Logan Mankins traded to Tampa Bay

[Mugsy's Walk-Off Bunt]

Marcus Cannon has played very little guard here, and hasn't looked even remotely more than slightly above average no matter where he played. The idea that we now may be able to extend Revis AND, what, lock up Marcus Cannon before we "lose" him next year is eight kinds of crazy. I hope to god you're right, but I don't know where the excitement about Cannon is coming from. Today's trade may well work out great, but I seriously doubt "we've gotta find a way to keep Cannon!" factored into the top billion reasons BB et al jettisoned Mankins.

Speaking of, Belichick's glowing, almost nuclear glowing, statement on Mankins:

“Logan Mankins is everything we would ever want in a football player. It is hard to imagine a better player at his position, a tougher competitor or a person to represent our program. He is one of the all-time great Patriots and the best guard I ever coached. Logan brought a quiet but unmistakable presence and leadership that will be impossible to duplicate. Unfortunately, this is the time of year when difficult decisions have to be made -- and this is one of the most difficult we will ever make -- but like every other decision it was made for what we feel is in the best interests of the team.”

 

[Mystic Merlin]

This is about when the Steelers cut ties with Alan Faneca (heading into his age 32 season).

 

[Harry Hooper]

 
 
Mankins was clearly on the downside, he's expensive, and BB got more for him now than he would get at any point after today.  We've had issues on the O Line in the past, but this team is almost a mortal lock for the playoffs barring some sort of apocalyptic injuries, so there is a ton of time for that group to come together throughout the season.  

 
Failure of the OL to keep Brady from being snapped in two will change that mortal lock calculation in a hurry. The margin of error (depth at OL) just took a sizable hit. Whoever takes the LG job essentially is now not available to fill in for Voellmer's inevitable missed games, not available to replace Connolly when he has his next (possibly career-ending) concussion, and so on. Even if the new LG plays better than Mankins would have, the OL as an overall unit can be viewed as weaker than it was yesterday if you assume some injuries during the campaign. It could all work out great, but BB definitely is placing a wager here.

 

[Dirty Sanchez Forever]

Jeez, you are a honk. There is no way you can call this a winner right now. This could be a massive failure.

There is nothing worse than creeping Felgerism.

 

[FredCDobbs]

Bill Belichick Ain't Nothin To Fuck Wit.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

I'll never forget the reaction on draft day by the ESPN crew, including Mel Kiper, when the Pats selected Mankins. They were utterly nonplussed, staring at each other, shuffling through their notes trying to find out who Mankins was and what to say about it. Six Pro-Bowls later and five All-Pro selections, Mankins finally moves on, trailing clouds of glory....

 
Mel Kiper Report Card:
 
New England Patriots: C 

Guard Logan Mankins was a reach in the first round but the Patriots obviously like his size and nastiness, 

Tackle Nick Kaczur could play guard as well but came off the board a little early

and Matt Cassel is a big project at quarterback. 
 
 
 
My report card of Mel Kiper's Report Card: F.

 

[axx]

Isn't Hooman banged up? They had no healthy tight ends. I wouldn't expect Wright to get much playing time against Miami, but they definitely had to get someone until either Hooman or Gronk gets healthy.
 
Be interesting to see how much Wright plays in the game on Thursday.

 

[Corsi]

 

Jason Cole ‏@JasonPhilCole  6m
Two sources said #Pats asked G Logan Mankins to take pay cut before trade. Initial request was right after Pro Bowl last season. He refused
 

 

[mpx42]

Of course they did - might as well check in and see if they can keep him at a lower price. And no surprise he said no.

 

[jsinger121]

Of course they did - might as well check in and see if they can keep him at a lower price. And no surprise he said no.

No surprise but good for the patriots to do this as he isn't worth his salary anymore. He was a pro bowler the last 2 years clearly on reputation and not for his play.

 

[Stitch01]

No surprise but good for the patriots to do this as he isn't worth his salary anymore. He was a pro bowler the last 2 years clearly on reputation and not for his play.

Good business to ask, but given they had little leverage not surprised Mankins said no.  Mankins did a great job maximizing what he got paid for his services.

 

[FL4WL3SS]

Man, I hope you guys are right on Wright, that take seems massively overoptimistic to me.  If Wright is good and contributes meaningfully this year its a very good trade.  I just think that's a lot to expect.
 
According to PFF, Hernandez broke 23 tackles to lead the league in '11, then 9 the next year when he was banged up and missed time.  Wright broke one tackle last year according to the same site.  Maybe there is a massive game charting discrepancy in there somewhere or the usage in each offense is just completely different, but Im not sure he's that similar to Hernandez.

I don't think anybody is saying Wright has to be Hernandez, but I think it's reasonable for people to get excited about the extra dimension to the offense the team hasn't had since Hernandez. In other words, Wright doesn't need to lead the league in broken tackles and put up Hernadezian numbers for him to have a significant impact on the offense.

 

[wutang112878]

I don't think anybody is saying Wright has to be Hernandez, but I think it's reasonable for people to get excited about the extra dimension to the offense the team hasn't had since Hernandez. In other words, Wright doesn't need to lead the league in broken tackles and put up Hernadezian numbers for him to have a significant impact on the offense.

 
+1  At the very least we should be excited that we might have a TE on the roster (besides Gronk obviously) who might be a better passing threat than Hooman

 

[Stitch01]

I don't think anybody is saying Wright has to be Hernandez, but I think it's reasonable for people to get excited about the extra dimension to the offense the team hasn't had since Hernandez. In other words, Wright doesn't need to lead the league in broken tackles and put up Hernadezian numbers for him to have a significant impact on the offense.

I think the post that I responded to said Wright might be the next closest guy to Hernandez in the league and opined he might now be a top ten TE.

 

[Marciano490]

I think the post that I responded to said Wright might be the next closest guy to Hernandez in the league and opined he might now be a top ten TE.

 
In fairness, it said he might now be a top ten fantasy TE.  I don't think you get points for blocking.

 

[RedOctober3829]

Yesterday reminded me of one particular scene in Bill Belichick's A Football Life documentary.  Kraft is on the training camp field talking to Richard Seymour.  They talk about how good the team looks and how many years he's been a Patriot.  Then, they shoot to a meeting with Krafts, BB, Floyd Reese, Nick Caserio, and Berj where Kraft says "Now that the Richard deal is done...." and they begin talking about Vince Wilfork and how the franchise tag works in their favor.  They run a very good business and yesterday shows you they don't care about what your name is.  They will do what they think is best for the franchise.  I've had a day to think it over and I don't like the move any more but I can understand why they did it. 

 

[Stitch01]

 
In fairness, it said he might now be a top ten fantasy TE.  I don't think you get points for blocking.

Very true.  Dont think Hernandez got many points for that either!

 

[54thMA]

Yesterday reminded me of one particular scene in Bill Belichick's A Football Life documentary.  Kraft is on the training camp field talking to Richard Seymour.  They talk about how good the team looks and how many years he's been a Patriot.  Then, they shoot to a meeting with Krafts, BB, Floyd Reese, Nick Caserio, and Berj where Kraft says "Now that the Richard deal is done...." and they begin talking about Vince Wilfork and how the franchise tag works in their favor.  They run a very good business and yesterday shows you they don't care about what your name is.  They will do what they think is best for the franchise.  I've had a day to think it over and I don't like the move any more but I can understand why they did it. 

 
This is where I am on this; after sitting on it for a day, I still don't like it, but I can understand why they did it.
 
This organization constantly has their eye on the present as well as the future and how they can continue to be successful, they've had an incredible 13 year run; 5 trips to the Super Bowl, 8 trips to the AFCCG including 3 in a row the past 3 seasons, an undefeated regular season and a winning record 13 years in a row.  They've made the playoffs 11 of the past 13 years and the 2 years they missed the playoffs, it came down to the last game both times, 1 of those years Brady was out the whole year.
 
As a Patriots fan, all you can ask for is that they make every effort to be competitive every year, no bridge years or years they tank to get the #1 draft pick like other teams have done.
 
They've entertained me as a fan and continue to make moves to improve the team; the moves may not be popular, but they are not in the business of being popular, they are in the business of winning.
 

 

 

[FL4WL3SS]

I think the post that I responded to said Wright might be the next closest guy to Hernandez in the league and opined he might now be a top ten TE.

Don't care. My point still stands.

 

[Stitch01]

OK.  I think Wright will be worth more than Hooman, worth less than Thompkins to this offense but YMMV.

 

[TomTerrific]

Looking at Miguel's patscap site, I see the following passage:
 
According to my figures the Patriots' 2014 current commitment is for $120,461,457 with 83 players signed. I have the Patriots' 2014 dead money as $11,314,990. $11,318,990 + $120,461,457 = $131,776,447. My numbers do INCLUDE the impact of the releases of Tommy Kelly, James Anderson, William, Marcus Forston and D.J. Williams and the waiving of Justin Jones. The Patriots 2014 adjusted cap number is $139,109,051 so I have the Pats under it by $7,328,604. The NFLPA cap report has the Patriots under their adjusted cap number by $6,657,532 so our numbers differ by $671,072 because the NFLPA numbers do not yet reflect the impact of the nine transactions that took place on or after August 18.
 
This presumably includes the Mankins trade, because later in the page he lists the most recent updates:

1. On August 26th removed Jemea Thomas and Logan Mankins.

To sum up, the NFLPA number is $670K over Miguel's number because it doesn't include transactions on or after August 18th. One of these is trading Logan Mankins for Tim Wright (and I keep hearing that the Mankins trade was worth ~$5.5M in cap savings). This makes no sense, so what am I missing?

 

[mulluysavage]

Logan Mankins is everything we would ever want in a football player. It is hard to imagine a better player at his position, a tougher competitor or a person to represent our program. He is one of the all-time great Patriots and the best guard I ever coached. Logan brought a quiet but unmistakable presence and leadership that will be impossible to duplicate. Unfortunately, this is the time of year when difficult decisions have to be made - and this is one of the most difficult we will ever make - but like every other decision it was made for what we feel is in the best interests of the team."

One of the all-time great Patriots. Hell of a statement coming from BB and I am with it. I think he's one of the top 3 Pats OL of the Pro Bowl era.

Pats OL pro bowls for comparison:
John Hannah 9
Bruce Armstrong 6
Mankins 5
Brian Waters 6
Matt Light 3
Brian Holloway 3
Leon Grey 2
Dan Koppen 1
Damien Woody 1

BBs statement begs the question, "one of how many?" So I am going to say, top 50.

Edit: had Mankins at 6 pro bowls when Wikipedia says 5

 

[mulluysavage]

Other Pats with 5+Pro Bowl selections as Patriots:

Hannah 9
Brady 9
Armstrong 6
Mike Haynes 6
Andre Tippett 5
Richard Seymour 5
Wes Welker 5
Ben Coates 5

 

[rodderick]

I'm not trying to shit on Mankins, he's been very good for the Patriots, and was great until his injury, but the Pro-Bowl itself is a popularity contest, so I don't put much  thought into the number of times a guard has been a pro-bowler. Seeing as the vast majority of fans don't have a clue in how to grade guard play, and considering guards don't have stats attributed to them, most of the votes go towards names that people recognize. I'm not sure that's the best way to properly evaluate him as a player.

 

[dcmissle]

I would evaluate him as a player by taking the statement -- he is the best guard BB ever coached -- at face value.

The statement was gracious enough to accomplish its purposes without including this assessment, if it were not genuinely held.

 

[bakahump]

Rod,
 
It may be a popularity contest but its voted on by Coaches, Players and Fans.  In 2 of those groups Mankins has to be close to AJ Pierzynski / Rodney Harrison Levels (Close...not at)  of Popularity.   As he seems to be basically an asshole to play against.  He is constantly the guy pushing and shoving after the play.  Dont get me wrong I loved the guy when here and feel that while he may have pushed and shoved he wasnt "Dirty".  Of course thats my fan perspective.
 
My point is I assume that opponents don't appreciate his aggressiveness and thus his "popularity" must suffer as a result.  Also Fans (not connected to or located in NE) certainly have no love for the Patriots and their players and thus would not be beholden to voting for him regardless.
 
I think its fair to question the last 1 or 2 PBs as that becomes reputation....but those first 3-4 where probably well earned.

 

[rodderick]

Rod,
 
It may be a popularity contest but its voted on by Coaches, Players and Fans.  In 2 of those groups Mankins has to be close to AJ Pierzynski / Rodney Harrison Levels (Close...not at)  of Popularity.   As he seems to be basically an asshole to play against.  He is constantly the guy pushing and shoving after the play.  Dont get me wrong I loved the guy when here and feel that while he may have pushed and shoved he wasnt "Dirty".  Of course thats my fan perspective.
 
My point is I assume that opponents don't appreciate his aggressiveness and thus his "popularity" must suffer as a result.  Also Fans (not connected to or located in NE) certainly have no love for the Patriots and their players and thus would not be beholden to voting for him regardless.
 
I think its fair to question the last 1 or 2 PBs as that becomes reputation....but those first 3-4 where probably well earned.

 
I think your point about Mankins having a mean streak and that being a deterrent for opponents to vote for him is solid, but I believe when filling a ballot most fans either: vote for who plays on their team; vote for those guys who are widely considered the best in the league at their respective positions. I can't remember a single instance of a Patriots player being recognizable/having a great season and getting screwed in the fan voting because of the team he plays for. That could be a factor for some, but I think on the whole it doesn't matter much.
 
Obviously, I'm not saying all his Pro-Bowls were unearned, he was doing something right to be noticed and be selected to play in one in the first place. I just believe that as time went on, Mankins became one of those "automatic" votes for guard in the AFC, where he had name recognition and always played in good offenses, protecting one of the faces of the NFL, so he was pretty much a no brainer in a position where turnover is big and individual play isn't always noticed. I don't know how much that influenced things, but I'm sure it played a role. I'm also not sure coaches and players are 100% immune to this same mentality fans usually suffer from.
 
Anyway, the point is: Logan Mankins was a great Patriot, but I'm not sure Pro-Bowl selections are an accurate barometer of a player's value, especially when he plays a position as hard to evaluate as guard.

 

[bakahump]

I would evaluate him as a player by taking the statement -- he is the best guard BB ever coached -- at face value.

The statement was gracious enough to accomplish its purposes without including this assessment, if it were not genuinely held.

 Agreed.
 
Waters was pretty damn good (even if only here a year or 2).

 

[rodderick]

I would evaluate him as a player by taking the statement -- he is the best guard BB ever coached -- at face value.

The statement was gracious enough to accomplish its purposes without including this assessment, if it were not genuinely held.

 
Sure, I'd agree with that. I also have no doubt it's a genuine sentiment by BB.

 

[mulluysavage]

Let's not use Pro Bowls as the sole or even number one evaluation of a player's greatness, but let's use it as one, meaningful indicator. What are some other indicators we can use to round out the eval?

The popularity contest and lifetime achievement aspect can otoh also be a indicator of greatness because other coaches and players' respect can be considered part of greatness.

Note that the second list excludes people like Curtis Martin and Ty Law, who had Pro Bowl selections elsewhere that brought them up to 5. I think this is useful in measuring the "all-time great Patriot" statement.

 

[The Mort Report]

Another point that keeps jumping out at me that I have not seen brought up is the line, if coached well, can much easier cover a weak link than a weak skill player.  Now obviously miscues by a single OL can kill a play(as shown in the video earlier in the thread), but at the same time can be somewhat covered up with good schemes and technique.  If Hooman is the only TE on the field the defense can basically ignore him.  If Wright is as advertised, the defense would at least have to pay some attention to him, opening up things for other skill players.  This also lessens the time Brady will have the ball in his hands, taking some pressure off the OL.
 
I'm not trying to belittle OL players, having a top 10ish OL player can make a huge difference, but once you get down to the average to above average players, which is where Logan now lives, it becomes more about the coaching than the abilities of the players.  And this is where I think people will be surprised how easily the Pats replace his presence

 

[Corsi]

In the latest revelation on how the Patriots' trade of Logan Mankins has affected the locker room, Bleacher Report's Jason Cole says that Tom Brady had an "emotional reaction" to the news.
 
"He was not happy with this move," Cole said.
 

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2014/08/report_tom_brady_was_not_happy_with_logan_mankins.html?camp=rssatriots&dlvrit=834382

 

[jsinger121]

He will get over it. Remember its a business folks. 

 

[Stitch01]

Yeah, its not Brady's first rodeo, not worried about his reaction at all.

 

[Leather]

Brady is doing what he has to do:  showing to the locker room that he considers all of his good teammates to be "his guys" (a feeling which may be 100% genuine) to let current players know he has their back, but not saying anything that would undermine an ownership/coaching staff that he knows is acting in the team's, and therefore his, best interests.
 
It's politics.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

Did Brady go on record about mankins holding out and not protecting him for half a season due to a contract dispute? Was he upset then?

 

[Shelterdog]

To look at this deal differently, if Mankins wasn't on the Pats would you sign Mankins to a one year $6.25 million unguaranteed contract (or to a 2 year $13 million contract?) Once you take out the dead money--which is a sunk cost--that's what you're left with.  If you think that's a good value then the trade is probably bad.  If you think that's too rich for a declining but still probably above average guard, then the deal is probably a good one, particularly with the draft pick and the somewhat promising player at a position of need.

 

[Harry Hooper]

 
I don't know how you can throw that last line out like that. 
 
It's very possible that they considered the draft pick and the promising player at a position of need worth the dead money all by itself. Like you say, it's dead money that has already been paid, so it's really just the cap hit. Is it worth taking the cap hit for those two assets, in exchange for the difference between Mankins and player X, plus another $6.25M?
 
Judging that decision is really based on the evaluation of player X. If they feel the downgrade is not as severe as it might seem from outside (or possibly even an upgrade), then it's an easy call, with or without the return from the trade being factored in. We have no idea what their evaluation of Mankins was at this point, but it's possible they made have simply cut him if they are that down on him. Either way I don't think it's as simple as you're making it out to be. 

 
Definitely not that simple. You have to consider not just Player X but Player X+1, i.e., the guy that comes off the bench when one of the starting OL is out.

 

[wutang112878]

To look at this deal differently, if Mankins wasn't on the Pats would you sign Mankins to a one year $6.25 million unguaranteed contract (or to a 2 year $13 million contract?) Once you take out the dead money--which is a sunk cost--that's what you're left with.  If you think that's a good value then the trade is probably bad.  If you think that's too rich for a declining but still probably above average guard, then the deal is probably a good one, particularly with the draft pick and the somewhat promising player at a position of need.

 
Putting my Bill hat on for a second, no I would not sign a guard for $6M.  Since he has been here I dont think he has signed a FA guard for that much money, and I also believe Mankins is the only guard he has ever given that much too.  It seems as though every time they go to fill in virtually any position on the line, outside of the draft, they dont spend big.  But when they are resigning their guys it seems their spending habits are different and I dont know why this is exactly.  So in a way your comparison is apples to oranges, although I understand why you would approach it in this logical, analytical way.
 
Another consideration here is this:
 
 

Another point that keeps jumping out at me that I have not seen brought up is the line, if coached well, can much easier cover a weak link than a weak skill player.  Now obviously miscues by a single OL can kill a play(as shown in the video earlier in the thread), but at the same time can be somewhat covered up with good schemes and technique. 

 
When we had Dante the response here was typically that Dante could take almost any level of talent (within reason) on the line and transform them into something that was adequate.  Every year it seemed we would give him some young guys or unheralded guys at 1 or 2 positions and he could coach them up.  I think annually he saved them about $3-4M in cap space by taking these cheap guys and getting them to perform at a level where finding a replacement on the free agent market could use up this cap space. 
 
Now we have DeGuglielmo, this is obviously an outsiders view but I think he can.  I'm not familiar enough with these teams to remember how much OL talent he was working with, and the thing I care about most is keeping Brady upright, but for the most part when he has had an adequate QB he has been able to make this happen:
 
2004, Giants: Warner 39 sacks, Eli 13
2005, Giants: Eli 28
2006, Giants: Eli 25
2007, Giants: Eli 27
2008, Giants: Eli 27
2009, Dolphins: Henne 26, Pennington 6
2010, Dolphins: Henne 30, Thigpen 8
2011, Dolphins: Matt Moore 36, Henne 11
 
I'd throw out the 2012 Jets because they were awful.  In 2004 I think Warner made things difficult for him, and in 05 to 08 Eli was actually pretty bad his QB ratings were 76, 77, 74, and 86 respectively but he was still standing by the end.  I dont think many coaches in the league could have really worked much magic with Henne and Matt Moore.
 
No one has the track record of Dante, but I'm pretty hopeful that DeGuglielmo can make this line adequate with what he is being given to work with.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

I get that it's a business. 
I get that it's the way Pats handle older veterans.
I get that it could be a net positive in the long run.
 
But damn it watching Mankins' press conference it kinda hurts, especially the part when he says "I can't say anything bad about New England... I loved that place":
 
http://www.buccaneers.com/multimedia/videos/Press-Conference-Logan-Mankins/0e68410f-c827-4eb1-a3ac-a7e3040591e1
 
I'm looking forward to the day when he signs a one-day contract to retire a Patriot and the day he dons that red jacket.

 

[axx]

The other thought is that perhaps they are going to run less/pass more (esp with the new rules) and Mankins doesn't fit into that.

 

[TomTerrific]

Looking at Miguel's patscap site, I see the following passage:
 
According to my figures the Patriots' 2014 current commitment is for $120,461,457 with 83 players signed...The Patriots 2014 adjusted cap number is $139,109,051 so I have the Pats under it by $7,328,604.
 
This presumably includes the Mankins trade, because later in the page he lists the most recent updates:

1. On August 26th removed Jemea Thomas and Logan Mankins.

To sum up, the NFLPA number is $670K over Miguel's number because it doesn't include transactions on or after August 18th. One of these is trading Logan Mankins for Tim Wright (and I keep hearing that the Mankins trade was worth ~$5.5M in cap savings). This makes no sense, so what am I missing?

 
Bumping my own comment. Apparently my assumption no. 1 above was incorrect, as the cap number has now changed by approximately the amount of the cap savings I cited.
 
Miguel's current cap figure is $125,960,447, which is $13,148,604 below the cap.

 

[finnVT]

That seems like a lot of cap space.  As someone who doesn't really understand the ins and outs of the cap rules, is there anything they can do with Revis to move some of next year's cap hit into this year?  Or are they equally well off rolling some of this space over to next year to lessen the effect of that big hit if they decide to keep him?

 

[wutang112878]

That seems like a lot of cap space.  As someone who doesn't really understand the ins and outs of the cap rules, is there anything they can do with Revis to move some of next year's cap hit into this year?  Or are they equally well off rolling some of this space over to next year to lessen the effect of that big hit if they decide to keep him?

 
Yes and no, from a cap standpoint it doesnt really matter.  They either have $13M in cap space to use up this year, or they roll it over and then next years cap space = 2015 cap space + $13M
 
From a contract negotiation standpoint it might be beneficial to use it up this year.  McCourty is the guy that should really be targeted for an extension right now and chances are if you were to approach him about an extension now he would probably leave some money on the table because it would reduce his risk (specifically his injury risk this year).  And chances are a contract extension for McCourty would probably reduce his $5M cap hit this year and create a little more cap space.  Solder is in somewhat a similar situation, not that his cap hit this year is a problem, but he is on the books for $7.4M for next year and any savings there could be applied to a Revis deal

 

[NortheasternPJ]

Great article my Jackie Mac interviewing Mankins

@BobSocci: Recommended reading from Jackie MacMullan: Mankins had tough season away from Patriots http://t.co/KbeCu5wUOD via @ESPNBoston

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

Great article my Jackie Mac interviewing Mankins

@BobSocci: Recommended reading from Jackie MacMullan: Mankins had tough season away from Patriots http://t.co/KbeCu5wUOD via @ESPNBoston

 
Perhaps he can come back to the Patriots, if the Bucs let him go: http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/02/15/jobs-some-nfl-veterans-may-jeopardy/cnFGcysFISdLXoYQ1PGK0J/story.html
 

Buccaneers guard Logan Mankins — The trade for Mankins didn’t work out as expected, with the team paying $6.25 million last year for a guard, while still finishing 2-14. Mankins played fairly well, but he’ll be 33 next month and has a $7 million contract for 2015 with no dead money. Several other Bucs veterans have high salaries and little to no dead money as well, including wide receiver Vincent Jackson, cornerback Alterraun Verner, and defensive tackle Clinton McDonald.

 
Although he's been praised as the veteran leader of the group, the Bucs have shown they're not afraid to release a big ticket vet, even if he cost draft picks in the past. I'd be thrilled to see Mankins back at Foxboro where he belongs.  

 

[tims4wins]

Eh I don't want them getting older on the line.

 

[jsinger121]

I'd pass. He is going to want some money and we need the money to sign more important and useful players. They can draft a younger guard and pay him nothing and he would probably be just as productive as Mankins.

 

[Ed Hillel]

I'd take him for one season on the cheap (2-3 million), if he'd be willing, which he won't. I'd also hope to upgrade and end up with Mankins being the 6th man in. Someone will still overpay him on his reputation, so I see the chances of this happening as about 1%.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

The league is still willing to throw around money, but people are overestimating the stupidity. He'll be a 33 year old guard that has gone through multiple injuries and has never been that great in pass protection, which is more of an emphasis than ever. 
 
I think a few of you may be surprised at the size of the deal he receives.