Might as well start talking about 2021

jon abbey

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IMO LeMahieu is awesome, elite defender at 2B who has maybe fallen off some but is still solid, and has been NY's team MVP both seasons he's been in NY. He finished 4th and 3rd in the AL MVP voting in 2019/2020, but the big danger sign for him for other teams isn't just his age, it's that a large percentage of his HRs were wall-scrapers in Yankee Stadium, so his OPS looks decidedly better than it would likely be anywhere else.

I think he comes back to NY for something in the 4/84 range but the confusing factor is that both he and Gleyber are by far most valuable at 2B.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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IMO LeMahieu is awesome, elite defender at 2B who has maybe fallen off some but is still solid, and has been NY's team MVP both seasons he's been in NY. He finished 4th and 3rd in the AL MVP voting in 2019/2020, but the big danger sign for him for other teams isn't just his age, it's that a large percentage of his HRs were wall-scrapers in Yankee Stadium, so his OPS looks decidedly better than it would likely be anywhere else.

I think he comes back to NY for something in the 4/84 range but the confusing factor is that both he and Gleyber are by far most valuable at 2B.
What's crazy is that the Toilet has given him (and others?) an offensive bump more than Coors Field.... at least at a slight glimpse.
Prior to his tenure with the Yankees... his career OPS was .750
Great job on Cashman's part (or more likely... just luck) that he blossomed into what he was for the last two seasons.
 

BaseballJones

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HUGE strikeout numbers (e.g., 191 k in just 457 ab in A+ ball in 2017). But terrific power. Definitely worth a shot, because if he can just make a little more contact, he could produce. Especially if he is a good defensive player.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Sounds like Wily Mo Pena but with a good glove. No downside to giving him a minor league deal and seeing what they can do with him.
 

Earthbound64

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What's crazy is that the Toilet has given him (and others?) an offensive bump more than Coors Field.... at least at a slight glimpse.
Prior to his tenure with the Yankees... his career OPS was .750
Great job on Cashman's part (or more likely... just luck) that he blossomed into what he was for the last two seasons.
Meanwhile, Robinson Cano... Well, y'know.
 

E5 Yaz

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MLB.com reporters roundtable discussion on possibility of Springer coming to Boston.

 

vadertime

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Still have Springs, Valdez, Stock, Walden, Mazza, and Pedroia that can/will be removed for free agent signings.

This is was just the deadline to protect prospects though correct? They can still move guys of the 40-man to be able to make a selction in the Rule 5 draft between now and then, right?
 

chawson

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Man, Renfroe looks like a great fit if he can’t land a starting job elsewhere. It’s pretty rare to find someone with his RHH pull power who can also handle Fenway’s RF defensively. In a Beni/JBJ/Verdugo outfield he seems like an ideal 4th outfielder, and decent insurance in case we whiff on other CF options (with Verdugo moving to center).

It seems possible we could get a Cody Ross 2012 kind of year from him, but with plus defense. Maybe JDM can teach him something too.
 

chawson

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Would a Renfroe / Pederson platoon make sense?
In a vacuum, yes I think. But it would be more appealing if we knew what we were getting in Benintendi, who was decent vs. LHP in his otherwise down 2019 and bad against them in 2017-18. Pederson can’t hit them whatsoever, so that scenario could mean a lot of PT for a Renfroe type.

My read on Joc, fwiw, is that he’s not the type of LHH hitting profile the Sox chase, since he tends not to spray the ball and all of his power is to deep right field. I’d sooner see him as the Yanks’ new Brett Gardner.
 

RedOctober3829

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deep inside Guido territory
"The Chicago Tribune is mentioning the Red Sox has a potential Kris Bryant landing spot in a trade. They have two sources that say the Sox and Cubs were in trade talks over him this summer and the Sox would envision Bryant as a left fielder."

I had mentioned this a while ago as a possibility and I'm glad to see this could have a chance of it happening.
View: https://twitter.com/redsoxstats/status/1330920831871049729
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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"The Chicago Tribune is mentioning the Red Sox has a potential Kris Bryant landing spot in a trade. They have two sources that say the Sox and Cubs were in trade talks over him this summer and the Sox would envision Bryant as a left fielder."

I had mentioned this a while ago as a possibility and I'm glad to see this could have a chance of it happening.
View: https://twitter.com/redsoxstats/status/1330920831871049729
I would imagine this would mean the end of the Benintendi days unless they see him as a CF'er (I'm not confident in him there) and don't try to resign JBJ.
Safe to say that Bryant hasn't quite turned out to be the ultra-stud he was expected (and looking like he'd be), but he'd be a great addition to the lineup, and Fenway LF is probably a perfect spot for his D.
I also can't imagine a straight Benintendi for Bryant would work and am wondering what else the Sox have that'd make this work.
 

E5 Yaz

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I also can't imagine a straight Benintendi for Bryant would work and am wondering what else the Sox have that'd make this work.
Not when you consider that Bryant only has a season left on his contract. As you said, Bryant hasn't replicated his MVP-level season ... so the idea of working out a contact extension with him as part of a trade carries some risk.

If such a deal would be made, it might mama more sense with additional pieces on both sides ... a 3-for-2, perhaps
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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Not sure what the Sox would have to give up in a trade to get him, but at this point, I think I would rather have Bryant in the lineup over Benintendi if that is what it came down to
 

Cesar Crespo

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Not sure what the Sox would have to give up in a trade to get him, but at this point, I think I would rather have Bryant in the lineup over Benintendi if that is what it came down to
I was thinking a swap of Ben10 and Bryant but Ben10 has an extra year of control and is considerably cheaper.
 

DeadlySplitter

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Would Beni be shipped out in a Bryant deal?

I love Beni and am hoping he can break out Yelich-style (not to Yelich level, just a nice big leap in year 5-6), but I might be prospect hugging too much.
 

Minneapolis Millers

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There's that too. It's 1 year of Bryant for $18.6 mil or 2 years of Beni for probably around 17mil combined. I think it's close.
I agree. If I’m Chicago, I want more than Beni. But Bryant is expensive and was awful in 2020 - whiffed a ton (30%), walked a little less, made little contact, OPSed .644. If they’re not planning to extend him and need to save money now, they could do worse than AB. But they probably should hold onto him and see what he does early in the year, build back value, and trade him mid-season if need be. Of course, we’ve been there. What do you do if you’re contending, and Bryant is contributing?
 

nvalvo

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I agree. If I’m Chicago, I want more than Beni. But Bryant is expensive and was awful in 2020 - whiffed a ton (30%), walked a little less, made little contact, OPSed .644. If they’re not planning to extend him and need to save money now, they could do worse than AB. But they probably should hold onto him and see what he does early in the year, build back value, and trade him mid-season if need be. Of course, we’ve been there. What do you do if you’re contending, and Bryant is contributing?
He's not likely to extend in Chicago. He's been at war with the club off and on after they transparently manipulated his service time to delay his FA by a year. I'm not a close follower of the Cubs, but I suspect that bridges have been burned, and there's value just in getting him out of there. Not because he's any kind of malcontent, to be clear, but because the team wronged him and he called them on it.

I wonder if the Sox have the pieces to get Darvish as well? If the Cubs are truly blowing it up. Three years left on his deal...
Dalbec could be in such a deal, potentially. Chicago will need another infielder, assuming Bote is back at 2B, where IIRC he's seen as a better fit.

The trade simulator thinks that [Dalbec + Beni <—> Darvish + Bryant] works as a four-player deal, but IMO Dalbec and Benintendi might be worth a touch more than Darvish and Bryant in the current financial environment (which the trade sim knows nothing about, of course).

Such a deal would subtract Benintendi's $5m AAV and Dalbec's league minimum, and add Bryant at 1/$22m (or so) and Darvish at 3/$59 ($19+ AAV). If the Cubs don't contribute any money, that spends most of our headroom to the first CBT threshold.

So I would judge that any deal with the Cubs probably depends on how motivated Hoyer and the Ricketts are to lower payroll.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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ISn't Bryant being considered basically a salary dump for CHC?
If it was entirely about salary, they'd just non-tender him. He doesn't have a contract for 2021 yet, he's just under team control because he's 9 service days short of free agency. They're shopping him because he has value and they want something signficant in return.
 

JBJ_HOF

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If it was entirely about salary, they'd just non-tender him. He doesn't have a contract for 2021 yet, he's just under team control because he's 9 service days short of free agency. They're shopping him because he has value and they want something signficant in return.
Or, far more likely, they want a small or modest return rather than non-tendering.
 

BaseballJones

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But isn't Bryant considerably better? He OPS'd .903 in 2019. It's not like he's fallen off a cliff
Yeah I mean, it was just one non-Covid year ago that he hit 35 doubles and 31 homers in 543 ab, putting up a slash line of .282/.382/.521/.903, 132 ops+.

That would be a really nice addition to the Sox' lineup. He will only be 29 during the 2021 season.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Or, far more likely, they want a small or modest return rather than non-tendering.
If all they want is a small/modest return, they're going to get hosed (and I'd love for the Sox to be the beneficiary). I just don't have faith that Jed Hoyer is that stupid.
 

nvalvo

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If all they want is a small/modest return, they're going to get hosed (and I'd love for the Sox to be the beneficiary). I just don't have faith that Jed Hoyer is that stupid.
The question isn’t whether Hoyer is that dumb, it’s whether he has been told by ownership to cut the payroll by $10s of millions in a season when few teams are taking on money.
 

Minneapolis Millers

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Jeezus. It’s hard to know exactly how good Bryant is, because he faltered a bit in 2018 and, with 3 different minors injuries, tanked in 2020. But he’s Dustin Pedroia with power at age 29. He won ROY. Then MVP. Helped lead his team to a WS. In 2019, his OPS was over .900. He’s got 24 bWAR in 5.5 seasons. The Cubs are not gonna freakin dump him because of salary.

I don’t actually think they’d do Bryant for Beni, although Beni has shown more at the MLB level than any double A prospect. I think they’d want something more, even in the Season of COVID; something like Song or Seabold. And most here would say HELL NO. So we probably shouldn’t be disappointed if it doesn’t happen.
 
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jon abbey

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No one checked the original piece this is all stemming from? This is literally all of the relevant info:

“ Two sources confirmed the Red Sox and Cubs discussed Bryant this summer, but those talks faded.”

 

JBJ_HOF

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No one checked the original piece this is all stemming from? This is literally all of the relevant info:
There was a trade deadline, and the cost was for 2 playoff runs was more than it would be for one playoff run.

The Athletic is saying the Cubs seem fearful to tender him next week and then risk no team willing to trade anything for him:
 

DeadlySplitter

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another thing.... is Bryant any good in LF? Hanley, Swihart say hello in the "can't stick anyone in LF, even at Fenway" argument. Benny is not a good CF but he can play LF.
 

nvalvo

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another thing.... is Bryant any good in LF? Hanley, Swihart say hello in the "can't stick anyone in LF, even at Fenway" argument. Benny is not a good CF but he can play LF.
Per baseball-reference, Bryant has 172 games in the OF, including 117 GS. All three positions, too, but mostly the corners.
 

DeadlySplitter

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That's way more than I expected (I should have just done the bbref check, sorry for my laziness especially on this section of the board). I thought he was a full-time good 3B? injury concerns?