C's pick Aaron Nesmith #14 overall

Jimbodandy

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But what's the harm in playing PP and AN in Maine until Ime figures it out? Nesmith putting together a string of 5-6 games where he goes 23/50 from 3 might do wonders for his confidence level. PP too.
They must think that the opportunity to evaluate guys in practice--and develop guys in practice--is more important at the moment than Nesmith and Pritchard throwing up bombs in the grownup AAU all star games that happen in the G league. Those things are like a more athletic version of the Y. Nobody learns squat there.
 

Cesar Crespo

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They must think that the opportunity to evaluate guys in practice--and develop guys in practice--is more important at the moment than Nesmith and Pritchard throwing up bombs in the grownup AAU all star games that happen in the G league. Those things are like a more athletic version of the Y. Nobody learns squat there.
That's true. I've made the argument myself that 99.9% of the time players are better practicing and traveling with their NBA teammates, coaches, trainers etc. The best everything is going to be at the NBA level, not in Maine.

They also haven't played much at home this year. Probably easier to let AN go play in Maine while the C's are in Boston and not Florida. Kinda like Bruno tonight. You'd probably rather have even Bruno travelling with the team than having to fly him out if for some god awful reason you'd actually need to use him. *shudder* Him and Hernangomez are the new Edwards and Waters.
 

HomeRunBaker

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But what's the harm in playing PP and AN in Maine until Ime figures it out? Nesmith putting together a string of 5-6 games where he goes 23/50 from 3 might do wonders for his confidence level. PP too.
What is the goal here for a team positioning for the playoff? Bruno is never going to play in Boston so you can send him to Maine and it doesn’t affect the Celtics. Nesmith and Pritchard are the 9th, 10th or 11th men right now and are needed in case of injury, foul trouble or the team simply needing a spark like tonight when Nesmith played 1H minutes. They aren’t going to be playing in Maine this year at all as they are needed as bench depth here.
 

Euclis20

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That is incredibly disappointing. His length, athleticism and shooting are just what the Celtics need but he just can't string together any consistently good play. You can squint and try to see the upside here (he's more likely to improve by actually playing, and that isn't happening in Boston) but it's hard to view him as anything other than a bust, pending new developments. With his profile he should able to play in any lineup, but he can barely crack the rotation of a mediocre team that has been hit hard with injuries. Terrible.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I'd like him to get some developmental minutes but unless the above is true, you'd have to think Nesmith doesn't deserve much more than developmental minutes.

I'm not a huge fan of the G league and question how much it helps, but I think Nesmith might be one of the few players who would benefit from going. Let him play 30-35 minutes a night for a handful of games. Especially if he's just going to play scattered minutes at best in the NBA.
Good. I'm not a fan of the G League but let's see if he can hit some 3s in the G league and build his confidence some. Rotting on the bench isn't doing him any good, especially after missing a bunch of time. He could probably use the cardio.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I’m ready to start throwing around the “b” word with him. This is not a good development for a 2nd year player.
Yeah. On the plus side, he's only 22. Though, most players start to show at least a little something by then.

Can Langford still play in the G league? I fail to see his role on the team when its fully healthy.
 

Euclis20

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I'd love to know how many 22 year olds (especially those who aren't rookies) who have been sent down to the g league ended up being anything in the NBA.
 

BigSoxFan

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I'd love to know how many 22 year olds (especially those who aren't rookies) who have been sent down to the g league ended up being anything in the NBA.
Can’t be that many. There are always outliers but this basically means Ime doesn’t trust him at all and he’s 100% justified. Nesmith just hasn’t done anything with his time. He competes and tries hard and has had a few fleeting productive moments but this is the big leagues and you need production to stick. I really wanted Nesmith to be that shooter we were lacking but he’s basically a penny stock now. If he turns his career around, it’s likely somewhere else.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I'd love to know how many 22 year olds (especially those who aren't rookies) who have been sent down to the g league ended up being anything in the NBA.
Danny Green and um... that's all I got.

edit: Max Strus. Nope, one year for him too.
 

Cellar-Door

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I'd love to know how many 22 year olds (especially those who aren't rookies) who have been sent down to the g league ended up being anything in the NBA.
Probably more than you think, a ton of guys do a couple game stint while the main team is off if they have a G League team within a couple miles
 

mcpickl

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I'd love to know how many 22 year olds (especially those who aren't rookies) who have been sent down to the g league ended up being anything in the NBA.
Off the top of my head, Christian Wood would be the best player I can think of under these narrow terms.

If you included 22 year old rookies, you'd bring in Van Vleet, Siakam, Marcus Morris, and bunches of role players

I don't think it means much. Last night was Nesmiths first game action since before Christmas. I would guess he plays today, then gets recalled right back tomorrow.
 

NomarsFool

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A few years ago the Celtics had all those extra picks in their war chest and we ended up with Langford and Nesmith and paying someone to take Kanter’s contract. What a disappointing result.
 

Cesar Crespo

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A few years ago the Celtics had all those extra picks in their war chest and we ended up with Langford and Nesmith and paying someone to take Kanter’s contract. What a disappointing result.
And while we probably don't draft him, the player taken with the Kanter pick is looking like a borderline all star and one of the better 3 point shooters in the league. He's also played 500 more minutes than RL and AN combined over the course of their careers. He has more points and assists this year than Nesmith and RL have in their careers, combined.

The team that ended up with him was supposed to land us a top 5 pick, instead it landed us RL because Memphis lucked out in the lottery and landed Morant.

Crazy how the Nets and Grizzles are better than us. At least the Kings still suck.
 

tbb345

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Off the top of my head, Christian Wood would be the best player I can think of under these narrow terms.

If you included 22 year old rookies, you'd bring in Van Vleet, Siakam, Marcus Morris, and bunches of role players

I don't think it means much. Last night was Nesmiths first game action since before Christmas. I would guess he plays today, then gets recalled right back tomorrow.
This is exactly what all of the beat writers are saying. It’s not a demotion but a unique opportunity for Nesmith to get in-game action on a run and return to the team
 

Eddie Jurak

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I think people are reading WAY too much into this.

1. The Celtics were home last night.
2. Maine has a game at 5 PM today (Sunday).
3. The Celtics are home vs Indiana tomorrow night.

People are leaping to the conclusion that this is exile, when it could just as likely be "give him a chance to get some minutes and shots on an off day."
 

128

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I don't remember Terry Larrier from his UConn days, but he was out of his mind in this one. Forty-two points.
 

lexrageorge

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And while we probably don't draft him, the player taken with the Kanter pick is looking like a borderline all star and one of the better 3 point shooters in the league. He's also played 500 more minutes than RL and AN combined over the course of their careers. He has more points and assists this year than Nesmith and RL have in their careers, combined.

The team that ended up with him was supposed to land us a top 5 pick, instead it landed us RL because Memphis lucked out in the lottery and landed Morant.

Crazy how the Nets and Grizzles are better than us. At least the Kings still suck.
Langford was the Kings pick. Until the 2018-19 season, the Kings highest winning percentage was 0.463 since their last playoff appearance in 2006; their next highest was 0.402 (twice). Of those 12 seasons prior to the one that matted, the Kings failed to crack 0.400 9 times and 0.300 twice.

Then they improve by an improbable 12 games when the Celtics own the pick, resulting in Langford instead of Tyler Herro. Or just about anyone else picked in the first 13 picks. And yes, Memphis getting Morant basically resulted in Nesmith.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Then they improve by an improbable 12 games when the Celtics own the pick, resulting in Langford instead of Tyler Herro. Or just about anyone else picked in the first 13 picks. And yes, Memphis getting Morant basically resulted in Nesmith.
Yeah, my bad. Langford was literally in the Morant draft so that would be hard to do. Both were below average outcomes and the players we drafted didn't help. While there aren't many players drafted after Langford that are better (at least yet), there are quite a few after Nesmith. I guess there's still time and hope for the 2 but I'm not a huge believer.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I think people are reading WAY too much into this.

1. The Celtics were home last night.
2. Maine has a game at 5 PM today (Sunday).
3. The Celtics are home vs Indiana tomorrow night.

People are leaping to the conclusion that this is exile, when it could just as likely be "give him a chance to get some minutes and shots on an off day."
We’ll he’s already been in exile but I agree with you that this is likely a one-game run which is one of the purposes of the G-League and having your affiliate an hour or two up the road. The priority is this Celtics team and you don’t want to be willingly playing shorthanded without your deep bench in the middle of the season.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Nesmith was pretty good yesterday and is not without talent. Most of this is garbage time in a blowout, but the first two baskets were not.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MT0C40TlfwU


He got almost as close to missing that first three as one could get without actually missing it (Marcus hit one earlier this year that was closer because it went backboard-front rim-backboard-front rim-in).

The second basket was one of the key baskets in the game, as it broken a Sixer 10-0 run after Marcus' injury.

The rest was garbage time.
 

lexrageorge

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Nesmith was pretty good yesterday and is not without talent. Most of this is garbage time in a blowout, but the first two baskets were not.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MT0C40TlfwU


He got almost as close to missing that first three as one could get without actually missing it (Marcus hit one earlier this year that was closer because it went backboard-front rim-backboard-front rim-in).

The second basket was one of the key baskets in the game, as it broken a Sixer 10-0 run after Marcus' injury.

The rest was garbage time.
I thought that was a really nice pass by Tatum to set up Nesmith, and a heads up play by Nesmith to take it in and land a good shot.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I mentioned this in the game thread but I think if AN was on DET, where he could jack up shots and didn't have to worry about playing defense, he'd be scoring 15+ a game and would probably be a net negative on the whole but DET wouldn't care about that.

He can definitely score on 3 levels.
 

Eddie Jurak

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I mentioned this in the game thread but I think if AN was on DET, where he could jack up shots and didn't have to worry about playing defense, he'd be scoring 15+ a game and would probably be a net negative on the whole but DET wouldn't care about that.

He can definitely score on 3 levels.
I wonder if anyone has studied the development of role player types on good teams vs bad. There are some advantages either way, but getting consistent playing time, not always available on a good team, has to be a big advantage. (While being mired in a crap system, eg Sacramento, has to be the opposite).
 

HomeRunBaker

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I wonder if anyone has studied the development of role player types on good teams vs bad. There are some advantages either way, but getting consistent playing time, not always available on a good team, has to be a big advantage. (While being mired in a crap system, eg Sacramento, has to be the opposite).
I have a strong opinion on this. It would vary by player but generally speaking a younger player needs the playing time to figure out what his niche in the league is. Some enter the league already pretty good at this……Grant, Leon Powe, Pritchard, Olynyk. These are typically the more physically mature “low upside” guys. The rest, like you say, need to figure out who they are. Perfect example is Javonte Green, even Gerald Green back in the day who was able to carve out a pretty long career once he recognized his strengths/weaknesses. This is Romeo, Aaron, TL, etc. The more athletic and higher upside a young player has the more playing time he needs to learn how to utilize his athletic skills……the low upside guys who lack the athletic skills don’t have to worry about that as much and are even susceptible to being overexposed when asked to play behind their role.

On the flip side, once you’ve established what you are like a George Hill, PJ Tucker, etc……you are basically worthless to a rebuilding team as you don’t need minutes to figure it out since you already have. These guys need the right situation more than they do minutes. I read everywhere how these guys are “toast” or “declining” but it’s nothing but a head fake as it’s often said when a role player is in a bad situation on a losing team.
 

tbb345

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A few things on Nesmith…

-It seems like he needs time to settle into the game. He comes out with a lot of nervous energy and generally needs a bit to calm down and get into the flow.
-This also applies to his shooting and shooting mechanics. Some of his 3P shots seem rushed which throws the mechanics off.
-To my eye he seems like a better shooter on the move, or when he can step into his shot, than a catch and shoot guy. This especially applies to his corner 3’s, where he seems to shoot a very low percentage.
-He needs to work on his footwork on offense and getting into shooting position before receiving the ball
-Hes surprisingly good at attacking close outs. Has a really nice floater in his arsenal.

Overall, it seems like he really needs minutes to develop his game, work out the kinks, and become more comfortable
 

128

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A few things on Nesmith…

-It seems like he needs time to settle into the game. He comes out with a lot of nervous energy and generally needs a bit to calm down and get into the flow.
-This also applies to his shooting and shooting mechanics. Some of his 3P shots seem rushed which throws the mechanics off.
-To my eye he seems like a better shooter on the move, or when he can step into his shot, than a catch and shoot guy. This especially applies to his corner 3’s, where he seems to shoot a very low percentage.
-He needs to work on his footwork on offense and getting into shooting position before receiving the ball
-Hes surprisingly good at attacking close outs. Has a really nice floater in his arsenal.

Overall, it seems like he really needs minutes to develop his game, work out the kinks, and become more comfortable
He looked much more comfortable on the third 3-pointer he made than on either of the first two, IMO. He looked fluid on that and didn't have too much time to think.

There's something there. Let's hope the C's can bring it out.
 

HomeRunBaker

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-To my eye he seems like a better shooter on the move, or when he can step into his shot, than a catch and shoot guy. This especially applies to his corner 3’s, where he seems to shoot a very low percentage.
Yes. Nesmith was never a stationary catch-and-shoot guy in college. The large majority of his shots came in the halfcourt set running off multiple screens on the move. One of the reasons I liked the pick at the time was that I watched a lot of Vanderbilt games that year and noticed two things about his game……one, he made a massive leap from his first year which you always want to see and two, the team absolutely fell apart when he went down with his injury indicating his impact on the game. Of course this was before Brad cautioned us all with his words then we got to see the player who didn’t at all resemble the guy I watched the prior year. Goes to show how imperfect the evaluation process is when prognosticating out of the college game which doesn’t resemble that of the NBA.
 

tbb345

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Yes. Nesmith was never a stationary catch-and-shoot guy in college. The large majority of his shots came in the halfcourt set running off multiple screens on the move. One of the reasons I liked the pick at the time was that I watched a lot of Vanderbilt games that year and noticed two things about his game……one, he made a massive leap from his first year which you always want to see and two, the team absolutely fell apart when he went down with his injury indicating his impact on the game. Of course this was before Brad cautioned us all with his words then we got to see the player who didn’t at all resemble the guy I watched the prior year. Goes to show how imperfect the evaluation process is when prognosticating out of the college game which doesn’t resemble that of the NBA.
That’s interesting because what I am reading kind of falls in line with what we’ve seen no? (Obviously other than the team falling apart when he’s not in the game portion).
How many times has Nesmith ran around multiple screens for a catch and shoot? I honestly think the number might be 0. His only consistent touches and chances have been on catch and shoot 3’s (mostly in the corner) which you just mentioned he really doesn’t have much experience with…
 

tbb345

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He looked much more comfortable on the third 3-pointer he made than on either of the first two, IMO. He looked fluid on that and didn't have too much time to think.

There's something there. Let's hope the C's can bring it out.
If you’re talking about the 3 that I think you are, he was in the middle of the court and was able to step into his shot and release. It looked so clean that it actually looked like a player whose scouting report was that he was a dead eye shooter.

I’m sure the Celtics know all about this and are already working with him but he clearly needs to practice corner 3’s where he’s set with no step in.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I wonder if anyone has studied the development of role player types on good teams vs bad. There are some advantages either way, but getting consistent playing time, not always available on a good team, has to be a big advantage. (While being mired in a crap system, eg Sacramento, has to be the opposite).
It would be fascinating to study and if a team could figure this out, they'd get a leg up in drafting/developing. Hopefully some team(s) has(ve) invested some money into figuring this out and we'll learn about it later.

In addition - or maybe adjacent to - to HRB's point about "low ceiling" versus "high ceiling" players, I would think that a player that knows his role would be able to develop more quickly on a good team while a player (particularly a younger player) that has just beaten everyone with physical ability - like Romeo - really needs lots of reps to figure what they can and cannot get away with in the NBA.

BTW, with all of this in mind, TL's development is remarkable given his high ceiling but it probably has a lot to do with not being asked to do very much - play defense and rim run.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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How many times has Nesmith ran around multiple screens for a catch and shoot? I honestly think the number might be 0. His only consistent touches and chances have been on catch and shoot 3’s (mostly in the corner) which you just mentioned he really doesn’t have much experience with…
Definitely not 0 (see video below) but not very often. I know Ime has run a couple of plays for him over the season and my memory says that he's not missed much whn coming off a screen. I would think Ime would run a play or two for him every game that he's in.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbvicpUN0P4
 

sezwho

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I have a strong opinion on this. It would vary by player but generally speaking a younger player needs the playing time to figure out what his niche in the league is. Some enter the league already pretty good at this……Grant, Leon Powe, Pritchard, Olynyk. These are typically the more physically mature “low upside” guys. The rest, like you say, need to figure out who they are. Perfect example is Javonte Green, even Gerald Green back in the day who was able to carve out a pretty long career once he recognized his strengths/weaknesses. This is Romeo, Aaron, TL, etc. The more athletic and higher upside a young player has the more playing time he needs to learn how to utilize his athletic skills……the low upside guys who lack the athletic skills don’t have to worry about that as much and are even susceptible to being overexposed when asked to play behind their role.

On the flip side, once you’ve established what you are like a George Hill, PJ Tucker, etc……you are basically worthless to a rebuilding team as you don’t need minutes to figure it out since you already have. These guys need the right situation more than they do minutes. I read everywhere how these guys are “toast” or “declining” but it’s nothing but a head fake as it’s often said when a role player is in a bad situation on a losing team.
I agree with this as well. Aside from the end of both sides of the ability bell curve, opportunity can be everything.

I'd also dispute those who viewed the last trade deadline concluded CBS doesn't value draft picks. I'd say perhaps the opposite is true: maximizing the pick value means only taking it if you have a real opportunity to develop it.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I predict he'll be somewhat decent after the ASB, not necessarily because he's any better but because some teams start to lay off the gas, resting some of their players or play for lottery position. Though with the play in game, those are far less of an issue.

This is assuming he gets any minutes other than sporadic garbage play. I think there are minutes to be had because when the team is fully healthy, there aren't any minutes for the 8th man (DT). It's PP, AN or a combination of both.

If the C's get someone like Gary Harris though, all those minutes go bye bye.
 

Fishy1

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I predict he'll be somewhat decent after the ASB, not necessarily because he's any better but because some teams start to lay off the gas, resting some of their players or play for lottery position. Though with the play in game, those are far less of an issue.

This is assuming he gets any minutes other than sporadic garbage play. I think there are minutes to be had because when the team is fully healthy, there aren't any minutes for the 8th man (DT). It's PP, AN or a combination of both.

If the C's get someone like Gary Harris though, all those minutes go bye bye.
That will bode particularly well for a guy who's earning the nickname "Crash."

Bigger question is if he finds his shot. If he could get hot -- really and truly hot from three point range -- that would be very interesting.
 

HomeRunBaker

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That will bode particularly well for a guy who's earning the nickname "Crash."

Bigger question is if he finds his shot. If he could get hot -- really and truly hot from three point range -- that would be very interesting.
Nesmith is so destined to drop 31 one night on 8 three’s. This must happen before his next career stop in Bulgaria.
 

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Garbage time or not, it was great to see Nesmith knock down several shots yesterday (4 of 5 overall; 3 of 4 from 3-point range). It's doubtful he plays much of a role the rest of this season, barring injuries, but hopefully he heads into the offseason with a little momentum.
 

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Garbage time or not, it was great to see Nesmith knock down several shots yesterday (4 of 5 overall; 3 of 4 from 3-point range). It's doubtful he plays much of a role the rest of this season, barring injuries, but hopefully he heads into the offseason with a little momentum.
He had a toe on the line on one attempt or these would have all been threes. He shot them all with confidence and they were all no-doubters. One was pretty deep. I don't know why I'm explaining it, just watch this video if you missed the game and want to see how he played:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cx3xIz7Onfg
 

bakahump

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That first 3 in the highlight was IN Rhythm. actually they all were. But that first one the Foot slide was very controlled.
Hopefully he builds on this.
 

benhogan

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I believe it's next year's business with Nesmith.

BUT there is an outside chance he gets heavy-duty minutes the next 3 games, catches fire and plays himself into a small role that gradually builds during the playoffs. His improving defense and familiarity with Celtic-killer Kris Middleton could come in handy if he has gained IME's confidence by the EC Finals