TB Suspension: Cheater free to play again
- Thread starter IdiotKicker
- Start date
The politics of why Kessler was the one who handled the appellate stuff... will be interesting, if it ever comes out. NFLPA screwed the pooch.
Today is a great day if you believe in integrity.
Brady's side flubbed it from the beginning. The Kraft laydown, allowing Don Yee to do...anything, Brady not swearing on his crops that the investigation was a goldarn disgrace, rolling with Kessler, winning too much, winning too much, and winning too much.
Brady's side flubbed it from the beginning. The Kraft laydown, allowing Don Yee to do...anything, Brady not swearing on his crops that the investigation was a goldarn disgrace, rolling with Kessler, winning too much, winning too much, and winning too much.
That's about a half step away from cheering an opponent's injury. But hey, congrats.
I think there is better odds of Tom Brady quitting football over this than of NFLPA striking.
Edit: Not that either will happen.
Keep in mind the other piece of this is Berman is (as a procedural matter) back with the mandate here. It is rare for a district court judge to do much other than enter the judgment, but this is a little bit of an odd set of facts. I wouldn't hold out a lot of hope, but something to consider when reading the 2nd Circuit opinion (which I have not been able to) is whether it truly responded to the avenues Berman left open, and just how strongly Berman feels about the factual context here (he is foreclosed on the legal one).
He needs not only to get it reversed, but he also needs to get a stay, because there is no way this will get decided before the start of the season.
Plus, even if he gets a stay, I don't want that, because I think the chances of him winning a further appeal are hopeless. The nightmare scenario is that he files a cert petition, gets a stay, plays the regular season, then the Supreme Court denies cert in December and the suspension goes into effect. No thanks.
If he wants to appeal to clear his name, fine. Maybe he'll have mootness problems. But he should sit the first four games of this year and it's time to move the fuck on.
I could barely care less about the 4 games - it may end up being good for the team anyway. But I don't want to listen to all the jealous fans of other teams gloating about their big "win" for the next week.
This is the long and short of it. The NFLPA were playing checkers to the NFL's 3D chess, and the bill came due today.
The other 31 teams may want to stop celebrating now. If ever they get organized enough to be as high-profile as the Patriots are, they're next
Katzmann in dissent:
Seems about right--2/3 of the country is against the Patriots, 1/3 would see it the way we do.
All it means is that the Dolphins' season might effectively end in late October instead of mid-October.
Andrew Brandt @AndrewBrandt 2m2 minutes ago
Brady/NFLPA can appeal to full Second Circuit (en banc) and then to the U.S. Supreme Court, but would think their chances are not promising.
Brady/NFLPA can appeal to full Second Circuit (en banc) and then to the U.S. Supreme Court, but would think their chances are not promising.
Can't force the courts to hear more appeals and it's unlikely they decide to at this point. Hope Jonathan Kraft burns the league office down once Bob passes on and that Brady lends his name to every lawsuit against the league for the rest of his life.
There is no better time for this to drop. Media will be on to the draft by Wednesday; they will then spend through the following Tuesday ripping teams for their drafts. BB will deflect all questions by saying he is focused on the draft.
It's like the court couldn't decide if they wanted to excoriate Berman or Kessler more. Quite a few shots at the Union and the agreement it signed. The decision almost revels and takes joy in the idea that the Union agreed to this stupid system and that Goodell could have suspended him for having long toenails if he wanted to.
The options are letting this hang over Brady and the team for another season in exchange for a minuscule chance of this decision being overturned. He's unlikely to get a stay, so he'll serve the four games either way. The time to fight the league and show indignation has passed, and the owner took his ball and went home when the opportuniy was there.
The dissent from Katzmann at least makes me feel better. I can't understand how the majority came to their conclusion. It defies logic.
The chief justice wrote the dissent. So any appeal can use that as a blueprint. I'd think NFLPA has one more step in them.
I'd hire Ted Olsen and I'd quote Katzmann a bunch.
I'd hire Ted Olsen and I'd quote Katzmann a bunch.
Ohhhh noooo! how can we finish ahead of Buffalo, Miami and the Jets without Brady for four weeks?!?!?
#sarcasm
#couldsiteightweekswouldntmatter
#sarcasm
#couldsiteightweekswouldntmatter
I doubt they would care about the chances of winning. The goal would be to push it out as long as possible.
As a Layman.. am I understanding right? The reasons the Suspension was upheld is the CBA gives Ginger a broad brush of discipline and the Brady (and the NFLPA) have only themselves to blame for agreeing to it in the first place?
Two lessons for those not members of the craft guild.
1. When those who are tell you it's not a "slam dunk", it's probably not a slam dunk. So it's generally not wise to get one's inner Reddit on and insist it IS a slam dunk.
2. Relatedly, when some of us said the composition of the panel would matter a fuckton, we meant it, and now you know why.
1. When those who are tell you it's not a "slam dunk", it's probably not a slam dunk. So it's generally not wise to get one's inner Reddit on and insist it IS a slam dunk.
2. Relatedly, when some of us said the composition of the panel would matter a fuckton, we meant it, and now you know why.
One extra regular season win last year and we might have won another Super Bowl.
I guess my point is that going 2-2 or 1-3 in the first 4 games will mean this is hanging over the team for another season regardless. So why not exhaust all options?
Ian Gunn @IanPGunn 6m6 minutes ago
Wow. CA2 agrees w/ NFL's last minute argument about shifting arguments. Calls out NFLPA for arguing in alternative
Ian Gunn @IanPGunn 5m5 minutes ago
That's not only a misunderstanding of NFLPA's position, but also NFLPA's position is allowed by FRCP.
Ian Gunn @IanPGunn 5m5 minutes ago
If anything it was NFL that "remain[ed] silent, raising no objection during the course of the arbitration proceeding" when NFLPA raised this
Ian Gunn @IanPGunn 3m3 minutes ago
Because Parker could not find the words "ball," "tampering," or "deflation" in the equipment violation policies, he argues it does not apply
Ian Gunn @IanPGunn 5m5 minutes ago
Long story short, CA2 bought NFL arguments on Equipment Policies and essentially ignored distinction arguments NFLPA made
@dcmissle
One of the rare times in the Brady era that we will learn if his backup is any good. If you take out the BS on how we arrived at this point, I still believe it serves the team better in the long run. Jimmy G does not need to be Brady for them to go 2-2 or 3-1. Brady will have 4 less games of wear and tear this season. I know it's a fairly weak analogy, but the Broncos won a SB with a QB on Obamacare. The Bengals were serviceable with AJ freeking McCarron. Better to deal with it now than in December.
Assuming this suspension is upheld: this is nonsense for Brady, and a disaster for the NFLPA.
As to your point, though, I almost agree. Might not be the worst thing to have Jimmy G take the fire while the offensive line works through their kinks this season.
And after 5 consecutive deep playoff runs I'm not that upset about Brady having a longer offseason, even if it costs us playoff seeding.
Different sports and situations, but Belichick has talked before about his deep admiration for Pop and the Spurs, and that team has expertly managed Duncan and Parker's minutes.
From reddit.com/r/nfl
For anyone wondering/hoping/guessing: no, this will not go to the Supreme Court. The case is too fact-bound and really involves a pretty straightforward application of existing law. It's true that the district court and circuit court disagreed on how that law mapped onto the facts of this particular case, but there's really no legal "hook" that would put this on the Supreme Court's radar. Second Circuit ruling will stand, though I do anticipate Brady's team will file for rehearing en banc and for cert. That's pretty much pro forma.
Edit: Sorry for the legalese at the end there. Brady's lawyers will first file for rehearing "en banc" in the Second Circuit. This case was decided by a panel of three judges, but the Second Circuit is actually composed of 13 active status judges. Brady's team will essentially be asking the entire court to rehear the case. Because the dissenting judge in this opinion is Chief Judge of the Second Circuit, I suppose there is some chance for rehearing.
If that doesn't work, Brady's team will file a petition for "cert" to the Supreme Court. That essentially means they'll be asking the Supreme Court to overturn the decision of the Second Circuit on legal grounds. That won't happen, for the reasons stated above. None of the judges in this case disagreed on the legal standard that should be applied, only the application of that standard to the facts of this case. The Supreme Court doesn't hear fact-bound appeals like this one unless they're of some other legal significance.
Edit: Sorry for the legalese at the end there. Brady's lawyers will first file for rehearing "en banc" in the Second Circuit. This case was decided by a panel of three judges, but the Second Circuit is actually composed of 13 active status judges. Brady's team will essentially be asking the entire court to rehear the case. Because the dissenting judge in this opinion is Chief Judge of the Second Circuit, I suppose there is some chance for rehearing.
If that doesn't work, Brady's team will file a petition for "cert" to the Supreme Court. That essentially means they'll be asking the Supreme Court to overturn the decision of the Second Circuit on legal grounds. That won't happen, for the reasons stated above. None of the judges in this case disagreed on the legal standard that should be applied, only the application of that standard to the facts of this case. The Supreme Court doesn't hear fact-bound appeals like this one unless they're of some other legal significance.
It means only that there maybe at least one vote for en banc. ("Maybe," because even the dissenter may not find approproate for en banc review).
Here's my take:
It's a practical decision for the second circuit, which embraces NY, which is the contractual forum for most commercial contracts, which often contain arbitration clauses.
The second circuit specifically, and federal courts in general, love arbitration because it lessens its docket load, but leaving the law squishy here would only lead to more appeals which would put arbitrable matters back in the federal court system. So, take a hard line, quash ambiguity, lessen appealable issues, unclog the docket, life goes on.
It's a practical decision for the second circuit, which embraces NY, which is the contractual forum for most commercial contracts, which often contain arbitration clauses.
The second circuit specifically, and federal courts in general, love arbitration because it lessens its docket load, but leaving the law squishy here would only lead to more appeals which would put arbitrable matters back in the federal court system. So, take a hard line, quash ambiguity, lessen appealable issues, unclog the docket, life goes on.
Interesting that these two judges seemed to be attacking Brady from the outset. Wonder if any large deposits have been made to their bank accounts this year.
Does this have implications beyond this case (i.e., do all arbitrators now have the option of making shit up, or just Goodell)?
Matt Sammon @SammonSez now3 seconds ago
The NFL is going to flip its lid when Johnny Manziel leads the Patriots to a 4-0 start this season.
The NFL is going to flip its lid when Johnny Manziel leads the Patriots to a 4-0 start this season.
Could a potential vote for en banc from the Chief Justice carry any weight with the rest of the judges?
Setting aside high dungeon over the rape of jurisprudence momentarily, I'm inclined to agree with this.
I for one was happy to make the LGBT for Lev Bell trade for game one last year.
If Goodell were smart he'd use this draft week exposure to cut the suspension to two games. That would allow him to seem "reasonable" while still hammering the Pats on the picks, and he gets his Brady trophy.
Ugh, what a turd. Hope the rest of the NFL is happy. Your franchise could be next.