Red Sox Rumors - Just Kidding

YTF

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I am all for rumors of any stripe and credibility level! Keep ‘em coming. They give us something to talk about, which is fun. But that Trevor Bauer blog post is not in any way a rumor. It’s not even a thought experiment. It’s barely disguised click bait, with the writer himself acknowledging, immediately after asking the question of whether the Sox should sign Bauer, that it will not happen because the Sox have historically avoided players with a history of domestic abuse and violence. There is no need for us to treat this as a rumor because it is not a rumor. The Red Sox are not contemplating signing Trevor Bauer. He will not play for this team. None of us has to worry about our fandom being put in any kind of moral quandary. I love rumors, no matter how shaky their source! More, more, more! This, however, is not a rumor and requires no discussion or rebuttal.
I fully understand where you are coming from, but the only difference between this and half of the other crap in this thread is that it pertains to Bauer. Well intended as it was, this thread has been a free for all from the get go and the title was changed to reflect so.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Did Bauer ever get proven guilty of abuse?
Why does that matter? The league saw fit to suspend him for a year. The Dodgers dropped him like a hot potato. That whatever he did didn't rise to criminal charges doesn't mean he's not entirely too toxic for any club to want to bring on board.
 

jbupstate

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Regarding Bauer - I hope the a Red Sox have a clearly defined process that allows them to look at and review every available talent in an effort to help the team win. I would also hope that process quickly eliminates a Bauer from consideration.

But we all know that talent and production outweighs character. Somebody will sign Bauer for this year because the potential production at a minimum salary could outweigh the criticism.
 

bosox1534

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Dec 17, 2022
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I’m just saying if the guy hasn’t been proven guilty and the league decided that his punishment should be lessened by quite a margin perhaps things aren’t as bad as they seem? I’m still not signing the guy just based on depth we already have but I’m not gonna judge the guys character until something’s proven. Seen it happen to too many other athletes and it ruined their careers.
 

WilhelmScream

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I’m just saying if the guy hasn’t been proven guilty and the league decided that his punishment should be lessened by quite a margin perhaps things aren’t as bad as they seem? I’m still not signing the guy just based on depth we already have but I’m not gonna judge the guys character until something’s proven. Seen it happen to too many other athletes and it ruined their careers.
which ones?
 

bosox1534

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which ones?
A defensive lineman for Baylor named Shawn Oakman was pretty much a guaranteed first round pick who was accused of sexual assault. Proven innocent years later, found out the girl made it up. By then had given up on NFL and played in the CFL for a couple years. Lost millions of dollars
 

bosox1534

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A defensive lineman for Baylor named Shawn Oakman was pretty much a guaranteed first round pick who was accused of sexual assault. Proven innocent years later, found out the girl made it up. By then had given up on NFL and played in the CFL for a couple years. Lost millions of dollars
Devin Ebanks was another one. Former NBA player
 

LogansDad

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Not having charges pressed is not the same thing as innocent. You should try doing some of your own research, but just because they didn't prosecuted doesn't mean he's a guy I am willing to put blinders on to root for. There's enough proof that he's an abhorrent human being for me.
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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I’m not going to war for the guy I just don’t think it’s fair to judge a guy until you know the facts.
Bauer himself had admitted to most of the allegations against him. He is disputing consent and liability.

You really need to read up on his case because the details are horrifying and Bauer AT BEST comes across as a massive scumbag, violent misogynist, and abhorrent person.
 

joe dokes

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A defensive lineman for Baylor named Shawn Oakman was pretty much a guaranteed first round pick who was accused of sexual assault. Proven innocent years later, found out the girl made it up. By then had given up on NFL and played in the CFL for a couple years. Lost millions of dollars
How criminal acquittals should be evaluated by teams is fair game for discussion, but words matter. As far as I know he wasn't "proven innocent" (not that anyone has to be). More imprtnatly though, I can't find anything about the "girl [making] it up." I only looked for a few minutes, but was there some later development where she recanted?
 

LogansDad

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How criminal acquittals should be evaluated by teams is fair game for discussion, but words matter. As far as I know he wasn't "proven innocent" (not that anyone has to be). More imprtnatly though, I can't find anything about the "girl [making] it up." I only looked for a few minutes, but was there some later development where she recanted?
No. Bauer admitted it. What they couldn't prove was "lack of consent". By a woman who had her skull broken while she was unconscious.
 

joe dokes

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No. Bauer admitted it. What they couldn't prove was "lack of consent". By a woman who had her skull broken while she was unconscious.
I know about Bauer. Dont want him.
I was referring to Shawn Oakman, the Baylor football player in the post I was responding to. (And if a mod says, "why are we talking about a Baylor football player in this thread," I have no objection to deletion).
 

LogansDad

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I know about Bauer. Dont want him.
I was referring to Shawn Oakman, the Baylor football player in the post I was responding to. (And if a mod says, "why are we talking about a Baylor football player in this thread," I have no objection to deletion).
Gotcha, sorry. Seeing red right now.
 

bosox1534

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Dec 17, 2022
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I don’t stand for the guy either i was just curious of the process more than anything. At this point probably best to delete the prior posts. Didn’t want to get this deep into the details I was just more questioning the situation and was confused on the actual allegations. My apologies I will refrain from posting things like this in the future.
 

effectivelywild

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Jul 14, 2005
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He clearly needs to go to a city where the stands are usually empty and the newspapers are all republished AP stories.
Cleveland might work given some Browns' fans antics this year.

The thing for me about Bauer is that he had already shown himself to be a misogynistic dickhead (on Twitter) before all of this came out. I've lived in LA for the last few years and when the Dodgers signed him I was pissed because I enjoy going to Dodger games and didn't want to ever see him pitch. If Boston signed him, I'd be disgusted with the team and would probably get warned by dopes about the amount of vitriol I was posting with. I understand that talent generally trumps everything else but...Bauer hasn't even shown any amount of contrition that could make me even ponder whether he deserves a "second chance."
 

chrisfont9

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I don’t stand for the guy either i was just curious of the process more than anything. At this point probably best to delete the prior posts. Didn’t want to get this deep into the details I was just more questioning the situation and was confused on the actual allegations. My apologies I will refrain from posting things like this in the future.
I think you raise a tricky subject, what are we supposed to do with reports like this? Your line of approach is straight from the US legal system, but as a society I think we've all been challenged to listen carefully to what women say about sexual assaults by men, because of the obstacles they face to being heard and believed. You are right in that we don't literally know what happened and probably never will, but given the power dynamics between a rich and famous baseball player and an anonymous woman, for her to even come forward is not nothing.
 

Daniel_Son

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I’m just saying if the guy hasn’t been proven guilty and the league decided that his punishment should be lessened by quite a margin perhaps things aren’t as bad as they seem? I’m still not signing the guy just based on depth we already have but I’m not gonna judge the guys character until something’s proven. Seen it happen to too many other athletes and it ruined their careers.
Even outside the sexual assault case (and I'm not trying to minimize that at all), he's had a well-documented history of being an immature shithead. Top of mind is him throwing a temper tantrum on the field after getting pulled from a game and harassing college students via Twitter. I want absolutely no part of him.
 

Max Power

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There's a higher level of proof required to send someone to prison than there is to decide not to pay them millions of dollars to play on your team. As there should be. I don't see anything wrong with the situation or if no team decides he's worth the trouble. They're in the entertainment business and positive public opinion is the number one goal for every team.
 

YTF

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I’m just saying if the guy hasn’t been proven guilty and the league decided that his punishment should be lessened by quite a margin perhaps things aren’t as bad as they seem? I’m still not signing the guy just based on depth we already have but I’m not gonna judge the guys character until something’s proven. Seen it happen to too many other athletes and it ruined their careers.
The league didn't decide this, an independent arbitrator retained by both the league and MLBPA came to the decision and applied the time that Bauer spent on paid administrative leave (second half of the '21 season) as partial credit for time served. I'm sure the league and the Dodgers are privy to things that neither you or I are aware of and it's also been reported that some members of the clubhouse advocated for cutting ties with Bauer.
 

BornToRun

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I’m not going to war for the guy I just don’t think it’s fair to judge a guy until you know the facts.
He’s always been an insufferable asshole. The allegations are just more icing on the shitty cake. Dude has an illustrious track record of douchebag behavior.
 

nvalvo

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Conviction or no, Bauer is clearly trouble. And furthermore, the nature of his violent misconduct, coming in an initially consensual sexual relationship, is one of the many flavors of sexual misconduct that our criminal justice system is simply never going to charge and convict. But that leaves us in a situation in which our appropriate moral indignation rightly holds people to a much stricter standard than our tragically inept justice system, which (here as elsewhere) is content to uphold social hierarchies and leave, by some survey-based estimates, 95% of intimate partner violence uncharged.

So if you are an organization like, say, MLB, who understandably doesn't want someone whom the public sees (quite probably correctly) as an unrepentant sexual predator as the ace of one of your flagship franchises, what are you to do about this sort of accusation? One option would be to defer to the legal system, on the understandable justification that you aren't really equipped to come to these kinds of determinations. But... the legal system also isn't equipped to come to these kinds of determinations, as their track record amply demonstrates. Another option would be to set up the kinds of ad hoc "courts" that many college and university campuses have adopted as they also flail around in the void of effective enforcement left by our criminal justice system. That is... another poor option, one that has gone really badly for colleges and universities while also failing to stop sexual misconduct on campus.

I guess I'd probably do more or less what they've in fact done: you hash out with the union a policy for imposing suspensions in cases of credible accusations. And most of the accusations are bad, but not this bad, so people accept whatever suspensions the policy allows as appropriate to a first approximation and everyone can move on. And most of the players are fungible enough that players who do something terrible wash out and cease being the league's problem. The system buckles, however, when the accusations are really vividly bad, as they are here, *and* the courts don't respond adequately, as they so rarely do, *and* the player is good enough on-field that unscrupulous front offices might be tempted to accept the blowback for some good starting pitching. That's tough, because the league should really not be trying to coordinate retribution against a player (even if deserved) in excess of the collectively bargained process. So I guess the league just has to hold its breath and hope no team does something shortsighted here.
 

Rovin Romine

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The league didn't decide this, an independent arbitrator retained by both the league and MLBPA came to the decision and applied the time that Bauer spent on paid administrative leave (second half of the '21 season) as partial credit for time served. I'm sure the league and the Dodgers are privy to things that neither you or I are aware of and it's also been reported that some members of the clubhouse advocated for cutting ties with Bauer.
And in so doing the arbitrator must have implicitly ruled that Bauer violated the MLB Domestic Violence policy. Because no violation means a suspension of 0 games.

Bauer has made his millions, too.
Let's hope the counter-claims against him in his various defamation suits bear fruit. Pocket draining fruit.
 

BeantownIdaho

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Bauer himself had admitted to most of the allegations against him. He is disputing consent and liability.

You really need to read up on his case because the details are horrifying and Bauer AT BEST comes across as a massive scumbag, violent misogynist, and abhorrent person.
I'm not a real Bauer fan for reasons prior to this incident....and I'm not a fan of brining him in... However, he didnt' admit to most of the allegations against him as you suggest.
https://www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/story/2022-02-08/trevor-bauer-will-not-face-criminal-charges-following-sexual-assault-allegation
 

YTF

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And in so doing the arbitrator must have implicitly ruled that Bauer violated the MLB Domestic Violence policy. Because no violation means a suspension of 0 games.



Let's hope the counter-claims against him in his various defamation suits bear fruit. Pocket draining fruit.
Asking because I think you might have some sort of feel for this... Seeing that this arbitrator was retained by both sides here would the MLBPA be privy to info gathered during league and team investigations concerning Bauer? Would they have conducted an investigation of their own? If so, what if anything does this say about the union not backing any further Bauer other than making sure he had MLBPA approved arbitration. There certainly didn't seem to be a groundswell of public support for the guy's innocence.
 

Rovin Romine

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Asking because I think you might have some sort of feel for this... Seeing that this arbitrator was retained by both sides here would the MLBPA be privy to info gathered during league and team investigations concerning Bauer? Would they have conducted an investigation of their own? If so, what if anything does this say about the union not backing any further Bauer other than making sure he had MLBPA approved arbitration. There certainly didn't seem to be a groundswell of public support for the guy's innocence.
Well, I think the line to MLBPA's knowledge is pretty short. First, Bauer's a talker, so I'm sure his teammates have heard some shit. Second, Bauer sued his accusers for defamation. Accordingly, 1) truth is a defense, and 2) he's been counter-sued for sexual assault in at least one case by the victim the original story broke around: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/63262440/trevor-bauer-v-lindsey-c-hill/

Here's the counter claim if you want to read it: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/63262440/36/trevor-bauer-v-lindsey-c-hill/

So, I don't think MLBPA is entirely in the dark about "what happened." That being said, I have no idea if they'd do their own investigation. . .but that seems a bit odd to me. Why would MLBPA want to mix into this in terms of speaking to victims to get their own impression? What's the upside for them in that? I also don't think it's likely there's attorney leaking via any conversations Bauer's counsel would have with MLBPA. I mean, what would that even look like? There's no polite mildly leveraging hypothetical chit-chat that's on the table in the course of negotiating for anything. "So I'm not saying he anally raped this girl after punching her while she was unconscious. . .but I mean, haven't we all been there. . .like 2 or 3 times in our life?" I just don't see it.
 

BringBackMo

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I’m just saying if the guy hasn’t been proven guilty and the league decided that his punishment should be lessened by quite a margin perhaps things aren’t as bad as they seem? I’m still not signing the guy just based on depth we already have but I’m not gonna judge the guys character until something’s proven. Seen it happen to too many other athletes and it ruined their careers.
When are professional athletes going to get a goddamned break in this country?
 

BornToRun

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When are professional athletes going to get a goddamned break in this country?
And again, it’s not like this is the first bit of spotty behavior from Bauer. He has a track record of misogyny and 4chan-style edgelordism. I don’t think it was super surprising that he ended up being accused of criminal acts towards women.
 

HangingW/ScottCooper

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Did Bauer ever get proven guilty of abuse?
Why does that matter? The league saw fit to suspend him for a year. The Dodgers dropped him like a hot potato. That whatever he did didn't rise to criminal charges doesn't mean he's not entirely too toxic for any club to want to bring on board.
Regarding Bauer - I hope the a Red Sox have a clearly defined process that allows them to look at and review every available talent in an effort to help the team win. I would also hope that process quickly eliminates a Bauer from consideration.

But we all know that talent and production outweighs character. Somebody will sign Bauer for this year because the potential production at a minimum salary could outweigh the criticism.
The Red Sox have to operate using the court of public opinion. For that reason alone, Bauer should be a non-starter. Until such time that he's fully exonerated, they shouldn't even talk about it.
Cleveland might work given some Browns' fans antics this year.

The thing for me about Bauer is that he had already shown himself to be a misogynistic dickhead (on Twitter) before all of this came out. I've lived in LA for the last few years and when the Dodgers signed him I was pissed because I enjoy going to Dodger games and didn't want to ever see him pitch. If Boston signed him, I'd be disgusted with the team and would probably get warned by dopes about the amount of vitriol I was posting with. I understand that talent generally trumps everything else but...Bauer hasn't even shown any amount of contrition that could make me even ponder whether he deserves a "second chance."
Didn't Francona run him out of town after he showed him up on the mound? This is also Francona that put up with Manny Ramirez for several years.
 

Eddie Bressoud

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Think we just wasted a page on a player the Red Sox will not touch, regardless of value. Bauer needs to get a rehab PR guy, but it won't work in Boston.
Focusing on more relevant things, wonder who we could get for Jarren Duran?
 

Sad Sam Jones

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Didn't Francona run him out of town after he showed him up on the mound? This is also Francona that put up with Manny Ramirez for several years.
His tantrum on the mound was because he was already headed out of town. He got shellacked in what he knew was his last appearance for Cleveland as it was only a few days before the trade deadline.
 

HangingW/ScottCooper

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My comment was the Sox should have a vetting process that turns over every stone and weighs potential rewards versus know risks. Bauer is a POS. But not sure I trust the court of public opinion alone to make business decisions.
When it's about talent on the field, I'd agree with you. When it's about abusing women, I'll side with the court of public opinion.
 

scottyno

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It's not a rumor that I've seen, though most of the recent posts in this thread wouldn't count as rumors, but outside of Correa, Elvis Andrus seems like the best possible fit of any player still available. Position of need, old enough that he isn't going to require a big or long enough contract to block Mayer, and they could slide Arroyo into the utility infielder role, which is something they don't really have right now on their 40 man.
 

rodderick

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When it's about talent on the field, I'd agree with you. When it's about abusing women, I'll side with the court of public opinion.
Right. I mean, what are the odds of him having actually done what he's been accused of doing that you'd be comfortable with? Or merely not being found guilty is enough to not even enter that conversation? I don't want this guy on my team.