Irrational exuberance: The Neemias Queta thread

lovegtm

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The +/- number is a deeply flawed metric, but Neemias led the team last night with a +15 and it helps explain why it felt like he way outplayed an otherwise unremarkable stat line (4 pts, 1 reb, 1 assist, 2 blocks). Count me in the Quet-anon (or is it al-Queta?) cult.
Has to be Quet-Anon, because of the irrational trusting the plan.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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I do see some real growth potential. Last night he was so close to a number of plays that he just didn’t quite make—an athletic layup or two, about a dozen rebounds he got his hands on but just missed or mistimed or mis-tipped.

Could be some irrational exuberance but seems like a guy who could be an interesting player if the game slows down for him a bit more. Sets good screens, moves really well, gets in good positions, athletic af.
 

joe dokes

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The self tip was earlier. He learns from his mistakes!
I should pay better attention. Or cut back on the weeknight THC.

I do see some real growth potential. Last night he was so close to a number of plays that he just didn’t quite make—an athletic layup or two, about a dozen rebounds he got his hands on but just missed or mistimed or mis-tipped.

Could be some irrational exuberance but seems like a guy who could be an interesting player if the game slows down for him a bit more. Sets good screens, moves really well, gets in good positions, athletic af.
He has pretty good instincts on offense. Defensively, though, it seemed at times like he was trying to guard all 5 guys. His own irrational exuberance.

Overall, in "real" minutes, he's the dimestore version of Robert Williams when *he* was a rookie.
 
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lovegtm

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At the end of the day, they beat a playoff team that REALLY cares about beating the Cs, on a B2B, with Kornet and Horford out.

You don't want Queta playing in the playoffs, but absolutely could steal a game here or there if 2 of the centers can't go for whatever reason. That has some value (if no one better is available at the deadline).
 

chilidawg

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You don't want Queta playing in the playoffs, but absolutely could steal a game here or there if 2 of the centers can't go for whatever reason. That has some value (if no one better is available at the deadline).
I'll take that out my 4th string center.

The jump ball sequence was classic Queta, botches the first by tipping it to himself (it was a terrible toss by the ref), but then totally redeems with the slam after tipping it to JB on the 2nd. His rebounding numbers have been great, but last night he just wasn't strong enough on the ball to secure them. Needs to work on his hands.
 

mostman

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Last night I found him infuriating to watch. He is in there to get boards and his rebounding skills absolutely suck. He’s also too slow to rotate on defense which led to a bunch of easy layups for the Pacers.
 

benhogan

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I do see some real growth potential. Last night he was so close to a number of plays that he just didn’t quite make—an athletic layup or two, about a dozen rebounds he got his hands on but just missed or mistimed or mis-tipped.

Could be some irrational exuberance but seems like a guy who could be an interesting player if the game slows down for him a bit more. Sets good screens, moves really well, gets in good positions, athletic af.
Queta is Exhibit A on why you don't pay up for back-up Centers in the modern NBA.

Every year cheap Fungible 5s can be found in the G-League (Queta), released (Bitadze), overseas (random Eurotrash), buyouts (Theis), late 1st/2nd round (Kessler/TJD), a Zeller/Plumlee household, etc

They are nice players to collect at the end of the roster/2-way contracts since Centers tend to take heavy punishment.

Let the Detroit Pistons extend the Beef Stews of the world for $64MM (a year ahead of RFA) while making him untradable (poison put) in the process. SMH
 

benhogan

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Last night I found him infuriating to watch. He is in there to get boards and his rebounding skills absolutely suck. He’s also too slow to rotate on defense which led to a bunch of easy layups for the Pacers.
The entire roster was a step slow, the night after a tight B2B.

Carlisle had a good game plan, tip of the hat
 

chilidawg

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Last night I found him infuriating to watch. He is in there to get boards and his rebounding skills absolutely suck. He’s also too slow to rotate on defense which led to a bunch of easy layups for the Pacers.
He has the best rebounding numbers on the team, and they outscored the Pacers by 15 when he was on the floor. Last night wasn't a good rebounding night for sure, but he's been an excellent rebounder overall.
 

mostman

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He has the best rebounding numbers on the team, and they outscored the Pacers by 15 when he was on the floor. Last night wasn't a good rebounding night for sure, but he's been an excellent rebounder overall.
He had one rebound last night. In 14 minutes. And the ones that sailed over his head on defense were leading to Pacer threes. What I see is him always going for tips, usually to himself. I want him to just catch the ball.
 

TripleOT

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Queta does a horrible job of corralling rebounds. He catches the ball like he has lobster claws for hands.
Bill Russell said that you should never tap a defensive rebound unless it is directly to a teammate. He said that if you can touch it, you should be able to grab it.

I have hope that Queta can turn into a rotation big, but he has to stop treating the ball like an unpinned hand grenade. Besides his rebounding issues, he has a habit of getting into awful body position when going up for a finish near the rim. He’s long and strong enough to not have to be a contortionist on finishes. Just go up strong.
 

TomRicardo

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He had one rebound last night. In 14 minutes. And the ones that sailed over his head on defense were leading to Pacer threes. What I see is him always going for tips, usually to himself. I want him to just catch the ball.
When you are taking deep 3s like Pacers, rebounding is about staying between you man and the hoop, not the center jumping up and grabbing the ball 20+ feet in the air. The ball is arcing out of rebound range as soon as it is coming off the rim.
 

slamminsammya

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He had one rebound last night. In 14 minutes. And the ones that sailed over his head on defense were leading to Pacer threes. What I see is him always going for tips, usually to himself. I want him to just catch the ball.
I'm rewatching the game right now and this criticism is totally detached from reality. there's like one shot that went his way that he didn't get and otherwise they got nearly every defensive board when he was in.
 

RSN Diaspora

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I'm rewatching the game right now and this criticism is totally detached from reality. there's like one shot that went his way that he didn't get and otherwise they got nearly every defensive board when he was in.
I'm not surprised at the initial criticism or the fact that reality didn't quite match it. We got destroyed on second-chance points last night 32-6, and slightly less crushed on offensive rebounds 19-7. Any time that happens, even in a win, you're going to feel like bigs had a far worse game than they might have.
 

Euclis20

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When you are taking deep 3s like Pacers, rebounding is about staying between you man and the hoop, not the center jumping up and grabbing the ball 20+ feet in the air. The ball is arcing out of rebound range as soon as it is coming off the rim.
Yesterday was just odd in that regard. The Pacers are not a particularly good offensive rebounding team (19th in offensive rebounds and 16th in ORB%), and the Celtics are somewhere between solid and great at defensive rebounding (1st in defensive rebounds and 11th in DRB%). A combination of tired legs on the 2nd night of a B2B, poor effort/positioning, and some truly bad luck bounces.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Last night I found him infuriating to watch. He is in there to get boards and his rebounding skills absolutely suck. He’s also too slow to rotate on defense which led to a bunch of easy layups for the Pacers.
That’s why he’s a 4th string NBA center who struggles defensively in most matchups and really whenever he has to leave the paint. This is a good place for him to maybe use fouls in a pinch but expecting much more from him when the games matter is going to leave people disappointed. Btw, his quickness and foot speed have improved by leaps since his college days if you can even imagine this….and he dominated that conference!
 

benhogan

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That’s why he’s a 4th string NBA center who struggles defensively in most matchups and really whenever he has to leave the paint. This is a good place for him to maybe use fouls in a pinch but expecting much more from him when the games matter is going to leave people disappointed. Btw, his quickness and foot speed have improved by leaps since his college days if you can even imagine this….and he dominated that conference!
soon to be 5th string (NQ is still on a G-League 2-Way contract) when Brad gets Xavier Tillman
 

joe dokes

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That’s why he’s a 4th string NBA center who struggles defensively in most matchups and really whenever he has to leave the paint. This is a good place for him to maybe use fouls in a pinch but expecting much more from him when the games matter is going to leave people disappointed. Btw, his quickness and foot speed have improved by leaps since his college days if you can even imagine this….and he dominated that conference!
How many teams win *any* games when the 4th string C gets 15 meaningful minutes?

For comparisons sake.....roster-wise on champions past, that would put him behind Greg Kite and Scot Pollard's manbunned sports corpse. I think he bests them both.
 

TripleOT

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<channeling Tommy Heinson> The Queta one handed dunks remind me of The Big Dipper, Wilt Chamberlain.

He looked great against the Memphis fifth stringers. Boston has done a great job developing Kornet into an effective third center. Maybe Queta will follow that development path. He is an intriguing prospect.
 

chilidawg

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<channeling Tommy Heinson> The Queta one handed dunks remind me of The Big Dipper, Wilt Chamberlain.

He looked great against the Memphis fifth stringers. Boston has done a great job developing Kornet into an effective third center. Maybe Queta will follow that development path. He is an intriguing prospect.
I'm not sure he isn't better than Kornet now. He's a physical presence, especially on the offensive boards, and has consistently had a positive impact on the game when he's had the opportunity.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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I'm not sure he isn't better than Kornet now. He's a physical presence, especially on the offensive boards, and has consistently had a positive impact on the game when he's had the opportunity.
Queta is great around the rim but imo he is nowhere near Kornet as an all around defender. Queta has yet to demonstrate that he can handle a switch. Kornet isn't perfect but he is very credible by NBA standards.
 

Euclis20

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I've enjoyed watching Queta (sometimes), but against better teams he's frequently in the wrong place on both ends of the court. That's not a guy you can have on the court in important games, and everything this season is geared towards the Celtics winning tough playoff games this season, not 2-3 years from now. Queta only has half a season of NBA games under his belt so it's not unreasonable to think he could improve to the point of being a credible part of a playoff rotation, but not 3-4 months from now. Kornet is unlikely to impress this spring, but he's also less likely to hurt the Celtics if pressed to play during non-blowout minutes due to an injury or foul trouble to Horford/KP.
 

slamminsammya

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I'm not sure he isn't better than Kornet now. He's a physical presence, especially on the offensive boards, and has consistently had a positive impact on the game when he's had the opportunity.
Queta is wildly inconsistent. I think he has the potential to be better than Kornet some nights but he is really bad when hes bad, which you dont' see with Kornet. Hes pretty solid night in and night out.
 

lovegtm

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Kornet is a very solid NBA backup center. You could play him as that against most teams in the league and have a good shot to win a playoff series (if the rest of the rotation were strong).

You cannot say the same about Queta imo.
 

PedroKsBambino

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Someone characterized Queta as a poor man’s healthy TL and that’s the right direction of comp. There’s some pure athleticism and energy impact which is interesting here…and I fully agree with others he’s too raw to play against serious teams.

he is perhaps their best rebounder and so I can imagine playoff spots where they decide that’s worth the switching risks…but I hope never to get there
 

chilidawg

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Well this is the irrational exuberance thread. Along the lines of what PKB said, he may have the potential for a higher impact due to his physical skills, which often have flashed this year. More downside risk because of his inexperience.
 

Eagle3

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Scal had to put the brakes on some irrational exuberance after Gorman said Queta "might be the answer" last night. Scal immediately said "The answer to what?".
 

NomarsFool

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I didn’t quite get Scal’s apparent skepticism on Queta. I mean, he certainly seems like a big body that could come in for a few minutes, provide some energy, grab some boards, and bang with Embiid. Will he commit some fouls? Yeah, for sure.
 

lovegtm

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I get the skepticism. "Banging with Embiid" isn't enough: you have to not destroy the offense on the other end (against aggressive, locked-in playoff defenses) and hold your own in more complex actions than banging.

Not at all convinced Queta can do that against good competition.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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he is perhaps their best rebounder and so I can imagine playoff spots where they decide that’s worth the switching risks…but I hope never to get there
best rebounder among centers or best rebounder period? If the latter, I'm not so sure about that - I'm old enough to remember when Queta was being killed for not being able to grab the ball all the way back a week ago in the IND game (when IND got 19 OReb and Queta got 1 Reb in 14 minutes).

I didn’t quite get Scal’s apparent skepticism on Queta. I mean, he certainly seems like a big body that could come in for a few minutes, provide some energy, grab some boards, and bang with Embiid. Will he commit some fouls? Yeah, for sure.
IMO, if Queta had to play Embiid in a meaningful game, Embiid would probably have a parade to the foul line plus PHI would have one guy they could ignore on defense. Yeah, it's always possible that they could steal a couple of minutes but more likely is that Queta would get hunted. I'm happy we probably won't have to find out!
 

lovegtm

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IMO, if Queta had to play Embiid in a meaningful game, Embiid would probably have a parade to the foul line plus PHI would have one guy they could ignore on defense. Yeah, it's always possible that they could steal a couple of minutes but more likely is that Queta would get hunted. I'm happy we probably won't have to find out!
Not having a post-up center to deal with until the Finals (and then only if Denver is the team out of the West) definitely changes things. I can't imagine the Cs will spend capital on a big at the deadline now. Wing/guard or nothing.
 

NomarsFool

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I get the skepticism. "Banging with Embiid" isn't enough: you have to not destroy the offense on the other end (against aggressive, locked-in playoff defenses) and hold your own in more complex actions than banging.

Not at all convinced Queta can do that against good competition.
We're talking about someone who might play 4-8 minutes in a game. I'd rather roll with Queta than the corpse of Blake Griffin who looked like complete toast even last year.
 

chilidawg

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A couple notes from Adam Taylor re Queta:

As with Walsh, it’s hard to lean too heavily into Queta’s performance against a Grizzlies team that lacks genuine NBA talent. However, the dunk above illustrates the size and power Queta brings around the rim. Factor in his 8 rebounds in nine minutes and his developing timing when guarding shots, and he already looks like a dramatically better player than the one we saw to begin the season.

Kornet will find his rhythm again. He will get his legs back under him and continue to make an impact — he’s proven he can be a reliable bench big throughout the season; there’s no need to doubt that fact based on one game. Still, with each passing game, Queta is breathing down his neck.


https://www.celticsblog.com/2024/2/5/24061942/back-on-track-10-takeaways-from-boston-celtics-memphis-grizzlies-jayson-tatum-kristaps-porzinigis
 

PedroKsBambino

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best rebounder among centers or best rebounder period? If the latter, I'm not so sure about that - I'm old enough to remember when Queta was being killed for not being able to grab the ball all the way back a week ago in the IND game (when IND got 19 OReb and Queta got 1 Reb in 14 minutes).
I'd say Tatum is the best rebounder---but I assume he's out there in any meaningful situation. I think Queta is a pretty impactful rebounder beyond that, though far from "perfect". He's been better most of the last few weeks than he was earlier in the year to my eyes, but agree he can be overpowered (though not really the issue vs Pacers) Jrue is also a sneaky-good rebounder for his size.

One of their minor issues/risks is that Al and Porzingis are both below-average for their size/position and Jaylen is hit or miss.
 

lovegtm

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One of their minor issues/risks is that Al and Porzingis are both below-average for their size/position and Jaylen is hit or miss.
Al is an issue to my eyes for sure. KP....I think he works well in a team rebounding scheme. When the team is focused and sending bodies to crash the glass, KP gives them a big advantage, even if someone else often secures it. When they're disconnected or fatigued, he isn't able to be a 1-man rebounding fix himself.
 

NomarsFool

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I'd rather roll with Kornet in those minutes
I don't necessarily disagree. I think it's more of a matchup thing and thinking about that "break glass in emergency" BIG when we need it. I'm just not sure there's any meaningful upgrade over Queta out there to be had. Muscala certainly didn't do anything for us last season. Olynyk is not getting bought out, we couldn't sign him even if he did, and trading for him seems extremely difficult (not saying that you were advocating for any of those things - I just see and hear silly people talking about how the Celtics need to go out and get another big).
 

benhogan

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Queta gets #15 with a team option for next season (is the assumption)

Beef Center depth on minimum deals is good business

https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/celtics/celtics-sign-neemias-queta-to-a-standard-deal

Brad's been lurking

Queta on a minimum contract, beef center, 4th string depth would be nothing to be concerned about.

He was fantastic end-of-the-roster value this season. On a 2-way contract (no tax implications by freeing up the 15th spot), he gave them 300 productive minutes, mostly in the dog days of December. He was the only guy from Maine who gave something to the C's this season

Queta's earned that 14/15th shot, if one of X/LK moves on.
 

MyDaughterLovesTomGordon

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When you see him in Portland it's pretty clear he has some NBA skills. I think this also is really good for organization morale - it's gotta be encouraging for Walsh, Drew, JD, etc., to see there's a path to the NBA through good play and improvement, with a dash of organizational need. Building on Hauser and Kornet and Pritchard (and, obviously, Tatum and Brown), that's some solid development success, which is going to be even more important in the big-tax era that's incoming.

Big picture, I think there's appetite in the market for more professional basketball - it's a good TV product, has good stats, players are recognizable, etc. I think the NBA is going a good job of blending in the women and G-League players to the All-Star weekend, increasing the two-way players, having the WNBA players doing NBA commentary, etc. It's good marketing to grow the industry of basketball.

I think they blow baseball out of the water in terms of growing their sport and capturing eyeballs.
 

benhogan

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When you see him in Portland it's pretty clear he has some NBA skills. I think this also is really good for organization morale - it's gotta be encouraging for Walsh, Drew, JD, etc., to see there's a path to the NBA through good play and improvement, with a dash of organizational need. Building on Hauser and Kornet and Pritchard (and, obviously, Tatum and Brown), that's some solid development success, which is going to be even more important in the big-tax era that's incoming.

Big picture, I think there's appetite in the market for more professional basketball - it's a good TV product, has good stats, players are recognizable, etc. I think the NBA is going a good job of blending in the women and G-League players to the All-Star weekend, increasing the two-way players, having the WNBA players doing NBA commentary, etc. It's good marketing to grow the industry of basketball.

I think they blow baseball out of the water in terms of growing their sport and capturing eyeballs.
Yea there is a huge demand for SPORTS from linear TV & the mega tech companies

The G-League is an untapped gold mine:
1. Get a TV contract
2. Add NBA 2-way contracts
3. Pay the G-League players more which will lead to NCAA/Euro talent wanting to play
4. Start the G League season on Labor Day
5. End the G-league season at the All-Star game (Championship game on Friday night)
6. Experiment with rules in the G-League to increase PACE of play
7. Critically grade refs at the G-League level and promote 5 a year and CUT the 5 worst NBA Refs
8. Aggressively develop officiating technology with an eye on quicker decision-making
9. Use larger college arenas. Kids U-13 free admission
 

MyDaughterLovesTomGordon

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Yea there is a huge demand for SPORTS from linear TV & the mega tech companies

The G-League is an untapped gold mine:
1. Get a TV contract
2. Add NBA 2-way contracts
3. Pay the G-League players more which will lead to NCAA/Euro talent wanting to play
4. Start the G League season on Labor Day
5. End the G-league season at the All-Star game (Championship game on Friday night)
6. Experiment with rules in the G-League to increase PACE of play
7. Critically grade refs at the G-League level and promote 5 a year and CUT the 5 worst NBA Refs
8. Aggressively develop officiating technology with an eye on quicker decision-making
9. Use larger college arenas. Kids U-13 free admission
Sign me up for all of this. If they do it right with enough foresight, it seems feasible to me that you could have relegation and advancement between the leagues in a decade or so.
 

lovegtm

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Huh, pretty surprising with Kornet's emergence and Tillman here now. Another example of how committed Wyc seems to be to Banner 18.