Doogie does defense, the Sam Hauser thread

lovegtm

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Ainge also had a lot of draftees to try to work into the lineup. Langford and Nesmith were going to get their chances to crack the rotation, and I can see why Ainge didn't want to walk away from Waters, Edwards, Ojeleye, etc. I mean, posters still bring up Max Strus as one that got away. To be fair, the players occupying spots 11-17 were not going to make up for Hayward's injuries, Kyrie's Kyrie-ness, Kemba's knee or Al Horford's exile to Philly and OKC.

Stevens knew he had to do something with the slots 6-10 during the offseason as the players occupying those spots got badly exposed in the playoffs, especially in the Finals (with the obvious note that it's the first 3 of those 5 slots that are most critical in the playoffs). And it will be nice to be able to distribute some minutes in January, February, and March, something Ime often did not have the luxury to do during last season's drive.
Wrt Waters, Edwards etc....Stevens has also (imo) done a good job collecting guys who are one question away, as opposed to 2 or 3 questions away. Waters had to find a way to hold up on D given size, shoot, score....a lot of questions. Edwards was similar.

Hauser is nice in that there's really only one question: can he find a way to move enough on D to not get run off the floor.
 

Jimbodandy

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Wrt Waters, Edwards etc....Stevens has also (imo) done a good job collecting guys who are one question away, as opposed to 2 or 3 questions away. Waters had to find a way to hold up on D given size, shoot, score....a lot of questions. Edwards was similar.

Hauser is nice in that there's really only one question: can he find a way to move enough on D to not get run off the floor.
That's kind of what I was thinking too, although you said it better.

Size is the biggest component, as the smurfs had that battle even if their shots were falling at a high rate.

We all love PPs shot, but needing to perform calisthenics to get it off against ball pressure from basically anyone is a mitigating factor. Edwards and Waters had the same problem. So, if you're short, then you need otherwordly handle, footspeed, or wiggle (think Curry, Dame, Trae, pre-injury Kemba) just to make sure that you get it off. Not a problem for Hauser.

Then there's the "can he really shoot" problem. Edwards, it turns out, doesn't. Neither could Waters (who was really unexpectedly terrible) or Nesmith (surprisingly to me anyway). Not a problem for Hauser.

Then there's the "is he a problem on defense" question. Edwards and Waters were just too damn small to guard almost anyone and were neon bullseyes on the court. Waters could pick it a bit, but nowhere near often enough to account for his size. Neither had any instincts or propensity to develop same or girth/muscle to complement their height any. Nesmith had some size, but terrible footwork and instincts and never seemed to improve. Hauser has a chance to develop some footwork and athleticism and seems to have some instincts. Jury is out. But he won't get backed down by the likes of Jordan Clarkson, which is something. He will get blown by occasionally for sure.

Basically if you have a checklist, Hauser has a shot (check), can get it off with size, reach, and doesn't need to be spider man or a contortionist (check), doesn't give up size and length on defense (check), has instincts on D (TBD), and can cover scorers respectably (probably not). That's still a pretty good sheet, albeit not perfect.
 

Cellar-Door

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Struts has proven (very small sample) to be an actual NBA player. At this point there is no real reason to think that Hauser is as good or better.
Not sure why not? Are we really going to argue you can't compare young players to guys who've been in the league? Strus had a year 3 breakout, but Hauser was the better prospect, has better size and was better through the same age as Strus. If I'm looking for comps, Strus is going to be on the list.
 

JM3

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Not sure why not? Are we really going to argue you can't compare young players to guys who've been in the league? Strus had a year 3 breakout, but Hauser was the better prospect, has better size and was better through the same age as Strus. If I'm looking for comps, Strus is going to be on the list.
The only one of those things I really think is true is the size thing (although they have the same wingspan so meh), but it's still a fine comp as one possible set of outcomes for Hauser.
 

lovegtm

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I know the comparison police don't like anyone to be compared to anyone who they're not already better than, but Max Strus is a pretty low bar by the usual standards of the comparison game.
 

Over Guapo Grande

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Struts has proven (very small sample) to be an actual NBA player. At this point there is no real reason to think that Hauser is as good or better.
Comparing him to Struts is shaky. I guess if everything is aligned right, it works? I'd like a bit more stability in their performances, though.
 

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The Nets announcers very specifically talked about how they’d be looking to go after Houser whenever they could. Also said something about looking for when he has his hands (too) low, which I’m now trying to watch for to see what they mean.
 

benhogan

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The Nets announcers very specifically talked about how they’d be looking to go after Houser whenever they could. Also said something about looking for when he has his hands (too) low, which I’m now trying to watch for to see what they mean.
The excessively hunting Hauser game plan has been an utter failure. Siakam had his worst attempt of the night when SAM challenged him in the lane. Opponents are very cognizant of his shooting and have been trying their best to take away his 3PA, which has led to some SAM closeouts and more spacing for others. Development is never linear but he is still improving as an NBA player.
 

HomeRunBaker

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The excessively hunting Hauser game plan has been an utter failure. Siakam had his worst attempt of the night when SAM challenged him in the lane. Opponents are very cognizant of his shooting and have been trying their best to take away his 3PA, which has led to some SAM closeouts and more spacing for others. Development is never linear but he is still improving as an NBA player.
Teams tried doing this to Strus once he began getting regular minutes in Miami too. They will test you in this league if there is any sign/appearance of weakness and Hauser is holding up fine so far. It’s expected so good for him.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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The Nets announcers very specifically talked about how they’d be looking to go after Houser whenever they could. Also said something about looking for when he has his hands (too) low, which I’m now trying to watch for to see what they mean.
NBA saying = "Hands Down Man Down." I.e., if a shooter notices that the defender has his hands down, the shooter should take the shot because most defenders won't be able to get their hands up in time to bother the shot.

Doogie particularly has to play with his hands up. The extra split second in time savings matters. Not sure how much but it certainly matters.

The excessively hunting Hauser game plan has been an utter failure. Siakam had his worst attempt of the night when SAM challenged him in the lane. Opponents are very cognizant of his shooting and have been trying their best to take away his 3PA, which has led to some SAM closeouts and more spacing for others. Development is never linear but he is still improving as an NBA player.
He held up well against Kyrie too, which was a pleasant surprise to me as well. According to NBA matchup data, Doogie did not allow a FG to anyone on BRK except KD, and KD was only 1-1 against him (Kyrie was 0-2).
 

Euclis20

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Hauser played just 5 minutes tonight (despite the Celtics missing 35+ wing minutes with Brown out), his lowest amount since opening night. He's still at .404 from 3 for the year, but he's under 30% over his last 22 games. His +/- over that stretch is -51 (despite the Celtics going 14-8) after being amongst league leaders in +/- earlier in the year. This is a pretty disappointing stretch because while his overall game (especially defense) are a bit better than expected, if he's not hitting 40% of his 3s he's still a liability on the court. Hopefully this is just a really cold stretch because it's not that teams are playing him differently (though they are), it feels like he's bricking a LOT of wide open looks.
 

128

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DNP-CD for Hauser last nite. He's shooting himself out of the rotation.
 

Euclis20

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We could see this coming for the last week or so, with Hauser in single digits since Jaylen's injury (his minutes should have gone up with a 35 minute wing out, instead they went down). Hope he turns it around because there's no one on the roster that can replace what he brings when he's playing well.
 

benhogan

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We could see this coming for the last week or so, with Hauser in single digits since Jaylen's injury (his minutes should have gone up with a 35 minute wing out, instead they went down). Hope he turns it around because there's no one on the roster that can replace what he brings when he's playing well.
It's early in the Hauser experience, I'm optimistic and believe his shooting will be fine. I'd give him a B+ for his first NBA half-season. Maybe he hit a wall after the first 2 months?
 

Cellar-Door

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I think there is still a role for him long term. He started the year on fire from 3 and surprisingly competent on D, he's slumped hard on both ends as teams started targeting him, next step for him in making the adjustment to the extra defensive attention, and finding ways to compete on D when teams attack him.
 

lovegtm

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I think there is still a role for him long term. He started the year on fire from 3 and surprisingly competent on D, he's slumped hard on both ends as teams started targeting him, next step for him in making the adjustment to the extra defensive attention, and finding ways to compete on D when teams attack him.
Agree. He'll need to shoot his way back into the rotation, and that could take until next year. But given his contract and shooting track record at all levels, he's going to be given the chance to do so.
 

The Raccoon

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Agree. He'll need to shoot his way back into the rotation, and that could take until next year. But given his contract and shooting track record at all levels, he's going to be given the chance to do so.
19/33 from 3 in the last 4 games (or 5 if you include the couple of seconds he played against the Suns).
With Smart, JB and today Brogdon out they really needed him to contribute over the last few games as one of the last remaining healthy wings on the roster... and he did!
 

tbrown_01923

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I am wondering if some of his struggles were injury related, such as not being a full 100. He looks smooth now and I am surprised when they don't fall. He is hitting on less than perfect passes, such as picking up off ankles and firing.
 

joe dokes

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One thing I noticed during a few of Hauser's slump-time games is that any sort of contact throws him off. He's solidly built but does not seem very strong. As has been observed here, when he moves his feet on defense, he can kinda sorta stay with his man enough of the time. But he seems to get knocked off his intended path pretty easily by less-than-heavyduty picks or slight physical play by the defense. I wonder if he's found/learned ways to avoid that contact more effectively. After all, it's his first taste of regular NBA time. It wouldn't be surprising if his increased exposure necessitated increased work in the more nuanced aspects of maximizing his one dominant skill.
 

Jimbodandy

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One thing I noticed during a few of Hauser's slump-time games is that any sort of contact throws him off. He's solidly built but does not seem very strong. As has been observed here, when he moves his feet on defense, he can kinda sorta stay with his man enough of the time. But he seems to get knocked off his intended path pretty easily by less-than-heavyduty picks or slight physical play by the defense. I wonder if he's found/learned ways to avoid that contact more effectively. After all, it's his first taste of regular NBA time. It wouldn't be surprising if his increased exposure necessitated increased work in the more nuanced aspects of maximizing his one dominant skill.
Regarding his strength, I think that's something that comes with NBA level training. Everyone gets bigger with the right regimen. And even though Sam's not a spring chicken, he still has growth potential there. It's a good observation on your part.
 

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(I recognize defensive rating isn't a good individual stat, we're just having fun here guys)
 

Eddie Jurak

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Just because it is still fun to do this:

Sam Hauser blocked 21 shots this year (rate 1.4%) and 29 steals (rate 1.1%) in 1,290 minutes. For his career, he has 23 blocks (1.4%) and 30 steals (1.0%) in 1,448 minutes. He has 3 career dunks, all in the last game.

Semi Ojeleye, for his career, had 19 blocks (rate 0.4%) and 76 steals (rate 0.9%) in 4,111 minutes. His season high in blocks was 6, season high in steals was 21.
 

benhogan

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Just because it is still fun to do this:

Sam Hauser blocked 21 shots this year (rate 1.4%) and 29 steals (rate 1.1%) in 1,290 minutes. For his career, he has 23 blocks (1.4%) and 30 steals (1.0%) in 1,448 minutes. He has 3 career dunks, all in the last game.

Semi Ojeleye, for his career, had 19 blocks (rate 0.4%) and 76 steals (rate 0.9%) in 4,111 minutes. His season high in blocks was 6, season high in steals was 21.
Semi was good defensively for like a minute until every taller NBA player realized they could turn & shoot over him unchallenged.

Sam's height, footwork, and Boston's switchy D hide a lot of his defensive flaws.

It was fun watching opposing teams get out of their offense, spend half the shot clock hunting, and isolating Hauser. Only to have Sam funnel the player to the middle for help, leading to late shot clock, challenged 2s by a tallish player. One of the least efficient shots in the game. At one point he was the most isolated player in the NBA. Surprisingly for the number of concentrated attacks on him, he wasn't very foul-prone (1.2/gm)
 

TripleOT

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Quite a few really trashy shots against Hauser, where the offensive player, after stymied by Hauser’s positioning and length, has to revert to rearing back and slinging the ball at the rim from a strange angle.

The time he blocked Caleb Martin made me think wistfully about him actually defending Martin in the ECF, unlike his teammates who actually got playing time.
 

benhogan

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Quite a few really trashy shots against Hauser, where the offensive player, after stymied by Hauser’s positioning and length, has to revert to rearing back and slinging the ball at the rim from a strange angle.

The time he blocked Caleb Martin made me think wistfully about him actually defending Martin in the ECF, unlike his teammates who actually got playing time.
Right, so much clock is burned by setting up the ISO - Hunt Hauser!

Sam pulls his hands back to not foul & uses his body to bump the offensive player into help + a late-shot clock attempt. Most importantly, 3SAM is used versus 2nd units that are not as well organized, with bench players trying to flash their full offensive arsenal against the unathletic white guy. It's laughably inefficient.

3SAM should see a bump in minutes this season & will be vying for the 8th man in the rotation on most nights.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Semi was good defensively for like a minute until every taller NBA player realized they could turn & shoot over him unchallenged.

Sam's height, footwork, and Boston's switchy D hide a lot of his defensive flaws.

It was fun watching opposing teams get out of their offense, spend half the shot clock hunting, and isolating Hauser. Only to have Sam funnel the player to the middle for help, leading to late shot clock, challenged 2s by a tallish player. One of the least efficient shots in the game. At one point he was the most isolated player in the NBA. Surprisingly for the number of concentrated attacks on him, he wasn't very foul-prone (1.2/gm)
He's a very good positional defender but to your point on list of reasons that hid his flaws....none are greater than his minutes were primarily matchup dependent against opponents who weren't able to exploit him. Mazzulla rarely placed him in a bad situation.
 

benhogan

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He's a very good positional defender but to your point on list of reasons that hid his flaws....none are greater than his minutes were primarily matchup dependent against opponents who weren't able to exploit him. Mazzulla rarely placed him in a bad situation.
Agreed. Sam Hauser, as a starter, would lose a lot of his efficiency.

Bench role players need to be used judiciously, with the right teammates & against the right opponents.
 

lovegtm

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Hauser is now playing 19 mins/game and shooting 45% from three on 11 attempts per 36.
 

TripleOT

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Hauser is now playing 19 mins/game and shooting 45% from three on 11 attempts per 36.
Its a beautiful thing when Hauser first enters the game with the Cs up 8-12 points, and he hits a couple of threes. Him getting hot early can start the blowout and when Tatum re-enters the game looking for his scoring, they can bust out the opposition, as we saw in the Toronto and Brooklyn games.

Hauser is 10-20 from three in the first half after nine games (14-33, 42.4%) in the second, which has included a lot of garbage time). Being able to hit your first three is obviously a very valuable tool for a shooting specialist like Hauser.
 

benhogan

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3SAM is clearly the 7th man on this team.

While most bench talk has been centered on the 3rd BIG, it's the 7th man who will see real playoff minutes.

A Hauser leap would have a sizeable effect on this team (not quite, but similar to Austin Reaves uptick last season for LA)
 

lovegtm

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He looks like a real guy out there.
Pretty clearly an NBA rotation player imo. Ideally they extend him next summer on something reasonable: he's made very very little money post-tax, and will be 26, so there will be more pressure for him to lock in PP-type money.
 

HomeRunBaker

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3SAM is clearly the 7th man on this team.

While most bench talk has been centered on the 3rd BIG, it's the 7th man who will see real playoff minutes.

A Hauser leap would have a sizeable effect on this team (not quite, but similar to Austin Reaves uptick last season for LA)
Hauser could be the difference in us only needing one key bench piece by the deadline which would leave Brad more chips to acquire a key impact guy. He's fine as an 8th man who you can play matchups with in the postseason.
 

benhogan

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Hauser could be the difference in us only needing one key bench piece by the deadline which would leave Brad more chips to acquire a key impact guy. He's fine as an 8th man who you can play matchups with in the postseason.
I'm sure someone will point out that PP has played more minutes than Sam so far without taking into the context that PP is running garbage time while Sam hasn't recently. Sam is better than PP on both sides of the ball and I'm totally comfortable with him as #7 (backup WING) if Brad still wants to add a defense first BIG
 

Everetts Dinosaurs

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He certainly is. Looks like he went to the Duncan Robinson/Max Strus school and is shooting quicker and on the move more often.
He also seems more comfortable shooting with a hand in his face. In previous years it felt like he would only take the shot if he was relatively wide open and would abandon on a close out. This season feels like an important evolution, particularly if he wants to have a role in a deep postseason run.

is there an easy way to find the number of contested 3s he’s taken vs last year?
 

HomeRunBaker

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He certainly is. Looks like he went to the Duncan Robinson/Max Strus school and is shooting quicker and on the move more often.
That's the next step in a shooter's evolution. Some adapt quicker than others like Strus, others take more time while others never adjust.
 

Eddie Jurak

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I'm sure someone will point out that PP has played more minutes than Sam so far without taking into the context that PP is running garbage time while Sam hasn't recently. Sam is better than PP on both sides of the ball and I'm totally comfortable with him as #7 (backup WING) if Brad still wants to add a defense first BIG
Here is how cleaning the glass breaks down the non-garbage time minutes:

1. Tatum, 319
2. Holiday, 300
3. Brown, 299
4. Porzingis, 268
5. White, 209 (missed 2 games)
6. Horford, 192
7. Pritchard, 152
8. Hauser, 148
9. Kornet, 59
10. Brissett, 42
11. Mykhailiuk, 12
12. Stevens, 5

Pritchard and Hauser have essentially played the same minutes outside of garbage time. Pritchard's on/off has been way better than Hauser's, but I suspect that may be because Pritchard has more minutes with Tatum and fewer with Brown compared with Hauser.

Edit:

According to bbref, Pritchard has 115 minutes with Tatum and is +27.6 per 100 possessions. Protchard has 66 minutes with Brown and is +2.6. Hauser has 85 minutes with Tatum and is +27.1. Hauser has 69 minutes with Brown and is <oof> -28.1. Mystery solved.

Brown's 2-man lineups are positive with each of the starters and just barely with PP. Negative with everyone else, but especially with Hauser and Kornet.
 
Last edited:

Euclis20

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Here is how cleaning the glass breaks down the non-garbage time minutes:

1. Tatum, 319
2. Holiday, 300
3. Brown, 299
4. Porzingis, 268
5. White, 209 (missed 2 games)
6. Horford, 192
7. Pritchard, 152
8. Hauser, 148
9. Kornet, 59
10. Brissett, 42
11. Mykhailiuk, 12
12. Stevens, 5

Pritchard and Hauser have essentially played the same minutes outside of garbage time. Pritchard's on/off has been way better than Hauser's, but I suspect that may be because Pritchard has more minutes with Tatum and fewer with Brown compared with Hauser.

Edit:

According to bbref, Pritchard has 115 minutes with Tatum and is +27.6 per 100 possessions. Protchard has 66 minutes with Brown and is +2.6. Hauser has 85 minutes with Tatum and is +27.1. Hauser has 69 minutes with Brown and is <oof> -28.1. Mystery solved.

Brown's 2-man lineups are positive with each of the starters and just barely with PP. Negative with everyone else, but especially with Hauser and Kornet.
Tatum's 2-man lineups are all crazy. Bref lists the Celtics 20 most used 2-man lineups, and Tatum is in 7 of them. Here's their point differential per 100 possessions:

-with Brown: +22.5
-with Hauser: +27.1
-with Holiday: +25.7
-with Horford: +17.5
-with Porzingis: +21.7
-with Pritchard: +27.6
-with White: +31.1
 

lovegtm

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Jared Weiss of The Athletic with a nice breakdown of Hauser's moves and instincts and how they've evolved, with a bunch of clips to illustrate. Good stuff here all around.

https://theathletic.com/5064451/2023/11/15/celtics-sam-hauser-joe-mazzulla-defense/?source=dailyemail&campaign=601983

At this point the only thing Hauser can't do better than Grant is bump with centers in the low post.
The team defense and lateral movement in this clip were nice:
https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2023/11/14190419/pt-1-of-knicks-play-1.mp4
 

slamminsammya

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Jared Weiss of The Athletic with a nice breakdown of Hauser's moves and instincts and how they've evolved, with a bunch of clips to illustrate. Good stuff here all around.

https://theathletic.com/5064451/2023/11/15/celtics-sam-hauser-joe-mazzulla-defense/?source=dailyemail&campaign=601983

At this point the only thing Hauser can't do better than Grant is bump with centers in the low post.
Grant had some very moderate ability off the dribble as well. I haven't seen any of that from Hauser. not that it's really a need on this team.