Dan Shaughnessy: Taking a dump in your mouth one column at a time

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If Kraft hires Dom Capers instead of Belichick, would anyone say that Parcells turned the franchise around forever? I doubt it. BB's success and championships soften what Parcells did. WIthout BB winning those Super Bowls, Parcells would be remembered with more hate around here.

Remember, in 2000 we weren't still riding some Parcells wave. There were key players around from his tenure, but the Patriots were looked at as one of the worst teams in the league and one of the least likely to have any sustained success at that point.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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Tying Parcells to the 6 titles with anything other than an indirect cord is fantasy.
What are you talking about? I never tied Parcells to the six titles.

But what he did for the franchise is immeasurable and Kraft (assuming it his him who has the final say) should get over it already. He won. He’s been the steward of a team that has seen its national profile explode, not to mention six (and counting) Super Bowl championships.
The "he" in the above statement refers to Kraft.

And I'm not sure how you be a Patriot fan before 1993 and not have some sort of appreciation for what Bill Parcells brought to this franchise. Up until that point he was the best coach the team ever had. Up until that point, he was the only figure that brought badly needed legitimacy to this once clown franchise. If that doesn't get him into some BS tourist trap, I don't know who belongs.
 

ifmanis5

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It's amazing (and somewhat amusing) how spoiled we've become. I guess 6 Lombardis will do that to a franchise. The Pats were dead in the water and one foot out the door when Parcells came in, solidified their reputation and got the team to a Super Bowl. In any other normal-ish football franchise that gets you put into their Ring Of Honor or whatever- like Tony Dungy and the Bucs might be a good comp. Also, it's just a team HOF, basically a glorified gift shop. He's the second most important coach in their history, sure put him in. It's just another t-shirt to sell anyway.
 

TheoShmeo

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I've been a Patriots fan since 1972. I rooted for them even before then but my first real memories were from that season, and I've been with them ever since.

I am fully aware that Bill Parcells was a major contributor to the franchise. I need no history lessons and am indeed grateful for his role in turning the tide, which he most assuredly did.

The notion that my views on this topic have anything to do with being "spoiled" is simply wrong. I would guess that is true for all those who disagree with the CHB on this. I am quite certain that I'm not a spoiled Pats fan, as I don't feel remotely entitled or as if I have wins or SBs coming to me and, to the contrary, remain in a state of almost bemusement that my once Charlie Brown like favorite team is, gulp, a legitimate dynasty. Is someone going to wake me up and tell me that this was all a dream and the Pats are still getting screwed over by their own ineptitude and the likes of Ben Dreith?

I'm also the kind of fan who never boos the home team or any of its players. And I mean never. But there's one circumstance in which I would break that rule, and that's if I perceived a lack of commitment to the team. Or a player totally dogging it. And I don't mean a Manny or Ortiz not running a ball out as if they were Dustin Pedroia or some other guy who famously is balls to the walls at all times. I mean a guy who downright quit on his team.

For me, despite all the good things Parcells did, and we all know exactly what they were, that he did ANYTHING that made winning that GB Super Bowl less likely crosses the line. Violently. It's simply unforgivable.

And for what? Did he really believe that the Jets would not be around after the Super Bowl? Even if Robert Kraft was a horrible jackass to Parcells, the HC owed it to himself, his assistants, his players, everyone else who worked for team, and yes, the fans, to make those two weeks be ONLY about preparation for the Packers. And even if that's naïve, and people can walk and chew gum at the same time, Parcells simply could not let the story gain life, become a huge talking point and a huge distraction. Reports are that Bledsoe approached Parcells before the game and said it had been an honor playing for him. That's nice on one level, and I'm sure it was true. But damn, I want Bledsoe thinking about topics other than his reportedly departing head coach at that time. And I don't want players thinking about the leadership of their team; I want them thinking about their assignments and how they can help their team win. I want that to the greatest extent possible.

Of course, we can't measure how the shit storm about the Jets affected the team's preparation. But I think only a total Parcells Fanboy would argue that it was a positive or that there is no reasonable chance that it was a negative. Like the swirl caused by SpyGate and John Tomase's rush to break his bogus story a decade or so later, I will always believe that the Pats would have been at their best without the extreme noise swirling around the team. One can argue that SpyGate was also self inflicted; with Parcells, there's nothing to debate. The HC introduced the problem.

So no, its' not about being spoiled. Or the 6 Titles. It's exactly the opposite, actually. It's about putting myself in the mindset of a fan whose team had never won jackshit when Parcells did what he did, and seeing the chance to finally win the big game sabotaged to some extent by the very man whose mantra was "No I in Team."

Last, as I've alluded to above, it's not as if Parcells doesn't have serious, deserving competition. You can rank order these names however but the following players are not now in the Pats HOF:

Randy Moss
Julius Adams
Tim Fox
Russ Francis
Rodney Harrison
Lawyer Milloy
Richard Seymour
Mike Vrabel
Wes Welker
Fred Marion

And I'm sure there are other deserving players who I did not cherry pick from the original list of 13 candidates (that Bill was on, by the way).

The CHB takes the Pats to task for not putting Parcells above the players on that list. Seymour, Vrabel and Harrison are on the ballot this year. For me, each of the finalists is head and shoulders above Parcells. For those advocating Parcells, which of those three should be behind Bill?
 

joe dokes

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And I'm sure there are other deserving players who I did not cherry pick from the original list of 13 candidates (that Bill was on, by the way).

The CHB takes the Pats to task for not putting Parcells above the players on that list. Seymour, Vrabel and Harrison are on the ballot this year. For me, each of the finalists is head and shoulders above Parcells. For those advocating Parcells, which of those three should be behind Bill?
Seeing how it was opened in 2008 and that Parcells was here at least 10 years before that, the list of people that "should be" ahead of him is only going to grow larger. Using that standard, he'll never "deserve" it, until perhaps they field another generation of bad players.
 

lexrageorge

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Kraft had a lease agreement with the team through 2001 that essentially gave him control over its movement. They weren’t going to St. Louis, which is why Orthwein eventually sold. The rest of this is myth making. Maybe there’s a media good guy award they can bestow upon him instead, since it seems aging sportswriters are the primary carriers of his water.
A couple of common mistakes above. First, the threat to move was real; the league wanted to the team to move, as did Orthwein.

Orthwein bought the team as a favor to the NFL as the team was close to folding. He bought it with the understanding that he would be allowed to get out in a few years. The league had a mandate for teams to play in either domed stadiums or warm weather locations, and Orthwein, being from St. Louis, had the intention of moving the team and selling to local owners in the St. Louis area. St. Louis had plans to build their stadium that would eventually become the home of the Rams.

Orthwein could have sold the team to owners other than Kraft, and they could have moved the team. Kraft would have sued to enforce the lease, and the result would have been a settlement with a good chunk of change going Kraft's way. Of course, the prospective owners new this, and so their offer to buy the team was lower than Kraft's.
 

Harry Hooper

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Orthwein could have sold the team to owners other than Kraft, and they could have moved the team. Kraft would have sued to enforce the lease, and the result would have been a settlement with a good chunk of change going Kraft's way. Of course, the prospective owners new this, and so their offer to buy the team was lower than Kraft's.
Not exactly, at least until 2001, according to this Inc. magazine piece:

if Kiam moved the Patriots to Jacksonville, then Kraft would be stuck with a worthless stadium and worthless parking lots.

But he didn't have to worry. The stadium's lease with the Patriots included an operating covenant that required the team to remain in the stadium through 2001. They couldn't just leave and keep paying rent; if you agree to an operating covenant, you have to operate your business from that location. If Kiam broke the lease, in Massachusetts the repercussions would not just be civil--they could be criminal.

So Kiam, and the Patriots, were stuck in Foxboro Stadium.

Which Kraft owned.
In 1992 Kiam ran into financial trouble of his own: The Patriots were losing money and so was Remington, his primary business. So he sold the Patriots to James Orthwein. Orthwein, a member of the Busch family and major shareholder of Anheuser-Busch, hoped to move the Patriots to St. Louis.

But Kraft held the trump card: The stadium's operating covenant still had 8 years left to run. Orthwein offered Kraft $75 million to get out of the stadium lease, three times what he had paid. But he wouldn't budge. And eventually Orthwein grew frustrated and put the team up for sale.

After a long bidding process, Kraft's winning bid was $172 million, a then-record amount for an NFL franchise.

Or from this 1994 NYT piece:

In securing the Patriots, Kraft, a multimillionaire philanthropist who made his fortune in paper and paper products, bested well-financed rivals from Boston, St. Louis, Baltimore and Hartford. The chief competition came from Stan Kroenke, a St. Louis businessman who reportedly offered as much as $200 million with the intention of moving the team to St. Louis.

However, the Kroenke offer required Orthwein to assume all related costs, including league fees of as much as $20 million for moving the team. More ominously, the bid also required Orthwein to incur open-ended legal and other costs of getting out of the team's lease on Foxboro Stadium, which has eight years to run.

Refused to Sell Lease

"I made the best bid with the least headaches," Kraft said, noting that as the stadium leaseholder, he would have been the Kroenke bid's chief headache.

"I'm not going to be the most popular man" in St. Louis, Orthwein said. "I'm going to still do the best I can for my hometown to help them get a team. As far as owning a team, I'm done with that."

Kraft, who bought Foxboro Stadium with a partner for $25 million at a bankruptcy sale in 1988 and who bought out his partner last month, said the present value of the lease had been estimated at $50 million to $100 million.

"People have offered me all sorts of money for the lease," he said, "but I let it be known that I wouldn't sell at any price."

He also let it be known that he would seek to enforce provisions of the lease that he maintains require the Patriots not only to make lease payments but also to play in the stadium. "I would have sought an injunction to keep the team in Foxboro," he said.

And Forbes had this:

By the end of 1988 Kraft had rights to the land, and with the stadium he controlled $2 million a year from parking, concessions and signage. More important, the stadium held an operating covenant that required the Patriots to stay put until 2001. "Now I had 13 years to try to figure out how to get the team."
 
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TheoShmeo

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No one is more obvious about his agenda than the CHB. In a column about how the Sox are now worth watching again -- funny, I guess we're all supposed to be fair weather fans and only watch when they are winning -- Shank can't resist a few paragraphs about why the Sox SHOULD be divided over how the White House ceremony. As if anyone cares about this issue, including the players. As if the reference has anything at all to do with the headline or premise of his story. He's such a piece of shit.
 

Average Reds

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No one is more obvious about his agenda than the CHB. In a column about how the Sox are now worth watching again -- funny, I guess we're all supposed to be fair weather fans and only watch when they are winning -- Shank can't resist a few paragraphs about why the Sox SHOULD be divided over how the White House ceremony. As if anyone cares about this issue, including the players. As if the reference has anything at all to do with the headline or premise of his story. He's such a piece of shit.
Shank is a troll, but I find it hard to accept the idea that no one cares about the White House visit. If it was a big nothingburger, they'd have all gone.
 

TheoShmeo

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Shank is a troll, but I find it hard to accept the idea that no one cares about the White House visit. If it was a big nothingburger, they'd have all gone.
I mean now. Do you think this is an issue in the Sox clubhouse? Even the CHB seems to acknowledge that it’s not “but but but it should be dammit.”

Beyond that, his placement was just weird. 90 percent of that piece was on how the Sox are now relevant again with a little Trump Turd dropped in for good measure.
 

joe dokes

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I mean now. Do you think this is an issue in the Sox clubhouse? Even the CHB seems to acknowledge that it’s not “but but but it should be dammit.”

Beyond that, his placement was just weird. 90 percent of that piece was on how the Sox are now relevant again with a little Trump Turd dropped in for good measure.
I think his point was that many teams might have not remained united. He even mentioned Cora's ability to keep them together. Frankly it is impressive.
And they just went two days ago, so there's nothing odd at about the placement. I also hadnt realized that no one gave the manager or MVP a shout-out til I read it in his column. Thats unfortunate.
Just because he's an asshole doesn't mean he always acts like one.
 

TheoShmeo

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I think his point was that many teams might have not remained united. He even mentioned Cora's ability to keep them together. Frankly it is impressive.
And they just went two days ago, so there's nothing odd at about the placement. I also hadnt realized that no one gave the manager or MVP a shout-out til I read it in his column. Thats unfortunate.
Just because he's an asshole doesn't mean he always acts like one.
The timing is fine. It’s still topical.

I just found the placement in that column to be forced. He was all in on the “they’re playing well now, pay attention” angle and then he dropped the visit in and returned to his main theme. To me, it smacked of a guy itching to make a point and raising it in the wrong place.
 

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I mean now. Do you think this is an issue in the Sox clubhouse? Even the CHB seems to acknowledge that it’s not “but but but it should be dammit.”
I have no idea if it's an issue. Regardless, it's not an unreasonable question.

Beyond that, his placement was just weird. 90 percent of that piece was on how the Sox are now relevant again with a little Trump Turd dropped in for good measure.
I didn't read it, but this strikes me as fair.

As we both recognized, he's a troll.
 

Humphrey

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The Globe's management always touts Shank's "courage". In terms of that article, it would have been much more courageous for him to write it two weeks earlier; that is, tell the fans to cool it, the Sox would start playing better soon. He could even have stuck in a few tomato can references given that several of the AL teams weren't going to end up with their current winning percentages.

Of course, for him, it was more fun to just shit on them until they started to win.
 

TheoShmeo

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Fair is fair, the CHB’s lines today about Grady Little and Earl Weaver in his Bruins column were pretty funny.
 

Humphrey

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You'll notice that he's on JBJ's case the last week or so. Several references, most of which are in places where none is needed.

I just love it when Shank zeroes in on a guy and the guy bounces back. Let's hope this is one of those times.
 

joe dokes

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You'll notice that he's on JBJ's case the last week or so. Several references, most of which are in places where none is needed.

I just love it when Shank zeroes in on a guy and the guy bounces back. Let's hope this is one of those times.
If Earl Weaver was alive, first he'd offer Shaughnessy some cigarettes. Then he'd say "Bradley? He's my Mark Belanger."
 

nattysez

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His shameless hypocrisy has reached a whole new level. His stupid book had a picture of Buckner after the ball had passed through his legs on the cover.
 

Deweys New Stance

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His shameless hypocrisy has reached a whole new level. His stupid book had a picture of Buckner after the ball had passed through his legs on the cover.
It's actually worse than that. I haven't read that book in nearly 30 years, but I still recall a section where Shank claims Buckner voted before the '86 postseason to stiff the clubhouse attendants and batboys out of playoff shares, and gloated in the clubhouse about how he was going to use his playoff shares to buy a flashy new sports car. Shank claimed that Marty Barrett and a couple teammates were aghast and tried to make it up the clubhouse staff. The clear point of the story was to paint Buckner as a greedy jerk and a villain who got what he deserved with the Game 6 outcome. For Shaughnessy to now attempt to scold others for the way Buckner was treated for decades in the media is vile.
 

ifmanis5

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Not linking it but Shank with some fin de siecle vibes today. At least he admits it...
The Crimes of the Ancient Sportswriter are many. My references are too damn old. I keep quoting “Animal House” which came out in 1978.
He concludes with a pledge to keep learning which is nice but maybe edit the 10 graphs of references down to one and get on to the meat of the story which is what has he learned and why he wants to continue. Instead, it's a lot of dated references in which he is happy to wallow.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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I thought that was a nice piece. He did a little self reflecting, he poked fun at himself and acknowledged some foibles.

This was actually a good column.
 

ifmanis5

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It's classic Boomer logic- I realize I suck but I'll just keep going and block opportunities for others.
To be fair, the role of the big city newspaper columnist as zeitgeist leader like himself, Lupica, Kornheiser, etc. is also dying. He's one of the last men standing from that era so I'd be more interested to hear Dan's takes on those things rather than the parade of old man references.
 

bankshot1

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At first I wondered if he was about to announce he was going to be riding off into the sunset. with his Selectric. I thought it was one of his better recent pieces. The last line nailed it.
 

gingerbreadmann

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I thought that was a nice piece. He did a little self reflecting, he poked fun at himself and acknowledged some foibles.

This was actually a good column.
I generally agree with your media opinions, but you really think this was good? This premise has been done to death by better (and worse) writers and rarely has it been done well. The little anecdotal humblebrags are all terrible; none of them are cute, and most of them are in poor taste. The last line, "Knowledge is good," laughs directly in the face of the entire piece, but specifically the earlier line, "I am allergic to analytics." Not that we didn't know that already.

This one takes the cake for me:
I think the majority of batted balls that are scored hits should be errors.
WTF does this even mean? Is this some warped version of the tired "America has gone soft" shtick? I can't even wrap my head around this one.

I read this piece and I see 0% self-reflection, 100% snark towards kids these days, and 100% pandering to his boomer fans. Judging by the comments, he at least seems to have succeeded at the latter. This kind of column is nostalgia at its worst, and the typical zero-effort Shaughnessy version of it is uniquely painful. 66 isn't even that old! Yet this godawful piece shows why he should have been kicked to the curb long ago.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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I generally agree with your media opinions, but you really think this was good? This premise has been done to death by better (and worse) writers and rarely has it been done well. The little anecdotal humblebrags are all terrible; none of them are cute, and most of them are in poor taste. The last line, "Knowledge is good," laughs directly in the face of the entire piece, but specifically the earlier line, "I am allergic to analytics." Not that we didn't know that already.
I guess that "good" is a relative term here. A lot of people hate Dan Shaughnessy and I'm not one of them. When he's motivated, he can really write. The dude has talent and can turn a phrase or capture what it's like to be at a big event. Does he do that every day? Absolutely not. I think that due to Boston having an unprecedented 20-year win streak in all four major sports, combined with him pretty much sticking to the sports section of the daily newspaper, Shaughnessy's sphere of influence has significantly waned in these years. No longer is the CHB the de facto voice of the "common Bostonian", the world has eclipsed him.

I think that this piece is about that mortality, or at least scratches that surface. At least that's how I read it. And not only that but it was kind of refreshing for a guy who has been saying for years that he knows all the answers to admit that like Keyrock from SNL's Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer, this world frightens and confuses him. I especially thought it was poignant when he wrote about how he's three times older than Rafael Devers. IDK, I've been thinking about this a lot lately and while Shaughnessy is 20+ years older than me, I see where he's coming from.

I think that being a sportswriter would suck. The people who cover you who lie to you but also think that you're out to get them and the people who read your pieces think you suck. Not only that, but you have bosses who are up your ass to do more, but the teams you cover provide less and less access. And you know you have it worse than the generations that come before you, thanks to stories from old timers who talked about sitting in train with Babe Ruth as he downed beers and told stories. And you don't have the luxury of winding down after a long day and getting lost in a ball game.

I think it's sort of admirable that he's still doing this. Is it as admirable as Bob Ryan and his seemingly never-ending lust for sports? No. But I think that Ryan is an anomaly. BTW, I don't think that the above absolves Shaughnessy for his truly, truly crappy hot sports takes that he makes every so often. I think that they're dumb as hell, but I get why he does it. Like I said, I just happened to find this piece refreshing in honesty.

WTF does this even mean? Is this some warped version of the tired "America has gone soft" shtick? I can't even wrap my head around this one.
Yeah. He thinks that all scorers bow to the home team. It's dumb, but understandable. I don't think he's the only person who kneels at this altar.
 

joe dokes

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I generally agree with your media opinions, but you really think this was good? This premise has been done to death by better (and worse) writers and rarely has it been done well. The little anecdotal humblebrags are all terrible; none of them are cute, and most of them are in poor taste. The last line, "Knowledge is good," laughs directly in the face of the entire piece, but specifically the earlier line, "I am allergic to analytics." Not that we didn't know that already.
I thought this column was considerably more good than bad. But YMMV. Just to be sure, however, you do know what the last line refers to, yes?
 

gingerbreadmann

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I thought this column was considerably more good than bad. But YMMV. Just to be sure, however, you do know what the last line refers to, yes?
I admit I didn't sniff out the Animal House reference at first, even though I've seen it more than once (I may have mentally discarded the earlier AH mention in the sea of other showy references he made after that). Clever device that I still think falls flat given the substance of what he wrote before calling back to it. But, fair, it is a nice punchy ending.

I guess that "good" is a relative term here. A lot of people hate Dan Shaughnessy and I'm not one of them. When he's motivated, he can really write. The dude has talent and can turn a phrase or capture what it's like to be at a big event. Does he do that every day? Absolutely not. I think that due to Boston having an unprecedented 20-year win streak in all four major sports, combined with him pretty much sticking to the sports section of the daily newspaper, Shaughnessy's sphere of influence has significantly waned in these years. No longer is the CHB the de facto voice of the "common Bostonian", the world has eclipsed him.
Thanks for these thoughts. I see where you are coming from here, and I'll try to check my biases in response.

I would argue that his sphere of influence has waned largely because he hasn't tried in 20 years. His standout talent is being a contrarian and stirring the pot, which naturally will look more desperate after 20+ years of winning than it did when the "Curse of the Bambino" was the elephant in the room every season. He made himself a household name during that era, but still: didn't Bill Simmons surpass him as the de facto voice of the Common Bostonian sometime in the early 2000s? He has stuck to the pot-stirring angle relentlessly in the face of that changing world, because he can do it in his sleep and hasn't been compelled to evolve.
I think that this piece is about that mortality, or at least scratches that surface. At least that's how I read it. And not only that but it was kind of refreshing for a guy who has been saying for years that he knows all the answers to admit that like Keyrock from SNL's Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer, this world frightens and confuses him. I especially thought it was poignant when he wrote about how he's three times older than Rafael Devers. IDK, I've been thinking about this a lot lately and while Shaughnessy is 20+ years older than me, I see where he's coming from.
I dunno, he milked an entire paragraph out of the mathematical revelation that being 3x older than someone means that you have spent three days on earth for every one day that they have. I get that aging is a universal phenomenon, but this whole thing struck me as performative. Roger Angell reflected on mortality. CHB boasted on and on about how he has kept his head buried in the sand on purpose. Is it inherently vulnerable to be frightened and confused by a world whose changes you have publicly (and profitably) scoffed at for years? That's not something he gave any thought to. Nor did he give thought to much else beyond listing anachronisms one after another.
I think that being a sportswriter would suck. The people who cover you who lie to you but also think that you're out to get them and the people who read your pieces think you suck. Not only that, but you have bosses who are up your ass to do more, but the teams you cover provide less and less access. And you know you have it worse than the generations that come before you, thanks to stories from old timers who talked about sitting in train with Babe Ruth as he downed beers and told stories. And you don't have the luxury of winding down after a long day and getting lost in a ball game.

I think it's sort of admirable that he's still doing this. Is it as admirable as Bob Ryan and his seemingly never-ending lust for sports? No. But I think that Ryan is an anomaly. BTW, I don't think that the above absolves Shaughnessy for his truly, truly crappy hot sports takes that he makes every so often. I think that they're dumb as hell, but I get why he does it. Like I said, I just happened to find this piece refreshing in honesty.
So I agree in principle with a lot of this, but it's also what gets me riled up about this piece. The low bar set by decades of crappy sports takes does make this column different. To me, it's only honest in the sense that he admits to doing all these crappy takes on purpose. There's nothing refreshing about that -- most readers have probably sensed that he loves to mock modern norms -- but it bothers me that he lays it all bare in typical lazy form and expects empathy for it.

This is where my thoughts converge with @ifmanis5. I think being a sportswriter would suck, too, but especially for someone who is eager to prove themselves through passion and insight, only to discover that they have it much worse than the Dan Shaughnessys of the generation before, who established themselves as TV personalities when the going was good and have since been collecting paychecks to hold petty grudges and shit out columns about whatever they want.

I think it would be admirable if he was still doing this well. Ryan is a curmudgeon too, but he has stepped out of the way and still has passion for what he does, when he does it. This column was Dan pouring cement on his Ignorant Old Guy perch and intending to keep loudly being ignorant for as long as he can. I don't think any boss of his has been up his ass to do more in a very long time. For him to continually suck up a large salary and valuable space on the Sports page at the expense of others who haven't had the opportunities he takes for granted, he needs to do a lot more self-reflection than he does in this column, IMO. He's clearly not willing to, and I get it. It's just kinda insulting, I think.

Yeah. He thinks that all scorers bow to the home team. It's dumb, but understandable. I don't think he's the only person who kneels at this altar.
Thanks, I hadn't seen that one before.
 
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TheoShmeo

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Does the CHB or anyone else in the media actually think that fans care about the morality based aspects of the so-called Patriot Way? Or that the Krafts might be inconsistent?

I care about playing good situational football, being disciplined on the field, putting the team over individual goals, excellence, being in great shape, hard work and the other like characteristics that have defined the Dynasty. That’s the Patriot Way that I think most fans focus on, not what Jonathan Kraft might say from time to time.

Dan’s column today comes down to a rant about the Krafts being hypercritical and totally ignoring that, as was the case with Marcell Dareous, the NFL and its teams aren’t likely doing to punish a guy who has been accused in a civil suit. Oh, and that AB’s language in texts demonstrate that he is not who many fathers would want for their daughters and, more to the point, is a bad guy. Which is just shocking.
 

Mystic Merlin

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The ‘Patriot Way’ is an unintentional stroke of genius by the sports media. They created the concept, they sustain the concept, and they use it as the standard by which they judge the conduct of the coaches and players.

It also seems to mean different things to different people, another winning attribute for any hot take machine.

I don’t know any Patriots fans who use the phrase, and I only recall hearing it from individuals associated with the team a handful of times from former Patriots players who - and this isn’t a coincidence - joined the sports media full time and, I believe, once from Jonathan Kraft on some radio or TV interview.
 

jose melendez

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The Krafts cultivated the shit out of the idea. Bob Kraft had a whole thing about how they didn't want to own a team if it meant enabling bad people. That is not how they operate any more--if they ever really did. Remember when they cut Christian Peter, he was happily signed by others without controversy. But the Pats have operated for a long time like any other NFL team.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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The Krafts cultivated the shit out of the idea. Bob Kraft had a whole thing about how they didn't want to own a team if it meant enabling bad people. That is not how they operate any more--if they ever really did. Remember when they cut Christian Peter, he was happily signed by others without controversy. But the Pats have operated for a long time like any other NFL team.
I seem to recall that it was Myra Kraft that was the one that pushed for cutting Christian Peter. She wasn't involved with the football decision to draft him, but she quite obviously had her say once she learned about the allegations surrounding him (which she likely learned of via the media). Sadly, she's been gone for a while now. Whatever influence she might have once had on the moral/ethical compass of the organization has long since been left behind.
 

bankshot1

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Feb 12, 2003
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where I was last at
Shank came out swinging low after today's all you can eat Filet o Fish buffet in Miami.

" MIAMI GARDENS, Fla. — Spygate. Deflategate. OrchidsofAsiaGate. Now Antoniogate.

Better than any team in the history of professional sports, the Patriots know what to do when they are charged with cheating or ethical bankruptcy.

Just win, baby. Take no prisoners. Fire all your guns at once. Deny, deny, then accuse. Give everybody the finger and march toward another Super Bowl Sunday. Unleash members of your fanboy nation as born-again civil libertarians, righteous in their pursuit of touchdowns over everything else."

Ethical bankruptcy?

Seems a little harsh.
 

TheoShmeo

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Shank came out swinging low after today's all you can eat Filet o Fish buffet in Miami.

" MIAMI GARDENS, Fla. — Spygate. Deflategate. OrchidsofAsiaGate. Now Antoniogate.

Better than any team in the history of professional sports, the Patriots know what to do when they are charged with cheating or ethical bankruptcy.

Just win, baby. Take no prisoners. Fire all your guns at once. Deny, deny, then accuse. Give everybody the finger and march toward another Super Bowl Sunday. Unleash members of your fanboy nation as born-again civil libertarians, righteous in their pursuit of touchdowns over everything else."

Ethical bankruptcy?

Seems a little harsh.
Dan desperately wants to look down his nose at Pats fans for not being caught up in the Krafts' supposed inconsistencies.

I wonder how Dan would feel if the Globe suspended him only on the basis of a civil suit.

Anyone who has ever been wrongly accused of anything -- raises hand -- knows how dangerous and foolish the CHB's line of attack is here.
 

54thMA

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Aug 15, 2012
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Dan desperately wants to look down his nose at Pats fans for not being caught up in the Krafts' supposed inconsistencies.

I wonder how Dan would feel if the Globe suspended him only on the basis of a civil suit.

Anyone who has ever been wrongly accused of anything -- raises hand -- knows how dangerous and foolish the CHB's line of attack is here.
Shank came out swinging low after today's all you can eat Filet o Fish buffet in Miami.

" MIAMI GARDENS, Fla. — Spygate. Deflategate. OrchidsofAsiaGate. Now Antoniogate.

Better than any team in the history of professional sports, the Patriots know what to do when they are charged with cheating or ethical bankruptcy.

Just win, baby. Take no prisoners. Fire all your guns at once. Deny, deny, then accuse. Give everybody the finger and march toward another Super Bowl Sunday. Unleash members of your fanboy nation as born-again civil libertarians, righteous in their pursuit of touchdowns over everything else."

Ethical bankruptcy?

Seems a little harsh.
He sounds pretty upset.

Just win baby is right, it's all about the Lombardi's, keep racking them up, take no prisoners.

I am past the point of worrying about what fans around the league think of the Patriots, or writers for that matter, just keep winning.

I really don't give a shit.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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He sounds pretty upset.

Just win baby is right, it's all about the Lombardi's, keep racking them up, take no prisoners.

I am past the point of worrying about what fans around the league think of the Patriots, or writers for that matter, just keep winning.

I really don't give a shit.
Not to play the whataboutism card, but really, what NFL franchise is pure at this point? Is there a team in the league that would have cut ties with Brown, or de-activated him, based on what has happened this week? No fanbase in the league has a leg to stand on with regard to Brown.

As for Shaughnessy, all he wants to do is stir the shit. Guaranteed if the Pats reversed course and didn't sign Brown after the allegations surfaced, Shank would find a way to criticize them for it.
 

nattysez

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He may as well just have written "Pats fans are blinded by the Lombardis." Not like Borges is going to accuse anyone else of plagiarism.
 

Humphrey

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If he was so incensed by Brown being on the team perhaps he should have politely declined the trip to South Beach for the weekend. Just sayin'. He could have written the same article from his home office.
 

RedOctober3829

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Jul 19, 2005
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deep inside Guido territory
Dan desperately wants to look down his nose at Pats fans for not being caught up in the Krafts' supposed inconsistencies.

I wonder how Dan would feel if the Globe suspended him only on the basis of a civil suit.

Anyone who has ever been wrongly accused of anything -- raises hand -- knows how dangerous and foolish the CHB's line of attack is here.
Any articles from Dan admonishing the Globe for still employing Brian McGrory?
 

Patriot_Reign

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Apr 21, 2011
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Does Dan take calls during his weekly 98.5 gig? If so their call screener must be working some serious overtime given the Globe sexual harassment shit - and for fun the troll job that is Shirley Leung (Chad Finn I know you won't address her as you're a good Globe employee) (Nothing to see here, just rampant abuse, but let's not talk about it).
 

HomeBrew1901

Has Season 1 of "Manimal" on Blu Ray
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The Krafts cultivated the shit out of the idea. Bob Kraft had a whole thing about how they didn't want to own a team if it meant enabling bad people. That is not how they operate any more--if they ever really did. Remember when they cut Christian Peter, he was happily signed by others without controversy. But the Pats have operated for a long time like any other NFL team.
This...

Put Brown on any team other than the Patriots and BBTL would be running rampant with the pearl clutching demanding he should be released. Just take a look at the #MeToo thread in the Omar Forum and all the people that coldn't "enjoy" Parks and Rec anymore because of what a woman accused Ansari of.

Oh noes.... CHB wrote an article to piss off die hard Patriots defenders.... TO THE INTERNET!!!!

Good job giving him the clicks.
 

jose melendez

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This...

Put Brown on any team other than the Patriots and BBTL would be running rampant with the pearl clutching demanding he should be released. Just take a look at the #MeToo thread in the Omar Forum and all the people that coldn't "enjoy" Parks and Rec anymore because of what a woman accused Ansari of.

Oh noes.... CHB wrote an article to piss off die hard Patriots defenders.... TO THE INTERNET!!!!

Good job giving him the clicks.
That is.... uhhh... not what I said.
 

HomeBrew1901

Has Season 1 of "Manimal" on Blu Ray
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That is.... uhhh... not what I said.
Sorry Jose... I was agreeing with what you said about the Kraft's carefully cultivating the Patriot Way and that's not how they operate any longer.

I was pointing out that some of the same folks getting pissed at CHB for the article would be clutching their pearls and calling for Goodell to suspend Brown if he were on another team.
 

jose melendez

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Sorry Jose... I was agreeing with what you said about the Kraft's carefully cultivating the Patriot Way and that's not how they operate any longer.

I was pointing out that some of the same folks getting pissed at CHB for the article would be clutching their pearls and calling for Goodell to suspend Brown if he were on another team.
The first part is true. Kraft's brand was we're a football team but we won't tolerate Lawrence Phillips. This team would absolutely tolerate Lawrence Phillips now, and it's fair for them to be called on it.
 

BaseballJones

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Oct 1, 2015
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Not to play the whataboutism card, but really, what NFL franchise is pure at this point? Is there a team in the league that would have cut ties with Brown, or de-activated him, based on what has happened this week? No fanbase in the league has a leg to stand on with regard to Brown.
I'd love to see a http://yourteamcheats.com site listing all the domestic abusers, criminals, sex offenders, etc., that each team has gainfully employed. That would be nice to reference anytime someone gave the Pats crap for this.