2013 Broncos: The Unholy Alliance

RedOctober3829

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Mystic Merlin

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86spike said:
Update is that the initial diagnosis is just a sprain and the MRI will tell if it's worse than that.

Also, how about Manning breaking Brady's TD record in just 15 games?
 
http://youtu.be/qYOH30WUX7Y?t=1m50s
 
2:00
 
Also, don't get too hopeful about Miller.
 

86spike

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Mystic Merlin said:
 
2:00
 
Also, don't get too hopeful about Miller.
I'm not holding my breath on Von. Seems like Denver's D has been cosmically determined to always lack 4 starters. Bailey came back today, so someone else had to go.

As for Manning's new record, I can't resist:

 

Ed Hillel

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86spike said:
I'm not holding my breath on Von. Seems like Denver's D has been cosmically determined to always lack 4 starters. Bailey came back today, so someone else had to go.

As for Manning's new record, I can't resist:

 
 
Some tough injuries on defense this year, eh?
 
Also, this could be karmic justice to Miller for not getting suspended an entire season for conspiring to cheat the NFL drug test.
 

snowmanny

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Actually they told Brady that Manning broke his record during his press conference and he said "He did? That's cool."

Maybe he wouldn't be as non-chalant if Manning broke his record for games over .500.
 

Euclis20

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The next big record would be total points scored:  The Broncos need 18 points to break the 2007 Pats record of 589 points (36.8 ppg).  Pretty likely they'll get that, considering they've yet to score under 20 points in a game.
 

ivanvamp

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86spike said:
Update is that the initial diagnosis is just a sprain and the MRI will tell if it's worse than that.

Also, how about Manning breaking Brady's TD record in just 15 games?
 
I'm sure a lot of Pats fans will poo-pooh the record, but honestly, that's pretty amazing.  He's had a phenomenal year.
 
Let's just hope it ends in typical Peyton Manning fashion.  Icing on the cake if Brady is the one that ends Manning's season.
 

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snowmanny said:
Maybe he wouldn't be as non-chalant if Manning broke his record for games over .500.
 
If we count postseason, Brady is +114, Manning +91. Regular season only, it's +104 to +93. 
 
Not that you were saying it was realistic, just putting the numbers out there.
 
To get to Manning's regular season record, Brady would have to go 11-34.
 

Oppo

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Brady had a higher TD% and lower INT% in 2007 compared to 2013 Manning
 

86spike

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Euclis20 said:
The next big record would be total points scored:  The Broncos need 18 points to break the 2007 Pats record of 589 points (36.8 ppg).  Pretty likely they'll get that, considering they've yet to score under 20 points in a game.
I think passing yards is also in the crosshairs next week assuming he plays more than a quarter. With the NE/Buffalo game moving to the 4:00 slot, neither NE nor Denver will know whether the other won early wrt the number one seed, so I guess he'll play for a while.

Total completions is close too, but he would need an ungodly 45 or so, which ain't happening.
 

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86spike said:
Update is that the initial diagnosis is just a sprain and the MRI will tell if it's worse than that.

Also, how about Manning breaking Brady's TD record in just 15 games?
 
Brady threw 50 TDs in 578 attempts all season long.
 
Manning threw 51 in 631 attempts. In fact going into yesterday's game Manning had 580 attempts already on the season and "only" 47 TDs to that point.
 
It's one helluva accomplishment to get the 51 TD mark, but some context is necessary.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
Brady threw 50 TDs in 578 attempts all season long.
 
Manning threw 51 in 631 attempts. In fact going into yesterday's game Manning had 580 attempts already on the season and "only" 47 TDs to that point.
 
It's one helluva accomplishment to get the 51 TD mark, but some context is necessary.
 
As a reminder, SJH:
 
 

86spike

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Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
Was JUST ABOUT to post that here. Curran's awesome. And right.
 
I guess this is finally just proof of what many people felt was behind that criticism in 2007: the media doesn't like Bill Belichick and used the "running up the score" to poke him in the eye.  They're not doing it this year because Manning and John Fox are well liked.
 
So case closed, right?  You guys can finally stop complaining about it.
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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86spike said:
 
I guess this is finally just proof of what many people felt was behind that criticism in 2007: the media doesn't like Bill Belichick and used the "running up the score" to poke him in the eye.  They're not doing it this year because Manning and John Fox are well liked.
 
So case closed, right?  You guys can finally stop complaining about it.
 
Are you fucking kidding me? Fuck that. This should be broadcast as often as possible because it's fucking ridiculous.
 
Look, I don't want to take away from what Manning has done this year. He's been incredible. It's a significant accomplishment and I'm extremely impressed by his play. At the same time, it's almost impossible to break a TD record without doing exactly what Manning did yesterday, throw while up big. It can't be overstated how much shit the Patriots caught for turning games into practice sessions throughout the 2007 season. And now when the Broncos are doing the same thing....silence. Obviously I didn't have a problem with the Pats doing it in 2007, and I don't have one when the Broncos do it now: these are professionals. But the double-standard rankles deeply.
 

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Nope. The case will be closed when the same "classless" accusations are thrown around regarding the Broncos.  The basic argument wasn't that the media doesn't like BB, it was that BB was disrespecting the opponent organizations.  It's the double standard that is the problem here. Two organizations since 2007 have scored a ton of points by throwing when they lead by 20+ late in games yet only one organization is labeled as classless. That's the fucking problem.
 

Stitch01

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Yeah, the media is composed primarily of idiots.  No shocker there, and no reason not to continue pointing it out. 
 
I said in the game thread that I thought having Manning throw to break the record yesterday was smart.  If the Pats lost yesterday the Broncos could have rested everyone next week.
 

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Stitch01 said:
Yeah, the media is composed primarily of idiots.  No shocker there, and no reason not to continue pointing it out. 
 
I said in the game thread that I thought having Manning throw to break the record yesterday was smart.  If the Pats lost yesterday the Broncos could have rested everyone next week.
 
I agree. And frankly there's not a team in the league that wouldn't give their QB a shot at breaking the TD record if it was in reach.
 

Dogman

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Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
I agree. And frankly there's not a team in the league that wouldn't give their QB a shot at breaking the TD record if it was in reach.
 
 
Yep.  I had no problem with it. 
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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86spike said:
 
Troll?
 
eat me.
 
You're not a troll.
 
Your comment was trolling.
 
"Also, how about Manning breaking Brady's TD record in just 15 games?"
 
There's no context other than "Hey, let me point this out to you guys!" You follow it up with a trolling .gif.
 
I'm OK with it. Twisting the knife into another teams fans is part of the deal with sports. I didn't complain about it when you posted it. But if you're going to troll, don't take offense when people call you on it.
 

ShaneTrot

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The Saints run up the score when they can, they cranked Dallas and AZ earlier this year and they have gone out of their way to let Brees set records and you never hear a peep about it from mediots.
 

86spike

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Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
Are you fucking kidding me? Fuck that. This should be broadcast as often as possible because it's fucking ridiculous.
 
Look, I don't want to take away from what Manning has done this year. He's been incredible. It's a significant accomplishment and I'm extremely impressed by his play. At the same time, it's almost impossible to break a TD record without doing exactly what Manning did yesterday, throw while up big. It can't be overstated how much shit the Patriots caught for turning games into practice sessions throughout the 2007 season. And now when the Broncos are doing the same thing....silence. Obviously I didn't have a problem with the Pats doing it in 2007, and I don't have one when the Broncos do it now: these are professionals. But the double-standard rankles deeply.
 
 
Dogman2 said:
Nope. The case will be closed when the same "classless" accusations are thrown around regarding the Broncos.  The basic argument wasn't that the media doesn't like BB, it was that BB was disrespecting the opponent organizations.  It's the double standard that is the problem here. Two organizations since 2007 have scored a ton of points by throwing when they lead by 20+ late in games yet only one organization is labeled as classless. That's the fucking problem.
 
 
Stitch01 said:
Yeah, the media is composed primarily of idiots.  No shocker there, and no reason not to continue pointing it out. 
 
I said in the game thread that I thought having Manning throw to break the record yesterday was smart.  If the Pats lost yesterday the Broncos could have rested everyone next week.
 
Here's the thing: it was always about people's dislike for Belichick.  
 
I suggest you guys accept that and you'll feel better.
 
Someone else is going to break Manning's newly-set record soon (and as he put it himself yesterday, it could be Brady next year) and that team will not be subject to the vitriol that BB got.
 
It's because people had a problem with BB.
 
Plain and simple.
 
BB seems pretty comfortable being hated.  I wouldn't let it bother me if I were you guys.
 

Stitch01

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It doesnt bother me.  Why exactly shouldnt we point out that the media are idiots though?
 
EDIT: lol at Brady breaking that record again next year.  That....wont happen.  Manning has to play next week so the record is going to 54 or 55 or something like that. 
 

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Stitch01 said:
It doesnt bother me.  Why exactly shouldnt we point out that the media are idiots though?
 
EDIT: lol at Brady breaking that record again next year.  That....wont happen.  Manning has to play next week so the record is going to 54 or 55 or something like that. 
 
So in this thread we have the topic of Manning setting the new single season TD record and the most common theme in the responses is "Why isn't the media calling them classless?!?".
 
That sentiment pollutes the thread.  It's not about Denver, it's about the media.
 
I don't expect a group of Pats fans to fall to the ground in awe of Peyton Manning.  But "the media sucks" is just so tired.
 

Stitch01

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Well, no, its one of the topics.  If you didnt keep fanning the flames it would die.
 
Basically, tough titties.
 

86spike

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Stitch01 said:
Well, no, its one of the topics.  If you didnt keep fanning the flames it would die.
 
Basically, tough titties.
 
That's actually a perfect note to leave it on.
 
Tough titties for all my friends!
 

Stitch01

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His accuracy is pretty incredible.  Even his ducks get into super tight windows. I think the wind hurts him more now because a lot of his throws arent tight spirals, but other than that he's done an incredible job adapting to losing something physically.   Its been super impressive to watch.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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Stitch01 said:
His accuracy is pretty incredible.  Even his ducks get into super tight windows. I think the wind hurts him more now because a lot of his throws arent tight spirals, but other than that he's done an incredible job adapting to losing something physically.   Its been super impressive to watch.
 
Meh. If Brady played against Peyton's powderpuff schedule, he'd have thrown up those numbers easy.
 
Seriously. The 15 teams Manning played has combined to give up 359 passing TD's. Add in Oakland's (Mannings week 16 opponent) 29 passing TD's, and you have 387 passing TD's. The 16 teams Brady played combined for 352. And Brady did it with 100 less passes. He did it with less throws, against better teams, and with less help from the ref's. Meh on Manning.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Stitch01 said:
His accuracy is pretty incredible.  Even his ducks get into super tight windows. I think the wind hurts him more now because a lot of his throws arent tight spirals, but other than that he's done an incredible job adapting to losing something physically.   Its been super impressive to watch.
Its really pretty amazing. His arm is so much weaker now than it was before his neck injury that he must have had to make a ton of adjustments - when to release the ball in a receiver's pattern, what types of throws he could get away with, a much greater focus on little touch passes and lobs, etc. All that precise timing and instinct and muscle memory developed over 20 odd years playing the position with a reasonably strong arm had to be consciously adjusted.

I love me some Manning face and I really hope the Broncos flame out of the playoffs in the first round but you have to tip your cap to the achievement.
 

dbn

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A silver lining to Manning's record is that no team has ever won a SB when their QB threw 50+ TD passes in the regular season.

(It hurt to type that.)
 

Stitch01

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
 
Meh. If Brady played against Peyton's powderpuff schedule, he'd have thrown up those numbers easy.
 
Seriously. The 15 teams Manning played has combined to give up 359 passing TD's. Add in Oakland's (Mannings week 16 opponent) 29 passing TD's, and you have 387 passing TD's. The 16 teams Brady played combined for 352. And Brady did it with 100 less passes. He did it with less throws, against better teams, and with less help from the ref's. Meh on Manning.
Nah, he's been awesome.  Pretend he threw for 41 TDs instead of 51, its still been incredible.
 

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So Von Miller is done.
 
Next man up is 3rd yr pro Nate Irving.  He actually played quite well yesterday, although Houston's offense and band-aid running game are hardly a tough test.  
 
Del Rio has some work to do preparing this banged up defense for the playoffs.  Derek Wolfe might return after the bye to assist in run-stopping and the newly-added Jeremy Mincey has some pass-rushing skills.  Rookie Sylvester Williams and veteran Terrence Knighton were making some noise pressuring Houston up the middle, so if those two can gel, it will help.  The losses of Miller and Vickerson are really tough, though.
 
Champ Bailey had a quiet game (not sure if that was due to him keeping his man covered and un-thrown to or just coincidence) so he may be back to positive contribution.
 
All in all, Denver will struggle on D (especially against the run).  The offense is going to need to bring the noise.  I would hope they don't end up facing KC, Pitt, or SD in the Divisional round.  Stout running attacks will be tough to deal with.  I'd rather draw Miami, Baltimore, Indy or the Bengals (although seeding will make some of those matchups impossible depending on how it shakes out after next week).
 

Morning Woodhead

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jsinger121 said:
 
Better get that extra cash ready for the urine collector.  I imagine there will be some dubious substances used during the rehab process given his track record. 
 

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Morning Woodhead said:
 
Better get that extra cash ready for the urine collector.  I imagine there will be some dubious substances used during the rehab process given his track record. 
 
Elway should just move him into his house and babysit him for the next 9 months.
 
Von is a free agent after next season.  His drug suspension status and now this ACL have undoubtedly taken a massive bite out of the offers he will get.  Hope he didn't spend too much on dope.
 

ivanvamp

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
 
Meh. If Brady played against Peyton's powderpuff schedule, he'd have thrown up those numbers easy.
 
Seriously. The 15 teams Manning played has combined to give up 359 passing TD's. Add in Oakland's (Mannings week 16 opponent) 29 passing TD's, and you have 387 passing TD's. The 16 teams Brady played combined for 352. And Brady did it with 100 less passes. He did it with less throws, against better teams, and with less help from the ref's. Meh on Manning.
 
Part of the reason Brady has thrown a lot fewer passes is because he hasn't been as good as Manning.  Manning has completed more passes, and at a much higher percentage, so he gets more first downs, which means he can keep throwing.  
 
Denver has 407 first downs this year compared to 354 for New England. (+53 for Den)
Denver has 274 passing first downs this year compared to 218 for New England.  (+56 for Den)
 
So Manning has passed his way to more passing opportunities.  
 
It's not the whole story, but it's a lot of the story.  
 
EDIT:  And as I look at their passing stats on espn.com, Manning has attempted 631 passes compared to 604 for Brady.  That's just 27 more.  He has completed, however, 59 more passes than Brady.
 
DOUBLE EDIT:  OH, my bad.  You're comparing 2013 Manning to 2007 Brady.  Ok, disregard….
 

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ivanvamp said:
 
Part of the reason Brady has thrown a lot fewer passes is because he hasn't been as good as Manning.  Manning has completed more passes, and at a much higher percentage, so he gets more first downs, which means he can keep throwing.  
 
Denver has 407 first downs this year compared to 354 for New England. (+53 for Den)
Denver has 274 passing first downs this year compared to 218 for New England.  (+56 for Den)
 
So Manning has passed his way to more passing opportunities.  
 
It's not the whole story, but it's a lot of the story.  
 
He's comparing Manning 2013 with Brady 2007, not with Brady 2013.
 

triniSox

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KFP must be trolling. Mannin has been pretty awesome. Yeah his arm isn't as strong as Brady's but his accuracy has been spectacular especially on intermediate (~30 yard) throws. I love Brady as much as the next guy but tip of the cap to Peyton.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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FO showed a few weeks ago that the Denver defense was 29th in the league in DVOA without Von Miller in Weeks 1-6 and 7th in the league with Von Miller in Weeks 7-12. Its a big loss.

I think you need to score 30-35 to beat Denver and that just got a little easier.
 

ivanvamp

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loshjott said:
 
He's comparing Manning 2013 with Brady 2007, not with Brady 2013.
 
Yeah I finally got that.  Personally I think 2007 Brady was better too.  But I think his estimation of 2013 Manning as "meh" is crazy.  Dude has been unreal.  You can't put up 5500 yards and 51+ touchdowns by being "meh".  
 

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Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
Are you fucking kidding me? Fuck that. This should be broadcast as often as possible because it's fucking ridiculous.
 
Look, I don't want to take away from what Manning has done this year. He's been incredible. It's a significant accomplishment and I'm extremely impressed by his play. At the same time, it's almost impossible to break a TD record without doing exactly what Manning did yesterday, throw while up big. It can't be overstated how much shit the Patriots caught for turning games into practice sessions throughout the 2007 season. And now when the Broncos are doing the same thing....silence. Obviously I didn't have a problem with the Pats doing it in 2007, and I don't have one when the Broncos do it now: these are professionals. But the double-standard rankles deeply.
 
They talked about this on ESPN Radio this afternoon. The host said "because it's Peyton Manning I don't mind."