The NFL and the National Anthem

soxhop411

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 4, 2009
34,171
@nike's mentions on twitter are a bunch of people cutting up/destroying/setting fire to Nike clothes that they own. Since doing that to clothing you ALREADY HAVE BOUGHT is sure to bring shame and economic downfall to the Nike Brand
 

Ralphwiggum

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2012
5,204
Needham, MA
Personally I think it’s fantastic. As a business move, we’ll see how it works out for them. I can see how this would attract more athletes, particularly athletes of color, to Nike as a choice sponsor, which as we know drives kids to want their sneakers/attire/etc. But they are basically making the exact opposite calculation that the NFL has made in terms of which way the sports-consuming public will lean on this issue.

Also, the Nike logo is going to be on every single NFL uniform this weekend as we head into week 1 of the NFL season. It is going to be very interesting, players are going to be asked to comment on this and lots of them are going to be honest about how they feel, one way or the other. And I am sure we’ll get some tweets by our president about this before the weekend.
 

PedroKsBambino

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 17, 2003
21,765
Personally I think it’s fantastic. As a business move, we’ll see how it works out for them. I can see how this would attract more athletes, particularly athletes of color, to Nike as a choice sponsor, which as we know drives kids to want their sneakers/attire/etc. But they are basically making the exact opposite calculation that the NFL has made in terms of which way the sports-consuming public will lean on this issue.

Also, the Nike logo is going to be on every single NFL uniform this weekend as we head into week 1 of the NFL season. It is going to be very interesting, players are going to be asked to comment on this and lots of them are going to be honest about how they feel, one way or the other. And I am sure we’ll get some tweets by our president about this before the weekend.
I think it is great as well.

I will bet on Nike's marketing team over the NFLs every time, though I agree with you there's some complex math on how it will play out.
 

Ed Hillel

Wants to be startin somethin
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2007
21,645
Here
This has to qualify as the single biggest troll advertising since Ginsu advertised in ancient Rome 43 BC. The owners have to be furious, which makes it quite delicious in my book.
 

Eddie Jurak

Go Leafs Go
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2002
21,789
Melrose, MA
Personally I think it’s fantastic. As a business move, we’ll see how it works out for them. I can see how this would attract more athletes, particularly athletes of color, to Nike as a choice sponsor, which as we know drives kids to want their sneakers/attire/etc. But they are basically making the exact opposite calculation that the NFL has made in terms of which way the sports-consuming public will lean on this issue.

Also, the Nike logo is going to be on every single NFL uniform this weekend as we head into week 1 of the NFL season. It is going to be very interesting, players are going to be asked to comment on this and lots of them are going to be honest about how they feel, one way or the other. And I am sure we’ll get some tweets by our president about this before the weekend.
Well said. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out, but kudos to Nike for using its position for good.
 

SoxinSeattle

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 6, 2003
1,642
Here
I hypocritically stopped buying Nike years ago because of China manufacturing. I'm back in whole hog. This is a very brave move by the brand.
 
Last edited:

snowmanny

Well-Known Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Dec 8, 2005
10,277
I haven’t purchased any Nike product for myself or worn anything Nike in over thirty years (since Spike Lee said Larry Bird was overrated) but maybe I’ll rethink that now.
 

Eddie Jurak

Go Leafs Go
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2002
21,789
Melrose, MA
I have a feeling the people cutting the swoosh off their joke stuff will be outnumbered by those who buy Kaepernick merch.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 24, 2002
29,095
I have a feeling the people cutting the swoosh off their joke stuff will be outnumbered by those who buy Kaepernick merch.
That sounds right to me, especially since Nike also is the dominant brand and jersey manufacturer for the NBA - a professional league that encourages its athletes to stand up for/speak out on causes.

On the other hand, Under Armour, which has a lot of jingoistic items including those that contribute to the Wounded Warrior Project is likely to gain some market-share from those offended by this marketing campaign.

Both companies may end up making out in the long-run. In the meantime, the NFL will still continue to be an awful league run by mostly terrible people who continue to cling to old ideas and values. And while it won't be anytime soon, at some point this approach will end up hurting the growth of their bottom line.
 
Last edited:

Ralphwiggum

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2012
5,204
Needham, MA
I tend to agree with those who think that Nike has this figured out the right way and the NFL is stupid, all of the evidence points to both of those things being true. But Nike doesn’t just sell a pair of socks to someone and then sit back and count their money. They need the people who bought the pair of socks to buy a bunch more the next time he or she needs socks. So, yeah, tearing up the socks doesn’t hurt Nike in the moment, but if the person tearing up the socks also doesn’t buy Nike socks the next time he needs socks that’s a problem for Nike.

The same thing was true for the whole Keurig thing, and actually more acutely true since they make their money on the pods not the machines, so smashing the machines actually does hurt them if the person smashing the machine is no longer buying pods.

Now having said all of that I think Keurig is fine and I think Nike will be fine, but not because they already banked the money from these idiots, but because ultimately I think the MAGAs are are in the minority and also not very disciplined about this kind of thing, and there are a tremendous number of people who support what Kaepernick is doing and will flock to Nike as a result.
 

RedOctober3829

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
39,373
deep inside Guido territory
My source have their number closer to $4B
https://news.nike.com/news/nike-inc-reports-fiscal-2018-fourth-quarter-and-full-year-results

BEAVERTON, Ore., June 28, 2018 - NIKE, Inc. (NYSE:NKE) today reported financial results for its fiscal 2018 fourth quarter and full year ended May 31, 2018.

Fourth quarter revenue increased 13 percent to $9.8 billion driven by strong double-digit revenue growth in international markets and NIKE Direct globally, and a return to growth in North America. Diluted earnings per share for the fourth quarter rose 15 percent to $0.69, primarily due to strong revenue growth, gross margin expansion, a lower tax rate and a lower average share count, which were partially offset by higher selling and administrative expense.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 24, 2002
29,095
Revenue is not profit. I think they made 4 on 10b in sales
I think revenue is the key metric here my Never Nude friend. All else equal, analysts would want to see how this campaign impacts their top line (revenue) number as there are many factors that can contribute to profitability (e.g. input costs).
 

Mystic Merlin

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 21, 2007
30,651
Hartford, CT
I tend to agree with those who think that Nike has this figured out the right way and the NFL is stupid, all of the evidence points to both of those things being true. But Nike doesn’t just sell a pair of socks to someone and then sit back and count their money. They need the people who bought the pair of socks to buy a bunch more the next time he or she needs socks. So, yeah, tearing up the socks doesn’t hurt Nike in the moment, but if the person tearing up the socks also doesn’t buy Nike socks the next time he needs socks that’s a problem for Nike.

The same thing was true for the whole Keurig thing, and actually more acutely true since they make their money on the pods not the machines, so smashing the machines actually does hurt them if the person smashing the machine is no longer buying pods.

Now having said all of that I think Keurig is fine and I think Nike will be fine, but not because they already banked the money from these idiots, but because ultimately I think the MAGAs are are in the minority and also not very disciplined about this kind of thing, and there are a tremendous number of people who support what Kaepernick is doing and will flock to Nike as a result.
Plus, what better way to cement your standing with the tens of millions of kids from 5-20 years old, who will buy your products for years and have kids who will also buy your products, etc. Not only is your brand 'cool' (it already was), but now it - at least in the sense a commercial brand for products like shoes can 'matter' - matters.

Alienating people like the sound guy for 'Big and Rich' is a small price to pay for that.

And what do these outrage trolls do if Adidas, Reebok, etc., come out with similar campaigns? Stitch their own socks?
 

teddywingman

Looks like Zach Galifianakis
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2009
8,053
a basement on the hill
I haven’t purchased any Nike product for myself or worn anything Nike in over thirty years (since Spike Lee said Larry Bird was overrated) but maybe I’ll rethink that now.
This is where I'm at, though I forgot about Spike Lee calling Larry Bird overrated. I don't really need any Nike stuff, but my daughter does.
 

Kliq

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 31, 2013
10,017
I feel like the number of people who are burning their Nike stuff is going to be evened out by the people enthusiastically purchasing the Kaepernick gear. The large majority of people probably don't feel strongly either way.
 

singaporesoxfan

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 21, 2004
8,039
Washington, DC
I feel like the number of people who are burning their Nike stuff is going to be evened out by the people enthusiastically purchasing the Kaepernick gear. The large majority of people probably don't feel strongly either way.
Another business factor is if the decision makes athletes (many of who seem pro-Kaep) more likely to sign with Nike
 

Red(s)HawksFan

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 23, 2009
10,791
Maine
Love the ignoramuses on Twitter punctuating their anti-Nike stance by declaring they're going to go with brand X instead, unaware that Nike owns brand X. Like this doofus Taylor Twellman called out last night...

 

mauf

Anderson Cooper x Mr. Rogers
Staff member
Dope
Gold Supporter
I think revenue is the key metric here my Never Nude friend. All else equal, analysts would want to see how this campaign impacts their top line (revenue) number as there are many factors that can contribute to profitability (e.g. input costs).
Depends. Nike makes (either directly or using a contract manufacturer) and sells some products for its own account, and has license deals for others where it earns a royalty on net sales and someone else owns the P/L. It wouldn’t surprise me if this controversy helps the core sneaker business but hurts demand for, say, athletic socks (which is almost certainly a licensed product). So I think you’d have to look deeper than top-line sales to evaluate how this move affects Nike’s business.
 

Caspir

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
5,248
Personally I think it’s fantastic. As a business move, we’ll see how it works out for them. I can see how this would attract more athletes, particularly athletes of color, to Nike as a choice sponsor, which as we know drives kids to want their sneakers/attire/etc. But they are basically making the exact opposite calculation that the NFL has made in terms of which way the sports-consuming public will lean on this issue.
Jemele Hill pointed it out, but this isn't Nike's first rodeo. Jordans we're banned from the NBA, and Nike went with black pitch men when doing so was seen as risky and bad for business. Buck is way off. They're not playing some short term, "Omg our stock dipped," nonsense. This is a long term play that will pay off big since it is a stance against fucking shit heads, and taking a stand for equality and decency.

Dude who cut his socks looks like he used garden shears while having a seizure.
 

bosox4283

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 2, 2004
3,874
Philadelphia
Keep your eyes on the stock price.

This will ultimately determine how happy the shareholders / markets are with this campaign.
Nike is a global brand. Some of the world's top football/soccer teams are sponsored by Nike and wear the logo on their kits: Atletico de Madrid, Chelsea, Tottenham, Paris Saint Germain, Barcelona, and Manchester City. That a small portion of MAGA yahoos are going to boycott the brand is a drop in Nike's multi-billion-dollar bucket.
 

sonofgodcf

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 17, 2005
625
The toilet.
Depends. Nike makes (either directly or using a contract manufacturer) and sells some products for its own account, and has license deals for others where it earns a royalty on net sales and someone else owns the P/L. It wouldn’t surprise me if this controversy helps the core sneaker business but hurts demand for, say, athletic socks (which is almost certainly a licensed product). So I think you’d have to look deeper than top-line sales to evaluate how this move affects Nike’s business.
Right. JR286 is (I believe) Nike's biggest licensing partner for socks & equipment. They're privately held though, so it will be difficult to see how this affects them. I think it will be pretty minimal either way though.
 

Ale Xander

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 31, 2013
22,511
This is a brilliant move, and people (not particularly here) are overrating how risky it is. Nike's buying demographic is so much different than the MAGA crowd. Bonus points for the NFL FU
 

HomeRunBaker

bet squelcher
SoSH Member
Jan 15, 2004
17,985
Keep your eyes on the stock price.

This will ultimately determine how happy the shareholders / markets are with this campaign.
I relate Nike's stock to that of Target when the gender issue of their restrooms hit the headlines. The initial hit is a given as the markets hate controversy and uncertainty. Once that dies down in a day or two, Ale Xander hits nail on the head with his post above. This is a millennials market and the large majority are supportive of this cause.
 

Jed Zeppelin

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2008
35,227
Nike will be around in 5/10/25 years. Kaep will be too, quite possibly as a significant national leader.

Guys like Trump, Kraft, Jones, Ross, McNair, et al, will be dead and gone. Nike knows what they’re doing.
 

mauf

Anderson Cooper x Mr. Rogers
Staff member
Dope
Gold Supporter
I relate Nike's stock to that of Target when the gender issue of their restrooms hit the headlines. The initial hit is a given as the markets hate controversy and uncertainty. Once that dies down in a day or two, Ale Xander hits nail on the head with his post above. This is a millennials market and the large majority are supportive of this cause.
Unfortunately, the consensus is that Target suffered for its decision to take a stand on bathroom access for trans people. But I think the analogy to Nike is flawed in a number of ways. In particular, Target seemed to be caught off-guard by the vehemence of the backlash; Nike assuredly won’t be similarly surprised.
 

Joe Sixpack

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Sep 9, 2002
4,048
Mansfield, MA
Unfortunately, the consensus is that Target suffered for its decision to take a stand on bathroom access for trans people. But I think the analogy to Nike is flawed in a number of ways. In particular, Target seemed to be caught off-guard by the vehemence of the backlash; Nike assuredly won’t be similarly surprised.
Consensus based on what? Conservative financial analysts who disagreed with the policy?

They suffered short term a bit, sure, but their stock price and profits have all recovered nicely.
 

slamminsammya

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2006
2,852
Palo Alto
I am happy to see Kaep rewarded for what in my opinion is the right thing. But as far as Nike goes, this is up there with the State Street girl stares down the bull statue in terms of people suddenly rooting for a soulless massive corporation.
 

soxin6

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
2,814
Huntington Beach, CA
While boycotts of local business can be effective in forcing them to change or driving them out of business, national boycotts are rarely sustainable. The people that are boycotting Nike today will forget all about that in a few months when a big sale happens. This will be a great tool for Nike to market to other athletes and try to build up their young customer base, but this was a business decision that was pushed by Adidas and Puma reaching out to Kaep.

The only issue I have with the initial promo is that Kaep didn't give up everything. He was not going to get the kind of money he seems to think he deserves, whether he had taken a knee or not. He was an average to below average QB once defenses adjusted to what he does well. While there are many 49er fans that support his protests, none of them wish they still had Kaep instead of Jimmy G.