They played preseason #5 LSU on a neutral field. It’s not like they didn’t try.
CFB 2023 Conference Championships: A thread enjoying five major conference championship games for the last time
- Thread starter Awesome Fossum
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You can say that, but all of the models indicate that mathematically it is more unlikely to go 13-0 against a schedule the strength of FSU's than it is to go 12-1 against a schedule the caliber of Alabama's.
ESPN captures this in their "Strength of Record" metric, which they define as "SOR:Strength of Record rank. Reflects chance that an average Top 25 team would have team's record or better, given the schedule."
Their top 5 according to that metric are Michigan, Washington, Florida State, Alabama, and then Texas.
They had a (relatively) weak schedule. It's not their "fault", but it also should count against them.
They didn't have one because they beat lesser teams.
Look, I'm not saying they should have finished 53rd, I'm just saying that they weren't a top four team. (And certainly weren't clearly a top four team.) Their fate isn't unreasonable.
Arguing against Florida State using resume' is pretty tough IMO. The Boston College bit is pretty disingenuous considering Alabama needed a 4th and 31 to beat a bad Auburn team and they struggled mightily with USF.
I covered the SEC this season. Went to games week in and week out for 3 months. Take a look at the quarterback play in that league this season...it's not very good. Alabama has one very good win (Georgia) and after that their next best win is...LSU. At Home. Smaller margin of victory than FSU had against the same team on a neutral field. Non-conference was a mess for the SEC this season. The resume argument for Bama over FSU boils down to this: Do you think beating Georgia at a neutral site completely negates losing at home by two scores to a very good Texas team? If you believe that - you can do the rest of the mental gymnastics to get yourself to "Bama's resume is better than FSU".
You don’t know that. Nobody does. Upsets happen all the time; underdogs exceed expectations and defeat teams that are ‘better’ than them on paper. That’s why the games are played and why we watch.
It's not clear cut that FSU is better than Alabama and therefore there shouldn't be any outrage that FSU got shut out of the playoffs. Another thing about strength of schedule: FSU’s opponents were 77-79 this season, whereas Alabama’s finished 98-61.
Programs like UCF and FSU really deserve more when they go undefeated. It’s a travesty that the big, strong, elite programs from top conferences just have to win while that tier of upper mid majors struggle for respect and need a little luck to get over the hump. Tough to be the kid brother.
It’s also a not-so-subtle message to FSU, Clemson, and others: “y’all best forget about that ACC thing and come play in our mega conferences…or else.”
Agreed, FSU should be 8th (not joking, I said that here already before the announcement).
The ACC is why we don’t have the expanded playoff this year. Part of me wonders if there was gamesmanship going on here.
Clemson and FSU don't need to be sent subtle messages encouraging them to leave the ACC. They'd leave today if they were offered a spot in the SEC.
You think they’re not in because they haven’t been offered? My understanding is they can’t get around something called “grant of right” tying them to the ACC.
It probably goes over a lot easier if they didn't have FSU in the top 4 to begin with. If they were consistently outside the top 4 then fine. Instead they were 4th, won, and got jumped by 2 teams.
I think FSU wouldn't have agreed to extend the grant of rights back in 2016 (originally set to expire in 2027; now 2036) if they thought an SEC invitation was likely. Big 12 had a grant of rights set up as well -- the ACC copied it -- and UT and OU told the conference they weren't going to extend it again after it expired after 2024. They ended up paying $100M to end it a year early.
Edit: But you're right that they're in a tough spot and not really in a position to leave the conference right now. "Today" was poor wording.
FSU's win over Florida is being completely discounted. I know Florida isnt good this year, but they are no worse than "generic mid tier SEC team" that Alabama gets credit for beating on-are they really any different than Kentucky/Tennessee/Auburn/Arkansas?
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATKb79FaZ8U
So Alabama benefits from a cheap play by another team from their conference? I'm not saying there is any kind of conspiracy or anything, but it is just wrong to reward Team A because Team B lost a player on a cheap hit from Team C.
Whatever. I just hope none of these kids get hurt in these games. NIL is nice, but it pales in comparison to what these schools make off their backs.
What really bothers me is this-Rodemaker (the backup QB) couldnt play against Louisville because he was in concussion protocol, he was injured on a cheap shot in the Florida game.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATKb79FaZ8U
So Alabama benefits from a cheap play by another team from their conference? I'm not saying there is any kind of conspiracy or anything, but it is just wrong to reward Team A because Team B lost a player on a cheap hit from Team C.
Whatever. I just hope none of these kids get hurt in these games. NIL is nice, but it pales in comparison to what these schools make off their backs.
The narratives all fall apart. “Best teams” so we’re better than Georgia in the eyes of the committee? Bullshit.
Why stop there? I'm sure a decent number of folks still like Oregon better than Washington. Go crazy with it! Results be damned.
I, too, despite FSU but they got jobbed BRUTALLY here.
Big 12 reffing Michigan-Bama is Big 10 reffing Washington-Texas is kinda funny. I think the players are gonna be pretty surprised by the differences.Oh and here are the officiating assignments for those who care:
The SEC runs the sport and its dominant narratives, and it sucks.
Some of their best work!
That cheap shot by Florida was absolutely brutal. I'm really happy that Rodemaker didn't play in the CCG even if it cost FSU a spot, because player health isn't taken nearly seriously enough yet.
I assume the general interested public is rooting for the meteor in Michigan-Bama?
Agreed. Doing the pre-ranking is nothing more than a way for ESPN to sell commercials.
That's a really good point that I hadnt thought of. So what happens next year with a team fighting to get in, even with the expansion? Coach is going to tell an injured player "hey, you have to strap it up and get out there. Can't have your injury costing us a bid."?
Not rooting for the meteor, but I really hope Michigan brings it (and I know you are a Michigan fan). If they dont, we are going to see six SEC teams in the playoffs next year.
On the subject of the 12-team playoff.....Ross Dellinger reported that there is no requirement to avoid conference matchups in the first round. I think they will try to avoid them, but there is no rule against it.
Didn't the hit in question on Rodemaker end with him returning to the game and Herbie giving him kudos for his toughness on the broadcast?
If his health and safety was truly front and center on the FSU sidelines, and that was the hit that caused him to miss the ACC Championship game, he probably should have been kept out against the Gators.
FSU was going to beat Louisville with a lawn chair at QB. 3-0 was the goal and the Noles defense delivered.
If his health and safety was truly front and center on the FSU sidelines, and that was the hit that caused him to miss the ACC Championship game, he probably should have been kept out against the Gators.
FSU was going to beat Louisville with a lawn chair at QB. 3-0 was the goal and the Noles defense delivered.
I’m hoping for 7 but it’s doubtful
(I’m the biggest SEC fanboy- apart from Bama, but FSU was robbed)
Yes. That absolutely happened. I was horrified and disgusted. It's still gross that the committee put in FSU over Bama (disregard my avatar -- I can't stand FSU and if Michigan is going to be the national champion, they need to be able to beat any comer anyway -- I just get sick of this unfounded narrative that the SEC is so head and shoulders above everyone else when, after their top 2 or 3, they're usually about the equivalent of other Power 5s and I can't stand the fact that they disregarded wins and losses in picking the 4th seed).
I believe so. Clemson would have had the win over Notre Dame, which would have been a 'brand win' and, sadly, that matters most to the Committee.
And I say this as a Clemson fan.
I am in no way an FSU fan, but I feel sick for that team.
If Notre Dame is a brand win, it makes the argument for FSU even stronger.
Louisville, the team that is so bad, a 3rd string QB from FSU beat them, absolutely fucking curb stomped Notre Dame.
LSU was the 5th-best team in the SEC, at least in the Committee’s sight. That’s better than anyone else FSU played, except maybe Louisville, but “tough non-conference opponent” is a reach. Alabama played three teams that were stronger than FSU’s strongest opponent.
LSU had the same SEC record as Missouri and beat them head to head at Missouri by 10 points. The reason LSU is lower than Missouri is because....LSU lost to Florida State and Missouri scheduled a G5 team instead. You won't find a single computer ranking that has Missouri OR Ole Miss ahead of LSU. The committee had to push LSU down in order to make FSU look worse.
Sure, they were. The lost to SEC Champ Bama @ Bama, Ole Miss (55-49) @ Ole Miss, and the undefeated Noles @ Neutral field.
LSU was ranked #5 when FSU played them and beat them by 3 TD's.
Bama didn't schedule their strong foes. The SEC scheduled them for them. FSU deserves credit for scheduling LSU.
Bama didn't schedule their strong foes. The SEC scheduled them for them. FSU deserves credit for scheduling LSU.
Can we just not do bullshit. The committee needed an excuse to get an SEC team in and the JT injury is that excuse. The nonsense about "best" teams is out the window once FSU is listed @5 in front of Georgia. We can see that from the line.
BB committee does similar BS when they schedule 2 mid-majors against each other, needlessly. They don't want a P5 team (usually B1G or ACC) expecting to be "upset"
I agree that all of this shit about strength of schedule, etc. is horseshit because everyone agree that FSU is in if Travis doesn't break his leg. I wasn't thinking the SEC angle, but more that the committee deciding for us what games they thought would be better.
Do you think that Texas gets boned for Bama if Travis wasn't hurt and the season otherwise plays out the same? That strikes me as crazy given the head-to-head win but I don't see how else you do it if want an SEC team in.
I don't really know. The unfolding narrative would have been different. I could see Bama getting dropped. Putting Bama in over Texas is hard. If FSU with Travis was undefeated, It's not clear how any argument besides narratives and preconceived notions has them worse than Michigan. Michigan played a horrible schedule this year yet it is a foregone conclusion that they are the #1 seed. Please go look at their schedule. No hate involved, I like Harbaugh, just go look at that schedule. You're going to say OSU. OSU beat no one and needed a miracle at South Bend.