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Arrests in Major NCAA College Basketball Probe

Discussion in 'College Sports' started by Was (Not Wasdin), Sep 26, 2017.

  1. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Yeah--granted it seems small compared to the others, but there's clearly a Duke player listed as having potentially received an "impermissible benefit".
     
  2. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    32,217
    March Madness is gonna be lit af when all these teams decide to punish themselves with no postseason this year and Western Kentucky goes in as a #1 seed.
     
  3. SuperManny

    SuperManny Member SoSH Member

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    The only thing I saw on Duke was from this story:

    http://www.wralsportsfan.com/report...deral-ncaa-basketball-investigation/17366186/
    Not sure what the rules are for lunch expenses with parents but it seems like there isn't much there at the moment.
     
    #253 SuperManny, Feb 23, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2018
  4. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    24,292
    Anyone who chimes in to say that this "can't touch my school, because (fill in lame excuse)" is engaging in magical thinking.

    There is too much money at stake in college athletics for any team to be truly clean. Boosters - who corrupt the system because they want nothing more than pride in their university - have been replaced by corporate execs, who have a vested interest in the success or failure of major programs. And they will work around whatever system a school puts in place to make sure that the players they want get to the "correct" schools.

    There are no more "clean" programs. Just degrees of corruption.

    Edit: And let me be clear, the villain here isn't the kids getting small handouts. Nor is it the schools struggling within a fantasy system of illogical rules and regulations. (Although their willingness to use the system to squeeze hundreds of millions per school from shoe/apparel companies certainly doesn't help.) The NCAA is the problem. Hopefully, they will collapse under their own weight at some point.
     
    #254 Average Reds, Feb 23, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2018
  5. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    About time to drain the ACC swamp. Get the corrupt Dukies and Tarheels out.
     
  6. doldmoose34

    doldmoose34 impregnated Melissa Theuriau SoSH Member

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    as someone said over on Outsider I think, its a benefit for BC sucking the past few years.. no mentions in FBI/NCAA Yahoo article
     
  7. MillarTime

    MillarTime Member SoSH Member

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    The part about the coaches meeting with Dawkins seems like it was included out of laziness or to maximize clicks and perception of wrong-doing. This is a Dawkins expense report back to ASM and there’s no payment/impermissble benefit there as coaches are free to meet with whoever they want.
     
    #257 MillarTime, Feb 23, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2018
  8. shaggydog2000

    shaggydog2000 Member SoSH Member

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    If this brings down the NCAA model of running a pro sport and collecting all the money for themselves, AD's, and coaches, and not paying the actual on court/on-field talent, then it's great. Talent has immense value in these sports. These athletes will be paid one way or another, as these scandals show. It's time to make it official and make sure all of the revenue generating athletes get some piece of the pie. NCAA and the coaches will fight it tooth and nail because it makes their cut smaller, but it has to happen eventually.
     
  9. DukeSox

    DukeSox Rick Derris SoSH Member

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    Some dude paid for his mom's lunch. Kick Carter out of the NCAA then, I don't care - this has nothing to do with Duke.

    Man that storm fucked me, my apt building was without power for a week and that night i had to walk down 51 stories of stairs lol.
     
  10. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    The Carter lunch was under $200 too. Permissible if paid back. He's not in jeopardy
     
  11. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    Pete Thamel, Yahoo, and Pat Forde used Duke and Carolina to get those sweet, sweet clicks? I'm shocked.
     
  12. DukeSox

    DukeSox Rick Derris SoSH Member

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    Please don't lump Duke in with a program that ran a scam for 20 years
     
  13. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    Yeah your sociology department is totally on the up and up
     
  14. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    It is way early in the process for that. The FBI doesn't want to send runners to prison they want runners to flip to bring charges against the big dogs in this investigation. Give it time.

    What I really want to do is WTF did Wendell's mother freakin eat for lunch that cost $106?!?!?
     
  15. Clears Cleaver

    Clears Cleaver Lil' Bill SoSH Member

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    Again, what they want is access to bank record and tax returns. Then can see all the different people who provided $$. The fact these clowns didn’t sign many shows that others likely offered more. And getting the records will lead to Nike and under armor etc. and then to boosters. And then to coaches. Etc.

    The tax returns show the benefits were not taxed, pressures the recipients to turn on everyone

    The only thing that will come of this short term is whomever “wins” the NCAA tournament will likely have done so will illegal players.
     
  16. Sox and Rocks

    Sox and Rocks Member SoSH Member

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    I have no ill-will towards Duke, per se, but their fans are another matter. I hope the program burns in hell just for their sake alone.

    I can make a similar argument for most of the top programs, and if this cleans up the sport, then dilly, dilly! Duke, though, is by far the worst.
     
  17. JShams

    JShams Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    The ESPN article is even worse and more disingenuous
     
  18. DukeSox

    DukeSox Rick Derris SoSH Member

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    +1
     
  19. hawaiirsn

    hawaiirsn Member SoSH Member

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    Totally agree with this. They should absolutely be mentioning Duke (obviously huge name program that is implicated, albeit to a much lesser extent than others), but looking at the info that has come out so far and leading with Duke is ridiculous. Really needs to put the relative allegations in context.

    Full disclosure, I'm a Duke grad student that enjoys basketball, but by no means a huge Duke fan. I did greatly enjoy being at Cameron watching (the much more heavily implicated) Dennis Smith Jr leading NC State to that upset win last year-- I just enjoy me some good basketball, and secondarily cheer for Duke.

    All that said, it seems like there is probably more there for most of these schools including Duke. Like many others have said, probably the tip of the iceberg.
     
  20. Reverend

    Reverend for king and country Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I understand where your are coming from, but Duke proving to be clean would actually underscore that the corruptive forces at work are not necessary to succeed.

    Which would underscore just how bullshit and exploitive the existing system is in that it is unnecessary, and therefore parasitic.

    I mean, we know this... but it would be a whole new level of demonstration.
     
  21. Reverend

    Reverend for king and country Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    37,359
  22. DukeSox

    DukeSox Rick Derris SoSH Member

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    +1
     
  23. Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat

    Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat has big, douchey shoulders Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    31,065
  24. benhogan

    benhogan Baynes Hogan SoSH Member

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    Yikes, this is going to get ugly real fast, Sean Miller caught red-handed.

    If you are a coach that spoke to ASM about paying kids money, start getting fit for your orange jumpsuit.
     
  25. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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  26. DukeSox

    DukeSox Rick Derris SoSH Member

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    Arizona has been corrupt forever from Lute, no surprise there
     
  27. Gdiguy

    Gdiguy Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    The spectacular note in that article:

    That's some fine negotiating there, Lou

    I really wonder - was AZ so incompetent they didn't think "hey, maybe we should not have to pay him if he's fired for cause", or was Miller so pre-aware he was going to do this that he fought to make sure that term was there
     
  28. Reverend

    Reverend for king and country Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    If it’s the latter, I bet I can guess something that the forensic accountants are in the process of looking at.
     
  29. The Big Red Kahuna

    The Big Red Kahuna Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    If more shoes like this drop (and I assume they will), tournament going to be a mess... Ayton is done. How many others? How does selection committee take into account? I think it’s clear that Cornell is the only program truly clean and should be granted a auto spot in the final 4.
     
  30. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Jay Bilas and Jeff Goodman(a U of A alum) on SportsCenter saying that Miller should never coach another game at Arizona. Seth Greenberg says he's known him for 40 years and is very disappointed and says the same as Bilas and Goodman.
     
  31. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    He should never coach another game in the NCAA, not just Arizona
     
  32. amfox1

    amfox1 Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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  33. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    I’m sure Miller was the only coach doing this.
     
  34. bosockboy

    bosockboy Member SoSH Member

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    Long fall from this for Miller:

     
  35. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    Bilas must feel like an ass after strongly defending Miller’s integrity last fall when his assistant was arrested.

    And yes, Miller should never coach anywhere again. But he will.
     
  36. wade boggs chicken dinner

    wade boggs chicken dinner Member SoSH Member

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    I would think that Sean Miller knows a lot of the process of getting guys paid and the FBI is going to lean on him to spill the beans.
     
  37. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    If Bruce Pearl and Kelvin Sampson could still get jobs, Miller will too.
     
  38. slamminsammya

    slamminsammya Member SoSH Member

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    I hope but don't expect that this whole episode ends the "student athlete" legal institution. Just pay the kids already.
     
  39. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    He’s done on the major college level. No team is going to hire him after a scandal that’s gonna put people in jail.
     
  40. Clears Cleaver

    Clears Cleaver Lil' Bill SoSH Member

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    Again, this is just the tip. Once the feds have access to all these players families/handlers bank records then all the dominoes fall. And now they have cause
     
  41. amfox1

    amfox1 Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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  42. amfox1

    amfox1 Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    #292 amfox1, Feb 24, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2018
  43. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    20,240
    Wonder if Ayton will play tonight. NCAA said it is in UA's hands.

    Also wonder if this will lead to the death penalty for UA hoops.
     
  44. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    Answers are that he's been cleared to play, so probably yes and no, they won't.
     
  45. Humphrey

    Humphrey Member SoSH Member

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    In other words they can't prove he actually got the money (even though most likely he did). Not that Miller is in any worse trouble.
     
  46. djbayko

    djbayko Member SoSH Member

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    I wonder if there's $100k under a mattress somewhere until the NBA Draft. Is that a standard part of the process?
     
  47. Humphrey

    Humphrey Member SoSH Member

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    Meanwhile Ayton has a double-double....at the half.
     
  48. Papelbon's Poutine

    Papelbon's Poutine Homeland Security SoSH Member

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    Exactly. They all do it to some extent. I don't get the "he shouldn't ever coach again" sentiment. We generally all agree these kids should get paid and that the NCAA is crooked. But then we get outraged when it comes out that someone got them paid. This isn't exactly Pitino hiring hookers. You're right that he probably won't* coach again, but should* is a different discussion.
     
  49. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Well, it *is* against the rules. He can't pay the kids even if he thinks they deserve it.

    And he's not paying them so they can buy a meal, he's paying them so they come play for him.
     
  50. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    Can someone help me understand what is criminal about this, as opposed to just a violation of NCAA rules? I read the money paragraph referenced earlier:

    ...and went huh?

    OK, so you're taking money from boosters and surreptitiously funneling it to the players, or people connected to the players, so that they come play for you and your school gets more media attention, reputation, and millions of dollars in TV contracts, student morale / enthusiasm / enrollment, your employers make out like bandits... and therefore, you are depriving your employer of honest services and have defrauded them?

    The original sin here is the farce of amateurism, no question. But short of fixing outcomes such that it upsets gamblers, what's the FBI's interest here? I feel like it's obvious to everyone in this thread, and meanwhile I'm watching this and to me it looks like Kafka's The Trial.
     

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