NBA Draft Night, June 22, Live Thread

Cellar-Door

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So one thing, today I was looking at trade options for guys who might be attainable via a Grant S&T... and my first thought was... wow, we have no 2nds to trade, so this either has to be a 1st or nothing. Getting 2nds is key for those deals, like Monte Morris, or Delon Wright or Caruso, Kyle Anderson, etc. those type of wings or guards in the range we could get for a S&T or Grant... not worth a 1st, but a couple 2nds... maybe.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Just one, I think.
I don’t think I like that. They traded 38 and 39 for 2 future second round picks. 38 and 39 are in the top third of the second round. Do we even know if the future second rounders will be that high? They probably won’t. I guess NBA is different in that maybe you are ok swapping for future picks of comparable value, but 38 and 39 are not just any seconds — they were somewhat high seconds.
 

Cellar-Door

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Semi was much older and therefore much closer to a finished product when he was drafted (he turned 23 about six months after the draft). Walsh just turned 19. There's plenty of time.
Also Semi played 284 regular season and 38 playoff games, all for playoff caliber teams, he was a great result for the 37th pick
 

Ale Xander

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I don’t think I like that. They traded 38 and 39 for 2 future second round picks. 38 and 39 are in the top third of the second round. Do we even know if the future second rounders will be that high? They probably won’t. I guess NBA is different in that maybe you are ok swapping for future picks of comparable value, but 38 and 39 are not just any seconds — they were high seconds.
Plus next year will be more shallow
 

Mystic Merlin

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I don’t think I like that. They traded 38 and 39 for 2 future second round picks. 38 and 39 are in the top third of the second round. Do we even know if the future second rounders will be that high? They probably won’t. I guess NBA is different in that maybe you are ok swapping for future picks of comparable value, but 38 and 39 are not just any seconds — they were high seconds.
They used 38 to pick Walsh.
 

OurF'ingCity

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So was not drafting a 1 tonight a purely financial move to keep them out of some tax penalty and keeping them eligible for MLE add ons?
That and they truly had almost no second-round picks going forward and this solves that issue. As CD points out above seconds can be valuable in facilitating sign-and-trades and the like.
 

billy ashley

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So was not drafting a 1 tonight a purely financial move to keep them out of some tax penalty and keeping them eligible for MLE add ons?

I don't think that's the rationale. I think more likely, they liked someone they thought would be available at 25, missed out and traded down to accumulate future 2nd round picks (which have more value under the new CBA).

They still have moves to make which will impact their tax status, etc.
 

pjheff

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Just watched some Walsh videos and, even though he shoots a low percentage, he has pretty clean mechanics
He was on my short list for #35 as one-and-done McDonald’s All-American possessing athletic tools you can’t teach and lacking basketball skills you can.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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They used 38 to pick Walsh.
I don’t have a great head for this. So at one point they had 34 and 39, which they turned into Walsh at 38 and a future second. I think I would have rather they picked at 34 and at 39 — probably Walsh anyway though you can’t assume it. I am skeptical the future 2d will be as good as a 34. Maybe it will. But jeez — a 34 and 39 gives you two lottery tickets to get better right now.
 

slamminsammya

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I don’t have a great head for this. So at one point they had 34 and 39, which they turned into Walsh at 38. I think I would have rather they picked at 34 and at 39 — probably Walsh anyway though you can’t assume it. I am skeptical the future 2d will be as good as a 34. Maybe it will. But jeez — a 34 and 39 gives you two lottery tickets to get better right now.
If you collect a bunch of second rounders that let you trade for someone who will definitely make you better right now then they are more valuable than lottery tickets.
 

DavidTai

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I don’t have a great head for this. So at one point they had 34 and 39, which they turned into Walsh at 38 and a future second. I think I would have rather they picked at 34 and at 39 — probably Walsh anyway though you can’t assume it. I am skeptical the future 2d will be as good as a 34. Maybe it will. But jeez — a 34 and 39 gives you two lottery tickets to get better right now.
My understanding from most is that the minute those second round picks are made, they tend to have little value for anything. But they're used as ballast for trades, and Boston just was lacking that for future trades. They're more useful as material for trades that can improve the team. Better they be used to get actual players, than lottery tickets.
 

Cellar-Door

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I don’t have a great head for this. So at one point they had 34 and 39, which they turned into Walsh at 38 and a future second. I think I would have rather they picked at 34 and at 39 — probably Walsh anyway though you can’t assume it. I am skeptical the future 2d will be as good as a 34. Maybe it will. But jeez — a 34 and 39 gives you two lottery tickets to get better right now.
So they turned 34 and 39 into Walsh and 2 future 2nds.

You aren't going to roster them both is part of it, also you can trade the 2nds much easier (and for more value) than a guy you pick.

Also, 2nd round is such a crapshoot, for example people in this thread were calling for TJD at 31.... it's looking like he's going to go undrafted (7 picks left).

Edit- forgot how many picks were in the 2nd round lol
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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If you collect a bunch of second rounders that let you trade for someone who will definitely make you better right now then they are more valuable than lottery tickets.
Sure, but they already had accumulated three. It’s basically giving up 34 for one more. I guess we will see what they do with all those picks.

Edit — thanks everyone. I think I get it better now.

Edit 2 — though note the finals MVP was a 41. :0)
 

greek_gawd_of_walks

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The final four MOP is probably about to go undrafted. Almost a completely different sport at times. Hard to figure.
Russillo was gushing about sanogo at the draft combine. He has value. He's strong as a bull. His shot isn't beautiful, but it started going in more as the season went on. If he can be a pick and pop guy, his rebounding and positional post defense will play.

He's floorbound, but I could definitely see him carving out a spot. Wished he went back to Storrs though. He's a perfect college big.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Russillo was gushing about sanogo at the draft combine. He has value. He's strong as a bull. His shot isn't beautiful, but it started going in more as the season went on. If he can be a pick and pop guy, his rebounding and positional post defense will play.

He's floorbound, but I could definitely see him carving out a spot. Wished he went back to Storrs though. He's a perfect college big.
I kind of thought he would be good for Phoenix. But they don’t have a late pick.
 

nighthob

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The Thunder ended up with Keyontae Johnson, who might be this year's Lou Dort. I would have liked seeing him rough people up here in Boston.
 

nighthob

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A couple of guys that I looked at as bench scorers pre-draft are still out there, Landers Nolley II and Ricky Council IV.
 

djbayko

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I like gambling. But if you are gambling on draft picks, get some help.
Seriously? Why would you say this? NBA and NFL draft are where I make a lot of my profits year after year.

I always get a kick of out it when people try to say "My preferred method of betting is fine, and yours degenerate." It's all in the eye of the beholder, and really, almost all of it's the same.
 

Jimbodandy

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Seriously? Why would you say this? NBA and NFL draft are where I make a lot of my profits year after year.

I always get a kick of out it when people try to say "My preferred method of betting is fine, and yours degenerate." It's all in the eye of the beholder, and really, almost all of it's the same.
You're right. It's all degenerate.
 

benhogan

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He was on my short list for #35 as one-and-done McDonald’s All-American possessing athletic tools you can’t teach and lacking basketball skills you can.
Walsh will slide into 1 of the 3 two-ways.

After a year in Maine a high-motor, defensive player might be usable from the deep bench over the course of a long regular season.

I don't think that's the rationale. I think more likely, they liked someone they thought would be available at 25, missed out and traded down to accumulate future 2nd round picks (which have more value under the new CBA).

They still have moves to make which will impact their tax status, etc.
Pritchard was the last time Boston drafted a 1st. I doubt they use the Golden State pick for the draft. That pick & all the seconds Brad collected tonight are trade fodder for NBA players. Tonight was the 4th time (5th if you count the SA swap) Brad has moved a 1st Round pick over the last 24 months (he's also traded ~10 2nds in that time span). Not sure you need any more evidence than that.
 

BigMike

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Essentially high-spending teams will be more limited in terms of signing free agents, so draft picks will become more valuable as a way for those teams to build out their rosters.
This is true. The new CBA also made some changes that make signing second round picks easier, and also changes I guess that make it easier to keep them if you get lucky and they are good
 

BaseballJones

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If you look at the ESPN draft tracker - even now, the day after the draft - and you click on "teams" to see who your favorite team got, here's who they have for the Celtics:

Julian Phillips, Tennessee (with the 5th pick of the 2nd round)

So I woke up, read who this guy is, and thought, oh man what a terrible pick. Then I came here and followed all the shenanigans and realized that that's not at all who Boston ended up with.

So can ANYONE here tell me why the NBA does it this way? If Boston trades the #25 pick for the #38 and #39, for example, why not just change in the actual draft who is picking, like everyone else does? Instead of having the team who had the original pick make the pick and then trade it (i.e., Boston picking for some other team at #25), just change the logo to reflect who actually has that pick?

It's insane that right now, the next day, I'm seeing a guy picked for Boston that wasn't picked for Boston.
 

benhogan

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If you look at the ESPN draft tracker - even now, the day after the draft - and you click on "teams" to see who your favorite team got, here's who they have for the Celtics:

Julian Phillips, Tennessee (with the 5th pick of the 2nd round)

So I woke up, read who this guy is, and thought, oh man what a terrible pick. Then I came here and followed all the shenanigans and realized that that's not at all who Boston ended up with.

So can ANYONE here tell me why the NBA does it this way? If Boston trades the #25 pick for the #38 and #39, for example, why not just change in the actual draft who is picking, like everyone else does? Instead of having the team who had the original pick make the pick and then trade it (i.e., Boston picking for some other team at #25), just change the logo to reflect who actually has that pick?

It's insane that right now, the next day, I'm seeing a guy picked for Boston that wasn't picked for Boston.
The NBA Draft Night is a laughably poor production. Between the baseball hats, stilted interviews, lack of knowledge from the commentators, Shams/Woj muzzle, lack of trade updates & draft tracking miscues. The league needs to overhaul it.
 

billy ashley

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Walsh will slide into 1 of the 3 two-ways.

After a year in Maine a high-motor, defensive player might be usable from the deep bench over the course of a long regular season.


Pritchard was the last time Boston drafted a 1st. I doubt they use the Golden State pick for the draft. That pick & all the seconds Brad collected tonight are trade fodder for NBA players. Tonight was the 4th time (5th if you count the SA swap) Brad has moved a 1st Round pick over the last 24 months (he's also traded ~10 2nds in that time span). Not sure you need any more evidence than that.


I think the new CBA is going to break that pattern. They're going to need some dirt cheap rotation players to offset paying for the Jays.
 

cheech13

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If you look at the ESPN draft tracker - even now, the day after the draft - and you click on "teams" to see who your favorite team got, here's who they have for the Celtics:

Julian Phillips, Tennessee (with the 5th pick of the 2nd round)

So I woke up, read who this guy is, and thought, oh man what a terrible pick. Then I came here and followed all the shenanigans and realized that that's not at all who Boston ended up with.

So can ANYONE here tell me why the NBA does it this way? If Boston trades the #25 pick for the #38 and #39, for example, why not just change in the actual draft who is picking, like everyone else does? Instead of having the team who had the original pick make the pick and then trade it (i.e., Boston picking for some other team at #25), just change the logo to reflect who actually has that pick?

It's insane that right now, the next day, I'm seeing a guy picked for Boston that wasn't picked for Boston.
As I mentioned earlier in the thread the issue is that while teams may have “agreed” to a trade it actually hasn’t been finalized, typically due to timing and salary cap reasons, and in many cases the trade itself won’t actually be completed until after the start of the new league year in July. They’ve looked into ways to fix this but there is no clear cut alternative that wouldn’t also introduce its own set of problems.
 

Bleedred

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Does anyone have a link to a good primer on the new CBA that highlights all of the material changes and how it affects the teams? I've read that it discourages "super teams" and places higher values on 2nd round picks. I roughly understand why, but would love to read something that people think is really on point.
 

benhogan

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I think the new CBA is going to break that pattern. They're going to need some dirt cheap rotation players to offset paying for the Jays.
Brad even joked in the presser that maybe he'll eventually draft someone in the first round.

2nds (JDD, Walsh), UDFAs (Hauser), & young washouts (Kornet, Kabengele, Champagnie) will primarily be the back of the roster/ two-ways going forward.

Late 1sts have more trade value in Brad's hands. Drafting and developing a 19-20yr old (at the end of the first round) that would get guaranteed money & want PT is not nearly as attractive, especially with the new CBA/JAYs super max.