Weren't a few of those picks on tipped balls?He had 7 TDs to 5 INTs in SF. He looks like he's going to be very good, but I think people are overstating his accomplishments a bit.
They certainly overpaid on those accomplishments. They have the money, though, but it's still way too much for such an unproven player.He had 7 TDs to 5 INTs in SF. He looks like he's going to be very good, but I think people are overstating his accomplishments a bit.
This is awesome. When Flacco was completely overpaid for a historic run to the Super Bowl, it was widely ridiculed. Rightfully so.Jimmy got paid a lot and he doesn't have an extensive track record. But I doubt that many Niners fans are going to be anything but thrilled that their team signed this guy to a 5-year deal. Given all their cap room and the potential Jimmy has shown, I'd be extremely pleased if I rooted for that team.
I do like the fact that Tom's annual number is materially lower that he thereby facilitates BB being able to spread the money around the roster and a deeper roster. But even with the very small sample, Jimmy looks like the real deal to me and I'd suffer some loss of flexibility to lock him up.
It would have been nice if there had been a sensible way to keep him in NE but I'm one Pats fan who will not find his success, assuming he has it and assuming it is not against the Pats, to be hard to take. Here's to this kid earning every dollar.
Could be. My point being, holy hell Jimmy G is still not a sure thing by any stretch of the imagination. I know scouting would tell the differences, but damn me he could well be a right-handed Scott Mitchell.Weren't a few of those picks on tipped balls?
Fair reaction. But the salary cap is bigger now and SF has a lot of room. Nick Foles aside, it's hard to win in the NFL without an elite QB, and JG looks to have at least that potential. One could say the same about Joe Flacco but that's not how I ever viewed him. Still, I get your point and Jimmy is indeed clearly an inexperienced guy getting a fat check. As a SF fan, I would be fine with my team taking that chance, but I know reasonable minds could differ.This is awesome. When Flacco was completely overpaid for a historic run to the Super Bowl, it was widely ridiculed. Rightfully so.
But Jimmy G gets one of the biggest deals in the history of football despite having a half a season of NFL experience, and it's great?
Didn't Stafford have $92MM of guaranteed money through 3 years?Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter
When 49ers' QB Jimmy Garoppolo's 5-year deal gets finalized shortly, it will include the largest three-year cash total for a new contract in NFL history, just shy of $90 million, per source.
This comparison makes no sense. Bledsoe was hurt and they needed someone to step in and play. Tom Brady just came off an MVP season and had one of the best playoff runs ever. At the halfway point, when the trade was made, he was his usual dominant self. Plus all the salary cap implications.And showed absolutely zero signs that what transpired in SF was a fluke, while the Patriots hope that Brady is the first quarterback in history to be good past 40. Thankfully 2001 Belichick didn't look at Tommy No Quarters and start Huard, or 24 Quarters Brady and go back to Bledsoe.
Hopefully, though, Brady can have a few age-defying seasons while that 2nd round pick develops.
Remember when everyone here made fun of Colts fans for suddenly becoming Broncos fans when Manning switched teams?This is awesome. When Flacco was completely overpaid for a historic run to the Super Bowl, it was widely ridiculed. Rightfully so.
But Jimmy G gets one of the biggest deals in the history of football despite having a half a season of NFL experience, and it's great?
You mean like the MVP season he just had and the insanely great super bowl? Jimmy is absolutely no lock and Brady is and has been his own standard.And showed absolutely zero signs that what transpired in SF was a fluke, while the Patriots hope that Brady is the first quarterback in history to be good past 40. Thankfully 2001 Belichick didn't look at Tommy No Quarters and start Huard, or 24 Quarters Brady and go back to Bledsoe.
Hopefully, though, Brady can have a few age-defying seasons while that 2nd round pick develops.
Huge amount of risk, I totally agree. However, I'm a bigger fan of taking this risk compared to Darnold, Rosen or Allen. None of those guys really jump out at me the way that Luck did and I think there's a good chance JG ends up being better than them. The young kids would cost less, but I feel like you're stuck with them for about the same amount of time due to the draft pick investment.Could be. My point being, holy hell Jimmy G is still not a sure thing by any stretch of the imagination. I know scouting would tell the differences, but damn me he could well be a right-handed Scott Mitchell.
The team did look dramatically different with him at the helm, and that's a major point in his favor and it's real, just as it was for Brady in 2001. But to me this deal looks like there's a decent amount of risk involved.
How much did JG jump out at you? Predraft, that is.Huge amount of risk, I totally agree. However, I'm a bigger fan of taking this risk compared to Darnold, Rosen or Allen. None of those guys really jump out at me the way that Luck did and I think there's a good chance JG ends up being better than them. The young kids would cost less, but I feel like you're stuck with them for about the same amount of time due to the draft pick investment.
Meh, Boston fans did it first when Bourque was traded to Colorado. We have no leg to stand on.Remember when everyone here made fun of Colts fans for suddenly becoming Broncos fans when Manning switched teams?
It's almost like some folks here are staging their exit in 2 years by hitching their wagon to Jimmy G.
Sure, it was a good risk on their part, no doubt about it, and it still is exactly that, but that doesn’t mean it was some God-awful worst ever trade because the Pats chose to keep Tom Brady, who’s proven GOAT and still playing like a major boss.I'm sure the second the Pats agreed to the deal they were high fiveing in Santa Clara. Teams take stabs at unproven college QBs in the first round every year. They got a potential franchise QB for a second round pick. Good for them.
And that was fucking awful. I hated that shit.Meh, Boston fans did it first when Bourque was traded to Colorado. We have no leg to stand on.
Edit: Fuck, he even got a parade in Government Center.
And $75M in guaranteed money against the cap over 5 years.I'm sure the second the Pats agreed to the deal they were high fiveing in Santa Clara. Teams take stabs at unproven college QBs in the first round every year. They got a potential franchise QB for a second round pick. Good for them.
Fair point! That's why I trust Belichick (and Lynch) way more than myself haha. I would have talked myself into one of the kids too.How much did JG jump out at you? Predraft, that is.
I believe it was a rally, my good man, not a parade.Meh, Boston fans did it first when Bourque was traded to Colorado. We have no leg to stand on.
Edit: Fuck, he even got a parade in Government Center.
If he turns into a hall of famer, sure.People are going to be really pissed if JG succeeds, aren’t they?
Nick Foles, Blake Bortles, and Case Keenum started championship games this season. Granted, Bortles and Keenum didn't win the Super Bowl, but it's not like you can't have success without paying a QB 30 million dollars a year.Fair reaction. But the salary cap is bigger now and SF has a lot of room. Nick Foles aside, it's hard to win in the NFL without an elite QB, and JG looks to have at least that potential. One could say the same about Joe Flacco but that's not how I ever viewed him. Still, I get your point and Jimmy is indeed clearly an inexperienced guy getting a fat check. As a SF fan, I would be fine with my team taking that chance, but I know reasonable minds could differ.
San Francisco was surprisingly competitive in a lot of games even before JG took over. He obviously helped turn close losses into wins, but in their first 6 losses, they had a lot of 2 or 3 point shortcomings against solid teams like the Seahawks, Rams and Redskins.It shows you how a franchise QB can quickly turn an organization around. I don't yet know if JG IS a franchise QB, but so far he looks every bit the part (SSS, I know). They have a ton of money still, and obviously ended the season playing well. I can see why Vegas is high on SF for 2018.
Personally, I'm gonna root hard for him and that team. I'd love to see Brady and JG be the top 2 QBs in the NFL for the next few years.
Correct.Everyone looking at this as an overpay -- and it might be -- needs to realize this is also the reason NE only got a 2nd rounder for him. He was a free agent and was getting paid this offseason no matter what. He just upped his rate by winning every game he played, most of which were in dramatic fashion.
Only one of them was. But that was evened out by a ball he threw into double coverage that his receiver straight up stole.Weren't a few of those picks on tipped balls?
This is a great point. They really could have won that first Rams game.San Francisco was surprisingly competitive in a lot of games even before JG took over. He obviously helped turn close losses into wins, but in their first 6 losses, they had a lot of 2 or 3 point shortcomings against solid teams like the Seahawks, Rams and Redskins.
The parameters of this deal help to explain to the variety of "casual Pats fans" - I met a handful at the superbowl party I went to, living here in SF - the financial reality of why they couldn't keep JG and TB. (As soon as you talk about franchise tags and salary caps, their eyes would glaze over anyway...)I still don’t get how any Pats fan could have wanted Jimmy over Brady or thought both could have been kept (especially after seeing this deal).
I've said for a while now that one of the biggest reasons for the Patriots' long-term success is Tom Brady. Not just Tom Brady the player, but Tom Brady the contract. He is worth far more than what his contract actually pays him. According to this: https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/01/highest-paid-quarterbacks-in-the-nfl.html ... Brady is the 15th highest paid QB in the league over the 2017-2018 seasons. Ahead of him:Nick Foles, Blake Bortles, and Case Keenum started championship games this season. Granted, Bortles and Keenum didn't win the Super Bowl, but it's not like you can't have success without paying a QB 30 million dollars a year.
I live in SF too so I know what you are talking about.The parameters of this deal help to explain to the variety of "casual Pats fans" - I met a handful at the superbowl party I went to, living here in SF - the financial reality of why they couldn't keep JG and TB. (As soon as you talk about franchise tags and salary caps, their eyes would glaze over anyway...)
True dat. Odds equal to or very close to the Falcons, Panthers, Cowboys, Texans, Jaguars, Rams, Saints and Seahawks. FWIW this site.It shows you how a franchise QB can quickly turn an organization around. I don't yet know if JG IS a franchise QB, but so far he looks every bit the part (SSS, I know). They have a ton of money still, and obviously ended the season playing well. I can see why Vegas is high on SF for 2018.
Personally, I'm gonna root hard for him and that team. I'd love to see Brady and JG be the top 2 QBs in the NFL for the next few years.
Absolutely. And the flip side to this is when teams pay guys like Stafford or Flacco. They are decent or good QBs, (sometimes great) no doubt, but they aren't worth the money and it ultimately hurts the entire team because they are completely overpaid for their talent level.I've said for a while now that one of the biggest reasons for the Patriots' long-term success is Tom Brady. Not just Tom Brady the player, but Tom Brady the contract. He is worth far more than what his contract actually pays him. According to this: https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/01/highest-paid-quarterbacks-in-the-nfl.html ... Brady is the 15th highest paid QB in the league over the 2017-2018 seasons. Ahead of him:
Rank. Name (Avg 2-year salary)
1. Stafford ($27m)
2. DCarr ($25m)
3. Luck ($24.6m)
4. Palmer ($24.4m)
5. Brees ($24.3m)
6. Cousins ($23.9m)
7. Flacco ($22.1m)
8. Rodgers ($22.0m)
9. Wilson ($21.9m)
10. Roethlisberger ($21.9m)
11. Eli ($21.0m)
12. Rivers ($20.8m)
13. Newton ($20.8m)
14. Ryan ($20.8m)
15. Brady ($20.5m)
So let's not say Brady needs to be #1. Let's say he ought to be, I dunno, at the $24m range - between Brees and Cousins. That $3.5 million they save on Brady is more than the Patriots pay Andrews ($3m/yr), Chung ($2.7m/yr), Brown ($1.9m), Develin ($1.2m), Rowe ($1.2m), Thuney ($800k), T Flowers ($709k/yr), etc. The point is that the money they save on Brady being below market can be used to bolster the roster elsewhere. Over the years, that's added up to a lot of talent they've been able to keep instead of lose because of a higher Brady salary.
True. And no one has made that argument.Nick Foles, Blake Bortles, and Case Keenum started championship games this season. Granted, Bortles and Keenum didn't win the Super Bowl, but it's not like you can't have success without paying a QB 30 million dollars a year.
Very true - thanks for that. The JG contract makes that accomplishment semi-permanent - I.e., JG is in the NFC for likely the rest of Brady's career.5. They accomplished a major objective — dealing him out of the AFC, for the foreseeable future. The Pats clearly thought very highly of JG. That judgment has been confirmed by the 49ers. I don’t want him in the AFC East, Denver or Jax.
1. Well, they could have cut Brady loose after this season and made JG the starter. Ya, a ridiculous notion, but a few years from now we may look back and say that would have been the right thing to do.The JG contract should be fantastic news for the Patriots brain trust (and us):
I look forward to seeing the 49ers in the SB in Feb 2020 as TB goes for #6 or even better #7 as his grand finale.
- Vindicates the Pats for trading him - there is no way they could have kept him, as it is clear he was looking for premium starter money - and more importantly for a premium starter role
- Shows that the Patriots did successfully develop a Brady successor - which lends credence to the idea that they can do it again (and it adds to Josh McDaniels legend as a QB whisperer)
- Creates another NFC rival to tire out would be opponents before they get to the SB (though the flip side of that is that NFC defenses will be that much more battle tested)
- Is a counterpoint to the prevailing theory that the Patriots are self interested cheaters. If the Patriots dealt JG to a good home in mid season, and provided he succeeds, it will reflect well on the organisation and potentially add SF to the list of teams that work well with the Patriots. I suspect it is not a coincidence that most of those teams are in the NFC.
1) There would be a fan mutiny. No, they couldn’t1. Well, they could have cut Brady loose after this season and made JG the starter. Ya, a ridiculous notion, but a few years from now we may look back and say that would have been the right thing to do.
2. Just because they developed JG is probably more of a reflection of JG than the Patriots. How many young QBs stuck behind Brady have gone on to great careers?
3. Tire out NFC opponents before they get to the SB? Huh?
4. Trading JG mid-season was nothing more than a franchise trying to figure out the best thing to do with an asset. It does not enhance the Patriots reputation of "self interested cheaters". In fact, many think they were fleeced for a potential franchise QB.
In the scenario 1 above, the Pats would cut Brady after an MVP season and amazing SB performance for a guy that had not even started more than a handful of games?1. Well, they could have cut Brady loose after this season and made JG the starter. Ya, a ridiculous notion, but a few years from now we may look back and say that would have been the right thing to do.
2. Just because they developed JG is probably more of a reflection of JG than the Patriots. How many young QBs stuck behind Brady have gone on to great careers?
3. Tire out NFC opponents before they get to the SB? Huh?
4. Trading JG mid-season was nothing more than a franchise trying to figure out the best thing to do with an asset. It does not enhance the Patriots reputation of "self interested cheaters". In fact, many think they were fleeced for a potential franchise QB.
Not to mention even if you assume that they could have gotten Jimmy to play 2018 at the same cap number as Brady is due, cutting or trading Brady would have cost another $14 million against the cap. So, this move would mean that Jimmy's first year as QB would cost the Patriots their MVP quarterback, and they've be significantly hamstrung in any ability to try to build around their new $100 million (give or take) franchise QB in his first year.In the scenario 1 above, the Pats would cut Brady after an MVP season and amazing SB performance for a guy that had not even started more than a handful of games?
It seems pretty difficult to draft and develop starting QBs, and there are few certainties in the talent pool. But the fact that they seemed to get it right with JG, and that a couple of other teams seem to have done well recently (Eagles / Wentz, Rams / Goff, KC / Mahomes, Texans / Watson) leads to optimism that the Pats can do it again in the next 2-4 years before Brady hangs them up.1) There would be a fan mutiny. No, they couldn’t
2) It doesn’t matter what those QBs do post NE - only what they do with McDaniels. Yes - thanks
3) Yes agreed that is meaningless. Everybody laughed at this point of mine. Re-reading, probably could have left it out for better results.
4) Also meaningless from a public image perspective but may make other GMs slightly more likely to work with the Pats. Exactly what I meant. The Pats really could care less what the non-New England public think of them, it's really whether they have good relationships with other teams (mostly in NFC) that allow them to trade, cooperate on off-season practices, and work with on league matters like rules committees and the like