Round 2 Bruins-Panthers

joe dokes

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That's the hockey equivalent of shooting the lights out. The second and third goals went into such tiny openings. Great start!
The message on Bob seemed to be "shoot high."

Lohrei's improvement on defense is pretty remarkable. He's still easily pushed around (which I expect to change as he gets stronger), but he's at least making the right play/attempt far more often in the D-zone than he was earlier in the season. And his offensive skill and instincts are so top-notch.
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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The message on Bob seemed to be "shoot high."

Lohrei's improvement on defense is pretty remarkable. He's still easily pushed around (which I expect to change as he gets stronger), but he's at least making the right play/attempt far more often in the D-zone than he was earlier in the season. And his offensive skill and instincts are so top-notch.
I can't remember where I read it, but basically Bob's stance in goal means he's extremely adept at moving side to side better than most goalies but is very vulnerable to the type of goals the Bruins scored last night.
 

joe dokes

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After last night, I’m not sure who he replaces, even though I do like him as a generally steadying presence. He’s not a C so it’s not Brown. JVR had an assist. Beecher wasn’t great but with the faceoff issues it’s nice to have him around since he was at 50% yesterday.
Also, it seems JVR has mostly recovered from whatever illness felled him mid season. Someone on TV mentioned he lost 10-15 lbs. Regardless, he was a zero for most of the spring, from whom I was not expecting much. Two weeks ago, I would've said Heinen in, JVR out, is a no-brainer. Not quite, right now.
 
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cshea

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After last night, I’m not sure who he replaces, even though I do like him as a generally steadying presence. He’s not a C so it’s not Brown. JVR had an assist. Beecher wasn’t great but with the faceoff issues it’s nice to have him around since he was at 50% yesterday.
Beecher is playing wing so they could take Brown out, kick Beecher to the middle and put Heinen on the 4th line. I'm not really sure what the deal was with Brown getting in anyway. I don't think Boqvist has been bad and doesn't appear to be injured given he skated both in the morning and in warmups.
 

IdiotKicker

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Beecher is playing wing so they could take Brown out, kick Beecher to the middle and put Heinen on the 4th line. I'm not really sure what the deal was with Brown getting in anyway. I don't think Boqvist has been bad and doesn't appear to be injured given he skated both in the morning and in warmups.
Yeah I could see that. I don’t really understand the Brown move either other than maybe faceoffs and wanting to be heavier, but I thought Boqvist was fine too. I just figured if they wanted him last night they’ll want him again.
 

cshea

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Yeah I could see that. I don’t really understand the Brown move either other than maybe faceoffs and wanting to be heavier, but I thought Boqvist was fine too. I just figured if they wanted him last night they’ll want him again.
Yeah, taking a deeper look, it was almost certainly for draws. Brown is about 55% for his career in the NHL, Boqvist about 35%. Brown ended up going 5-2 at the dot last night.
 

wilked

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If I'm looking for areas of improvement...

One thing I saw a lot of were icings by the Bruins. I checked the box scores of NHL.com and ESPN but didn't see number of icings. I'm sure the Bs were way higher than the Panthers.

a) How important is it to minimize icing?
b) Should the Bs work on it, or is it way down the list of priorities so as to leave it alone?
 

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Ideally they would work on the icings because they have been getting beaten on draws more often than not. I think it's not about working on not icing the puck, but rather working on their defense zone breakouts. The defensemen have been taking a little bit of extra time to settle the pucks and make the perfect pass but with the aggressive forecheck they've been getting hemmed in.
 

joe dokes

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Yeah, taking a deeper look, it was almost certainly for draws. Brown is about 55% for his career in the NHL, Boqvist about 35%. Brown ended up going 5-2 at the dot last night.
Glad you noted that. I had no idea about Brown in the dot.
 

cshea

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Icings were 14-5 Boston.

6 of them came in the 3rd period when they were up multiple goals and "just get it the fuck out" is priority #1, and another came wtih 3 seconds left in the second period. So roughly half were in defending a multi-goal lead game state. Can't surive just icing it over and over when you're ahead but again it's not the worst thing in the world.

Florida also has an incredible forecheck so the Bruins break out is going to look ugly at times and lead to a few extra icings throughout the course of the series. They aren't going to get clean exits every single time.
 

5dice

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Glad you noted that. I had no idea about Brown in the dot.
That and the move to being heavier/tougher in this series vs faster in the TOR series. Boquist is 184 pounds, Brown at 214. Same goes for Forbort at 216 vs Gryz 180 or Shattenkirk 203 but not that tough.
 

Dogman

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Yeah, taking a deeper look, it was almost certainly for draws. Brown is about 55% for his career in the NHL, Boqvist about 35%. Brown ended up going 5-2 at the dot last night.

Aside from the penalty he took, he was also there for checking and bodying guys. Clearly, Monty wants them hitting much more and with the number of hits last night, it is working to slow Florida down from any of their forecheck sets and odd man rushes.

I have no problem with getting the puck out quickly, icing or not.
 

wilked

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Icings were 14-5 Boston.

6 of them came in the 3rd period when they were up multiple goals and "just get it the fuck out" is priority #1, and another came wtih 3 seconds left in the second period. So roughly half were in defending a multi-goal lead game state. Can't surive just icing it over and over when you're ahead but again it's not the worst thing in the world.

Florida also has an incredible forecheck so the Bruins break out is going to look ugly at times and lead to a few extra icings throughout the course of the series. They aren't going to get clean exits every single time.
Thanks for grabbing the stats

I wonder if some of it was in response to how badly they got beat on faceoffs vs Toronto as well, which takes guys out of position / 'on their heels' if you start mentally expecting to lose a faceoff.

We'll see if it persists Game 2
 

cshea

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Thanks for grabbing the stats

I wonder if some of it was in response to how badly they got beat on faceoffs vs Toronto as well, which takes guys out of position / 'on their heels' if you start mentally expecting to lose a faceoff.

We'll see if it persists Game 2
I think there's been a couple of adjustments in terms of the faceoffs. First was putting Geekie in the middle and bumping Zacha to the wing. Zacha was good during the regular season (54%) but was getting crushed by Toronto. Game 5 he was 4-13, game 6 he was 1-9. Game 7 he was 6-7, then last night only took 2 draws (going 1-1). Getting Geekie on that line gives them 2 centers, a righty and a lefty, to cover draws, especially after icings when they can't change. Geekie is like 48% for his career so he's not like a faceoff wizard but it at least helps stabilize the situation. It's the multiple icings over and over that can kill and that was what happened in game 5. Zacha's line would ice it, they'd lose the draw, they'd spend 30 second running around, ice it again, etc. The second was Brown for Boqvist which also added a bit more heaviness.
 

joe dokes

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That and the move to being heavier/tougher in this series vs faster in the TOR series. Boquist is 184 pounds, Brown at 214. Same goes for Forbort at 216 vs Gryz 180 or Shattenkirk 203 but not that tough.
Shattenkirk's Game 7 pre-game speech notwithstanding (and he need not be playing to do that, anyway), if Lohrei has levelled up to somewhat-less-terrifying defense in the d-zone, then Shattenkirk becomes closer to superfluous.

Bigger picture -- Heinen, Boquist, Shattenkirk, Gryz dont suck, and all (*perhaps* with the exception of Heinen) have been replaced in the lineup for perfectly reasonable reasons with players who mostly have done the job.
 

Zososoxfan

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If I'm looking for areas of improvement...

One thing I saw a lot of were icings by the Bruins. I checked the box scores of NHL.com and ESPN but didn't see number of icings. I'm sure the Bs were way higher than the Panthers.

a) How important is it to minimize icing?
b) Should the Bs work on it, or is it way down the list of priorities so as to leave it alone?
Ideally they would work on the icings because they have been getting beaten on draws more often than not. I think it's not about working on not icing the puck, but rather working on their defense zone breakouts. The defensemen have been taking a little bit of extra time to settle the pucks and make the perfect pass but with the aggressive forecheck they've been getting hemmed in.
It felt to me that the Bruins were making a concerted effort to use the boards to get the breakouts going. I have no statistical backup for this, but it is a kinda clever way to beat a forecheck that probably focuses more on direct passing angles. Of course, this also risks more icings and losing possession, but it also pushes FL back a bit off the forecheck and can lead to good OZ possessions and OMRs.
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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I have to note that Monty called his time out with 14:12 left in the 3rd after sustained pressure by Florida in the Bruins' zone, and I thought that was a very, very smart move. He got them regrouped and it was apparently less about giving the team a breather and more about emphasizing to them the need to be better with the puck and to make simple plays.

And Brazeau promptly scored less than 2 minutes later to put the game to bed.
 

cshea

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It felt to me that the Bruins were making a concerted effort to use the boards to get the breakouts going. I have no statistical backup for this, but it is a kinda clever way to beat a forecheck that probably focuses more on direct passing angles. Of course, this also risks more icings and losing possession, but it also pushes FL back a bit off the forecheck and can lead to good OZ possessions and OMRs.
I'm not a big X's and O's guy but they do use the boards a lot for breakouts. In general, passing it up the middle can be dangerous.

When they go up the boards, the D gets it to the winger around the half boards. If the opposing D comes down and pinches, the idea is to win the puck battle with support from the center swinging in. Get it past that pinching D and they have speed through the NZ. Of course, lose the puck battle to the pinching D and the cycle starts all over.
 

FL4WL3SS

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DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Icings were 14-5 Boston.

6 of them came in the 3rd period when they were up multiple goals and "just get it the fuck out" is priority #1, and another came wtih 3 seconds left in the second period. So roughly half were in defending a multi-goal lead game state. Can't surive just icing it over and over when you're ahead but again it's not the worst thing in the world.

Florida also has an incredible forecheck so the Bruins break out is going to look ugly at times and lead to a few extra icings throughout the course of the series. They aren't going to get clean exits every single time.
Yeah. I think people fret too much about icing. Would have certainly taken an icing on the first Panthers' goal. Sometimes it's a pretty good play.

Of course, I've never played and so I don't actually know what it's like to have to stay on the ice after a 70 second shift. Maybe it's a bigger deal than I want to pretend, but against a team that we know can cycle as well as they can, sometimes you just have to take the safe play and fight the next battle when it comes.
 

tims4wins

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There were also a handful of icings - like 3 in a row - with 6 minutes left in the 2nd period, where the B's weren't trying to ice the puck to clear the zone, they just missed on some passes.

Edit: I just watched, it was Wotherspoon all 3 times.
 
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cshea

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Yeah. I think people fret too much about icing. Would have certainly taken an icing on the first Panthers' goal. Sometimes it's a pretty good play.

Of course, I've never played and so I don't actually know what it's like to have to stay on the ice after a 70 second shift. Maybe it's a bigger deal than I want to pretend, but against a team that we know can cycle as well as they can, sometimes you just have to take the safe play and fight the next battle when it comes.
A single icing in isolation to relieve pressure or missing on a exit pass isn't the end of the world. It's the multipe consecutive icings that get to be problematic. Guys get worn down, They get 1 or 2 guys off but the other 3 are dog tired, etc.
 

Cotillion

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There were also a handful of icings - like 3 in a row - with 6 minutes left in the 2nd period, where the B's weren't trying to ice the puck to clear the zone, they just missed on some passes.
I expect more icings cause the Panthers have always given the Bruins trouble with their forecheck, and trying to break the forecheck is by making those longer passes behind the forecheck. Gonna miss some of those passes and will inevitably have the icings.
 

TheRealness

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I remember some years ago I asked folks here about the goalie pipeline because I wasn't up to speed on that part of the organization and was curious about post-Tuukka life and @TheRealness mentioned Swayman and his potential to make it to the bigs. At that time I got excited about him and it's been an accelerated journey since then.

Good work Rory.
The most impressive thing about him has always been how quick he is, and how controlled his movements are. It's something Rask was exceptional at.

Big difference I think between them personality wise is Swayman is a dog and will get in your face. Rask is just as cool as the other side of the pillow. Swayman is like a cross of Rask's control, and Thomas' fire. Glad to see him putting both things together on this run.
 

joe dokes

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There were also a handful of icings - like 3 in a row - with 6 minutes left in the 2nd period, where the B's weren't trying to ice the puck to clear the zone, they just missed on some passes.

Edit: I just watched, it was Wotherspoon all 3 times.
With some of those passes along the near-side boards that end up as icing, it's hard to tell from TV if the pass was off, if the winger was late, if he just missed a good pass, or if the defender got a good stick lift. But as @Cotillion said, those types of icings might just be an unavoidable side-effect from how to beat the forecheck.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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With some of those passes along the near-side boards that end up as icing, it's hard to tell from TV if the pass was off, if the winger was late, if he just missed a good pass, or if the defender got a good stick lift. But as @Cotillion said, those types of icings might just be an unavoidable side-effect from how to beat the forecheck.
Yeah ultimately I’ll take this kind of thing over getting cute trying to find the perfect breakout and handing the puck over to the other team with our guys heading in the wrong direction and scrambling to recover.

As a disaster mitigation strategy it’s fine, but it’s on the forwards to execute a bit better in getting themselves to those board clearances so we don’t get stuck too many times with bad matchups after an icing.

Those “up the middle” turnovers have a way of ending up in the back of the net with regularity, so, yeah, I’m ok with the safer play.
 

Over Guapo Grande

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I can't remember where I read it, but basically Bob's stance in goal means he's extremely adept at moving side to side better than most goalies but is very vulnerable to the type of goals the Bruins scored last night.
I didn't see a reply to this - but they covered it in the 2nd intermission. BOB essentially locks his right side against the near post- that gives him something to push off of going side to side. For the Lohrei goal, his weight was already shifting left (across the goal), which opened up the gap above his shoulder. The hosts said that had BOB just stood square to the shooter, the goal never would have happened, and there were pretty much no passing lanes either.
 

Mr. Wednesday

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I don't know about a lane to get it to him, but Pasta was wide open at the back post. That may have distracted Bobrovski even if Lohrei didn't actually have room to get it across.
 

Foxy42

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Feels good to be the underdog and wake up feeling positive that we split the first two.
 

bsl394

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Obviously hate the result of G2 - but oh boy that was a "fun" third period. Wish the Bruins had a true fighter they could send out to just take a run at Tkachuk. I was telling a friend that, unlike last year, I didn't have high hopes coming into the season, so I feel like the Bruins are playing with house money at this point. Sure, I want them to win, but the season is already a success in my eyes - makes the playoffs a (little) less stressful.
 

RedOctober3829

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Fully expected Florida to play well last night. They're a good team for a reason. Now, go home and take care of business and re-take control of the series. This series is going to be a series of body blows thrown by each opponent. Throw the last one and knock the motherfucker out.
 

Maximus

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We need to leverage home ice now to give us a fighter's chance in this series. The Panthers are a very deep and talented team. Their D structure is much different than Toronto's 1-3-1 that gave us offensive issues in that series but still only gave us 15 shots on net last night. The D need to take shots quickly so their D and Bob are not set and we have opportunities with rebounds. And McAvoy needs to make quick decisions and to shoot, period. Our effort to get it cleanly out of our zone needs to be better against an excellent forechecking team.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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The Bruins were terrible last night as the game went on. Aimless wandering around in no man's land. Not strong on the puck. Tried to get out of every jam with their sticks instead of by taking the man. Were very weak in the corners as the game went on. Lots of gliding. Panthers are good team with good players who can make you pay for being lackadaisical, but most teams in the league would have beaten the Bruins last night.

I don't think it means anything. They had a shit game. We've seen them play better, including recently. Back on the horse. Panthers started the series a little better and were probably 60/40 to win. Not seeing anything that changes that.
 

mwonow

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Last change for the next couple of games should matter. I expect Tkachuk will get plenty of time opposite Maroon, Freddie, Brown if he's dressed. Maybe a couple of their skill guys get some similar shadow as well.

I'm not expecting a Pittsburgh '91 thing, but I don't think you can let Tkachuk targeting a guy who a) is our best scorer by miles and b) had exactly one NHL fight prior to last game, go unanswered.
 

cshea

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Last change for the next couple of games should matter. I expect Tkachuk will get plenty of time opposite Maroon, Freddie, Brown if he's dressed. Maybe a couple of their skill guys get some similar shadow as well.

I'm not expecting a Pittsburgh '91 thing, but I don't think you can let Tkachuk targeting a guy who a) is our best scorer by miles and b) had exactly one NHL fight prior to last game, go unanswered.
Tkachuk didn't target Pastrnak. Pastrnak was a willing participant. The shots at the end were obviously cheap but it wasn't like Tkachuk jumped Pasta. It was an agreed upon fight by both parties.

Secondly, the put the plug-who-can-fight out against the skill guys you are annoyed at for some sort of intimidation or retribution or whatever never ends well.