Part of the reason Brady sneaks have been so successful is he usually only runs them when the DL alignment allows for an easy sneak and the DL alignment wasnt really set up for an easy sneak.
The Goat Thread: Wk 1 vs The Chiefs
- Thread starter SeoulSoxFan
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Yeah, this is where losing Edelman really hurts. He's incredibly difficult to stop in short yardage situations. If he were healthy, we probably throw on at least 1 of those conversion attempts. As always, I still prefer to put the ball in Brady's hands throwing vs. running but without Edelman/Dola/Mitchell, we're very limited in our quick hit pass play options.
great news on Hightower
this game was just a bad mix of not hitting those key plays we usually make (very uncreative 3rd & short, 4th & short playcalling in particular), some breakdowns on defense, and injuries to some of our best players. I also think Brady is not quite gelling with the new guys yet, which we've seen before
this game was just a bad mix of not hitting those key plays we usually make (very uncreative 3rd & short, 4th & short playcalling in particular), some breakdowns on defense, and injuries to some of our best players. I also think Brady is not quite gelling with the new guys yet, which we've seen before
Some thoughts:
1. Brady was not good. Blame it on his receivers not getting open, blame it on not having Dola, Edelman and Mitchell. Blame it on age. I don't know. He was bad. But I don't expect this to continue and the talk of Brady being done is premature. The talk about Brady being afraid of getting hit can get right the hell of here. He's been doing that for years.
2. Short yardage play calling on offense. BRUTAL. KC stuffs 10 guys in the box, plugs the A gaps and we run right at them. Every fucking time. McDaniels was awful last night. How about a quick pass to Gronk or Dola one time? Spread em out!
3. Cassius Marsh, our pass rushing, special teams guy consistently being asked to drop into coverage against RB's was never going to work. Another brutal decision by the coaching staff. Just a complete misuse of his skills.
4. The D was a mess all night. They had no answer for the Kelce/Hunt/Smith trio when they were running the option/shovel pass play. It felt like Kelce was getting 8 yards and a first down every time they ran it. The D line was not good. No pass rush at all, which allowed Alex Smith to turn into A-A-ron Rodgers. The wheel route to Hunt for a TD where he burned Marsh was a great example of not getting any pressure on Smith, which allowed Hunt all day to get passed the slower LB. I don't know what we're going to get out of the front 7, but last night wasn't very inspiring.
5. Gronk's hurt. Has to be. He was not running very well at the end of the game, and was basically a blocker for the second half. Eric Berry did well in coverage, but something just looked off to me.
6.. Special teams was pretty good. Outside of those infuriating running into the kicker penalties, I thought ST played well. Kicking game was strong, coverage was solid with some really nice tackles on kick returns.
7. I expect this team to be much better next week. Too much talent on this team to keep playing like that. I think this will be a nice wake-up call to everyone in that locker room. We're on to New Orleans.
1. Brady was not good. Blame it on his receivers not getting open, blame it on not having Dola, Edelman and Mitchell. Blame it on age. I don't know. He was bad. But I don't expect this to continue and the talk of Brady being done is premature. The talk about Brady being afraid of getting hit can get right the hell of here. He's been doing that for years.
2. Short yardage play calling on offense. BRUTAL. KC stuffs 10 guys in the box, plugs the A gaps and we run right at them. Every fucking time. McDaniels was awful last night. How about a quick pass to Gronk or Dola one time? Spread em out!
3. Cassius Marsh, our pass rushing, special teams guy consistently being asked to drop into coverage against RB's was never going to work. Another brutal decision by the coaching staff. Just a complete misuse of his skills.
4. The D was a mess all night. They had no answer for the Kelce/Hunt/Smith trio when they were running the option/shovel pass play. It felt like Kelce was getting 8 yards and a first down every time they ran it. The D line was not good. No pass rush at all, which allowed Alex Smith to turn into A-A-ron Rodgers. The wheel route to Hunt for a TD where he burned Marsh was a great example of not getting any pressure on Smith, which allowed Hunt all day to get passed the slower LB. I don't know what we're going to get out of the front 7, but last night wasn't very inspiring.
5. Gronk's hurt. Has to be. He was not running very well at the end of the game, and was basically a blocker for the second half. Eric Berry did well in coverage, but something just looked off to me.
6.. Special teams was pretty good. Outside of those infuriating running into the kicker penalties, I thought ST played well. Kicking game was strong, coverage was solid with some really nice tackles on kick returns.
7. I expect this team to be much better next week. Too much talent on this team to keep playing like that. I think this will be a nice wake-up call to everyone in that locker room. We're on to New Orleans.
After sleeping on it, the only two things I'm worried about are the linebackers - who were collectively awful and have no reenforcements coming, and the wide receiver group, which now has three outside/deep guys, one of whom doesn't know the playbook yet, and no Edelman or Dola.
They'll figure something out on offense, but have to be worried about how the hell they're going to fix the linebackers.
They'll figure something out on offense, but have to be worried about how the hell they're going to fix the linebackers.
Yeah, asking Marsh to run downfield with their 4.3 and 4.4 running backs was the issue, not Marsh himself.
Overall, I thought the secondary was fine other than the horribly blown coverage on the Hill TD. I'm assuming that was Gillmore, but maybe it was DMC. Gillmore has all the physical tools, but I worry about his mental acumen. He looked confused at the snap an awful lot. Hopefully it's a new to the system thing and not a long-term bug.
The front 7 was dreadful and is a serious concern. Hightower needs to be playing most of his snaps at the LB position, because Jordan Richards fucking sucks. They were in a bind at DE and protecting Hightower's shoulder, but it looks like depth at the LB position isn't what we thought it was. But then that leaves Marsh and Flowers playing too many snaps at DE. That Rivers injury hurts. They'll need a trade or two in the front 7. What about Ayers?
Overall, I thought the secondary was fine other than the horribly blown coverage on the Hill TD. I'm assuming that was Gillmore, but maybe it was DMC. Gillmore has all the physical tools, but I worry about his mental acumen. He looked confused at the snap an awful lot. Hopefully it's a new to the system thing and not a long-term bug.
The front 7 was dreadful and is a serious concern. Hightower needs to be playing most of his snaps at the LB position, because Jordan Richards fucking sucks. They were in a bind at DE and protecting Hightower's shoulder, but it looks like depth at the LB position isn't what we thought it was. But then that leaves Marsh and Flowers playing too many snaps at DE. That Rivers injury hurts. They'll need a trade or two in the front 7. What about Ayers?
The big concern has to be that he shows up on the injury report with his back. If that's the case, there's a real chance he's just done. Edelman was a big enough issue, but when you add Gronk, the offense might go from best in the league by far with them healthy to 7-10 area.
Number 5 is my only worry after last night. He looked hurt or just a step slow. Year after year of injury it's possible Gronk is in a steep decline. Combine that and Edelman gone, not good.
One thing to keep in mind is that the Pats' weird backloaded divisional schedule works in their favor if they struggle for the first portion of the season with the new players, finding out where each member of the D is strongest, etc. They could go something like 6-4 over the first 10 games and still easily win the division if they improve enough in the second half to mostly take care of their divisional games.
(Or, they could be fine by next week and run the table the rest of the way and I wouldn't be totally surprised by that either.)
(Or, they could be fine by next week and run the table the rest of the way and I wouldn't be totally surprised by that either.)
Kind of my impression; lots of the short, back shoulder stuff seemed like timing was off. And he stopped trusting he could throw to a spot and have the receiver run the precise route.
Gilmore, outside of that monumental fuck up looked good to me. It's the linebackers that really concern me. They need an athletic coverage guy.
And Travis K. is the biggest d-bag in the league.
I doubt Belichick and Patricia are surprised by this outcome - they see this defensive unit every day in practice and must know it has serious flaws right now and is a work in progress.
It was jarring to see a team that usually excels in making halftime adjustments get blown out in the second half, at home.
It was jarring to see a team that usually excels in making halftime adjustments get blown out in the second half, at home.
The secondary/linebackers couldn't figure out how to defend stacked formations all night. It looked to me that one was on Gillmore. He thought Hill was breaking outside and looked back at the QB for the ball. Hill then took off deep and DMC was busy with Kelce in the middle of the field.
They couldn't figure out who to cover, guys crossing the middle were consistently open (Marsh and Van Noy, in particular, looked lost all night in coverage).
Yup, he had the Gronk Grimace going on after the overturned TD. The guy could barely even spike the ball after the catch. If he is indeed hurt the use of Allen becomes super mystifying. The first play of the game seemed to be designed to get him open (it worked) and after that he was MIA. Super frustrating that they didn't get him more involved with Gronk hobbled and Amendola concussed.
I think after Amendola went down that the remainder of the receiving corp just aren't good route runners. Cooks has a rep as a one trick pony and Hogan doesn't really seem to excel at making cuts and running timing routes. Can't really expect much from Dorsett since he's only been here 6 days. Also didn't help that the KC gameplan was obviously to get away with as much grabbing and holding as possible. The downfield gameplan was a total bust against the three man rush while KC lived off of the underneath pick play stuff which is nearly unstoppable at times in this NFL era. Not McDaniels finest hour to be sure.
Running up the A (or B) gap when the A (and B) gap are completely jammed isn't really being any better prepared than trying to sneak up the A gap. KC had the entire interior line stuffed with bodies - and that was pretty clear pre-snap.
Edelman being gone hurts, clearly, but the fact that they didn't have anything better than 'run it directly at the strongest part of the defense' planned for situations like this is definitely an indictment of the playcalling.
Gronk with back issues is of course #1 worry, but a close #2 is he's completely healthy and this is just Gronk now, after years of pounding and injuries. One game isn't enough to make a judgment, but it would be good to see a vintage Gronk performance next week to calm me down a little.
He looked pretty vintage making a TD catch that was dubiously overturned. Which also happened to be the play that he got hurt on. Whatever it was (chest contusion maybe) it sapped his ability to play to his max.
The other thing besides LB that concerns me is that they don't have a young slot WR. Amendola played 19% of the snaps last year by design, he's not cut out for this much grind. Dorsett has all that speed, but what they need is a tough threat to patrol the middle and read defenses. I really wish they had kept Carr and at least given him a few games.
This. Given Edelman's injury, a mortal or injured Gronk pretty much dooms this team. I really hope this is just a bump in the road but I'm quite concerned about Gronk's decline, which I do think will be steep and profound whenever it comes. When the body goes, it goes.
If he's healthy, he should thrash the Saints next week.
Remeber, he hurt his back last year taking a hit to the sternum. That's where the impact was last night. My hope is he appears on the injury list with "rib/chest," and that's it. Fun thing to hope :/
One last thing, and this may have been due to the WR injuries, but I thought they looked great early going up-tempo and then we never saw it again. Why? They moved the ball with ease when they were going no-huddle and after that they slammed on the brakes and decided to slow things down.
Trent DilferVerified account @DilfersDimes
You guys need me to say something idiotic again to inspire an epic run? I got nothing else going on, more than happy to help if needed.
You guys need me to say something idiotic again to inspire an epic run? I got nothing else going on, more than happy to help if needed.
Even on that catch he was blanketed and Brady just fired it in there. I am talking about his ability to use his physicality to get open, and then to demolish defenders once he has the ball.
I was at the game and just prior to the catch on which he may or may not have injured himself I was remarking to my brother-in-law that Gronk did not look himself, in terms of explosiveness off the line, fluidity of movement and ability to separate from defenders. Ridiculously SSS and Berry is obviously a great player himself so I am not panicking, but worth watching.
One of the non-called holding calls was a jersey grab. It certainly would have been defensible to call holding on that play, but it was not egregious and it looked like Gronk immediately started looking for the flag once his jersey was tugged rather than swatting the guy's hand away or just powering through him.
not to harp too much but the ground clearly helped him secure the catch. that was a perfectly fine overturn call
Thanks for the super post, DM. It's unfair to knock Marsh when he was forced into a new defense AND into new roles he is/may not be suited for.
T4W beat me to it, but I also share this point of view. Many of the issues last night are fixable -- especially better use of their impressive RB corps, but also smoother communication in the secondary. Dante will coach up the OL, as per usual. But the big personal challenges are at LB and slot receiver. The latter should be fixable: the RBs can help (just throw James White in there?), or maybe offer Austin Carr a roster spot to pull him off the Saints practice squad? But the LBs is going to be hard.
Finally one bright spot -- while I'm not knowledgable enough to speak to his coverage I though McCourty's hustle and tackling were exceptional last night.
Wow, thanks for that. Marsh getting more defensive snaps than Wise is a joke.
I would kill to have Collins back right now. The LB play was that horrid yesterday
Yeah, it was weird. Thought Burkhead was going to be a bigger part of the game plan, BB had talked about having RBs that can catch and run being useful (Gillislee can play in the passing game too). They tried to throw a couple to Burkhead on the first series, then he kind of went away and that was mostly it for throwing to RBs. They ran a couple of plays with Lewis/White in the game together but just wasnt a part of the game plan.
PFW, NESN, MassLive, and others have come out and said Carr was not good during pre-season and could not separate.
I was high on Carr as anyone but with Edelman gone you think BB/JMC would have put him on the 53 roster.
Moving forward, as long as NE wins the AFCE and get at least 1 home PO game I'm good. 11-5 would be just fine.
He was grabbing at his chest and stomach area just before spiking it. I thought in real time he landed on the ball and had he wind knocked out. Maybe it was a rib. Either way, I'm hopeful it wasn't his back.
KC run defense was just 25th according to FO DVOA rankings. They must have thought they can wear down the D as the game went on.
They have options, at least:
- Play Harris more
- Play Roberts more
- Get Marsh up to speed and hope he improves with more time
- McClellin coming back from IR-DTR
- Langi?
- Try Marquis Flowers?
In hindsight, Gilmore signed for about what Jamie Collins did. Plenty of time for it to turn around but I'm not feeling great about that decision this morning.
I kind of assumed this was going to be Cooks long-term. If he's just going to be a short, home run deep threat and not a guy who gets #1-type targets, I'm not sure why they gave up a first for him.
Maybe. I thought the value came from his outside threat opening up the middle a bit for others, but if the others are all injured or ineffective, I'm not sure what you do. I don't know how long Cooks would last taking shots over the middle.
What is the snap distribution you would like for the four RBs?
Given the upside in White and Gillislee, I am not necessarily troubled by limited snaps for the other two RBs last night.
I also don't know if trying to keep all four fresh and involved is a good idea. Bringing a fresh guy off the bench late is appealing in that he's ready to go when the D is tired. But overall, having primary RBs who get in a groove with Brady and their blockers seems positive, as well.
I hate to pick up on things that Collisnworth says, but I do think he has a point that the limited playing time in the pre-season for starters makes it hard for newish units to jell during the regular season.
Eh, gonna have a hard time second guessing the Collins decision ever based on how last year played out
I kind of assumed this was going to be Cooks long-term. If he's just going to be a short, home run deep threat and not a guy who gets #1-type targets, I'm not sure why they gave up a first for him
Maybe it will be, but this sort of was what he was in NO.
Nink quoted to be working out "aggressively". This D could use some stability if he does decide to come back.
Also, DMC know he done bad:
@RyanHannable
Josh McDaniels: "It starts with me. I didn't do a good enough job yesterday."
Nink doesn't seem to me to be a solution to the biggest problem on D, which is that they have too many slow, unathletic bodies in the front 7, specifically at linebacker.
Matty will get the secondary fixed, there's plenty of talent there. But that isn't going to matter if underneath routes are open and there is no pass rush.
Matty will get the secondary fixed, there's plenty of talent there. But that isn't going to matter if underneath routes are open and there is no pass rush.
Thanks, Trent...but SJH has ya covered!
You'd think that after writing off the team last year -- on the way to a Super Bowl -- you'd know a bit better -- hell, if evenTrent Dilfer knows better...
Count me in the not worried category -- showed lots of good versus a
Game balls to:
1: Gillislee;
2: Amendola - get healthy! and
3: Cook (good stats, terrific if you consider the flags he attracted).
Goats to:
1: Brady (I see it as early season conditioning -- a few missed throws and a lot of not throwing to open receivers, but showed the arm strength and accuracy that makes me think it was just early season jitters.
2: Gronk -- I'm more worried about him than Brady...still likely fine and absolutely above average -- but he did look physically tentative. Hopefully just a short term ding after the non-TD.
3: Coaching: I don't agree with all the generic complaints, but why DA was fielding punts and why they didn't use more of Burkhead/White et al on passes is a puzzle -- the former, in particular..
The most likely path to success this year is probably an elite offense with a below average defense. Im pretty hopeful based on track record BB can coach up the front 7 up enough to just be a kinda bad defense as opposed to a 2011 level atrocity (although that team was still a play away from winning it all)
Brady only attempted five passes over the middle last night, so early returns are it ain't working. In general I find this concept wildly overrated, and if this is all they have in mind for Cooks, I'm disappointed they traded what they did for him.
If a 33-year-old retiree who had four sacks last year is the answer ... yeesh.
.
Here's the case for optimism with Gronk. In 2013, after his injuries, he spent like 7 weeks just practicing and getting comfortable before he'd even play. In 2014 he was very much a non factor for four weeks. In 2015 he basically took a week off after the Denver scare just because. Obviously given the injury history he could just be breaking down, but Gronk has never really been a guy who comes off an injury and is ready to fire. He's always taken a little bit to get back into the groove.
Or maybe he's got a weird Samsonesque power source thing going and he needs to get back to the heavy boozing.
That's a good bit of perspective and is likely correct. And Berry is (was?) obviously great.
NO is another spread it out type offense, but Cooks only got 10 targets once last year and was kind of in that 6-9 target range most weeks. Got 7 targets last night and a couple of PIs, so usage is pretty much where I think we can expect from Cooks. Maybe they'll turn him into a different player, but its not like he's a rookie or a guy that was buried in a bad offense. I dont think they're gonna be targeting him 12 times a week and throwing him intermediate routes over the middle much or anything.