The Game Goat Thread: Wk. 1 @ Miami

[8slim]

I guess I’m just basing my “not worried” on the last 22 years. This team has talent on offense — they need to get the OL in line, and with Wynn/Andrews/Owenwu/Strange/Brown, that feels like they will get it figured out. They should have a solid running game with Harris/Stevenson. They have enough WRs/TEs to have a passable offense with Meyers/Parker/Agholor/Bourne and Henry/Smith. I was much more concerned about the defense this year — but they have some talent there, and I am counting on the Belichicks to figure it out.

They have a tough schedule this year — Vegas had the over/under at 8.5 — that feels about right, and I think they can get closer to 10 wins with the Belichick factor, a mild leap from Mac, and some luck.

Appreciate the reply. I’ve always been an In Bill We Trust guy as well, but this year feels different. I’m really, really down on the offensive coaching situation. And while the D hung in there today, I’m concerned that Miami isn’t the caliber of O we’re going to face more often than not this year. Hoping for the best.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

This has to be the first game since the start of the BB era when I felt almost no emotion during and after the game. That means I had no expectations going into it.

Like the current Sox season, I'd be "happy" to see the young players develop.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

It's game 1, and they clearly are still figuring out who they are. That's ok, but it is hard to feel great about what we saw especially offensively.

I didn't have the same read on the Ogbah sack---the math is that three vs two is a problem for the TE/QB moreso than Brown. Not sure he had the right read himself, but he wasn't the real problem there...no matter who he takes there's a free rusher. Not sure what people wanted him to do---was there some line call we think he should have made differently? On other plays---yeah, not good. Overall, line was weak.

The strength of the offense (if there is one) is the running backs. I'd like to seem them lean into that, both more running plays and using them as pass-catchers more often. That might help set up the short passing game that Mac has flashed talent at running...and it seems to fit the OL better than drop-back passing does. It's early, so we'll see.

Defense looked pretty good up until fourth quarter, where it seemed like they lost their starch. Considering only Judon and Dugger really flashed that is not a bad defensive performance, even allowing for Tua's weakness. Can't say the DB play inspired great confidence but it didn't kill them (only one really awful play, and that right after Phillips went out).

 

[JohnnyK]

For me it is certainly the offensive line and Trent Brown in particular. Especially on the strip and touchdown he didn't even seem to notice the guy creeping up to the line.
Then Mac for reasons already stated by others. I really hate that almost any play looks like a touch pass without any zip.
And while the D line was good against the run I am a little disappointed we didn't see more pressure, especially fromBarmore.

Also, something that has been irking me for a while now is the lack of urgency displayed. It always feels like the Patriots are satisfied with running the clock down even when trailing as if they expect to be able to score quickly at any point to make up a deficit. Which they are decidedly not.

 

[BaseballJones]

Should be among the top priorities for the next offseason to bring in a player like this who can actually get open without being schemed open, especially for a QB whose game is largely predicated on precision passing.

If camp was any indication, they have that guy on the roster. He’s just recovering from a broken collarbone right now.

 

[Van Everyman]

Bedard is happy at least:

The days of Belichick ripping his team a new one, just being downright miserable about a loss — Bill Parcells long ago nicknamed Belichick "Doom" — seem to be just about gone. Now we're left with Brightside Bill.

After his team trailed the Dolphins by at least two scores for over 37 minutes, after falling behind 17-0 at halftime to a rookie coach installing a new offense with a defense missing a top cornerback, after giving up a strip-sack score and two fourth downs — the second of which went for a 41-yard touchdown — after his new-look offense was totally punchless and needed 15 plays and nearly 9 minutes to score its first touchdown of the year in the third quarter, and after allowing Tua Tagovailoa to beat him for the FOURTH STRAIGHT TIME, Belichick had this to say after the game:

"Well, it's obviously a disappointing start here," Belichick said. "It was really a pretty even game. Two big plays, 14 points, really skewed the game."

Really a pretty even game.

Two big plays really skewed the game.

What in the Sam hell is he talking about?

Is he technically correct? Yes. But that was one very rose-colored way to look at this game.

There was the 2020 salary cap excuse. There were the last two Bills losses last year, when the defense reportedly did show up to those games, and Belichick wondered if they were just bad nights or if that's who they were. Evidently the answer was no, because Belichick and his coaches constantly talk about how statistically they were a good defense last year (ignoring how they did that vs. bad or injured offenses). Belichick even did it twice in an interview with Dan Shaughnessy just this week:

"We were pretty high up there statistically last year. We didn’t play well obviously in the Buffalo game and a couple of other games, but I wouldn’t say we had a bad year defensively. At least not statistically."

I thought stats were for losers and the scoreboard was the only thing that mattered.

Belichick is blissfully whistling past the graveyard, probably because he's surrounded by all his guys now on his coaching staff. Maybe it's tougher for him to put the screws to them like he did the former coaches around here.

 

[lexrageorge]

Typical nonsense take from Bedard. Not sure what the team was supposed to do about the 2020 salary cap issues; Bedard was supportive when the team kicked the can down the road in the prior years. He should stick to analyzing plays.

 

[Silverdude2167]

Man it's amazing how all the sudden the Dolphins are a joke of a team and how could they have lost to them...with that write up I am sure he had the Pats finishing ahead of the Dolphins this year...right, huh.

 

[MuppetAsteriskTalk]

What does "put the screws to them" even mean? Like if Bill just yells at the coaches, they will do a better job? And Bedard's theory is that they're his buddies so he doesn't want to yell at them? Seems like an amazingly childish take.

 

[MuppetAsteriskTalk]

I remember when the Pats were getting smoked on the scoreboard at the half in the Falcons super bowl and Belichick had similar things to say about how the game was actually going from his perspective.

 

[BigSoxFan]

This team can only survive with a strong OL. Nothing else really matters at this point. I was disappointed in the OL yesterday. I get they need time to gel but there is solid talent across the board and we used our top pick on Strange. Our best 2 offensive players are RBs. We can’t get ourselves into negative game scripts.

 

[BigJimEd]

I didn't have the same read on the Ogbah sack---the math is that three vs two is a problem for the TE/QB moreso than Brown. Not sure he had the right read himself, but he wasn't the real problem there...no matter who he takes there's a free rusher. Not sure what people wanted him to do---was there some line call we think he should have made differently? On other plays---yeah, not good. Overall, line was weak.

Yeah, I'm not sure that was Brown's fault either. Maybe TE is expected to at least chip there. Could be a hot read. Maybe RB slides over. Could be several things. A breakdown for sure but not necessarily by Brown or only by Brown. Good play and good timing by the defense as well.

 

[BigJimEd]

I keep coming back to when Belichick said he's at the point in his career where he just wants to coach the players he wants to coach. I would assume this also applies to working with the coaches he wants to work with. Responding to the loss of McDaniels by bringing back his old assistant buddies to fill the void tells me BB just isn't interested in coaching development at this point in his career, apart from sons, perhaps.

While he's always been a disciplinarian, everything starting from moving on from Brady shows me a coach who's old, tired, and wants a comfortable situation of players and coaches who ho don't challenge his authority in any way. This to me is a dying administration that I fear isn't going to end as gracefully as the Brady era did.

That "comment" is from over 5 years ago and second hand. We don't really know the context but Meyer seemed to suggest Belichick wanted guys with the same goal and passion for the game. More focused. Patriots won at least one SB since then and probably several since Belichick adopted this "viewpoint."

As for the bolded do you have any evidence of this? We've heard from people that Belichick likes and encourages different ideas and pushback. I have some questions about the offensive staff but neither Judge nor Patricia seem like "yes" men to me. I don't see those two biting their tongues and sitting quietly.


edit: Brady stuff has been covered to death. No need to rehash it again.

 

[Helmet Head]

This has to be the first game since the start of the BB era when I felt almost no emotion during and after the game. That means I had no expectations going into it.

Like the current Sox season, I'd be "happy" to see the young players develop.

100% the same and it was a very odd feeling to watch a Patriots game with little to no emotion after the last 2 decades . When they gave up a TD at the end of the half all I could do was laugh. That wouldn’t have been the case a few years back.

Just hope they get better as the season progresses to give us hope for the future. Not in any way writing this season off after week 1 but had very little expectations coming in so not exactly surprised by what happened.

 

[BigJimEd]

Yeah, had no expectation going in. Emotion ramped up some during game but not terribly upset by loss. I'd also "be 'happy' to see the young players develop."

 

[BigSoxFan]

This has to be the first game since the start of the BB era when I felt almost no emotion during and after the game. That means I had no expectations going into it.

Like the current Sox season, I'd be "happy" to see the young players develop.

Agreed. Here we are against a team I have historically hated and right after the game, I was like, "ok, whatever". I'm at the point where I'm almost rooting for a bad season that gives us some high picks because the talent level on this team just isn't impressive. Thus, I'm pretty much ok with any result for any game this year. If they want to scratch and claw their way to a playoff spot, go for it. If it never comes together and they pick top 10...let's do it.

 

[Ralphwiggum]

I'm more or less there too, with the one caveat that if the team is bad and the talent level on offense is what it appears to be, it is going to be really hard to figure out whether Mac is the answer at QB or not. If you look at teams that try to rebuild the ones that spend years dicking around with mediocre (or worse, bad) QBs are the ones that are never able to make the leap to being a SB contender again. I don't think Mac is bad, but I'm not sure he's good either. The Pats need to figure out whether Mac is the answer or not by no later than 2023 IMO.

 

[Petagine in a Bottle]

So, it’s a bridge year?

 

[Van Everyman]

I'm more or less there too, with the one caveat that if the team is bad and the talent level on offense is what it appears to be, it is going to be really hard to figure out whether Mac is the answer at QB or not. If you look at teams that try to rebuild the ones that spend years dicking around with mediocre (or worse, bad) QBs are the ones that are never able to make the leap to being a SB contender again. I don't think Mac is bad, but I'm not sure he's good either. The Pats need to figure out whether Mac is the answer or not by no later than 2023 IMO.

They’ve already detrrmined Mac is good/“The Guy.” That’s what last year and the splurge on FA was about. Now they’re building the team around him, I think.

I’m not saying I expected them to lose yesterday – but I would’ve been surprised if they won. Not because I think they’re terrible or because I’m convinced BB has lost his Fb and surrounded himself with yes men. But because they often need time for things to come together (2014 and 2021 being good examples as well as 2018 IIRC). And clearly they have some stuff they’re working on right now.

That said, I actually thought things looked better to me than the results yesterday – or what I expected. I completely expected people to lose their shit about two three and outs on offense … and then I either happened. In fact, they seemed to move the ball pretty well on a number of their drives. They just didn’t finish them

Other things: The great Bourne catch (and throw). Agholar looked speedy and dangerous (also, that sure seems like a questionable fumble). Jacoby made a number of great plays. Jonnu looked more like a weapon than at any point last season. And the defense, for. 100 degree day, played well until the end.

Obviously the results weren’t great. But for a game where they only put up 7 points, I was a lot happier with how they played and looked than games where they played badly but put up 20+ points.

 

[Arroyoyo]

They had 271 yards of total offense.

And the one touchdown was a wide open, uncovered receiver in the flat that had to scoop the ball low and roll into the end zone with nothing but ghosts covering him.

We can point to historical struggles in Miami, but those teams were MUCH more talented (and different) than this team.

I saw a lot of the same as last year: Jonnu mostly MIA, Henry disappearing this week and he’ll probably reappear next week, Agholor making no substantial impact, Meyers being our best receiver just by putting up #3 receiver numbers. Oh, and the “strong group” of RBs being nonfactors because we fell behind quickly so we mostly had to abandon the run.

 

[BaseballJones]

Yeah, I'm not sure that was Brown's fault either. Maybe TE is expected to at least chip there. Could be a hot read. Maybe RB slides over. Could be several things. A breakdown for sure but not necessarily by Brown or only by Brown. Good play and good timing by the defense as well.

On that play, there were two guys that Brown "was responsible for" if he didn't get help. The DE and then the blitzer. As big as Brown is, he can't handle two guys. If he slides over to take the blitzer, the DE just has a straight shot to Mac. On that play there should have been some help. Or the pass should have been delivered in like a second (literally). Neither happened, and one of those two guys was going to get a totally clean run at him. Turned out that Brown took the inside guy and left the outside guy. But if he took the outside guy, then the inside guy would have gotten Mac. Either way, what else was Brown supposed to do?

So I think Mac should take the heat for not recognizing that and sliding protection or something.

 

[Bigdogx]

It's going to be a long year, I said 3-5 wins here a month ago and i might need to revise that down a bit.

And Ralph i'm with you on that, sorry but i'm in the Mac is average at best camp. I think he has some good smarts with directing an offense but his arm strength is yikes to me at times.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

If camp was any indication, they have that guy on the roster. He’s just recovering from a broken collarbone right now.

Fair. I do still think they need a jitterbug slot guy for the middle of the field too with Thornton as more of a downfield guy.

 

[Ralphwiggum]

They’ve already detrrmined Mac is good/“The Guy.” That’s what last year and the splurge on FA was about. Now they’re building the team around him, I think.

I mean, OK, but I think the jury is most definitely still out on Mac and if they have already 100% determined he's the guy that's a massive mistake. They only scored 7 points yesterday, Mac definitely missed some easy throws, and looked more like a rookie at times than he did most of last year. The o-line was trash and there's nobody he's throwing the ball to who defenses have to gameplan for so it's not all on him, but that's precisely my point. I want Mac to succeed but if he's not the guy and they are already all-in on him being the guy we will be sitting here in 3-5 years hoping they tank in order to draft a QB.

 

[moondog80]

Does Agholor lose time because of the fumble? I thought it more of a good defensive play -- he got popped pretty good, right on the ball.

 

[Arroyoyo]

It's going to be a long year, I said 3-5 wins here a month ago and i might need to revise that down a bit.

And Ralph i'm with you on that, sorry but i'm in the Mac is average at best camp. I think he has some good smarts with directing an offense but his arm strength is yikes to me at times.

I’m starting to wonder if Mac would make a great offensive coordinator.

 

[Arroyoyo]

Does Agholor lose time because of the fumble? I thought it more of a good defensive play -- he got popped pretty good, right on the ball.

I think he loses time because he’s largely unproductive, especially in his role as the “X” receiver meant to draw the safety’s attention and open the middle of the field up for our TE’s and slot receivers.

He has to be one of the worst signings, with Jonnu, in the last decade on this team. We all questioned Agholor at the money they signed him at the day it happened, and it’s clear we were all correct in doing so.

 

[Toe Nash]

It just feels the attention to detail is missing. The offsides on the fourth down play. The first team offense has not looked sharp in the preseason and today. I just wish they had a guy who was a threat to suddenly get open. This team has always had an Edelman, Welker, or Brown or a bailout back like White, Vereen or Foulke.

This was a problem last year as well. The offense was good but when it struggled it was because whoever they schemed didn't get open and no one could reliably win a one-on-one matchup. From a staff who has always unearthed guys like the above for relatively cheap it's disappointing that they didn't and their hope was James White...it could be partially that these guys are more in demand around the league.

 

[lexrageorge]

Does Agholor lose time because of the fumble? I thought it more of a good defensive play -- he got popped pretty good, right on the ball.

The pass, like many others, seemed to miss its location and left Agholor exposed to that very type of play.

 

[BigSoxFan]

I must admit that Mac's struggles and yesterday's SNF game got me thinking about an alternate universe where Micah Parsons falls to #15 (or we trade up) and then we take Davis Mills in the 3rd round. Just one game so hopefully he improves but some of those throws yesterday were...concerning.

 

[teddykgb]

In regards to the defense, it felt like a classic Patriots approach of trying to limit big plays (failed there) and force the other team to execute consistently. I wonder about that approach in a post Brady world — they basically bet on Brady’s ability to execute more plays over 60 minutes than the other team .

I don’t think they played poorly yesterday but Tua looked pretty bad and they still had 300 yards and picked up a lot of conversions (6/14 on third down) so it’s not like the defense really smothered them. There’s very little you can do about gifted points but it feels to me like the big picture strategy is still built around a team that no longer exists

 

[NickEsasky]

As loathe as I am to give Bedard credit, he does have a point about how Bill has spoken about the team over the last few years. He's way more positive and much more prone to make excuses since Brady has left. Maybe it's the type of coaching this new team needs, but it does kind of smack a bit of doing PR for himself and where the team is right now.

 

[Van Everyman]

I mean, OK, but I think the jury is most definitely still out on Mac and if they have already 100% determined he's the guy that's a massive mistake. They only scored 7 points yesterday, Mac definitely missed some easy throws, and looked more like a rookie at times than he did most of last year. The o-line was trash and there's nobody he's throwing the ball to who defenses have to gameplan for so it's not all on him, but that's precisely my point. I want Mac to succeed but if he's not the guy and they are already all-in on him being the guy we will be sitting here in 3-5 years hoping they tank in order to draft a QB.

What I mean is, I think they are building the team as if he is the guy -- the personnel, the offensive system, etc. Obviously if he follows up last year's pretty promising season with two turds, I'm sure Bill will reevaluate. But as you say, a lot of it is building the team per se.

But you are right: it's hard to look at a QB in a vacuum. For instance, while some of Mac's throws yesterday were crappy, it's hard to separate them from his comfort with the protection -- think back to the Raiders pre-season game where he scrambled outside of the protection right into a sack.

I think they're still figuring things out. I know it's not satisfying and gives the Bedards of the world all kinds of fodder to panic and draw conclusions about the Old Man in the Mountain stubbornly refusing to change with the times, hiring yes men and whistling weak pep talks down the graveyard to a dejected and under-talented team. But as I said, I saw more there yesterday than I saw at any point during camp -- they weren't running play after play into the defensive line. Mac wasn't chucking prayers to guys covered by three defensive players. They had plenty of moments, but didn't finish. It's easy to say but they just need to do it more consistently.

 

[Ed Hillel]

At the end of the day, Mac was 21-30 and the INT should have resulted in PI and almost certainly 7. He had a few bad throws, but it's not like he was a disaster out there, and the OL had 5-10 breakdowns that left him exposed. I really wanted to see him with Thornton this season (a WR who might actually be above average), so I guess we'll just have to wait, but the schedule this year is brutal and I don't expect they'll be going anywhere. Also, our offense is coached by not offensive coaches, so that's probably bad.

 

[8slim]

As loathe as I am to give Bedard credit, he does have a point about how Bill has spoken about the team over the last few years. He's way more positive and much more prone to make excuses since Brady has left. Maybe it's the type of coaching this new team needs, but it does kind of smack a bit of doing PR for himself and where the team is right now.

I said it upthread, but I've seen this dynamic transpire in other sports. Long-tenured, very successful coach gets into his 70s and builds a staff/program that is designed, among other things, to bring him more comfort and joy. I'm sure BB really enjoys coaching with his sons, and with Patricia and Judge. And I don't blame him for wanting that, since he literally just concluded the most prolific 20 years in the history of the game. But I'm not sure it ultimately yields championship-caliber teams.

 

[SMU_Sox]

The strip sack was on Brown and not the TE. Brown had 2 awful blown assignments that both lead to sacks, a holding penalty (might have been declined because incomplete) and some bad run whiffs including on the negative outside zone play with Stevenson. He was truly dreadful. I know picking up a late blitzer is tough but he had issues in the second half of last season doing it too. Teams are going to throw that at them. Recovering from negative plays is hard enough and more so when you don’t generate explosive plays.

 

[BigSoxFan]

At the end of the day, Mac was 21-30 and the INT should have resulted in PI and almost certainly 7. He had a few bad throws, but it's not like he was a disaster out there, and the OL had 5-10 breakdowns that left him exposed. I really wanted to see him with Thornton this season (a WR who might actually be above average), so I guess we'll just have to wait, but the schedule this year is brutal and I don't expect they'll be going anywhere. Also, our offense is coached by not offensive coaches, so that's probably bad.

Mac isn't anywhere near the top of the list of this team's problems but he wasn't very good either. We'll see if the OL can improve to a point where we can actually see what he can do. If Brown is consistently as bad as he was yesterday, we're in trouble regardless. The OL just HAS to improve.

And having Patricia/Judge managing all of this is just pouring salt on the wound. I miss Josh already.

 

[8slim]

At the end of the day, Mac was 21-30 and the INT should have resulted in PI and almost certainly 7. He had a few bad throws, but it's not like he was a disaster out there, and the OL had 5-10 breakdowns that left him exposed. I really wanted to see him with Thornton this season (a WR who might actually be above average), so I guess we'll just have to wait, but the schedule this year is brutal and I don't expect they'll be going anywhere. Also, our offense is coached by not offensive coaches, so that's probably bad.

Not a disaster, but going 21-30 doesn't really tell you much given the way the game is played these days. 20 QBs had a 60% or better completion rate yesterday. His QB rating was square in the middle of the pack, which I think seems right. He was mediocre.

 

[BaseballJones]

Does Agholor lose time because of the fumble? I thought it more of a good defensive play -- he got popped pretty good, right on the ball.

The instant he caught it he got drilled. I mean, yeah, hold onto the ball, but that was a tough one for him.

 

[Ed Hillel]

The strip sack was on Brown and not the TE. Brown had 2 awful blown assignments that both lead to sacks, a holding penalty (might have been declined because incomplete) and some bad run whiffs including on the negative outside zone play with Stevenson. He was truly dreadful. I know picking up a late blitzer is tough but he had issues in the second half of last season doing it too. Teams are going to throw that at them. Recovering from negative plays is hard enough and more so when you don’t generate explosive plays.

Hmm, well Brown and the LG (forget who it was at the time) both picked up other men right off the snap, so someone was going to get through if Henry didn't participate.

Not a disaster, but going 21-30 doesn't really tell you much given the way the game is played these days. 20 QBs had a 60% or better completion rate yesterday. His QB rating was square in the middle of the pack, which I think seems right. He was mediocre.

I agree, I thought he was average.

 

[BaseballJones]

Mac isn't anywhere near the top of the list of this team's problems but he wasn't very good either. We'll see if the OL can improve to a point where we can actually see what he can do. If Brown is consistently as bad as he was yesterday, we're in trouble regardless. The OL just HAS to improve.

And having Patricia/Judge managing all of this is just pouring salt on the wound. I miss Josh already.

Here's what I think about Mac: He's not the guy that elevates the team and carries them. He throws a nice ball most of the time. Hits his targets most of the time. I think he throws a very pretty deep ball. But he's not the guy who, when other things aren't working, can just bail the team out.

There's nothing wrong with this. You can win with a guy like that. You can win a lot. But the other guys have to "do their job", and too many guys didn't do their jobs yesterday.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Chad Graff of Athletic had an interesting stat: Pats used only two personnel formations, 28 plays with 11 personnel and 26 with 12 personnel.

That is really interesting---only one other team (Panthers) used just two personnel formations. And historically, Pats were a lot more multiple than that. Is it about defense, QB, line, or some combo? Or is this the direction they are going----I didn't watch enough pre-season to assess that but I am sure some of you did....

 

[BaseballJones]

I must admit that Mac's struggles and yesterday's SNF game got me thinking about an alternate universe where Micah Parsons falls to #15 (or we trade up) and then we take Davis Mills in the 3rd round. Just one game so hopefully he improves but some of those throws yesterday were...concerning.

Every QB makes throws that are "concerning". Even Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes. They've all thrown some godawful passes. Plenty of them.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Here's what I think about Mac: He's not the guy that elevates the team and carries them. He throws a nice ball most of the time. Hits his targets most of the time. I think he throws a very pretty deep ball. But he's not the guy who, when other things aren't working, can just bail the team out.

There's nothing wrong with this. You can win with a guy like that. You can win a lot. But the other guys have to "do their job", and too many guys didn't do their jobs yesterday.

I would tend to agree. But the real question is can you win like that in a league with Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, Herbert, Wilson, Jackson, Watson (ugh), etc.?

The rest of your team has to be pretty damn good to overcome the fact that your QB can’t make plays.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Every QB makes throws that are "concerning". Even Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes. They've all thrown some godawful passes. Plenty of them.

This is a silly point. The concerning throws from Mac are mostly physical limitations. Those other guys are light years ahead of him in that department. Mac’s lack of arm strength is a real issue for this team.

 

[Hoya81]

I just don’t understand rolling the dice with Patricia/Judge on offense when there’s a number of former Pats offensive assistants around the league who worked under McDaniels or O’Brien and would have at least maintained some continuity. Unless there’s some kind of beef between BB and the likes of Godsey, O’Shea, Schuplinski, it seems like malpractice to not bring one of them in.

 

[lexrageorge]

Yeah, I think the jury is definitely out if a team that relies upon "QB that does a few things well but cannot carry a team" can win consistently in today's NFL. The league play has changed drastically since Trent Dilfer won that Super Bowl.

I also think the Pats used a first round pick on Jones assuming he will be able to carry the team from time to time.

 

[Mystic Merlin]

I would tend to agree. But the real question is can you win like that in a league with Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, Herbert, Wilson, Jackson, Watson (ugh), etc.?

The rest of your team has to be pretty damn good to overcome the fact that your QB can’t make plays.

It’s gonna be hard to get to the upper reaches of the playoffs every year, and maximizing your legitimate bites at the apple is how most teams eventually win a Super Bowl.

But, like, finding one of those elite guys is not easy and takes luck, so what can you do?

 

[BigSoxFan]

It’s gonna be hard to get to the upper reaches of the playoffs every year, and maximizing your legitimate bites at the apple is how most teams eventually win a Super Bowl.

But, like, finding one of those elite guys is not easy and takes luck, so what can you do?

To be clear, I'm not lamenting the fact that Mac isn't one of those guys. Coming out of the Brady departure, our options were limited and Mac probably is/was the best option. The only thing the Pats can do here is to have a really strong OL and coach to the players' strengths. Right now, the OL sucks and our offensive coaches are completely unproven in their new roles. It's just a bad formula. Hopefully, the OL improves and they clearly tried to address it with the Strange pick. But letting Patricia/Judge guide your young QBs progression...meh.

Cellar posted a good tweet in the other thread about how Mac is more effective throwing out of play action and the Pats called 2 PA yesterday. That would appear to be in conflict to the "playing to your strengths" point. In short, I have confidence that Mac could be decent-to-good NFL QB. We already saw that last year.

What I don't have confidence in is Patricia/Judge getting him there. But BB wanted them in the role so what do I know. I just know that, on the surface, it feels like a very bad fit.

 

[JohnnyK]

The strip sack was on Brown and not the TE.

Spoiler

I grabbed this from Gamepass, Brown and Ferentz both initially block Ingram, Ferentz then switches to the guy Andrews is blocking. Neither Brown nor Henry ever look at the extra rusher creeping up and Henry runs a short route.