RealFantasy Pigskin - Progress Report

SMU_Sox

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Just an fyi tashaun gibson and kyke d clemons are our starting safeties. Cyrpien is riding the pine.

Edit... I greatly appreciate you doing this.
 

SeoulSoxFan

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SMU_Sox said:
Just an fyi tashaun gibson and kyke d clemons are our starting safeties. Cyrpien is riding the pine.

Edit... I greatly appreciate you doing this.
 
All scores adjusted. Division standings still remain the same, but the distance between you guys and the rest just got wider.
 

Super Nomario

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SeoulSoxFan said:
And now onto defenses. First up are the defensive tackles:
 
[tablegrid= DT Ratings ]Team DE1 PFF DE2 PFF DT/NT1 PFF DT/NT2 PFF TOTAL Austin Browns (KFP) Charles Johnson 5.5 Carlos Dunlap 4.3 Kyle Williams -5.0 Glenn Dorsey 9.2 14.0 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) Corey Liuget 0.0 Cameron Jordan 18.1 Athyba Rubin 2.5 Armond Armstead* -11.7 8.9 Seoul Steelers (SSF) Derek Wolfe -9.3 Alex Carrington -3.0 Akiem Hicks -2.5 Roy Miller -8.8 -23.6 Cleveland Ravens (SN) Quinton Coples -9.2 Richard Seymour* -8.9 Haloti Ngata 4.1 Jesse Williams* -11.7 -25.7 [/tablegrid] 
The surprise here has to be the low rating that Coples has, but that may be due to his transition into a LB role rather than as a DT. Semi-retirement of Seymour also hurts here. 
Thanks for doing these.
 
If I can sub in Barry Cofield (+6.5) and Whitney Mercilus (-.8) for Seymour and Williams, I look somewhat better. Secondary help might have to wait until next year's draft, though I expect Gilmore to be effective as he gets healthier (he's only played two games).
 
EDIT: oh, and Avant for Crabtree
 
EDIT2: and SF121 has OL substitutions. Bonus points for SSF for being the only one who can field a full team without using his supplemental players.
 

soxfan121

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SeoulSoxFan said:
And the uglies upfront:
 
[tablegrid= OL Ratings ]Team LT PFF LG PFF C PFF RG   RT   TOTAL Austin Browns (KFP) Michael Roos 7.2 Chad Rinehart -2.3 Gino Gradkowski -13.6 Jon Asamoah 6.6 Cordy Glenn 12.0 9.9 Cleveland Ravens (SN) Anthony Castonzo 8.8 Korey Lichtensteiger 9.7 Peter Konz -10.8 Alex Boone -1.1 Anthony Davis 1.3 7.9 Seoul Steelers (SSF) Tyron Smith 5.7 Amini Silatolu 4.3 Ted Larsen -9.1 Jordan Mills -18.5 Kelechi Osemele -4.9 -22.5 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) Mike Adams -9.0 Mike Iupati -1.7 Nick McDonald* -13.6 Brandon Moore* -16.9 Phil Loadholt 4.7 -36.5 [/tablegrid]
 
Another case of grade penalties doing a number on the final ratings, with SF121's former Pat Nick McDonald and the sudden retired Brandon Moore not playing a snap for the Bengals. 
 
Our Steelers suffer from the absolutely horrid play of Jordan Mills, although in RL he's playing right tackle rather than the RG I've plugged him into. 
 
SN is flexing his muscle again with a solid bookend tackles Glenn and Roos, and wins the group. BTW, is this the worst group of centers in all of RF draft league? 
 
What are the numbers on Evan Dietrich-Smith & JR Sweezy, aka the guys I replaced McDonald & Moore with after the supplemental draft?
 

SMU_Sox

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Kyle d. Williams is a 9.4... not a minus 5.5. You are looking at the wrong kyle williams bro. The guy you are looking at is a safety. No wonder he is a minus as a dt lol. (That was a joke)

As for 121...
Dietrich smith is a plus 2.3
Jr sweezy is a minus 4.1
 

SeoulSoxFan

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Alright let's see how things shape up after the latest updates.
 
Here are the OL ratings -- after replacing the 2 deadweights, SF121 improves by a whopping 28.7 points. However, I also replaced my sucktitude that was Jordan Mills with a late supplemental pick Brandon Fusco, who's been kicking ass with the Minnesota playing almost all the snaps at RG:
 
[tablegrid= OL Updated Ratings ]Team LT PFF LG PFF C PFF RG   RT   TOTAL Austin Browns (KFP) Michael Roos 7.2 Chad Rinehart -2.3 Gino Gradkowski -13.6 Jon Asamoah 6.6 Cordy Glenn 12.0 9.9 Cleveland Ravens (SN) Anthony Castonzo 8.8 Korey Lichtensteiger 9.7 Peter Konz -10.8 Alex Boone -1.1 Anthony Davis 1.3 7.9 Seoul Steelers (SSF) Tyron Smith 5.7 Amini Silatolu 4.3 Ted Larsen -9.1 Brandon Fusco 7.5 Kelechi Osemele -4.9 3.5 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) Mike Adams -9.0 Mike Iupati -1.7 Evan Dietrich-Smith 2.3 JR Sweezy -4.1 Phil Loadholt 4.7 -7.8 [/tablegrid]
 
The order does not change, but the gaps are much smaller. So how does this change the aggregate offense ratings?
 
[tablegrid= Updated Aggregated Offense Ratings ]Team TOTAL Seoul Steelers (SSF) 3.8 Austin Browns (KFP) 1.8 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) -0.4 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -5.9 [/tablegrid]
 
Lookie here -- our Steelers jump ahead on the strength of Brandon Fusco, edging out SN's Browns. 
 

SeoulSoxFan

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Now to the DT ratings, with the right Kyle Wililams plugged in:
 
[tablegrid= Updated DT Ratings ]Team DE1 PFF DE2 PFF DT/NT1 PFF DT/NT2 PFF TOTAL Austin Browns (KFP) Charles Johnson 5.5 Carlos Dunlap 4.3 Kyle Williams 9.4 Glenn Dorsey 9.2 28.4 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) Corey Liuget 0.0 Cameron Jordan 18.1 Athyba Rubin 2.5 Armond Armstead -11.7 8.9 Cleveland Ravens (SN) Quinton Coples -9.2 Barry Cofield 6.5 Haloti Ngata 4.1 Whitney Mercilus -0.8 0.6 Seoul Steelers (SSF) Derek Wolfe -9.3 Alex Carrington -3.0 Akiem Hicks -2.5 Roy Miller -8.8 -23.6 [/tablegrid]
 
Increases the existing gap of strong line play for the Browns. This is a dominating positions of strength for the Austin squad.
 
Now the updated aggregate defense ratings:
 
[tablegrid= Updated Aggregate Defense Ratings ]Team TOTAL Austin Browns (KFP) 33.3 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) 9.5 Seoul Steelers (SSF) -8.4 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -10.7 [/tablegrid]
 
Browns pulls ahead of the division with a superb 33.3 ratings, and SN improves a ton by swapping in Barry Cofield. 
 

SeoulSoxFan

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And the updated ratings combining offense, defense, and 10% of ST ratings:
 
[tablegrid= Updated Total Ratings ]Team Offense Defense ST Total PBS PBL Austin Browns (KFP) 1.8 33.3 2.4 37.5 - - Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) -0.4 9.5 1.2 10.3 -27.2 -27.2 Seoul Steelers (SSF) 3.8 -8.4 2.0 -2.6 -12.9 -40.1 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -5.9 -10.7 2.0 -14.6 -12.0 -52.1 [/tablegrid]
 
Heh -- same standings as before, although the gaps between teams have narrowed. To track that, I've added two more columns:
  • PBS: Points Behind Standing - gap between you and the team right above 
  • PBL: Points Behind Leader - gap between you and the leading team
It's clear -- KFP & SMU's Browns are the class of the division so far. 
 

SMU_Sox

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I got to thinking about PFF rankings and how relevant they are for our squads. Here's a potential monkey wrench for ratings... Our safeties and corners would all see a huge boost playing behind our pass rush. That's why PFF falls a bit short imo for our defense. When you have Charles Johnson, Carlos Dunlap, Kyle D Williams and even Glenn Dorsey blowing up the pocket and our guys playing an aggressive man scheme you're best option is to test Arthur Brown and Patrick Willis in coverage. Good luck with that. Our front 4 makes our defense.
 
I suppose the same would be true for our RB's though. We'd be facing 8 in the box forcing our shitastic QB to throw to someone. Luckily we have a good O-Line. I'd expect both Moreno and Murray to have lower numbers for us if this were real life. Our WR's are probably right given who their QB's are and how they are used.
 

Super Nomario

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SeoulSoxFan said:
And the updated ratings combining offense, defense, and 10% of ST ratings:
 
[tablegrid= Updated Total Ratings ]Team Offense Defense ST Total PBS PBL Austin Browns (KFP) 1.8 33.3 2.4 37.5 - - Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) -0.4 9.5 1.2 10.3 -27.2 -27.2 Seoul Steelers (SSF) 3.8 -8.4 2.0 -2.6 -12.9 -40.1 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -5.9 -10.7 2.0 -14.6 -12.0 -52.1 [/tablegrid]
 
Heh -- same standings as before, although the gaps between teams have narrowed. To track that, I've added two more columns:
  • PBS: Points Behind Standing - gap between you and the team right above 
  • PBL: Points Behind Leader - gap between you and the leading team
It's clear -- KFP & SMU's Browns are the class of the division so far. 
Jason Avant (-1.6) for Crabtree (-7) would push my O almost into the black.
 
The numbers don't lie: my squad is struggling.
 
 
SMU_Sox said:
I got to thinking about PFF rankings and how relevant they are for our squads. Here's a potential monkey wrench for ratings... Our safeties and corners would all see a huge boost playing behind our pass rush. That's why PFF falls a bit short imo for our defense. When you have Charles Johnson, Carlos Dunlap, Kyle D Williams and even Glenn Dorsey blowing up the pocket and our guys playing an aggressive man scheme you're best option is to test Arthur Brown and Patrick Willis in coverage. Good luck with that. Our front 4 makes our defense.
 
I suppose the same would be true for our RB's though. We'd be facing 8 in the box forcing our shitastic QB to throw to someone. Luckily we have a good O-Line. I'd expect both Moreno and Murray to have lower numbers for us if this were real life. Our WR's are probably right given who their QB's are and how they are used.
You make a fair point on the D end, but there's little doubt that a straight sum of PFF rankings overrates your offense. There's just no way your OL would make up for who you have throwing the ball back there.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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I just looked at my team and my offensive line is -28 total.  Sam Bradford is going to get killed.  Oh wait...
 
On the bright side, my defense is +41 total and that's without Von Miller.
 

SMU_Sox

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No, but a shitty QB with a lot of time in the pocket can still be not negative enough to cost you games. See Sanchez in 2009-2010. No doubt our QB will stink. But that O-Line and our RB's might give us favorable matchups with our WR's. Let's not forget we have Dwayne Bowe and Greg Jennings - that's not too shabby as a 1, 2. We're a bottom 1/3rd offense. But with that O-Line and these 2 RB's we're not dead last. A good O-Line can do wonders for shitty QB's and good RB's.
 
Edit: just want to bold that I am conceding that we're bottom 3rd. It's just that our skilled positions are at least average and our O-Line is beastly. You can have an offense that works with that. It won't be good, but it won't be dead last.
 

SeoulSoxFan

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Also here is a fun exercise, just in terms of pure points, which teams are most like our RF squads? As SMU comments above, in real life there'll be a thousand other factors that make this not much more than a fun exercise, but it's still amusing to compare.
 
For offense, we track the PFF rating of the closest team above & below, and takes the average win/loss record:
 
[tablegrid= Offensive Conterparts ]Team TOTAL Team 1 PFF Team 2 PFF Avg. Win Avg. Loss Seoul Steelers (SSF) 3.8 49ers 9.8 Patriots 2.7 5.0 2.0 Austin Browns (KFP) 1.8 Patriots 2.7 Rams -2.1 4.0 3.0 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) -0.4 Patriots 2.7 Rams -2.1 4.0 3.0 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -5.9 Dolphins -4.9 Vikings -7.2 2.5 4.5 [/tablegrid]
 
When the win/loss total did not equal 7 games, I've added 0.5 until numbers normalized (not exactly scientific but all Asians aren't math geniuses). And for defensive counterparts:
 
[tablegrid= Defensive Conterparts ]Team TOTAL Team 1 PFF Team 2 PFF Avg. Win Avg. Loss Austin Browns (KFP) 33.3 Colts 36.5 Bengals 30.3 5.0 2.0 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) 9.5 Browns 12.4 Giants 8.4 2.0 5.0 Seoul Steelers (SSF) -8.4 Cardinals -2.1 Packers -7.9 3.5 3.5 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -10.7 Packers -7.9 Steelers -11.3 3.0 4.0 [/tablegrid]
 
What's interesting is that the offensive numbers turned out as expected -- better the offense, better the win/loss record. On the defensive side however, the Bengals sport a 2-5 record despite having the 3rd best O numbers and 2nd best D numbers. 
 

SeoulSoxFan

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So here's the almost mid-season AFCN "Standings", including the real life counterpart win/loss records (ST play aren't factored in the w/l columns):
 
[tablegrid= AFCN Standing Inc. RL Avg W/L ]Team Offense Defense ST Total PBS PBL Avg Win Avg Loss Austin Browns (KFP) 1.8 33.3 2.4 37.5 - - 5.00 2.00 Bengal Bay Bengals (SF121) -0.4 9.5 1.2 10.3 -27.2 -27.2 2.75 4.25 Seoul Steelers (SSF) 3.8 -8.4 2.0 -2.6 -12.9 -40.1 3.75 3.25 Cleveland Ravens (SN) -5.9 -10.7 2.0 -14.6 -12.0 -52.1 3.00 4.00 [/tablegrid]
 
It's pretty much neck-and-neck after the Browns. Wait, this looks like a lot like how the AFCE is playing out with the Pats having a decent lead and the rest of the teams slugging it out. 
 

Phragle

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What does the total look like if you multiply the QB rating by 20?
 
I ask because I find this all quite useless unless there is a heavy positional value multiplier for the QB.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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What does the total look like if you multiply the QB rating by 20?
 
I ask because I find this all quite useless unless there is a heavy positional value multiplier for the QB.


Good thing nobody cares what you think.
 

SeoulSoxFan

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phragle said:
What does the total look like if you multiply the QB rating by 20?
 
I ask because I find this all quite useless unless there is a heavy positional value multiplier for the QB.
 
Since we have the base numbers with separate numbers for each "unit", I can run a few variations where we can factor in multipliers for QB. 
 
Oh, and what KFP said ;)
 

Phragle

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
Good thing nobody cares what you think.
 
A Gabbert/Wilson QB tandem is probably the worst in NFL history.  You have at best a 4 or 5 win team, with none in the division.  If the PFF rating doesn't reflect that then it's useless.
 
Maybe you could put together a trade for Tim Tebow if your dead-set on competing this year.
 

Super Nomario

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phragle said:
What does the total look like if you multiply the QB rating by 20?
 
I ask because I find this all quite useless unless there is a heavy positional value multiplier for the QB.
20 is obviously an exaggeration, but I wonder what the "real" multiplier should be. Gut instinct says 3 or 4.
 
 
Kenny F'ing Powers said:
No mention of Fitzpatrick?
LOL
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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LOL


Yuck it up. PFF likes him better than a few QBs taken pretty early in our draft...

I wonder what QBs are on that list...
 

Super Nomario

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
Yuck it up. PFF likes him better than a few QBs taken pretty early in our draft...

I wonder what QBs are on that list...
PFF doesn't like him; he just hasn't had enough opportunities to be awful this year. In 147 snaps, Fitzpatrick's put up a -4.9. Pro-rate that to the 450 or so snaps a starting QB has, and Fitz has like a -15, which would be worst in the league by a significant margin. Last year, he was -18.6, 35th in the league. He sucks.
 

soxfan121

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
Yuck it up. PFF likes him better than a few QBs taken pretty early in our draft...
 
What are things said by Buddy Nix, Alex?
 
Fall into the Ed Hillel fallacy* and overrate Ryan Fitzpatrick based on very small sample size if you want to but it does negate your ability to tool on others for being completely clueless. 
 
*Still maybe my favorite BBTL post was when Ed tried to justify ranking Ryan Fitzpatrick as a top 15 QB in the NFL because "he just signed an expensive extension". 
 
Oh, and thanks to SSF for putting all of this together. Very interesting stuff. I suppose a "SoSH adjustment" for Brady should be debated...clearly, he has better weapons in the RFP and maybe the same quality OL...is he a (-) player in the RFP...I mean, if we're adjusting and making arguments about whether our RFP teams improve or hinder the real life results.
 
And yeah, losing Gio Bernard AND Marcel Reece in the division still hurts. 
 

Phragle

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
No mention of Fitzpatrick?
 
I don't know what you're talking about, and I don't care.
 
Super Nomario said:
20 is obviously an exaggeration, but I wonder what the "real" multiplier should be. Gut instinct says 3 or 4.
 
20 is not an exaggeration.  A QB is everything to an offense.  It's why Brandon Weeden was a first round pick, a one armed Manning got 96 million, Carson Palmer was traded for - twice, and Flacco wipes his tears with 121 million separate 1 dollar bills.
 

Super Nomario

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phragle said:
 
 
20 is not an exaggeration.  A QB is everything to an offense.  It's why Brandon Weeden was a first round pick, a one armed Manning got 96 million, Carson Palmer was traded for - twice, and Flacco wipes his tears with 121 separate 1 dollar bills.
At 20 though, you're basically saying the QB is as important as the rest of the offense and the entire defense combined (since there are 21 other starters). That seems way too high.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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PFF doesn't like him; he just hasn't had enough opportunities to be awful this year. In 147 snaps, Fitzpatrick's put up a -4.9. Pro-rate that to the 450 or so snaps a starting QB has, and Fitz has like a -15, which would be worst in the league by a significant margin. Last year, he was -18.6, 35th in the league. He sucks.


Meh, lets have some perspective. He had a -4.9 against the best defense in the league (Seattle) and broke even (0.0) in his other two starts. I think extrapolating his worst game into a full season of work is disingenuous at best.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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And, by the way, he also has faced what could be 3 of the top 5 defenses in the NFL with Seattle, KC, and the NYJ. He really hasn't been that vad this year.
 

Super Nomario

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
Meh, lets have some perspective. He had a -4.9 against the best defense in the league (Seattle) and broke even (0.0) in his other two starts. I think extrapolating his worst game into a full season of work is disingenuous at best.
My point is that PFF doesn't "like him" as you said; on a rate basis, they rate him as awful.
 
As for extrapolation, I agree it's unfair, but in Fitzpatrick's case we have a larger body of work where we can say with confidence that he stinks.
 
Kenny F'ing Powers said:
And, by the way, he also has faced what could be 3 of the top 5 defenses in the NFL with Seattle, KC, and the NYJ. He really hasn't been that vad this year.
I guess 52% completion and a 2/4 TD / INT ratio isn't that bad compared to Tyler Wilson and Blaine Gabbert. :)
 

Phragle

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Super Nomario said:
At 20 though, you're basically saying the QB is as important as the rest of the offense and the entire defense combined (since there are 21 other starters). That seems way too high.
 
It's at least as important as the rest of the offense.  So at least 10.
 
I think something like this would be ideal
 
QB: 10-15
O line and D line: 2
The rest of the offense and defense: 1
Kicker and punter: 0.2
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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I guess 52% completion and a 2/4 TD / INT ratio isn't that bad compared to Tyler Wilson and Blaine Gabbert. :)


Now we're cooking!
 

Super Nomario

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phragle said:
 
It's at least as important as the rest of the offense.  So at least 10.
 
I think something like this would be ideal
 
QB: 10-15
O line and D line: 2
The rest of the offense and defense: 1
Kicker and punter: 0.2
When you say "2" for O-line and D-line, do you mean 2 individually or collectively? What about 1 for rest of?
 

Phragle

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Super Nomario said:
When you say "2" for O-line and D-line, do you mean 2 individually or collectively? What about 1 for rest of?
 
You'd multiply each (e.g) guard's score by 2, each (e.g) CB's by 1.  Or 0, same difference.
 
The multiplier for the O and D linemen is because they have a big effect on both the run and the pass, unlike say a CB or WR.  
 

SMU_Sox

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Pff doesn't adjust for opponents strength. Football Outsiders does. Ryan Fitzpatrick is 26th in DVOA. That's about right. A bottom tier starter but not a guy who can't play at all.
 

Eck'sSneakyCheese

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Thanks for putting in the time SSF to show the rankings of your division. I can honestly say I take PFF's rankings with a grain of salt, and while it's interesting to see how it plays out with those numbers they don't really cover what these teams would do surrounded by the talent they have in our league. It's going to be very difficult to accurately predict what our RFP teams would do in our environment.
 

soxfan121

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Eck'sSneakyCheese said:
They've finally unleashed the Foles! The AFC East is mine.
Eck'sSneakyCheese said:
Second week for Foles and another great performance. Dare I say I have the best QB in the AFC EAST?
 
How's that workin out for ya, smokescreen?
 

Super Nomario

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phragle said:
 
You'd multiply each (e.g) guard's score by 2, each (e.g) CB's by 1.  Or 0, same difference.
 
The multiplier for the O and D linemen is because they have a big effect on both the run and the pass, unlike say a CB or WR.  
I disagree with your weightings, but just to be clear, you're not really saying a QB is 10 times the value of a typical player if you're saying half the other offensive starters are twice the value of a typical player and the rest are the value of a typical player. You have a total of 25 weight on offense and 15 weight on defense, so a QB ends up being about 5-7 times that of a typical other starter.
 

Phragle

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Super Nomario said:
I disagree with your weightings, but just to be clear, you're not really saying a QB is 10 times the value of a typical player if you're saying half the other offensive starters are twice the value of a typical player and the rest are the value of a typical player. You have a total of 25 weight on offense and 15 weight on defense, so a QB ends up being about 5-7 times that of a typical other starter.
 
Well I did say 10-15.  If it's 15 then it works.  With my weightings the average player other than the QB is worth 1.43.
 

Super Nomario

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Monster game for Kaepernick on Sunday (QBR rates him at 99.8, the highest rating in 3 years) and suddenly his overall numbers aren't dissimilar from last year (in 198 passing attempts vs 2012's 218). His completion percentage is down (57.1% from 62.4%), but his Y/C is 14.0, second in the league, so his Y/A is 8.0, 7th in the league and just off last season's league-leading 8.3. He's not running quite as much or as effectively as last year's 63 carries at 6.6 YPC, but at 49 at 6.0, he's still making plays with his legs. No word on if he's added any more tattoos yet this season.
 

soxfan121

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Eck'sSneakyCheese said:
 
Well, if we're taking DVOA into account, even though Foles played a couple games he ranks 6th. Where's Brady?
 
Taking snaps every Sunday. 
 
Congrats on pinpointing why stats arguments with unequal sample sizes are complete horseshit.
 

SMU_Sox

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In this case I agree with you 121, but let's not forget that FO uses those SSS stats as a "hey this guy might be really good - try playing him more". And in a lot of cases they find gems. Miles Austin was one of those guys. Now in this case I think Foles has potential but is a long way off (and he's out now anyway).
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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This thread - and this exercise in general - makes me realize how many crusty, crabby, stubborn, cry baby bitches frequent this forum.
 
You're all what makes BbtL home. Thank you.
 

soxfan121

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SMU_Sox said:
In this case I agree with you 121, but let's not forget that FO uses those SSS stats as a "hey this guy might be really good - try playing him more". And in a lot of cases they find gems. Miles Austin was one of those guys. Now in this case I think Foles has potential but is a long way off (and he's out now anyway).
 
That's reasonable but it doesn't fit my shittalking agenda so I'm going to ignore it. 
 
SMOKESCREEN!
 

soxfan121

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Eck'sSneakyCheese said:
 
It haunts your dreams. Doesn't it.
 
It does not. It tickles my funny bone. (and if this were RMPS, here's where there'd be a joke about your mom, but since this BBTL and we're classier than that, I'll just leave it here)
 

Eck'sSneakyCheese

Member
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May 11, 2011
9,952
NH
soxfan121 said:
 
It does not. It tickles my funny bone. (and if this were RMPS, here's where there'd be a joke about your mom, but since this BBTL and we're classier than that, I'll just leave it here)
 
Tickles your funny bone? Then an attempted mom joke? Weak. Real weak. You should have phragle write your jokes.
 

soxfan121

JAG
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SoSH Member
Dec 22, 2002
23,043
Eck'sSneakyCheese said:
 
Tickles your funny bone? Then an attempted mom joke? Weak. Real weak. You should have phragle write your jokes.
 
You know what? I'm doing it here too.