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Arrests in Major NCAA College Basketball Probe

Discussion in 'College Sports' started by Was (Not Wasdin), Sep 26, 2017.

  1. Was (Not Wasdin)

    Was (Not Wasdin) Member SoSH Member

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    1,691
  2. canderson

    canderson Fomenting voting confusion and angst since 2016 Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    From the ESPN link:

    This is a huge deal. It very well might change the basketball landscape of AAU and club teams. I hope so.

    Sounds like they have a lot more coaches on tape too, they just haven't been charged as of yet.

    My boy Brad Underwood suddenly left OK State for Illinois, I'm guessing this maybe had a role in that.
     
  3. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Louisville being implicated in this probe as well.

    LOUISVILLE, Ky. (WDRB) – At least one university in Kentucky – one that meets the description of the University of Louisville – is involved in a wide-ranging fraud and corruption probe into college basketball, according to the U.S. Attorney’s Office in the Southern District of New York.

    The indictment made public Tuesday accuses four men of funneling about $100,000 to an All-American high school player from May until of September 2017 to assist one or more coaches at the university in recruiting the player. The “bribe money” was meant to be concealed from the NCAA and university officials.

    The money was wired to third-party consultants who then made cash payments to the player’s family. However, the indictment alleges the scheme “could only succeed” if one or more coaches at the university made “false certification to the university.”

    http://www.wdrb.com/story/36454113/...-to-federal-fraud-probe-of-college-basketball
     
  4. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    Does that put Louisville basketball in potential death penalty range?
     
  5. Detts

    Detts Member SoSH Member

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    Louisville: Now we know where the money for the strippers came from.

    What...No World Wide Wes or John Calipari?
     
  6. shaggydog2000

    shaggydog2000 Member SoSH Member

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    Nothing will change until they break the head coaches magic wall of deniability and start charging them with crimes or kicking them out of the game. Until then, they'll just find new patsies and ways to deny they knew anything about anything.
     
  7. Mugsy's Jock

    Mugsy's Jock Longtime Member Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Louisville... what a shock.
    Beyond the strippers, they also needed budget to buy stolen playbooks from disgruntled ex-Wake Forest football coaches.
     
  8. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    Adidas, not Nike

    at least for now
     
  9. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    The former director of Nike Elite Youth Basketball was also arrested.
     
  10. TheRooster

    TheRooster Member SoSH Member

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    This X100. Issue a few lifetime bans for head coaches (the bucks stops somewhere) as well as those caught red-handed and things will change quickly. Of course it would be nice if college presidents would police their own athletic departments but that seems to be asking too much.
     
  11. berniecarbo1

    berniecarbo1 Member SoSH Member

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    A total cesspool. College hoops is so rotten and has been for years. I see that Auburn is involved...and we know who runs the Auburn program. Seems trouble just follows Bruce Pearl doesn't it?
     
  12. RingoOSU

    RingoOSU okie misanthrope SoSH Member

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    Well, this is probably the end of OSU Cowboys Basketball.
     
  13. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    Decades and decades. There are many stories about the reason why John Wooden got out when he did being due to not being at UCLA when the shit hit the fan.

    It isn't even only at the top tier D-1 level. When I played D-3 ball in NC my late coach told me detailed stories about how he lost recruits. Knowing that I was from RI and a huge Friar fan he smirked and asked me how I felt about Dwight Williams, an elite PG in the late 70's who was expelled from PC over a bar fight. Dwight was ready to come to Guilford but on the first day of class he enters coaches office to ask how much he would offer him to stay. When coach said he doesn't pay for players Dwight old him that Gardner-Webb was giving him $20k so that's where he was going. This was NAIA back then not even D-1!
     
  14. TappenWatney

    TappenWatney lurker

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    Elephant in the room question:

    how much of this corruption would cease to take place if players were paid?
     
  15. steveluck7

    steveluck7 Member SoSH Member

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    In this particular case, not much, i don't think. If players were paid, the pay scale would likely be relatively similar between major D-1 schools. This type of sweetener would still exist
     
  16. shaggydog2000

    shaggydog2000 Member SoSH Member

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    Yup, there would be a difference between what the schools would be allowed to pay athletes, and what the players were actually worth to the school. Just like now. And just like now, they would find a way to bridge that gap.
     
  17. Was (Not Wasdin)

    Was (Not Wasdin) Member SoSH Member

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    ACC is going to get hammered in this before all is said and done. Louisville, and likely Miami

    NC State and GA Tech are Adidas schools as well.

    I have to believe that there is real risk that a number of sponsors look to terminate their deals. They cant be associated with criminal conduct like this.
     
  18. Infield Infidel

    Infield Infidel teaching korea american SoSH Member

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    Yeah, NBA players make millions and the T-Wolves still tried to do a backroom deal with Joe Smith. Other teams apparently did and just didn't get caught.
     
  19. Otto

    Otto Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    The sneaker companies have set up a well oiled, dirty machine. They fund the AAU programs, pay the AAU guys, fund the $ to get those players to the universities they have deals with, and then are first in line for the players who become NBA draft picks to sign endorsement agreements. And then to start the lather-rinse-repeat process all over again, they sign that lottery pick to an endorsement deal that includes ... money and uniforms for the player's old AAU club.

    I'm certainly not giving the schools a pass, but they don't stand a chance if they don't play ball - the sneaker companies and AAU clubs already have it rigged.
     
  20. shaggydog2000

    shaggydog2000 Member SoSH Member

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    It's not just the sneaker companies and AAU. I'm sure the same thing happens with top level college football players as well. When what something is worth and what it costs are that different, this is inevitable. All revenue generating sports are going to be like this in college.
     
  21. adam42381

    adam42381 Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    My first year teaching in Fort Myers, my assistant was the mother of then-NFL player Phillip Buchanon. She told me how she demanded $40000 and an Escalade from Butch Davis in order for her son to play for Miami. She had no shame about this and swore she was going to do the same with her youngest who was in high school at the time. I have no idea what happened because I only worked with her for one year.

    She ended up in the news a couple years later when Phillip came out and said she basically made him pay her $1million from his rookie contract (first rounder). This stuff has been going on forever.
     
  22. Otto

    Otto Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I agree with the general concept, but I disagree that football players and basketball players have the same things. The basketball player comes up the ranks of his AAU club in an established structure, whereby Sneaker Brand A is paying for their uniforms, their new court, and lining the coaches' pockets. That structure generally leads that player to a university that has a deal with Sneaker Brand A, who shells out some money to make sure it goes smoothly. The school has to be involved, but the money can (and usually) comes from Sneaker Brand A. If that player turns out to a NBA player, Sneaker Brand A will sign that player, creating a new revenue stream back to his AAU club ... so that they can keep that coach happy and get the next kid ...

    Football players have nothing like that. To put it in perspective, Sneaker Brand A will sign a late lottery pick (NBA obviously) to an endorsement contract worth at least $1.5MM per year (cash) for three years plus something in the vicinity of $100k per year in product. A late first round wide receiver (NFL obviously) would be lucky to get a cash/product deal from the same company worth 1/30th of that.

    Point being: these sneaker companies have bigger prizes in mind when they fund these recruiting/NCAA violations for basketball players. The same motivation doesn't exist for them to pay for football recruits and no similar structure exists to build these connections with 8th grade (and younger) prospects (and their coaches), so basketball has a uniquely organized and high-dollar situation.
     
  23. steveluck7

    steveluck7 Member SoSH Member

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    The only thing i could think of for football and reasons that shoe companies would be involved is merchandise sales. If Adidas wants top WR to go to an Adidas school and get more people to buy jerseys, hats and shirts, adding to Adidas's bottom line. Probably drops in the bucket compared to basketball and the money flying around AAU but that's all i got.
     
  24. shaggydog2000

    shaggydog2000 Member SoSH Member

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    There have been plenty of cases where boosters were providing cash, no show jobs, and cars to NCAA football players. Reggie Bush's family got a car and a free house out of him not signing with an agent, if I recall correctly. I'm sure the mechanism of action is different between the sports, but it is a pay to play industry if you want to compete in either.
     
  25. Otto

    Otto Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I don't disagree. I'm saying something slightly different, which is that the basketball problem has been particularly difficult to police (to date - which is why this case will be really interesting to follow) because otherwise legitimate enterprises (sneaker companies) fund the violations through legitimate (we're giving your AAU team new uniforms and a new court!) and non-legitimate (here's an envelope of cash) operations. Because there isn't the same infrastructure for football players as recruits to negotiate these things, if they are getting anything of value, it is smaller in scale and comes from much different sources, like overly-rich boosters who are spending money to fund their hobbies and egos, as opposed to Fortune 500 companies improving their bottom lines.
     
  26. Kliq

    Kliq Member SoSH Member

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    The last few years as I've read more and more about prep basketball; it's unbelievable to me how much control sneaker companies have over basketball; the amount of influence they gain in attempting to find the half dozen or so NBA stars who can actually sell sneakers is mind blowing.
     
  27. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    The other difference is most college football relationships end at college, while the shoe companies are basically acting like quasi-angel investors by throwing a bunch of money around in the hopes one of their guys pops and his shoe becomes the next Kyrie or something.
     
  28. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Already hearing calls for Pitino to resign.
     
  29. Marciano490

    Marciano490 Urological Expert SoSH Member

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    That was quick. It's only been like 15 seconds.
     
  30. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    That's long for Rick.
     
  31. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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  32. Marciano490

    Marciano490 Urological Expert SoSH Member

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  33. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    I can't help but laugh at this statement. It's never his fault, is it? Strippers bought by a staffer? Not my fault I didn't know. Your staff conspiring with Adidas to pay $100,000 for a player? Not my fault, I didn't know. It's a joke.

    "These allegations come as a complete shock to me," Pitino said in a statement Tuesday night. "If true, I agree with the U.S. Attorneys Office that these third-party schemes, initiated by a few bad actors, operated to commit a fraud on the impacted universities and their basketball programs, including the University of Louisville. Our fans and supporters deserve better and I am committed to taking whatever steps are needed to ensure those responsible are held accountable. But the FBI and the United States Department of Justice have come to clean up the sport and the mess made by Louisville and other programs.

    http://www.espn.com/mens-college-ba...ino-facing-big-big-problem-corruption-scandal
     
  34. moly99

    moly99 Member SoSH Member

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    It blows my mind that people are dumb enough to buy shoes with a 500% markup because their favorite player endorses it.
     
  35. Buck Showalter

    Buck Showalter Member SoSH Member

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    Totally agree - Pitino has to go.
     
  36. Kliq

    Kliq Member SoSH Member

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    Obviously the investment is worth it for the companies, but to me, there might one or two truly marketable players in every class; yet I assume their are hundreds of sponsored AAU teams across the country all trying to have the inside track on signing those one or two guys.

    Don't ask me to explain sneaker culture because I find it just as mind blowing as you do.
     
  37. canderson

    canderson Fomenting voting confusion and angst since 2016 Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Arizona’s coach is facing 60 years and a $1.5m fine. Out on $50,000 bail.

    Rumors Louisville’s athletic department is in shambles and they’re already in serious financial trouble. They are also on probation. UL should be shuttered probably.
     
  38. mauidano

    mauidano Mai Tais for everyone! SoSH Member

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    Kicking and screaming. He’s narcissistic and will never resign and never take accountability.
     
  39. leetinsley38

    leetinsley38 Member SoSH Member

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    Fraud is a Choice.
     
  40. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    I would have agreed with this until I saw Pitino's lawyer quoted as saying that "there's no reason" for Pitino to consider resigning.

    Kiss of death, right there.

    This is one of those posts that I really, really, really wish I had come up with first.

    Well done.
     
  41. nighthob

    nighthob Member SoSH Member

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    Yep. I can tell you that one of my former friends used to work as a basketball scout for a sneaker company, his job was to evaluate teens (as in 14-16 year olds) playing AAU to pick out the ones that his company should be grooming for future deals.
     
  42. Detts

    Detts Member SoSH Member

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    Well played
     
  43. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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  44. wade boggs chicken dinner

    wade boggs chicken dinner Member SoSH Member

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    You mean ARI's assistant coach, Book Richardson. His story is here: http://tucson.com/sports/arizonawil..._501418c4-a2f6-11e7-bde8-37db291076d6.html#10.

    For local flavor, it could be that the story was referring to a current Celtic.

    However, since we are all up-in-arms against Pitino, wither Sean Miller?
     
  45. Detts

    Detts Member SoSH Member

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    Pitino is a jackass with a track history of 'I was shocked by this news' with his scandals (and repeated last night). Sean Miller has been clean as far as we know during his coaching career.
     
  46. TheRooster

    TheRooster Member SoSH Member

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    Yeah, Miller can get fired too. This is a rare opportunity to clean up the mess. I'm not holding my breath. The hangers-on and the guys caught red-handed will be painted as the villains and as outliers. Slick Rick might end up a sacrificial lamb due to his extensive list of priors but he'll just resurface as "respected" analyst in a few years (see Valvano, James). I'd love to be wrong.
     
  47. wade boggs chicken dinner

    wade boggs chicken dinner Member SoSH Member

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    Sean Miller is shocked about this whole thing too, particularly since Richardson was (I would guess) his best recruiter for 11 years. I'm sure he'll have a statement out to that effect shortly.

    Here's a list of people that were named in the complaint: Richardson, Auburn assistant Chuck Person, USC assistant Tony Bland and Oklahoma State assistant Lamont Evans, James Gatto (director of global sports marketing at Adidas), Merl Code (recently left Nike for Adidas), Christian Dawkins (NBA agent who was recently fired from ASM Sports for charging approximately $42,000 in Uber charges on a player's credit card), Jonathan Brad Augustine (president of The League Initiative and program director of the Adidas-sponsored 1 Family AAU program), Munish Sood (a financial adviser), and Rishan Michel (former NBA official who founded Thompson Bespoke Clothing line).

    But as Kenny Klein, a spokesman for the University of Louisville athletic department, said, "We have no idea about any of this stuff," and "This is the first I've heard of it. Nobody in basketball is aware of any of this."

    http://www.azcentral.com/story/spor...asketball-assistants-fraud-charges/703477001/

    edit: sad to see Person on this list. I'm the $22M he made in salary went quickly. (Side note: I was shocked to see that the Rifleman's highest yearly salary was $2.8MM. Makes me feel old.)
     
  48. johnmd20

    johnmd20 literally like ebola Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    When the players involved are so valuable, and there is this much money to be made, there will be no cleaning up the mess.
     
  49. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    People should spend time reading through the complaints here. It's pretty clear that the actions of Adidas are not an outlier, but simply the way they conduct business. Which means we should expect that every school with an Adidas endorsement contract likely has a slush-fund pipeline running through an assistant coach. This is probably true for Nike.

    Unless the executives at Adidas spill the beans in order to save their hide, color me skeptical that these arrests will do anything more than drive the money underground.
     
  50. canderson

    canderson Fomenting voting confusion and angst since 2016 Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Pat Forde says Jurich and Pitino just had two separate meetings at the main admin building at UL; each meeting was less than 5 minutes. Both left without commenting.

    I'm guessing they were fired.
     

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