FA Cup

Kliq

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Lo Celso with his best moment for Spurs so far, a wonderful knifing run up the field, eventually getting it to Lamela who found Son to put Spurs up 1-0.
 

Cellar-Door

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Moyes has made 5 half-time subs in his last 2 matches. Yet Manuel Lanzini who has the accelleration and energy of a 3 week old corpse and the strength on the ball of a gentle breeze has not been among them., Of course Fornals has played 120 minutes of the 270 in the last 3 games despite being our best midfield player. At least Pellegrini failed because he stuck to his system, Moyes is failing because he has no fucking clue what he wants to do or which players are good.
 

Cellar-Door

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And West Ham are out of the cup, couldn't score even after WBA went down to 10 men at 72 minutes. This club is a disaster, and there in no relief coming given the owners are even less likely to sell if relegated.
 

SocrManiac

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Joao Cancelo with one of the most embarrassing injury displays in recent memory... He got caught on the ankle, flopped down and rolled around screaming and gesticulating. City were up 4-0 and already up a man past 90’. He got back to his feet after treatment, then continued to bitch to the ref after the final whistle.
 

fletcherpost

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United are four goals to the good at Tranmere. Ole lives to fight another day. But man, the pitch at Tranmere is a fuckin mess.
 

PedroSpecialK

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Phil Jones in on the act! Who had money riding on Maguire, Dalot, Lingard, Jones getting on the scoresheet?
 

67YAZ

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Indeed. Cooly finished by Jones.

nice to see Minamino in the Firmino role. They’ve never had a true backup for what Firmino does.
 

Dummy Hoy

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United are four goals to the good at Tranmere. Ole lives to fight another day. But man, the pitch at Tranmere is a fuckin mess.
Potato field, that.

Good though...I think the Premier League players should be forced to recognize how good they have it all the time. I read somewhere recently that Arsenal to a plane to Norwich, something like a 15 minute flight. Pool did the same to Sheffield or somewhere else obnoxiously close.

Credit to United for not being distracted by that.
 

PedroSpecialK

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Thankfully the Shrewsbury pitch is an actual pitch. I can't imagine Klopp risking Salah / Firmino on a pitch like Tranmere's
 

SocrManiac

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I wouldn’t have been angry if Fabinho heard the whistle, but it would have been harsh.

Add “slowest guy on the pitch” to my list of complaints against Larouci.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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Quite relieved actually with a replay .. Lovren and Matip looked like they haven’t played since 2016. Lorouci was awful, Fabinho was very rusty .. Pool were dammed lucky to get out with a draw.
 

fletcherpost

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Fair play to Shrewsbury. They'll get a decent payout from a game at Anfield and more TV money.
 

SoxFanInCali

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Since the replay will be during the "winter break", apparently Klopp is going to put a full youth team out.
 

Tuff Ghost

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Not only is Klopp going to play a full-youth team for the replay, but he has said that he is not going to manage it either. That job will be given to U23s coach, Neil Critchley.

The Athletic had an interesting piece that discusses both sides of this decision.

From Klopp's perspective, the team is already overworked and he wanted to give the first team a full winter break to recoup. They are getting 7 days off to be with their family away from the team (and provided with personalized training regimes they should follow during that period). He thinks it is irresponsible of the FA to schedule the replays during this planned time off.

From FA's perspective, they gave everyone advanced notice ahead of time. Teams involved in replays would have 10 days off and others would 13 days off.

From Shrewsbury's perspective, this is great news:
But try selling that idea to the thousands of jubilant Shrewsbury fans who invaded the pitch at the final whistle on Sunday. Their joy was centred around the fact they had secured what for some will be a once in a lifetime chance to watch their team walk out at Anfield.

For the Shrewsbury manager Sam Ricketts, there’s also the financial repercussions of taking Liverpool to a second game. He says the cash will enable them to purchase video analysis equipment and install better drainage for their training pitches. There’s life outside the Premier League bubble.
The article also makes a counter-argument that Liverpool have plenty of players that could actually use the game time to work off some of their rust.
Dejan Lovren, Joel Matip and Fabinho all looked horribly rusty on their return to the starting line up against Shrewsbury after injury lay-offs.

That trio have hardly been overworked this season with Fabinho, who was sidelined for two months, playing 1,033 top-flight minutes. Lovren has clocked up just 670 minutes and Matip 630 minutes. Divock Origi (423 minutes), Adam Lallana (337 minutes), Naby Keita (197 minutes) and Xherdan Shaqiri (175 minutes) have featured to an even lesser degree.
Regardless of where you come out on the argument, the article concludes that the end-result of Liverpool U23s playing this match is not in the best interests of anybody. It's a tough call, Liverpool have bigger concerns this year, but it is too bad that the FA Cup is made to seem less legitimate. Klopp's statement at least makes it more likely that discussions regarding over-scheduling in England will become more prevalent.
It is the biggest snub delivered to the FA Cup since Manchester United opted not to take part back in 1999-2000 so that they could compete in the Club World Championship in Brazil.

Liverpool Under-23s will face Shrewsbury Town for a place in the last 16. No matter where your loyalties lie, that simply can’t be right.
 

SocrManiac

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I'd argue Matip and Lovren looked to be in typical form. They just weren't partnered with Van Dijk. Fabinho looked shockingly mundane, however. Lallana's exclusion after owning the Everton match is the biggest head-scratcher to me.

I agree with Klopp's approach. Take the break, play the kids. Match time for rusty players partnered with guys they won't see outside of training isn't going to help them find their footing in the first team.
 

PedroSpecialK

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Obviously, Liverpool being in good positions in two much more important competitions makes this an easier decision, but fully agreed with Klopp's stance. The FA and PL not being aligned on fixture scheduling is sadly expected.

Kelleher, Williams, Van de Berg, Hoever, Larouci, Chirivella, Jones, Elliott makes 9. They are thin up front with Glatzel injured, Brewster on loan at Swansea, and Duncan having fucked off to Fiorentina to play for their U19s
 

67YAZ

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There’s a small group, including Liverpool, that now see themselves as global super clubs, and they brush aside the romantic nostalgia of historic cup competitions. For the biggest clubs, the FA Cup is at best an emergency back door to European competition or the lesser jewel in a treble. This attitude will only become more common as super-wealthy owners move into the EPL (eg, Saudi sovereign wealth fund) and further de-prioritize cup competitions.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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I think Klopp's stance is pretty lame. The FA makes the rules and everybody lives with them. If Klopp didn't want to play a fixture toward the end of this mini-break, he should have played a stronger team. Given that he has a fixture, it's well within his rights to rest first-team players and deprioritize the competition but to decline to manage the team himself is indefensible.

As far as deprioritizing the FA Cup goes, its Klopp's call but I think a shortsighted one in the big picture. Agree with it or not, winning a treble is a defining feature of most of the greatest ever teams. There is a reason that people talk about United 98-99 as a more impressive season than United 07-08, despite the latter arguably being a better side. And why people think of Barca 08-09 as the defining team of Pep's tenure, not Barca 10-11. Liverpool have a chance to win the treble and should go for it in my view, especially given how far ahead they are in the league. If Klopp is worried about getting players enough rest, he could easily rotate more in league fixtures.
 
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Mighty Joe Young

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I think Klopp's stance is pretty lame. The FA makes the rules and everybody lives with them. If Klopp didn't want to play a fixture toward the end of this mini-break, he should have played a stronger team. Given that he has a fixture, it's well within his rights to rest first-team players and deprioritize the competition but to decline to manage the team himself is indefensible.

As far as deprioritizing the FA Cup goes, its Klopp's call but I think a shortsighted one in the big picture. Agree with it or not, winning a treble is a defining feature of most of the greatest ever teams. There is a reason that people talk about United 98-99 as a more impressive season than United 07-08, despite the latter arguably being a better side. And why people think of Barca 08-09 as the defining team of Pep's tenure, not Barca 10-11. Liverpool have a chance to win the treble and should go for it in my view, especially given how far ahead they are in the league. If Klopp is worried about getting players enough rest, he could easily rotate more in league fixtures.
As for the bolded - The FA doesn't make squat. Liverpool play in the Premier League so they have to obey Premier League rules first and foremost. The Premier League instituted a winter break and told their clubs not to schedule any games for that period. The Winter Break has been one of Klopp's pet projects for years - he finally gets it and he should throw it away for an - at best - third rated competition? All because of its cherished (stupid IMO) replay rule?

That being said a lot of the complaints are lower tier teams complaining that taking away replays costs them money. The PL makes a fortune these days and really should be doing a better job of disseminating their TV riches down the pyramid.

From what I understand there are possible re-scheduing solutions available which may get both sides out of this mess,

Still - I blame Lovren

edit: wasn't trying to be confrontational MMS - but which set of rules should clubs be following? The FA knew about this winter break last summer - and they simply viewed it as an opportunity to schedule replays.

edit#2 I really should have read the upthread posts - @Tuff Ghost gave a nice overview
 
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SoxFanInCali

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If Liverpool do win the replay, they get a trip to Chelsea.

Sheffield Wednesday v Manchester City
Reading/Cardiff v Sheffield United
Chelsea v Shrewsbury/Liverpool
West Brom v Newcastle/Oxford
Leicester v Coventry/Birmingham
Northampton/Derby v Man Utd
Southampton/Tottenham v Norwich
Portsmouth v Bournemouth/Arsenal

A potential Rooney vs Man United game if Derby win their replay.
 

tmracht

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If Liverpool do win the replay, they get a trip to Chelsea.
Whats crazier is the potential windfall for Shrewsbury Town if they managed to beat the Liverpool U23s. If at Liverpool gets them replay technology and drainage improvements, what would at Stamford Bridge in the 5th round get them? Love the Cinderella stories in the FA cup (especially when its me on FM).
 

Dummy Hoy

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There’s a small group, including Liverpool, that now see themselves as global super clubs, and they brush aside the romantic nostalgia of historic cup competitions. For the biggest clubs, the FA Cup is at best an emergency back door to European competition or the lesser jewel in a treble. This attitude will only become more common as super-wealthy owners move into the EPL (eg, Saudi sovereign wealth fund) and further de-prioritize cup competitions.
This is truth here. It’s ugly and selfish, but it’s the way of things these days. I look forward to the closed super euro league so I can ignore the clubs and fans who think they’re bigger than the game.


I wanna see Justin's mob take down Citeh.
Me too. I’ve already sent threatening texts to Ryan.
 

fletcherpost

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Arsenal look quite comfortable with a two goal lead at Bournmouth. I hope the Bournmouth high heid yins don't get trigger happy and fire the manager if their side continue to slump.
 

67YAZ

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This is truth here. It’s ugly and selfish, but it’s the way of things these days. I look forward to the closed super euro league so I can ignore the clubs and fans who think they’re bigger than the game.
I do think the FA Cup could be updated to be more relevant and exciting. First, do away with the league cup and move more matches into the fall. Second, no replays - 90 minutes and then penalties, which should actually increase the number of upsets. Third, weigh the seeding so that EPL teams are more likely to draw each other and more lower pyramid teams get into the later rounds; I think the TV networks would be fine with this since i’d bet an Arsenal-Bournemouth match gets more eyeballs than Liverpool-Shrewsbury. Fourth, give the fourth Champion League’s A slot to the winner. Last, add another substitution (total 4) to allow manager a little more flexibility with their squads.
 

Dummy Hoy

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I do think the FA Cup could be updated to be more relevant and exciting. First, do away with the league cup and move more matches into the fall. Second, no replays - 90 minutes and then penalties, which should actually increase the number of upsets. Third, weigh the seeding so that EPL teams are more likely to draw each other and more lower pyramid teams get into the later rounds; I think the TV networks would be fine with this since i’d bet an Arsenal-Bournemouth match gets more eyeballs than Liverpool-Shrewsbury. Fourth, give the fourth Champion League’s A slot to the winner. Last, add another substitution (total 4) to allow manager a little more flexibility with their squads.
I do think they could update the competition for sure.

I love the replays though. I would limit it to two like a two legged affair though. And I love the idea of the cup winner getting a Champions League slot.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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As for the bolded - The FA doesn't make squat. Liverpool play in the Premier League so they have to obey Premier League rules first and foremost. The Premier League instituted a winter break and told their clubs not to schedule any games for that period. The Winter Break has been one of Klopp's pet projects for years - he finally gets it and he should throw it away for an - at best - third rated competition? All because of its cherished (stupid IMO) replay rule?

That being said a lot of the complaints are lower tier teams complaining that taking away replays costs them money. The PL makes a fortune these days and really should be doing a better job of disseminating their TV riches down the pyramid.

From what I understand there are possible re-scheduing solutions available which may get both sides out of this mess,

Still - I blame Lovren

edit: wasn't trying to be confrontational MMS - but which set of rules should clubs be following? The FA knew about this winter break last summer - and they simply viewed it as an opportunity to schedule replays.

edit#2 I really should have read the upthread posts - @Tuff Ghost gave a nice overview
I'm not sure whether edit2 reflects you realizing this, but the Football Association absolutely makes the rules. It is the governing body for competitive football in England. The Premier League is just one competition they oversee so there is no rules conflict. The FA determined that there would be a winter break for Premier League clubs but that this break would be three days shorter for any club needing to play a replay in this round of the FA Cup. By refusing to manage his side, Jurgen Klopp is just thumbing his nose at the FA and unilaterally declaring that he's not going to abide by the same rules as everybody else. I know Liverpool fans like to think of him as this uber endearing guy but he is absolutely in the wrong here and it makes him look like a shit. Every manager complains about fixture congestion and scheduling but refusing to manage your club because the FA isn't run the way you want is highly unusual, and not in a good way.