strong feelings about drivers or teams. I mean, my default is to root for Hamilton, but I don't have strong allegiances yet. So the fact that the championship will be decided a month before the GP doesn't really matter to me.
Holy fuckola, $800 for practice & quali? Old fogey alert - I think the GA "all practices and qualifying - everything but the race" ticket at Indy for the USGP in the early 2000's was $30, possibly $40. And the race tickets were $200 for paddock penthouse at the start-finish which was considered "expensive" at the time - you could get some decent race seats for $90-100. Ye gods.
COTA doesn't take 3 hours to get there btw, unless they have torrential rains.
COTA doesn't take 3 hours to get there btw, unless they have torrential rains.
It's insane. That's the stubhub price. To date they have only sold 3 day tickets through official channels. (Day 1 is P1 and P2; Day 2 is P3 and Qualification; Day 3 is race.) To find tickets for a single day you need to find someone who is splitting up their tickets.
There is a very small GA area that they sold for $500 for the three days but people think it's going to be hard to see the race and the area is small. For grandstands, the prices have been: $1500 ($1700 with fees) for the last straight before the final turn into the finish and the pit/grid/garage area. $2000 ($2300 with fees) for grandstands about halfway around the track near a chicane. $2500 ($2900) for grandstands on the grid or on the strip. $3200 ($3500) for the "Max Verstappen" stand, near turn 3 (can't see the grid) where you get some swag and a chance to win a signed helmet and sit in Red Bull branded bullshit. Hospitality starts around $8,000. Tickets come with food and drinks.
The way they've been selling these tickets is pretty telling. All sorts of presales and shit to try to goose demand and then selling them in phases to increase demand. But these prices are absurd. That's why I think that a day two ticket at $800 is indicative -- I think the market will be pretty soft. Especially after the season is done and dusted in Singapore or whatever.
It's going to be interesting to see what happens in 2024. It seems to me that these are the kind of prices you can get away with once when you're dealing with a crowd that doesn't actually understand how little of the race they are going to see.
I may well end up going without a ticket and taking a chance. In the end I'm predicting I'll get a grid ticket for day 2 and a race ticket in a decent spot for under $1k.
(I've never been to COTA but have a friend that goes and said it was a real cluster getting back to Austin on Sunday from the track.)
That Day 1/2/3 arrangement of events is the standard F1 schedule btw - the only oddity is that it is Th/Fr/Sa instead of Fr/Sa/Su.
I think your assessment of the demand / market softness sounds about right.
I paid $800 (might have been 800 euros so maybe $1000?) for a race-day-only ticket to the German GP about 10 years ago, where we drove into the parking lot, walked straight to the ticket counter and bought them cash about an hour before race start. We sat in the covered infield section of Hockenheim with a view of the entire infield/stadium section plus start/finish (i.e. the best seat you could almost possibly have). We had just enough time to get beers + sausage + pretzel, sit in our seats and then the formation lap went off. That was considered "very expensive" back in the day.
The numbers you are talking about are inconceivable to me, but I guess that's what has happened.
COTA last time I went was a few years ago now, we had good luck taking Ubers in/out actually. And did an airbnb just outside of town, towards the track/airport area. I have a friend who lives in Austin and is part of a car club that drives at COTA, I think he said he could arrange for hospitality there if we wanted to commit to it way in advance, but I'm not enthused for it this year.
I think your assessment of the demand / market softness sounds about right.
I paid $800 (might have been 800 euros so maybe $1000?) for a race-day-only ticket to the German GP about 10 years ago, where we drove into the parking lot, walked straight to the ticket counter and bought them cash about an hour before race start. We sat in the covered infield section of Hockenheim with a view of the entire infield/stadium section plus start/finish (i.e. the best seat you could almost possibly have). We had just enough time to get beers + sausage + pretzel, sit in our seats and then the formation lap went off. That was considered "very expensive" back in the day.
The numbers you are talking about are inconceivable to me, but I guess that's what has happened.
COTA last time I went was a few years ago now, we had good luck taking Ubers in/out actually. And did an airbnb just outside of town, towards the track/airport area. I have a friend who lives in Austin and is part of a car club that drives at COTA, I think he said he could arrange for hospitality there if we wanted to commit to it way in advance, but I'm not enthused for it this year.
Ferrari never fails to disappoint, while Mercedes keep surviving their mediocre car like cockroaches.
Sounds as though they wanted intermediates for Alonso but gave him the wrong tires at his pit stop. (Edit — team director denies the report.)
Just getting into the sport but it seems like Ferrari and the others keep making mistakes while Red Bull rarely puts a foot wrong. Mercedes say they made improvements this week. Not the track to get the best sense I guess but they did do pretty well today.
Just getting into the sport but it seems like Ferrari and the others keep making mistakes while Red Bull rarely puts a foot wrong. Mercedes say they made improvements this week. Not the track to get the best sense I guess but they did do pretty well today.
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Anyone watching live? I'm up way too late and pretty tired, but I swear the color commentator on the Sky broadcast, Martin Brundle, used the term "Chinaman" in reference to Yuki Tsunoda. It sounded like he recognized the gravity of the slip in real time, paused a beat, course corrected, then passed back to the play-by-play guy who cheerfully and seamlessly moved forward with the broadcast. It happened around lap 17, but I'm not watching in a way that allows me to rewind, so I can't double-check. Am I overtired and misheard things? Am I nuts?
Edit/Correction: Not nuts but certainly tired; Brundle used that term in reference to Zhou, not Tsunoda. Sorry for the confusion.
Edit/Correction: Not nuts but certainly tired; Brundle used that term in reference to Zhou, not Tsunoda. Sorry for the confusion.
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I heard it. I took it more as an old man forgetting the world he’s now in. I’m sure it’ll blow up but I struggle with it being malicious.
It’s interesting, because I have always thought it a bit weird how often in formula 1 it is common to refer to drivers not only by their nationality, but to refer to them by their nationality as a noun. “The Monaganese” or “the Dutchman.”
So “the Chinese” would be in form with that weird convention. So you could kind of see a person using “the Chinaman” in this context in a way that is misguided but without being malicious. If, of course, the driver were actually Chinese.
So “the Chinese” would be in form with that weird convention. So you could kind of see a person using “the Chinaman” in this context in a way that is misguided but without being malicious. If, of course, the driver were actually Chinese.