Kobe Killed in Helicopter Crash

Bozo Texino

still hates Dave Kerpen
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Thanks.

And before someone quotes me to say I missed it again, don't worry, I got it. But thanks for the correction anyway. I will try not to confuse them in the future.
You missed my mea culpa, man.

When I show my [ample] ass, I own up to it.
 

amRadio

lurker
Feb 7, 2019
423
At least I don't need to resort to name calling and wishing for violent dog attacks. I think it is virtue signalling to bring this up on the day the man and his daughter died. His sexual assault case was complicated and I guess it's fair to bring it up and I reacted poorly to that out of sentimentality in the aftermath of a death, but to call him a rapist and attack people uncomfortable with that is weird. I'm done now as this is uncomfortable. I hope no rabid dogs attack me and I dispute the fact that I'm a jerk. I have a rape victim in my own family very close to me, I just see things very differently than you do on this day right now.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Its obvious but worth stating that if you are an assault or abuse victim, a person like Kobe Bryant is exactly the sort you would reference in terms of being talented and wealthy enough to get away with the crime. As such, their emotions are just as valid as those who mourn the loss of a basketball hero.

People do good and bad stuff during their lives to varying degrees and how you remember them is a function of how that "stuff" relates to your experience.

Kobe was a very complicated person for someone who seemed singularly focused on playing the game of basketball. We need to acknowledge that for good and bad.
 

MDJ

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Feb 9, 2009
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Crow, I grew up playing ball during the same era and I pretended I was Jordan and all the same shit you're saying. I'm sorry to rain on your admiration parade, but tough shit. Go ahead and mourn him. I'm not telling you not to. I'm saying that those of you who only want to see him as a basketball player are not the only ones who get space in discussing him upon his untimely death. It does NOT make me an asshole that YOU are offended by people pointing out that the guy was a fucking rapist, AS WELL AS being a phenomenal basketball player, and a man who gave millions of dollars to charity and a father and a husband and the face of LA sports and and and...he was all of these things. I think it's important not to forget the bad part off who he was. It was that bad. And make no mistake that it had an effect on how women decide whether or not they will report being raped.
Well said.
 

Imbricus

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Jan 26, 2017
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Sad. A great player for the ages. I didn't realize how much of a student of the game he was until I watched some of his video breakdowns of various players, and their strengths and weaknesses, and was enthralled by his observational skills. RIP, Kobe.
 

uncannymanny

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7,885
Will you actually be done this time? He was a rapist. Because he raped. He also did lots of other good things. All of these are fair game on a message board.
 

amRadio

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Feb 7, 2019
423
There have been enough opinions shared about the appropriateness of discussing Kobe's dark side that I won't add my own.

However, to the bolded: you're going to need to bring some better receipts if you're going to accuse fellow posters of being "phony" in their opinions. To the contrary, I doubt luckysox - herself a survivor of rape IIRC - could be more serious about anything. And likewise TSC and the various others for whom this is an issue that is deeply emotionally felt, and dominates whatever else they might think about Kobe Bryant. To be "virtue signalling" would require that they be posting to earn the approval of the group despite feeling differently. Given the pile of shit dumped on them, it seems "phone virtue signalling" is exactly 180-degrees backwards. They chose to state an unpopular opinion, precisely because that's their sincerely-held truth.

You're welcome to disagree with their perspective, but accusing them of bad-faith posting without the slightest hint of evidence of that is pretty shitty by you.

I brought up no poster in particular. I think calling him a rapist today amongst people remembering his life is virtue signalling considering the lack of a conviction as a rapist. I am sorry if that bothers you. Put me on ignore.
 

bankshot1

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Feb 12, 2003
19,673
where I was last at
Bob Ryan on MSNBC now, saying he did not know him real well, he's riffing and off the cuff, but he says more in a few sentences than can most experts

In particular he dicusssed his Italian upbringing and cosmopolitan outlook and how he did not quite fit in with the average NBA player. And that he was not one of the boys and that led to friction.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill
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I just think it's gross to take a moment to tape dance on the mans grave on the day he and his daughter died because you enjoy taking a political stance on the internet. Such phony virtue signalling. I see nobody claiming he was a role model. To attack him as a rapist right now seems phony and gross. All I have and will have to say on that.

RIP Kobe and Gianni Maria (hope that's ok to say here)
We are, literally, having a discussion through our feelings about Kobe about the relative importance of violence against women in 2020. It turns out that the premature death of Kobe Bryant is a perfect catalyst for that discussion. If that is a discussion you don’t wish to have, that is fine, but the mods of this particular site have said it is a discussion that may be had here.

So, if you wish to keep saying it is a discussion you don’t wish to have here, you should take it up with those who have decided otherwise. Or just find a place where the discussion is other.
 

Cesar Crespo

79
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Dec 22, 2002
13,195
At least I don't need to resort to name calling and wishing for violent dog attacks. I think it is virtue signalling to bring this up on the day the man and his daughter died. His sexual assault case was complicated and I guess it's fair to bring it up and I reacted poorly to that out of sentimentality in the aftermath of a death, but to call him a rapist and attack people uncomfortable with that is weird. I'm done now as this is uncomfortable. I hope no rabid dogs attack me and I dispute the fact that I'm a jerk. I have a rape victim in my own family very close to me, I just see things very differently than you do on this day right now.
What do you call someone who rapes someone? He's a rapist. Sorry that makes you uncomfortable. I'm sure that girl was pretty uncomfortable too.
 

Steve Dillard

wishes drew noticed him instead of sweet & sour
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Oct 7, 2003
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It's like all four seasons of the Good Place and its questions all wrapped into a new thread. But without the jokes and the personable Ted Danson.


Spoiler. Like many religions, it the trying to be good that counts, even if you previously failed, many times.
 
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Jimbodandy

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Jan 31, 2006
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Crow, I grew up playing ball during the same era and I pretended I was Jordan and all the same shit you're saying. I'm sorry to rain on your admiration parade, but tough shit. Go ahead and mourn him. I'm not telling you not to. I'm saying that those of you who only want to see him as a basketball player are not the only ones who get space in discussing him upon his untimely death. It does NOT make me an asshole that YOU are offended by people pointing out that the guy was a fucking rapist, AS WELL AS being a phenomenal basketball player, and a man who gave millions of dollars to charity and a father and a husband and the face of LA sports and and and...he was all of these things. I think it's important not to forget the bad part off who he was. It was that bad. And make no mistake that it had an effect on how women decide whether or not they will report being raped.
Great post.

It's understandable that some people have a different sensibility about when to bring up the bad stuff that the deceased was involved in. Most of us have had to navigate that exact thing with wildly imperfect (and criminal) parents and other relatives around their funerals. But it's not even a little bit kosher for those with a different take to shout down and tell you or anyone else what to think on the matter. That's bullshit, especially since the bad stuff in question is a real thing that happens to a lot of people.
 

SoxFanInCali

has the rich, deep voice of a god and the penis of
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Well in that case, I apologize. The internet is a confusing place. :)
You said it right, it's "say your piece", but when not objecting to a wedding, you "forever hold your peace".

This has been another episode of "Know Your Idioms". We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming.
 

Bozo Texino

still hates Dave Kerpen
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At least I don't need to resort to name calling and wishing for violent dog attacks. I think it is virtue signalling to bring this up on the day the man and his daughter died. His sexual assault case was complicated and I guess it's fair to bring it up and I reacted poorly to that out of sentimentality in the aftermath of a death, but to call him a rapist and attack people uncomfortable with that is weird. I'm done now as this is uncomfortable. I hope no rabid dogs attack me and I dispute the fact that I'm a jerk. I have a rape victim in my own family very close to me, I just see things very differently than you do on this day right now.
DUDE. STOP. NOBODY IS FUCKING "VIRTUE SIGNALING." AND STOP USING THAT PHRASE IN EVERY ONE OF YOUR GODDAMNED POSTS.

Some people are going to talk about things that they deeply believe. I cannot think for a SECOND about anybody on here trying to impress someone else by being a good person.

If I had a copy of that MS Paint Buchholz drawing, I'd post it here.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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Jan 2, 2006
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Literally the first thing that crossed my mind when this flashed across my phone was, "Known rapist dies in helicopter crash." Clearly, I'm not alone in that.

I think it's totally fucked that some people want to whitewash that away just because he died in some bizarre fashion at a young age. People die every day.

Rape is part of his legacy. He has to own that, whether you like it or not.
He was a rapist and a piece of shit, but it still doesn't make the news that one of the best basketball players of all time died in a crash less shocking.

Also his kid(s) dying is the worst part of this.
 

Bozo Texino

still hates Dave Kerpen
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You said it right, it's "say your piece", but when not objecting to a wedding, you "forever hold your peace".

This has been another episode of "Know Your Idioms". We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming.
It wasn't even a case of me mixing them up.

I was just wrong as a dong all day long.
 

singaporesoxfan

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It would be in poor taste to go to Kobe's funeral and reference the sexual assault allegations.
It would be journalistic malpractice for a news outlet to write Kobe's obit and not reference the sexual assault allegations.
In my mind, a discussion on SoSH is much closer to discussing the news than attending a funeral
 

amRadio

lurker
Feb 7, 2019
423
What do you call someone who rapes someone? He's a rapist. Sorry that makes you uncomfortable. I'm sure that girl was pretty uncomfortable too.
I'm mostly referring to discomfort of being called a "cunt" in a PM and being told that someone hopes rabid dogs attack me, but sure. I totally deserve that. Thanks for your thoughts.
 

amRadio

lurker
Feb 7, 2019
423
DUDE. STOP. NOBODY IS FUCKING "VIRTUE SIGNALING." AND STOP USING THAT PHRASE IN EVERY ONE OF YOUR GODDAMNED POSTS.

Some people are going to talk about things that they deeply believe. I cannot think for a SECOND about anybody on here trying to impress someone else by being a good person.

If I had a copy of that MS Paint Buchholz drawing, I'd post it here.

If you feel this strongly, PM me about it. You seem like you're out of control and need to take a minute to calm down though.
 

Cesar Crespo

79
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Dec 22, 2002
13,195
I'm mostly referring to discomfort of being called a "cunt" in a PM and being told that someone hopes rabid dogs attack me, but sure. I totally deserve that. Thanks for your thoughts.
Because I'm supposed to know someone pm'd you that because I'm omniscient. If someone is attacking you via pm, report it to a mod and they will be dealt with. I'm pretty sure I haven't personally insulted you even though I disagree with you vehemently.
 

soxhop411

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Dec 4, 2009
37,797
So uh. The memorial that will be held in LA has to be at the LA Memorial Coliseum right? There is no way staples center is big enough to hold everyone. Regardless of it being where the Lakers play.
 

YTF

Member
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I just think it's gross to take a moment to tape dance on the mans grave on the day he and his daughter died because you enjoy taking a political stance on the internet. Such phony virtue signalling. I see nobody claiming he was a role model. To attack him as a rapist right now seems phony and gross. All I have and will have to say on that.

RIP Kobe and Gianni Maria (hope that's ok to say here)
You do understand that there are some here (and elsewhere) who have a very personal connection to the realities of who Kobe Bryant was. I'm not sure why you want to minimize that. I'm sure more than a few feel that Bryant's the one who did some tap dancing all those years ago.
 

djbayko

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Or perhaps a grieving only day. Maybe?

I'm actually not upset it was brought up. It was your line that didn't understand why people would be upset. If you can't understand how it could upset people, then maybe you're not as empathetic as you think you are.

This isn't political. No one was even whitewashing. The Clemente comment in context was about magnitude, not life story. And I understand the people bringing up the past also grieving, but man, when I go to a funeral, I bury that shit for a day.

We will be discussing his legacy, all if it, in great detail for a really long time to come. It's a great conversation to have. But if people really don't see how this is to someone just in shock, who just naturally gravitates towards trying to remember the good in someone, might get upset right now?? I'm genuinely concerned.

I'm Sorry man. I generally like you, abd I don't hate you now either, but you know, for a group of people always out to get everyone else to listen to what they have to say, I don't think some of you are very good listeners either.
We are not at his funeral. We are not even on r/Lakers. I don't get why a grieving only day is expected here. If what you want to do is grieve about Kobe Bryant without hearing a single opposing thought, then this isn't the place.
 

Was (Not Wasdin)

family crest has godzilla
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Jul 26, 2007
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DUDE. STOP. NOBODY IS FUCKING "VIRTUE SIGNALING." AND STOP USING THAT PHRASE IN EVERY ONE OF YOUR GODDAMNED POSTS.

Some people are going to talk about things that they deeply believe. I cannot think for a SECOND about anybody on here trying to impress someone else by being a good person.

If I had a copy of that MS Paint Buchholz drawing, I'd post it here.
I can’t believe it took this long to get even the (oblique) Munson reference, which is the first thing I thought of (not joking).
 

Bozo Texino

still hates Dave Kerpen
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If you feel this strongly, PM me about it. You seem like you're out of control and need to take a minute to calm down though.
Aaaaaah. You're that guy.

Bang-up job on not including the phrase "virtue signaling" in one of your posts, though. :fonz:
 

mikeot

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Dec 22, 2006
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Just found out about this - woke up from a nap after a night with little sleep (long story). Never a fan of his, though I respected his obvious talents. Nonetheless, shocked and saddened.
 

fletcherpost

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Five people died in a helicopter crash. Am I the only one thinking at all about the people who died whose surname wasn't Bryant, and whose surviving family members probably don't have virtually unlimited funds going forward to help them grieve? This is a tragedy for everyone involved - including the Bryants, but by no means limited to them.
We are, literally, having a discussion through our feelings about Kobe about the relative importance of violence against women in 2020. It turns out that the premature death of Kobe Bryant is a perfect catalyst for that discussion. If that is a discussion you don’t wish to have, that is fine, but the mods of this particular site have said it is a discussion that may be had here.

So, if you wish to keep saying it is a discussion you don’t wish to have here, you should take it up with those who have decided otherwise. Or just find a place where the discussion is other.
Couple of well saids amongst a whole bunch of well saids.
 

Greg29fan

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I sincerely apologize for setting off an unintended firestorm. I recognize and acknowledge the shitty side of Kobe Bryant and that he committed a reprehensible act or even acts many see as unforgivable.

I chose to focus on the positive - and I do believe that he had evolved into a good person who did want to do well for society at large through his charity work and other endeavors.

I think any all and takes on his legacy and whatever else are fair today, so I'm not going to disagree or get in a fight with people who see or it some other way.
 

Trlicek's Whip

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Feb 8, 2009
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I have already let you know what a tool you are for bringing 15 year old accusations into a thread about a storied sports star's tragic death. I'm leaving now, but make sure you stay here and guard the thread to make sure that any latecomers know that Kobe Bryant wasn't Jesus Christ. Everyone is confused on that, and you're performing a valuable service.
Dude, you can still appreciate him as an athlete. He was also likely a rapist.
 

j44thor

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Aug 1, 2006
9,558
This thread is all kinds of suck, maybe P&G would be a better venue for discussion of Kobe the human and all his failures? Typically SOSH is two steps ahead of MSM when it comes to breaking news but this thread is anything but.
I was simply hoping to come here and find out more about the crash and who else was on board. Only one post on the last page, can only imagine what the other 6 consist of, that even mentions the daughter.
Fuck this thread not for content but for lack of. Back to the cesspool that is Twitter I go.
 

singaporesoxfan

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If you feel this strongly, PM me about it. You seem like you're out of control and need to take a minute to calm down though.
You really need to stop using the phrase "virtue signalling", or learn what it is implying. Because it isn't just saying "I think it's in poor taste to bring up these issues". It's implying that these issues don't actually matter to the person talking about them, they're just faking outrage to look good. Just as you got called names (perhaps unfairly so), you should recognize that by using the phrase you were calling people names.
 

ngruz25

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Sep 20, 2005
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The post that started this derail called him a great person. You're a jerk to presume anybody is virtue signalling or bringing politics into this. Fuck off.
This thread is moving too fast for people. The original posts detailing Kobe's past, uh, misdeeds, was in response to one poster describing him as a great human being. That's all.

Slow down before you post, folks.
 

axx

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Jul 16, 2005
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I was simply hoping to come here and find out more about the crash and who else was on board.
His daughter, her teammate on a basketball team, a parent of the teammate, and the pilot.