Stanford and Cal probably have to go independently. Four corner schools to Big 12, OSU and WSU to the Mountain West.
Realignment 2023: Whither the Pac12?
- Thread starter Zososoxfan
- Start date
Stanford and Cal are going to be left out in the cold. They honestly should just drop football all together or drop to FCS. So should Oregon State and Wazzu.
I think OSU and WSU fit well with the MWC - they were so lucky to have been dragged along to the Pac 10 as it was. They're smaller programs with smaller fanbases that match the MWC quite well.
UW and Oregon fans will rue this decision for years. Their football teams are going to go from automatic bids out West to never getting out of the Big 10. Will be hilarious.
Also, losing things like the Apple Cup and the Civil War is insane.
Also, losing things like the Apple Cup and the Civil War is insane.
I have heard that Washington State borrowed against future Pac-12 revenue to upgrade their facilities so if that indeed is true they're royally screwed right about now. They will need to continue to put in cost-cutting measures to stay above water now that they're not getting that revenue. The biggest cost-cutting move would be to drop the football program and spread that money out to the other programs. I'm sure they will try everything else before thinking about that, but dropping the program would be the smartest thing they could do to survive long-term.
I genuinely have no idea what they do. Twelve percent of the undergrads at Stanford are on an intercollegiate sports team, so any change involving more travel would affect a disproportionately large number of students academically. Cal has won at least one team or individual national championship in something every year since WWII, but that is actually hurting them because they fund a ton of sports without the sort of recent success in the revenue sports that would help defray those costs. A conference bringing them on is just signing up to get its ass kicked in swimming, rowing, water polo, and rugby while not generating additional revenue.
Wazzu is in dire financial trouble - https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/wsu-cougar-football/wsu-athletic-department-budget-cuts-and-hiring-freezes-due-to-pac-12s-financial-issues/
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I feel really bad for OSU and WSU in all of this, they will be left out in the cold when all is said and done. As a WVU alum/fan, we've been dealing with realignment for 20 years now going back to the original ACC raid on the Big East. It's a horrible feeling to be on the cliff's edge whenever these things go down and not knowing if you will be in a viable conference when the music stops. The fact that the leaders of our educational institutions do nothing but chase the next dollar, backstab, and lie is extremely disheartening. These people would knife their closest ally for an additional dollar, but are also entrusted in helping shape millions of kids at their schools.
This sucks. It's been tough enough being a BC fan the past decade+ but if they ever have a decent season, who cares? It's only a matter of time before FSU, Clemson, etc. leave the ACC and schools like BC in the dust. I get why all of this is happening...but I don't like it.
You shouldn’t like it. We’re rapidly approaching a point where the fans of roughly 35 schools should care about college football, and the rest have no need to because either their conference or their program is utterly irrelevant.
Why is the Big10 so much more interested in Washington/Oregon than Cal/Stanford? The Bay Area is far from a college sports hotbed, but it's also a huge media market and one of the two or three richest metros in the country. And both teams have plenty of football history; even Cal, which has mostly sucked lately, has a #1 overall draft pick in the last decade.
Agreed. I’ve completely lost my connection to the sport. And I used to be a diehard.
Pete Thamel
@PeteThamel
8m
Sources: Both Utah and Arizona State have applied for formal membership to the Big 12 Conference, and there’s a call tonight with the Big 12's presidents and chancellors to discuss their membership. Arizona applied and was approved yesterday.
@PeteThamel
8m
Sources: Both Utah and Arizona State have applied for formal membership to the Big 12 Conference, and there’s a call tonight with the Big 12's presidents and chancellors to discuss their membership. Arizona applied and was approved yesterday.
In a media world that relies more on streaming subscriptions than cable TV ratings, brands are more important than markets. Oregon and Washington have large, rabid fan bases who will certainly subscribe to a B1G product when that is ultimately offered. Stanford and Cal don’t and won’t.
In the current iteration of realignment, brand strength is what's driving the bus more than market size or certainly history. When the Big 10 goes to negotiate its next round of media deals, who can make the pie so much bigger that even after slicing it an extra two ways, everyone will come out ahead?
Edit: Beaten by 8slim. And yes, definitely think ahead to an AppleTV or Amazon, etc. Who has the strength to actually make a streaming deal work?
Cal is broke, doesn't prioritize sports, doesn't drive viewers, and is haughty enough that they don't want to be around "the poors". Stanford has more wiggle room to get invited to the B1G since they invest in the non-revenue sports and they provide a bit of hope they can eventually snag ND with all of ND's rivals being in the B1G but Cal doesn't bring anything to the table besides research and academic prestige.
This is why Boise's omission from conference talks is a total head-scratcher.
Say what you will about the DMA, but it is a national brand with a strong local/regional following.
Big 10 (possible west) USC, UCLA, Oregon, Washington, Nebraska, Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Northwestern
Big 10 (possible east) Rutgers, Maryland, Penn St. Ohio St, Purdue, Indiana, Michigan, Mich St., Illinois
Big 12 (possible west) Arizona, Arizona St, Utah, BYU, Baylor, Houston, TCU, Texas Tech
Big 12 (possible east) Central Florida, West Virginia, Cincinnati, Iowa St, Kansas, Kansas St, Oklahoma St, Colorado
Pac 4 Stanford, California, Washington St, Oregon St
EDIT: I assume Wash St and Oregon St will end up in the Mountain West and Stanford and Cal will eventually end up in the Big 10 (which can then go to three divisions of 6, 7 and 7).
Big 10 (possible east) Rutgers, Maryland, Penn St. Ohio St, Purdue, Indiana, Michigan, Mich St., Illinois
Big 12 (possible west) Arizona, Arizona St, Utah, BYU, Baylor, Houston, TCU, Texas Tech
Big 12 (possible east) Central Florida, West Virginia, Cincinnati, Iowa St, Kansas, Kansas St, Oklahoma St, Colorado
Pac 4 Stanford, California, Washington St, Oregon St
EDIT: I assume Wash St and Oregon St will end up in the Mountain West and Stanford and Cal will eventually end up in the Big 10 (which can then go to three divisions of 6, 7 and 7).
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This is correct. Eons ago LSU left the table when the SWC was being formed and went their own way.
This just clears out a lot of mismatches and teams cobbled together. It sucks for old rivals but new ones develop.
And for teams “left behind” it’s not any different imo and not verify smoked every year by Bama or USC is not a negative.
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Stanford can teach business classes on how poorly the PAC handled realignment.
And Utah being the best football program in the new B12 is wild. But credit to the B12 - they could’ve dissolved and ended up putting together a pretty fun conference.
And Utah being the best football program in the new B12 is wild. But credit to the B12 - they could’ve dissolved and ended up putting together a pretty fun conference.
PAC12 schools joining the B12 tracks. It’s not like it’s a requirement to play defense there, so stylistically it should be a seamless transition.
I know no one cares about basketball, but all these moves make some pretty competitive conferences for basketball. Conference play is really going to be a gauntlet.
ACC is probably going to turn into what the Big East was when I went to BC in early 90s: basketball centric conference that had some teams that also played football
BC should focus on hoops like Villanova, UConn, etc. Football is a lost cause. Let’s try to be good at something.
Your last paragraph is ridiculous. Not playing them is a huge negative. As a BC fan, it would be markedly different watching UConn every year than it is currently with a Clemson. Hooray we get an easier game every year though to get us closer to a shitty bowl! Give me a fucking break.
I get that argument but BC (and similar programs) and the major programs aren’t remotely close to competitiveness and never will be, esp with NIL. I hate it - but it is where CFB has going forever. The PAC 16 (with Texas, OU, Nebraska, etc) a thing -15 years ago and that would have spiked the sport like today’s actions did.
If anything the expanded playoff means the BCs of the world can actually get into the fight. That’s essentially been impossible the last 20 years.
Edit: IMO this is all headed to a NFL style two conference deal that seeds X teams automatically into the playoffs and the other schools/conferences get X dedicated spots. A bit like the ncaa tourney
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Seeing reports that the Big 12 will now try to get UConn and Gonzaga for basketball. Tue commissioner is on record wanting a separate deal for basketball and football.
If hey have a separate deal for basketball - the big 12 is a stellar blue bood conference with Kansas and Zona. Adding those two storied programs is likely huge money and more than they’re getting now
I guess we'll see. No one is currently selling their basketball rights as a standalone product, correct? Looks like Big East teams currently bank $4.6M/yr.
West Coast Conference (including Gonzaga)
26-34 games
17 with ESPN, rest with CBS and CBSN
Not sure how much
through 2026-27
I think that’s right and the Bug 12 wants to be a trailblazer there. With those 4 schools it’ll be the best basketball conference and can prob get major money.
Edit: I forgot about Baylor and Houston. Wow.
How does BC get into the fight when their toughest games are UConn and Syracuse?
None of the above has anything to do with your arrogant point that the smaller teams no longer getting smoked by the bigger teams is somehow a good thing for the smaller teams. They’ll play shittier teams, the fans will care less and the money will be less. But thank god we didn’t lose by 30 to Clemson year! I fail to see how any of this is good or even neutral for the left behind teams.
I don't think he's saying it's good or even neutral, just that it's a silver lining. Certainly BC would trade places with Rutgers if they could.
Because BC can now have a chance to win its conference title snd earn the playoff spot. That’s impossible now essentially.
It’s not good. But it’s a chance and imo that’s something worth looking forward to.
CFB is crazy unequal and only getting worse. A separation has been coming for a while. That sucks.