USMNT: To Rüssia With Love

[soxfan121]

FJ dismissed from camp:
 
https://twitter.com/DougMacESPN/status/653674481723015168
 
https://twitter.com/BrianSciaretta/status/653674069192257536
 

 
https://twitter.com/A_W_Gordon/status/655411841057730560
 
Aaron W. Gordon ‏@A_W_Gordon  13m13 minutes ago
Fabian Johnson starts, Klinsmann removes pants in triumph.

 

[Dummy Hoy]

Grant Wahl suggested that players on the NT were annoyed a FJ's effort and commitment level to the team and had no problem with Klinsmann sending him packing. It just sucks for the caliber of player on the team.

 

[Titans Bastard]

 
I have never understood the fascination with the guy. 
 
The one time I've seen him live it was difficult to articulate just how hurtful was to his team. There were a number of breaks where he'd be drifting toward the ball carrier, drawing his defender to the ball. This eliminated any outlet for his teammate and brought a double team with absolutely no consequence to the opponents. He had no sense of spacing whatsoever, no real direction of what he was supposed to be doing. For a big forward that should hold the ball up, he'll often return the ball to sender with his back to goal before he even feels the bump of a defender.
 
He's just... Not good. At all. At some point it needs to be understood that whatever potential he once possessed just isn't going to materialize. He's dragging the USMNT down while given repeated opportunities to realize it. I mentioned in another thread... Giovinco's service and pressure relief is going to generate stats that continue to inflate perceptions of Altidore's ability. Playing alongside the little Italian is going to make any forward look good right now. Time to cut bait and develop other forwards with potential that they may yet actually realize.

 
These highlights have been making me sad recently:
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmExheyGwKs

 

[Titans Bastard]

Well, drama time re: FJ.  I wonder if Johnson will share his side of the story.  He does not talk to the media all that often and doesn't seem like the type to stir the pot publicly.  I hope the situation can be salvaged by the time the World Cup qualifying games get tougher.
 
After all that, it was Michael Bradley who missed a club game with a minor groin injury.

 

[Titans Bastard]

With apologies for the triple post, there's some news:
 
 
- The US is opening the U17 World Cup with a game against Nigeria at 4pm ET today.  All their games will be on FS2 and Telemundo.  The US has a tough-looking group with Nigeria, Croatia, and the hosts, Chile.  You never really know at this age level though.  There are some supposedly good prospects on the team, but these players are so young that there's still plenty of time for trajectories to derail.  The crown jewel at the moment is Borussia Dortmund's Christian Pulisic, an attacking midfielder / second forward.
 
- The Olympic playoff has been changed from a one-off in Rio to a home-and-away format.  If Wikipedia is to be believed, Colombia is hosting the second leg and will play in Bogotá (~8,500 ft) instead of their usual international venue in Barranquilla (sea level).
 
- Development Academy changes.

• U12 division created (9-a-side)
• U12s will have two teams per club to maximize playing time
• U13 division split off from U14 division, so there will be U18, U16, U14, U13, U12.  No standings in the three youngest divisions
• they're trying to minimize travel for the youngest divisions; we can only hope that they get enough suitable applicants for small regional divisions because the travel at the U18 and U16 levels is already very high, with U14 only a little better.

 

[Vinho Tinto]

 
These highlights have been making me sad recently:
 

Random note: Brazil's goal scorer, Leandro Lima, got in hot water in Portugal. Turns out his age documents were bogus and he was 2 years older than his listed age.

 

[Bailey10]

Olympic qualifier between US-Colombia changed from one game playoff in Rio to 2-legged home and home series.
 
link. 

 

[DJnVa]

Caleb Porter said on Extra Time Radio that JK has contacted team about possible Nagbe call-up in November.

 

[Titans Bastard]

USSF finances from April 2014 - March 2015 released.  There are some interesting nuggets in there, but no bombshells.  Revenue from the Nike sponsorship deal and from the SUM deal is up.  The USSF also more than doubled its investment in NWSL, up to $1.43m.
 
A good piece on Hugo Perez, who was unceremoniously dumped as U-15 boys national team manager, a real shame for US soccer and a clear sign of USSF dysfunction.  His group of players played great soccer while under his stewardship, but now that they've spent two years under Richie Williams in U17 residency, they play like they've never trained with each other before -- which happens every god damned cycle.  Bradenton is useless.  It's said that he ran afoul of Richie and some of the other USSF insider types like Lepore.  And while that rumor has been largely propagated by a bunch of agents (who are never all that trustworthy) who represent a number of the players in residency, it's also probably true.
 
The only good thing is that a larger number of U17 national teamers than ever spend most of their days with pro clubs both in the US (Zendejas, Adams, Wright, Velela) and abroad (Pulisic, de la Torre, Barbir, Gallardo, Vazquez, Perez).
 
Take all the money that's spent on Bradenton and invest it in youth coaching, please.  Or at least hire a coach who is actually qualified in youth development.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Hmm...
 

 
Despite recent losses, Jurgen Klinsmann remains the U.S. men’s national team coach and technical director, but multiple sources say that Klinsmann’s duties in the latter area have become more ceremonial than before.
 
Over the past year, U.S. Soccer’s chief commercial director Jay Berhalter—the brother of Columbus Crew SC coach Gregg Berhalter—has started taking over a lot of the day-to-day technical director duties. Berhalter even called an important meeting in Chicago in August that did not include Klinsmann.
 
People on the inside have different views about it. One said Berhalter is a smart guy who gets things done. Another said if you’re going to give Klinsmann the technical director job you should let him do it without interference. Communication between Berhalter and Klinsmann is described as “not good.” One insider used the term “power struggle.”

 

 
That's not all of the behind-the-scenes happenings involving Klinsmann. In the last week, Klinsmann fired head trainer Sue Falsone. Falsone had been in the job for a year after having the same role for the Los Angeles Dodgers. I’m told that, among other things, Klinsmann was not happy with the way she dealt with Alejandro Bedoya’s illness that kept him out of the USA's CONCACAF Cup playoff against Mexico and friendly against Costa Rica.

 
 
I'm not sure exactly what to make of it.  Wahl portrays Klinsmann's TD role as "ceremonial" as if that's a new thing.  As I've said a bunch of times before, it's hard to see Klinsmann's imprint on the USSF except for the U23s and (obviously) the USMNT.  If anything, I wouldn't be shocked if the "power struggle" is Klinsmann trying to assert himself a bit more among the USSF insiders, rather than him losing control that he never really had.  I'm neither a fan of Klinsmann nor of most of the US youth coaches nor of Tab Ramos the youth TD, so I dunno what to root for here.
 
I don't have an opinion about Jay Berhalter, as I know nothing about him.

 

[djhb20]

1.  Fire Klinsmann
2.  ??
3.  Profit
 
Here's a self-promoted idea for Step #2 - Miguel Herrera 

 

[Jimy Hendrix]

Interesting (and Klinsmann-retweeted, apparently) article from American Soccer Now that tries to quantify his impact as a technical director.

http://americansoccernow.com/articles/a-tale-of-two-klinsmanns-technical-director-and-coach

I think some of these things have been discussed in this very thread, and I have no idea how many of those items are actually good or directly attributable to Jurgen, but it seemed like a pretty good summary point to start to try and understand what's been happening recently on the TD side of things.

Also surprisingly pro-Klinsmann from a site that I find is usually not in his corner. New writer I suppose, so she might not have yet had her indoctrination session where they do the Clockwork Orange thing but with Benny Feilhaber highlights.

 

[Statman]

Interesting (and Klinsmann-retweeted, apparently) article from American Soccer Now that tries to quantify his impact as a technical director.

http://americansoccernow.com/articles/a-tale-of-two-klinsmanns-technical-director-and-coach

I think some of these things have been discussed in this very thread, and I have no idea how many of those items are actually good or directly attributable to Jurgen, but it seemed like a pretty good summary point to start to try and understand what's been happening recently on the TD side of things.

Also surprisingly pro-Klinsmann from a site that I find is usually not in his corner. New writer I suppose, so she might not have yet had her indoctrination session where they do the Clockwork Orange thing but with Benny Feilhaber highlights.

 
I agree with Thomas in that we just don't have any viable alternatives if we fire Klinsmann.  I would gag if we hired some retread like Arena or Bradley and the MLS coaching alternatives simply don't have the track record in that league to show that they are capable of managing on the international level. 
 
Kreis is someone is of often bandied about as a potential USMNT head coach candidate, but he can't even get his tactics right with three big name DPs, all of whom were starting in Champions League games, including the last year's final.  Kreis calls out his own players more than Klinsmann so it's not like we are going to get a respite in that regard either. 

 

[Titans Bastard]

 
I agree with Thomas in that we just don't have any viable alternatives if we fire Klinsmann.  I would gag if we hired some retread like Arena or Bradley and the MLS coaching alternatives simply don't have the track record in that league to show that they are capable of managing on the international level. 
 
Kreis is someone is of often bandied about as a potential USMNT head coach candidate, but he can't even get his tactics right with three big name DPs, all of whom were starting in Champions League games, including the last year's final.  Kreis calls out his own players more than Klinsmann so it's not like we are going to get a respite in that regard either. 

 
I agree on Kreis.  He did great things with RSL, but he needed to keep the momentum going and his decision to take a year off in 2014 to join NYCFC in 2015 looks like a bust.  To be successful as a manager you have to be talented, but you also have to choose your employers wisely.  There is a lot of parity in MLS, so the margins between success and failure can be small.  That means that an organization has to get the little things right and it's clear that NYCFC still has a steep learning curve ahead of them with regards to being successful in MLS.
 
While I think he made a mistake in his career choices, I think it is harsh to blame Kreis for NYCFC's struggles.  I think David Villa is a great signing, but I would argue that Lampard and Pirlo are a hindrance, rather than a help to NYCFC.  To be successful in MLS, you must be extremely value-conscious.  Lampard and Pirlo are poor values.  While much of their big salaries are "off budget" due to the DP rule, they still soak up a lot of cap dollars that could be devoted to the supporting cast.  On their own, they are no-defense luxury players.  Pirlo looks great when he's supported in the midfield by freaking Paul Pogba and Arturo Vidal.  When he's paired with Mix Diskerud and Andrew Jacobson, his "orange traffic cone" style defense is a much bigger problem.  Lampard has similar issues.  All of this was very foreseeable, too -- clearly, no one is surprised that the supporting cast at NYCFC is vastly weaker than that at Juventus, Chelsea, or Man City.  In MLS, they cannot be catered to like they were at their clubs in Europe.  And all that is before considering the opportunity cost of signing fossils like these guys who will be gone soon instead of another building block player like Villa.

 

[FlexFlexerson]

U.S. make an unceremonious exit from the U-17 World Cup by falling to Chile, 4-1. Not a banner month for U.S. soccer, all things considered.

 

[Titans Bastard]

U.S. make an unceremonious exit from the U-17 World Cup by falling to Chile, 4-1. Not a banner month for U.S. soccer, all things considered.

 
The less said about this tournament, the better.  An observer of the U17 WC who knew nothing about Bradenton would be stunned to learn that the US team had been training together for two years.  As usual, a team that looked promising at the beginning of the cycle looked terrible by the end.  It's time for the USSF to either stop hiring hack system coaches or shut residency down.
 
Richie Williams, whose team didn't qualify in 2013 and embarrassed themselves this year, simply doesn't look up to the task.  He's certainly not the first poor U17 manager to come through Bradenton and its problems extend beyond him, but he needs to go.  If he doesn't, it's another sign of real complacency by the USSF.

 

[DJnVa]

Darlington Nagbe has been named to the team as part of the WCQ matches against St. Vincent and T&T.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Darlington Nagbe has been named to the team as part of the WCQ matches against St. Vincent and T&T.

I'm glad to see it. The full roster is here:

GK
Brad Guzan (Aston Villa)
Bill Hamid (D.C. United)
Tim Howard (Everton)

DF
Ventura Alvarado (América)
Matt Besler (Sporting Kansas City)
Geoff Cameron (Stoke City)
Fabian Johnson (Borussia Mönchengladbach)
Matt Miazga (New York Red Bulls)
Michael Orozco (Tijuana)
Tim Ream (Fulham)
Brek Shea (Orlando City)

MF
Kyle Beckerman (Real Salt Lake)
Michael Bradley (Toronto FC)
Mix Diskerud (New York City FC)
Jermaine Jones (New England Revolution)
Miguel Ibarra (León)
Darlington Nagbe (Portland Timbers)
DeAndre Yedlin (Sunderland)

FW
Jozy Altidore (Toronto FC)
Alan Gordon (LA Galaxy)
Jordan Morris (Stanford)
Bobby Wood (Union Berlin)
Gyasi Zardes (LA Galaxy)


Nagbe and Matt Miazga are the two completely new arrivals. It looks like Klinsmann's issue with Fabian Johnson has blown over.

Rimando, Evans, Chandler, and Johannsson are injured. Brooks started this weekend for the first time in a while, as he's also working back from an injury. Bedoya is still struggling with an illness.

Beasley, Gonzalez, Williams, Morales, Zusi, Dempsey, and Wondolowski have been dropped. JK says that he's giving younger forwards a chance, but this could be the beginning of the end for Clint.

My main beef with this roster is the lack of DM alternatives. Kyle Beckerman is fading and it's only a matter of time before the wheels come off entirely. When that happens, there needs to be a successor at DM. Williams didn't impress last time, so this camp should be used to give an opportunity to someone else - McCarty, Kitchen, Trapp, whoever. Just someone.

 

[Tangled Up In Red]

My main beef with this roster is the lack of DM alternatives. Kyle Beckerman is fading and it's only a matter of time before the wheels come off entirely.

This could have been written 18 months ago.

 

[Titans Bastard]

This could have been written 18 months ago.

Sadly...

I think Beckerman was intended to be the backup DM at the World Cup. But Berti Vogts came on board as an advisor and the team quickly changed formation to utilize the Beckerman/Jones/Bradley trio. The roster had already been submitted, so it was not possible to adjust the roster to fit the depth needs of this new formation.

We pretty much haven't had a backup DM since. Danny Williams has gotten a few (unsuccessful) runs....but experiments have also been wasted on Bedoya(!), Diskerud(!!), and Corona (!!!) at various times.

 

[Titans Bastard]

The USSF finally announced the roster for a U23 camp in Brazil, with two friendlies against Brazil U23 on Nov 11 and Nov 15.

GK
Cody Cropper (Milton Keynes Dons)
Charlie Horton (Leeds United)
Jon Kempin (Sporting Kansas City)

DF
John Brooks (Hertha Berlin)
Cameron Carter-Vickers (Tottenham Hotspur)
Eric Miller (Montreal Impact)
Shane O'Neill (Mouscron)
Boyd Okwuonu (Real Salt Lake)
Dave Romney (LA Galaxy)
Oscar Sorto (LA Galaxy)

MF
Fatai Alashe (San Jose Earthquakes)
Julian Green (Bayern Munich)
Alejandro Guido (Tijuana)
Matt Polster (Chicago Fire)
Dillon Serna (Colorado Rapids)
Gedion Zelalem (Rangers)

FW
Jerome Kiesewetter (Stuttgart)
Khiry Shelton (NYCFC)
Maki Tall (Sion)


Brooks and Miazga have "traded teams", for the November window anyway. There are some key players who are occupied with MLS playoffs, but it's still annoying to see Herzog barely widen his search for players at all. Other than Brooks, who isn't really "new", only Dave Romney is getting a first look.

Still no reason why Vancouver's Tim Parker or KC's Amadou Dia haven't been called in.

 

[DJnVa]

Here's a story from the summer about CCV: https://sports.vice.com/en_us/article/the-rise-of-american-soccer-talent-cameron-carter-vickers

 

[Vinho Tinto]

US Soccer has passed an initiative to prevent youth players 10 and under from heading in games or practice. 11-13 will have it limited during training.

I don't have a problem with this if it leads to a greater emphasis on possession and passing. A fraternity brother of mine started the Knockout Project due to the physical issues he now experiences brought from concussions (He was a competitive BMX racer). He points out that the brain forms myelin until the age of 13. From my own experience, the blow to head from heading a soccer ball was really painful. My last year playing organized soccer was age 11 and I remember having to psych myself up when going for a header because I knew it was going to really hurt. I played high school football and took few hits as a teen that were as painful as a soccer ball to the head when I was a child.

I expect that this going to get a lot of bad press, but I really think this will be a positive decision.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Oh, Jürgen. Nobody believes this crap.

If getting outshot 85-47 by everyone in the Gold Cup except Cuba is "the type of performance that Klinsmann wanted to see", I'd hate to see what he considers subpar.

The US has also failed to win in four consecutive home games against CONCACAF opposition, going 0-1-3 against Jamaica, Panama, Mexico, and Costa Rica (and the tie was the 3rd place game in which Panama won on PKs).

 

[DJnVa]

Well, maybe he means that those performances were wanted he wanted to see in the sense that he can now get rid of some of those players.

 

[Titans Bastard]

The WCQ campaign has begun. The lineup against St. Vincent & each and every Grenadine:

Altidore -- Wood
Johnson -- Bradley -- Jones -- Zardes
Ream -- Besler -- Cameron -- Yedlin
Guzan
​

 

[DennyDoyle'sBoil]

What the fuck has happened to this team?

 

[Titans Bastard]

1-0 St. Vincent & the Grenadines.

Yup.

 

[McBride11]

I know this isnt a true game thread but shit, blow it up. St Vincent and Grenadines?!

 

[tims4wins]

I'm basically at the point of good, it's time we move on and this is a good reason to do so.

 

[SocrManiac]

Why isn't Altidore glue yet?

It's embarassimg to go down a goal but the US will not lose.

 

[McBride11]

Woods!!!

 

[McBride11]

Least the US has turned the tide of play. Always good sign against V&G.
Couple of wasted chances.
But FJ at left mid looks really good.

 

[Billy R Ford]

FJ restoring order in the world.

 

[Titans Bastard]

3-1, Jozy off a corner set piece play that seemed designed to crowd SVG's tiny keeper out of the play.

 

[SocrManiac]

Altidore still sucks. Anybody reading this under 350lbs scores that.

 

[Infield Infidel]

I always thought Stan Van Gundy stressed defense

 

[Titans Bastard]

Darlington Nagbe and Matt Miazga are coming on for their debuts. Johnson and Cameron off.

It's fun to finally see Nagbe in a US shirt, but he's better in the middle than he is on the wing.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Looks like the US switched to a 4-3-3.

Jones should have seen straight red for that challenge, but the ref doesn't even issue a yellow.

 

[Titans Bastard]

6-1 now after Altidore got his second. Morris came on for Wood a little while ago.

Jones just went off with an injury - no prizes for guessing that it's a hamstring.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Jones comes back on, but he's still clearly hurt. He's playing CB and Besler has moved into the midfield. The CBs aren't under pressure, so it doesn't really matter.

 

[Titans Bastard]

6-1 FT.

No lessons to be learned today.

 

[crystalline]

US Soccer has passed an initiative to prevent youth players 10 and under from heading in games or practice. 11-13 will have it limited during training.

I don't have a problem with this if it leads to a greater emphasis on possession and passing. A fraternity brother of mine started the Knockout Project due to the physical issues he now experiences brought from concussions (He was a competitive BMX racer). He points out that the brain forms myelin until the age of 13. From my own experience, the blow to head from heading a soccer ball was really painful. My last year playing organized soccer was age 11 and I remember having to psych myself up when going for a header because I knew it was going to really hurt. I played high school football and took few hits as a teen that were as painful as a soccer ball to the head when I was a child.

I expect that this going to get a lot of bad press, but I really think this will be a positive decision.

The brain forms myelin till around the mid-twenties. It's not clear that a concussion before 13 is worse than one after 13, but the risk may be lower- older kids have stronger necks and more massive heads.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Sunil Gulati finally talked to the media before yesterday's game. Goff published a good deal of what Gulati had to say:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/soccer-insider/wp/2015/11/13/u-s-soccer-boss-sunil-gulati-address-range-of-issues/?postshare=6511447453860106&tid=ss_tw

Is there a performance metric Jurgen needs to reach early in World Cup qualifying?

“We did meet after the Mexico game very briefly and in New Jersey [before the Costa Rica friendly]. And then when we met two weeks ago – [CEO] Dan [Flynn], Jurgen and I – in Washington when the women’s team was there [for the White House ceremony]. That was certainly the most in-depth of the discussions because it was after the two [October] games. But I don’t know if we have ever given any coach of our teams a specific metric and specific result and said, ‘If this happens, everything’s good. If this happens, it’s not.’

“We have certain targets and goals that are different for each of our teams, but I am not sure it would be appropriate to have a specific metric for a game or two games. But it’s pretty well understood qualifying for the World Cup is the specific target and many of our agreements with coaches, not just in the senior team, there are clauses in terms of continued employment if X, Y or Z doesn’t happen, in terms of our desire to make a change. But we didn’t get into specific ‘We need to win these two games’ or ‘We need to beat St. Vincent by this amount of goals.’ ”

Is there a level of concern about whether you are on the right path?

“Of course, there is a concern. We have had some results which didn’t go our way, both in terms of wins and losses and play. Of course, that raises concerns. The more of those you have, the more concerns are raised, and they compound very quickly. But it’s not about individual games – wins or losses. We didn’t get too exuberant about beating Germany and Holland away [in June friendlies]. When you lose a single game at the Gold Cup, it’s a huge disappointment and then not winning the third-place game adds a little bit to that and then having not a good result against Brazil compounds that. In some sense, that is salvageable if you win the game against Mexico. We didn’t do that. It wouldn’t erase the fact we didn’t get those results. We had a chance for a mulligan [with a second opportunity to qualify for the Confederations Cup] and missed it. That’s a huge opportunity missed.”

Beyond the results, how concerned are you about the way the team is playing and the direction of the team?

“I don’t think we’ve been on a good run. There are concerns. I don’t mean they get masked by good results, but we’re talking about a relative short amount of time. Sure, we are concerned about that.”

After reading through the whole thing, I have to say that Gulati could not sound like more of a weenie if he tried. So much hedging and mumbling, so little clear and confident leadership.

 

[teddykgb]

I don't know, it sounds reasonable. The recent run hasn't been great, it invites the questions he's being asked, but I'd rather not have US Soccer run by some overreacting Abramovic wannabe

 

[Titans Bastard]

I don't know, it sounds reasonable. The recent run hasn't been great, it invites the questions he's being asked, but I'd rather not have US Soccer run by some overreacting Abramovic wannabe

I have no desire for FMF-style leadership, but I'd like to see more of a balance. "Qualification for the World Cup" would not have been considered an acceptable target for Bob Bradley or Bruce Arena. Why the lowered expectations? In general, I found Gulati to be saying a lot about nothing - just a lot of "there are good things and also bad things, so we'll see. We're disappointed, so let's hope to take advantage of opportunities". I did find it interesting that he acknowledged the direct question about Klinsmann's frequent scapegoating instead of attempting to refute it, though.

---

The U-23s just lost a pair of friendlies in Brazil 2-1 and 5-1, both in uninspiring fashion. I really don't think we'll get by Colombia; we needed to wrap up Olympic qualification earlier.

Here's more Klinsmann today:

I think we can be proud of ourselves in what we’ve done so far, the last couple of years – in ALL age groups. I think this is what a lot of people unfortunately forget quickly. Because suddenly we came out of the Group of Death in Brazil, I don’t know, people now expect maybe miracles, expect you to get easily into the final four of a World Cup or final eight, or have our Under-20s win the World Cup in New Zealand or our Under-17s win the World Cup in Chile. And that’s not gonna happen. Because this is only a process that over many, many years will hopefully one day end in big, big successes.

Our U23s were desperately disappointing in Olympic qualifying and the U17s totally sucked at the WC past the point where you can hide behind a tough group. Klinsmann's ego is large and it's either preventing him from admitting that anything is wrong or it's rendered him truly delusional.

“So when you hear a lot of people talking some things are going wrong because you lost maybe two or three games recently, then that’s a bit immature (laughs). That’s simply wrong.

More pride and/or delusion. And what a douchebag. The guy who wanted "more pressure" from fans and media is being hoisted by his own petard.

 

[soxfan121]

Why the lowered expectations?

Because everyone not invested in pumping MLS's tires knows the talent in the player pool has gotten significantly worse and doesn't figure to improve.

And probably because Gulati & Klinsmann known there's a 20-year plan in year 3 or 4 here, and JK will be gone by year 7 at the latest, and Gulati might get a decade. They're playing the game to set the USA up for the future, while navigating the minefield that is (almost) every good player regressing because they're all getting paid huge money with their guaranteed starting spots in a league that isn't any better than the English Championship.

The problem is the player pool, not Klinsmann. And no, calling in more MLS prospects isn't the answer. Maybe in 10 years the competition in MLS will be good enough to produce players who can compete for international success, but it ain't happening sooner than that.

 

[Vinho Tinto]

I still believe that any plan he or Gulati are pushing that doesn't involve the MLS franchises (As always, we must remember they are not clubs because they generally don't act like one) taking a leading role in player development is a waste of time. I'm not sure they are genuinely interested in taking that role at this point of time (Or ever), but an FA will never successfully find and develop talent unilaterally from its domestic league. The US will never be able to farm out player development to Europe or South America in any kind of meaningful way.

 

[Titans Bastard]

Because everyone not invested in pumping MLS's tires knows the talent in the player pool has gotten significantly worse and doesn't figure to improve.

And probably because Gulati & Klinsmann known there's a 20-year plan in year 3 or 4 here, and JK will be gone by year 7 at the latest, and Gulati might get a decade. They're playing the game to set the USA up for the future, while navigating the minefield that is (almost) every good player regressing because they're all getting paid huge money with their guaranteed starting spots in a league that isn't any better than the English Championship.

The problem is the player pool, not Klinsmann. And no, calling in more MLS prospects isn't the answer. Maybe in 10 years the competition in MLS will be good enough to produce players who can compete for international success, but it ain't happening sooner than that.

Even those invested in pumping MLS's tires know the player pool has weakened. But if you watch the games, you can still evaluate how Klinsmann is doing. And he's not doing well. In the Gold Cup, we saw the US forced on the defensive and badly outshot on home soil by a bunch of teams that featured a ton of those dreaded MLS-caliber players in their lineups - or worse. Jamaica started an MLS bench player and a USL starter against us as well as League One types. I saw the Haiti game in person, in which the US was outshot 21-6. Haiti started three minor leaguers, as well as guys in places like Cyprus.

It's depressing and the problem clearly goes far beyond the player pool.

At pretty much every level from the senior team down to the U-17s, we are seeing squads look like less than the sum of their parts. That has never been the case for the US until now. It's plain to see that these teams lack cohesion, lack a solid game plan, lack any sort of system, lack good coaching. I watch these games and I'm seeing dreadful stuff, even from players who are successful at their clubs. At the younger age groups, it's the USSF's fault for hiring shit youth coaches who are simply well-connected to the federation. At the senior team and the U23 level, it's on Klinsmann.

In the current context of a weaker player pool, we need to maximize the use of all the resources we have. Klinsmann isn't doing that and isn't even coming close.

Lastly - do you really believe there is a 20-year plan, or anything like that? For his entire tenure, I've struggled to understand exactly how to translate Klinsmann's lofty vision into something tangible or specific. I have yet to hear much articulated beyond empty sound bytes and buzzwords.

 

[Titans Bastard]

I still believe that any plan he or Gulati are pushing that doesn't involve the MLS franchises (As always, we must remember they are not clubs because they generally don't act like one) taking a leading role in player development is a waste of time. I'm not sure they are genuinely interested in taking that role at this point of time (Or ever), but an FA will never successfully find and develop talent unilaterally from its domestic league. The US will never be able to farm out player development to Europe or South America in any kind of meaningful way.

I agree entirely. A number of MLS clubs have invested quite a bit of money in youth development in the last few years - subsidizing player costs, training facilities, USL teams. What the return on that investment will be is yet to be determined.