Stitch01 said:Door opens a crack for TB, rightly or wrongly. Probably needs one more GB loss
Stitch01 said:I'll be shocked if a defensive player on a non playoff team wins MVP
Mystic Merlin said:I bet Watt wins it.
Seels said:A non qb on a team that isn't even sniffing a playoff spot would be like a relief pitcher winning it in baseball.
While I agree that Watt will not win the MVP because MVP writers don't vote for the bolded, Watt's performance this year has been incredible and is certainly MVP worthy. He's been the reason (101.1 EPA) the Texans are mediocre and not one of the worst teams in the league.Seels said:A non qb on a team that isn't even sniffing a playoff spot would be like a relief pitcher winning it in baseball. Meh.
Watt is amazing but with or without him the Texans are mediocre. I'd be willing to hear the argument if they're even battling the Colts. But they're 7-7 in one of the worst two divisions in football.
That chart's impressive, but EPA just tells the same story as everything else - there are NINE quarterbacks with better EPA figures than that.EricFeczko said:While I agree that Watt will not win the MVP because MVP writers don't vote for the bolded, Watt's performance this year has been incredible and is certainly MVP worthy. He's been the reason (101.1 EPA) the Texans are mediocre and not one of the worst teams in the league.
Of course, Aaron Rodgers is a QB on a competitive team in a much tougher division, making him a more likely MVP in the eyes of the NFL media.
There is the Defensive Player of the Year Award for Watt to win.Super Nomario said:They really ought to have a second award for Watt to win. He's the best player at his position by the biggest margin, but there's no way for a non-QB to actually be as valuable as one of the top 10 or so quarterbacks. They ought to have an MVP award and an "outstanding player" award or something.
Stitch01 said:It would take sort of a really weird definition of most valuable player to give the award to either Watt or Gronk given the years Rodgers, Brady, and a handful of other quarterbacks are having for contending teams.
Brady is pretty clearly more valuable than Gronk, as awesome as Gronk is.
Ed Hillel said:
I know what you are saying, but there are times when I watch Gronk where I wonder if I'd rather have Jimmy G step in for Brady than to have Hooman step in for Gronk. Gronk does absolutely everything on the field; he blocks, he catches, and he draws 2-3 defenders every play (and beats them fairly often).
Ed Hillel said:
I know what you are saying, but there are times when I watch Gronk where I wonder if I'd rather have Jimmy G step in for Brady than to have Hooman step in for Gronk. Gronk does absolutely everything on the field; he blocks, he catches, and he draws 2-3 defenders every play (and beats them fairly often). Brady is awfully valuable, that much is obvious, but Gronk is so good that I often wonder how he compares. I'm not sure I've seen as valuable a non-QB in the league since Randy Moss in his Vikings days.
Ed Hillel said:I'm not sure I've seen as valuable a non-QB in the league since Randy Moss in his Vikings days.
coremiller said:
2012 Adrian Peterson says hello.
Stitch01 said:Id take both Watt and Gronk over Peterson in 2012 pretty comfortably.
rodderick said:
Last two years Brady didn't have Gronk for extended periods of time and the Patriots made the AFCCG without him. So you'd expect Garoppolo with Gronk to do better than that? I guess since we have both Brady AND Gronk this season the Super Bowl is but a mere formality at this point.
Double teams and safety help are usually dictated more by formation and overall personnel than individual matchups. Belichick will dedicate two players just to taking Tony Gonzalez out of the game, but he's a rarity, which is why Gonzalez caught 1300+ passes over his career and why Gronk goes off every week even though everyone knows he's the Pats' go-to guy. If the Patriots align Edelman wide (as opposed to the slot), he's going to be single-teamed unless he runs a crossing route or a post that takes him into the middle of the field, Gronk or no Gronk. Gronk's a weapon for sure, but I think you're overstating the kind of ripple effect he has throughout the offense.Ed Hillel said:
I know it doesn't work this way, but when I look at certain matchups, there are times I think I'd rather have Gronk. Let's take Seattle, for example. Take out Gronk, and you've got a double team on Edelman, man on LaFell with safety help, Wright replacing Gronk, and a dominant DL against the team's weakness (OL). Despite his run last week, I think we can agree Brady is not the most mobile of guys. You're also losing Gronk's blocking ability, in the run and pass game. How many points is that offense scoring?
Now keep Gronk on the field, you've got 2-3 men on him each play, Edelman going one on one, LaFell with a number of one on one looks, Gronk blocking, and a mobile QB. A lot of this analysis has to depend on one's belief in Jimmy G., but if we think he can step in as an average QB with above-average mobility (which may not be fair, though I think it is), I think you have an offense capable of scoring more points, though with more risk for turnovers.
gryoung said:The MVP is largely a beauty contest. QB's are a sexy choice and receive more credit than they should in a team game. JJ Watt has some of the mystique this season also and will grab a portion of those ballots.
Do we really care if Brady or Gronk gets the award? Being the champ is the best.
Ed Hillel said:
I know what you are saying, but there are times when I watch Gronk where I wonder if I'd rather have Jimmy G step in for Brady than to have Hooman step in for Gronk. Gronk does absolutely everything on the field; he blocks, he catches, and he draws 2-3 defenders every play (and beats them fairly often). Brady is awfully valuable, that much is obvious, but Gronk is so good that I often wonder how he compares. I'm not sure I've seen as valuable a non-QB in the league since Randy Moss in his Vikings days.
No fewer than four NFL MVP awards are given each season. For 18 seasons Miller Lite awarded an MVP. Further evidence that macro-breweries will spend money on whatever so long as it’s not beer.