Heyman says Lackey/Corey Littrell to Cardinals for Kelly/Craig
- Thread starter MakMan44
- Start date
Craig moving to another team for prospects? Since don't see Napoli or Papi moved, and Craig can't play 3B and I don't want him in the OF.
Interesting return. More indication that they consider 2014 a bump in the road and are looking to be highly competitive again in the offseason. Hard not to expect them to make Lester a market offer and/or pursue other FAs.
Underwhelmed by these deals, but Lackey isn't stud this year or next and Lester is a rental so the expectation of an elite prospect return was not realistic.
Underwhelmed by these deals, but Lackey isn't stud this year or next and Lester is a rental so the expectation of an elite prospect return was not realistic.
MakMan44 said:
Kelly can touch close to 100 mph. I think he's more of a reliever going forward.
Craig is interesting if he can rediscover his power stroke. His swing seems pretty compatible with Fenway.
There has to be another piece moving somewhere. Unless with all of our young pitching we're just going to be playing with 4-5 outfielders every game.
nattysez said:
No, Craig and Kelly is a pretty good haul for a club that isn't looking to rebuild. This is a better trade if competing in 2015 is the goal.
bosockboy said:
For this year, they can throw him in right while giving Victorino another DL stint to rest up. After Vic gets back, rotate Craig, Cespedes, JBJ and him through the outfield to keep getting them reps while keeping them fresh to help avoid injuries.
This is a better deal than Shelby Miller and Allen Craig (my guess above) so I'm pretty happy with it. Joe Kelly is a solid mid-rotation starter. There's a decent chance he approximates Lackey's production next year.
From Cot's
Allen Craig rf
5 years/$31M (2013-17), plus 2018 option
5 year/$31M (2013-17), plus 2018 club option
signed extension with St. Louis 3/8/13
13:$1.75M, 14:$2.75M, 15:$5.5M, 16:$9M, 17:$11M, 18:$13M club option ($1M buyout)
award bonuses: $50,000 for All-Star selection
Kelly is arbitration eligible after 2015.
Allen Craig rf
5 years/$31M (2013-17), plus 2018 option
5 year/$31M (2013-17), plus 2018 club option
signed extension with St. Louis 3/8/13
13:$1.75M, 14:$2.75M, 15:$5.5M, 16:$9M, 17:$11M, 18:$13M club option ($1M buyout)
award bonuses: $50,000 for All-Star selection
Kelly is arbitration eligible after 2015.
Not great, but decent. Craig is having a brutal year, but even so, his career stat line is still .291/.344/.460 with a career OPS+ of 120.
Kelly is a decent young arm, obviously expendable to the Cardinals. Would have prefered Carlos Martinez or Shelby Miller, but I think he can stick as a middle of the rotation guy.
Kelly is a decent young arm, obviously expendable to the Cardinals. Would have prefered Carlos Martinez or Shelby Miller, but I think he can stick as a middle of the rotation guy.
MakMan44 said:
What numbers? He's consistenly been a roughly 4 FIP and xFIP pitcher. That's middle of the rotation quality. I'd take a risk on him continuing to be that over hoping Shelby Miller figures it out.
It will be interesting to see how much money the Sox spend in the offseason, and what they spend it on. Lots of young and cheap players are now a major part of the core, and the remaining vets are relatively cheap, too
His K-BB% is terrible as a starter. I don't see him having all that much success as a starter in the AL. I'm willing to be proven wrong, and yeah, maybe Miller would have been bad too but I'm unimpressed right now.Snodgrass'Muff said:
Possibility that Victorino goes to the dl. Also opens up the possibility of Betts as part of a big deal somewhere along the lineRasputin said:
So this looks like one of the top 5 worst deals Cherington has ever struck. Joe Kelly was the luckiest pitcher in baseball last year and will get blown the hell up if he actually pitches in the AL East. Craig is a guy I was all for acquiring in exchange for Peavy, but his remaining money, lack of production this year, limited positional versatility, and likely ongoing lisfranc issues hindering him this year makes him horrible return for a legit #2 with a year of control left.
There is a very real possibility that a year from now we got more of value from Jake Peavy than John Lackey. That is a serious failure in what was supposed to be a seller's market.
There is a very real possibility that a year from now we got more of value from Jake Peavy than John Lackey. That is a serious failure in what was supposed to be a seller's market.
Drek717 said:
The trade happened 2 minutes ago and it is already the worst deal BC has struck and a huge failure.
Good to know.
So in about 2 hours we've added a hopefully motivated free agent to be Cespedes and a hopefully 100% healthy Craig to our 2015 lineup. Not to mention we may end up getting this Cuban OF.
Many trades are going to go down in the next 6 months, should be very interesting to see what our 2015 roster looks like.
Many trades are going to go down in the next 6 months, should be very interesting to see what our 2015 roster looks like.
Rasputin said:
He's got a career 4.00 FIP and a 4.07 xFIP. He's at 3.93 and 3.72 this year and throws really hard.
http://www.brooksbaseball.net/velo.php?player=523260&time=month&startDate=03/30/2007&endDate=07/31/2014&s_type=2
Drek717 said:
Unless the Sox know Lackey is unlikely to pitch for $500k and know they don't want to extend him.
Yea not a fan of either of these trades today. Surely a guy that is almost free next year and put up a FIP of 3.6 and 3.8 bb/k is worth more than these two. What the hell. I'd rather Lackey have just stayed, why are we helping out playoff contenders for this payoff?
AND we have to throw in a minor leaguer?? Wow, sucky return for Lackey at the minimum salary next year.
Edit: From the latest Corsi-bot post-- Or maybe we don't throw in a minor leaguer, but we do throw in money? Not as bad, still don't like it.
Edit: From the latest Corsi-bot post-- Or maybe we don't throw in a minor leaguer, but we do throw in money? Not as bad, still don't like it.
It's always easy to look at the warts of players you're bringing back, just as it is easy to overlook those warts and focus on the positives. Every player the Sox have brought back so far in these deals (including the ones they got for Peavy) are imperfect. But they all have upside.
Seels said:
Because the Red Sox aren't making the playoffs this season, Lester will be a FA at the end of the year, so it doesn't matter, and the Cardinals are in the NL so it also doesn't matter?
Drek717 said:
Red Sox just received a lot of years of control of 2 guys that have actually produced at the major league level. Perhaps the Sox are content with their own farm system and how they are going to develop that talent through. Also, which talent they will develop through versus trade. Given that, you need a core of actual major league players. This makes the team able to contend faster by the looks of it. I'll take that versus hoping a prospect ever develops the line Craig has already put together.
Drek717 said:
What are you basing the bold on? He outperformed his peripherals, but it's not like he had that 2.69 ERA with a 5.00 FIP and xFIP. He's a middle of the rotation guy in the AL East. I see nothing in his peripherals to suggest he's going to get blown up.