Which type of plate discipline is eating Panda?

Red(s)HawksFan

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I've seen no commentary at all about Sandoval's switch hitting prospect in 2016. Will he give it another try?
I've seen nothing about it either but I would hazard a guess and say yes, he will switch-hit in 2016. He abandoned hitting righty after he was hit by that pitch and the injury affected him more as an RHH than it did as an LHH. Presuming good health, I imagine he'll go back to hitting right-handed against lefties.
 

Al Zarilla

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Bump thread with just a comment from a guy who played next to Sandoval for years, Brandon Crawford. Last year, a few games after the Giants started to play Matt Duffy at 3B, someone asked Crawford if he had to cheat toward over in the hole to cover the new guy. He said hey, I know what that's like having played next to Sandoval and McGehee, but, with Duffy, no, I don't have to. But, word is that we're getting a sleeker (if that word could ever be used) Sandoval this year?
 

soxhop411

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Bump thread with just a comment from a guy who played next to Sandoval for years, Brandon Crawford. Last year, a few games after the Giants started to play Matt Duffy at 3B, someone asked Crawford if he had to cheat toward over in the hole to cover the new guy. He said hey, I know what that's like having played next to Sandoval and McGehee, but, with Duffy, no, I don't have to. But, word is that we're getting a sleeker (if that word could ever be used) Sandoval this year?


Yes?
 

Al Zarilla

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Alright, let's do this. He looks like spring 2011 again. Do we dare hope for a season say, 75% as good as that?
.315 .357 .552, 5.2 fWAR, even missing a bunch of time (but he has no more hamate bones).


 

Savin Hillbilly

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Alright, let's do this. He looks like spring 2011 again. Do we dare hope for a season say, 75% as good as that?
.315 .357 .552, 5.2 fWAR, even missing a bunch of time (but he has no more hamate bones).
An in-shape Pablo should certainly be able to play better defense, and that would be helpful, especially for our LHP.

Offensively, though, I'm going to keep my expectations low. Pablo's whole offensive game had been in gradual decline for several years going into 2015, and last year the decline accelerated. That could be a blip, but even if it was, it's hard to see how he gets back to the 2011 game. That was a bit of an outlier even at the time, and his skills have deteriorated since then. I suspect the best we can hope for is a rebound to his 2013-2014 numbers, i.e., around a 115 wRC+, or a slash line on the order of .280/.340/.420. And that might be a best-case scenario; a .270/.320/.400 kind of line might be closer to rational optimism. I'd take that, plus a modest defensive recovery.
 

iayork

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This will end well
Jason Mastrodonato (@JMastrodonato)
2/21/16, 9:24 AM
Pablo Sandoval said he has nothing to prove, last year was not a disappointment and the Red Sox did not ask him to lose weight.
And one sentence later he said that he does have something to prove ....

“Yeah, I’m going to prove to the fans, prove to my teammates that I can be a better defensive player, a better offensive player, to win games,” he said the second time, just a few minutes later. “What I have to prove is that I have to work hard to get to those moments. I’ll keep working hard and keep my head up and do everything I can do out on the field.”
and that last year was a disappointment ...

“It was a tough, tough year,” he said, “but it’s in the past, and now I’ll prepare myself to be better.”
It's almost like writers, who are clever with language, are trying to trick an athlete, who is not clever with language, into saying something that can draw self-righteous indignation from people, thus selling advertisements! Fortunately we here are not gullible enough to be drawn into that sort of thing.
 

brandonchristensen

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Glad he dropped some weight, hopefully it helps him perform better. I'm sure we would all love to root for Panda.
 

benhogan

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And one sentence later he said that he does have something to prove ....



and that last year was a disappointment ...



It's almost like writers, who are clever with language, are trying to trick an athlete, who is not clever with language, into saying something that can draw self-righteous indignation from people, thus selling advertisements! Fortunately we here are not gullible enough to be drawn into that sort of thing.
Very good catch/point.

The media is going to have a field day putting the magnifying glass on: Hanley, Pablo, Porcello, Price and Kimbrel (be prepared for Margot, Guerra & Co updates at the farm all season long).

And to a lesser extent: JBJ, Castillo, Kelly, Tazawa, and Dombrowski off-season moves.

Lots of storylines for CHB to spin.
 

timlinin8th

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And one sentence later he said that he does have something to prove ....



and that last year was a disappointment ...



It's almost like writers, who are clever with language, are trying to trick an athlete, who is not clever with language, into saying something that can draw self-righteous indignation from people, thus selling advertisements! Fortunately we here are not gullible enough to be drawn into that sort of thing.
Seems funny how there are no direct quotes showing that he said he had nothing to prove after a disappointing season, and direct quotes showing he said that he did. Weird right?
 

iayork

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Seems funny how there are no direct quotes showing that he said he had nothing to prove after a disappointing season, and direct quotes showing he said that he did. Weird right?
There are quotes both ways, the point being that writers can not only spin quotes however they want, they can elicit the quotes just about any way that plays into their narratives. A larger point is that quotes that come out of these press conferences are largely bullshit, since they either come from media-savvy athletes who are smart enough to only say innocuous, meaningless things, or they come from media-non-savvy athletes who can get their words twisted however the writers want. And a larger point still is, Who gives a shit if Panda is really sorry for making us sad, or if he's just kind of sorry?
 
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NDame616

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Very good catch/point.

The media is going to have a field day putting the magnifying glass on: Hanley, Pablo, Porcello, Price and Kimbrel (be prepared for Margot, Guerra & Co updates at the farm all season long).

And to a lesser extent: JBJ, Castillo, Kelly, Tazawa, and Dombrowski off-season moves.

Lots of storylines for CHB to spin.
Hanley and Pablo could be 2 of the worst big contract signings in Red Sox history. I don't think it's unfair to put a magnifying glass on them
 

Harry Hooper

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This doesn't look like it's going to go well at all:

In a bizarre interview Sunday morning upon arriving at the Fenway South complex, Boston Red Sox third baseman Pablo Sandoval said no one from the team ever asked him to lose weight in the offseason, that he hasn't weighed himself since October, and that he has nothing to prove after a disastrous 2015 season.

Other than that, it was a quiet morning in the clubhouse.

Although manager John Farrell said in January that Sandoval was "roughly 20 pounds lighter than the last game he played for us in 2015," Sandoval didn't appear that much lighter Sunday.

"I don't weigh. I don't weigh in at all," Sandoval said after being asked how much weight he had lost. "I just do my work, try to do everything I can out there. I don't weigh at all in the whole offseason. I just try to get better, be in a better position and, like I say, be an athlete."

His contention that no one from the team asked him to lose weight was curious, given that Farrell, coach Torey Lovullo and president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski all have said that the team mandated he lose weight. Lovullo, who was the interim manager to finish last season, said on the final day in Cleveland that the team had talked to Sandoval and Hanley Ramirez and asked them to lose weight. For Ramirez, it was 15 to 20 pounds, and Lovullo wasn't sure the exact amount for Sandoval.
Story also says he plans to resume switch-hitting.
 

Rovin Romine

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Hanley and Pablo could be 2 of the worst big contract signings in Red Sox history. I don't think it's unfair to put a magnifying glass on them
For some athletes a certain amount of media scrutiny may be helpful as a motivator. How many extra reps in the weight room has the CBH been good for over the years?

That said, the media narrative can always make things worse. Hanley probably does not need it; say whatever you will about ethic, he did change positions and was injured. Pablo may need it; if he wants to talk the talk, he has to realize he's accountable for his actual performance.
 

geoduck no quahog

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"I don't weigh. I don't weigh in at all," Sandoval said after being asked how much weight he had lost. "I just do my work, try to do everything I can out there. I don't weigh at all in the whole offseason. I just try to get better, be in a better position and, like I say, be an athlete."
"Fuck you you bunch of pendejos. Take your weight questions and shove them up your white yankee asses. I'm not answering any of them except to say, 'I don't look at my weight' so go fuck yourselves and ask Pedey why he didn't grow taller this winter...fucking pajeros..."
 

TheoShmeo

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Given the picture below, the Manager sounds, well, a little bit out of touch.

"I just saw him briefly this morning, but I can tell you that seeing him in January and spending a couple of days with him, we feel like he is in better condition than he finished the year in last year, so we feel like it will allow his range to be improved at third base, which is needed," Farrell said. "But I can tell you that the work he put in in the offseason and watching it first-hand, we feel like he's in better condition today when he walked in here."

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/red-sox/post/_/id/47604/john-farrell-pablo-sandoval-in-better-condition-than-he-finished-the-year
 
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Van Everyman

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This doesn't look like it's going to go well at all:



Story also says he plans to resume switch-hitting.
Didn't we go over this on the last page?

And one sentence later he said that he does have something to prove ....



and that last year was a disappointment ...



It's almost like writers, who are clever with language, are trying to trick an athlete, who is not clever with language, into saying something that can draw self-righteous indignation from people, thus selling advertisements! Fortunately we here are not gullible enough to be drawn into that sort of thing.
 

Dahabenzapple2

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Just as fat as last year. I think fatter.

If Farrell has guts, he can't play him against lefties if he insists on being an automatic out from the right side

Soon enough the Sox need to cut their losses. This fucking guy is pathetic. He has a historically awful year and his initial response is there is NO problem. Sure he comes around to some BS speak saying he needs to work hard, blah fucking blah...this dude just be counting his money and living large.
 

RedOctober3829

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Obligatory Gammons defense. From his Twitter page.

The odd twist in the Sandoval Supper Story is that he hired and kept a fdietician/chef and Brian Butterfield says "he's clearly lighter on his feet and is getting much lower on ground balls, which was a problem last year." And, yes, he was told to lose weight. Now, heat.
 

Sampo Gida

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Well, its not what you want. This should be of no surprise to the Red Sox since they have been monitoring him. It seems a player should be contractually obligated to stay in shape to perform his job.

The loyalty clause here in sec 3a of the Uniform Players Contract says a player is required to stay in first class condition and adhere to the teams training rules

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/files/mlb-contract.pdf

Is the next step to begin proceedings to have the contract voided?. Perhaps the threat of this gets Pablo's attention cause right now he seems to be in denial and not on board with the program.
 

iayork

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Is the next step to begin proceedings to have the contract voided?. Perhaps the threat of this gets Pablo's attention cause right now he seems to be in denial and not on board with the program.
Sampo Gida, real world. Real world, this is Sampo Gida. I don't think you two have met before. I'll leave you to get acquainted.
 

geoduck no quahog

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In the real world, evaluators wait and see what the data says...performance, reliability, benefits, drawbacks...before making a decision.

Spring Training hasn't even started. I'm with iayork that we might just want to give it a chance to see what an uninjured Sandoval looks like and then decide if last year was a trend or an outlier.

Or we could just kill him (or let CHB do it for us).

He's the team's starting 3B. I'd like to think he'll be a pleasant surprise. Performance on the field will tell.
 

canderson

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It's weird to me that an athlete doesn't concern himself with what he weighs. Sounds to me like he doesn't really care what kind of condition he's in.
This is my fear.

I don't care if a guy is 680 lbs. so long he can stay on the field, perform well and contribute. Babe Ruth and David Wells were fat slobs but they performed.

But a pro athlete, paid millions upon millions to perform on a team that eyes championships, not paying attention to his weight and nutrition is deeply concerning.

Between this and the experiment known as Hanley I'm terrified of the media destroying the fun from this season before Opening Day.
 

Clears Cleaver

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I'm placing the O/U on games Panda plays for the Sox in 2016 at 50. I think the under is a safe bet. I'm guessing he's done as a productive player and the Sox dump him on someone and pay most of his salary. There will be a phantom DL in May and he will be benched and then they will trade him once they figure out who can play 3B for them on an every day basis
 

moondog80

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I'm placing the O/U on games Panda plays for the Sox in 2016 at 50. I think the under is a safe bet. I'm guessing he's done as a productive player and the Sox dump him on someone and pay most of his salary. There will be a phantom DL in May and he will be benched and then they will trade him once they figure out who can play 3B for them on an every day basis
I'm not optimistic at all on Panda, but 50 games? I'll take the over.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Well, its not what you want. This should be of no surprise to the Red Sox since they have been monitoring him. It seems a player should be contractually obligated to stay in shape to perform his job.

The loyalty clause here in sec 3a of the Uniform Players Contract says a player is required to stay in first class condition and adhere to the teams training rules

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/files/mlb-contract.pdf

Is the next step to begin proceedings to have the contract voided?. Perhaps the threat of this gets Pablo's attention cause right now he seems to be in denial and not on board with the program.
This should be of no surprise to the Red Sox since he was a fat tub of goo prior to signing him to a 5/$95m contract. There will no voiding of contracts that is silly talk......he doesn't even have a weight clause in his contract so the Red Sox can "request" he lose all the weight they want he isn't contractually obligated to do so.
 

EvilEmpire

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Take your weight questions and shove them up your white yankee asses.
No need to bring the Yankees into it, I don't think they care how much he weighs. Maybe some morbid curiosity over how much his plate coverage increases over the course of the season though. Maybe they'll get a pool going.
 

O Captain! My Captain!

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Hanley and Pablo could be 2 of the worst big contract signings in Red Sox history. I don't think it's unfair to put a magnifying glass on them
Carl Crawford was signed for about as much money as Hanley and Pablo combined. They're both bad contracts but I think after one year it's impossible to put them in disaster territory already.
 

Harry Hooper

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Sampo Gida

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Sampo Gida, real world. Real world, this is Sampo Gida. I don't think you two have met before. I'll leave you to get acquainted.
Your snark adds nothing to the discussion. There have been several attempts by MLB teams to void player contracts, some of which were partially successful as they did not have to pay the full amount.

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2013/7/26/4557390/should-mlb-contracts-be-more-easily-voided-yankees-brewers-braun-rodriguez-biogenesis

In the NHL where they had a similar clause regarding conditioning, Vladimir Krutovs 3 yr contract was voided after 1 yr by the Canucks for reporting to camp out of shape. Not sure what the settlement was but he never played in the NHL again.

http://scholarship.law.marquette.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1069&context=sportslaw
pg 7-8 of pdf

Not really saying the Red Sox could win this, but the threat (which does not need to be public) could get his attention. Some people don't respond to reason and it takes the hammer
 

Pilgrim

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They couldnt void his contract if he gained another hundred pounds, much less under the shocking development that a fat guy is still fat. Part of the reason he signed here is that he was tired of the Giants hassling him about it.

The last time I remember a team considering trying to void a contract over conditioning was Jason Giambi when he did steroids and then got sick and turned into a stick figure. That didnt go anywhere, so forget it.

http://nypost.com/2004/12/03/jasons-likely-done-as-yankee-steroid-use-could-void-contract/
 
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