CFB Coach Carousel

canderson

Mr. Brightside
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
39,634
Harrisburg, Pa.
Miami paid $8 million to buy out Diaz, $9 million to buy out Cristobal, and then signed Cristobal for $8 million.

I guess Miami wants to get back at the big boys table very badly.
 

RIrooter09

Alvin
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2008
7,266
Ah yes truly the spirit of college football....
Let's take money from our hospital and use it to hire/fire football coaches.
View: https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/1467713444220600324


I enjoy football... but if you're paying tens of millions on coaches you should lose non-profit status
Don’t most major universities have hospital systems? Do you think the performance of those systems has no effect on the athletic program in all other cases?
 

Cellar-Door

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 1, 2006
34,847
Don’t most major universities have hospital systems? Do you think the performance of those systems has no effect on the athletic program in all other cases?
I mean... that's my point. That college football is a broken system in which you take money from hospitals, not to support your non-profit's stated objective, but to a pay a man tens of millions (which amusingly he wouldn't get from the highest level of for profit professional sports) to help you exploit young people.

College football at it's core is immoral, but at least some places have budgets that are only made from the profits and donations from nutcases who will only give money for sports, to take OUTSIDE money that could go to education and use it to pay $17M for coaches is shameful. It's bad enough to pay coaches a ton of money because you can exploit the labor and you aren't allowed to turn a profit, it's much worse to exploit the labor, squeeze alumni.... and still have to raid the coffers for money. It's football... if your college football program can't pay for itself you should shut it down.
And it's clearly not about "advancing athletics" considering football revenue is huge. $17M could pay for a whole lot of non-football athletics. It's a shameful vanity play.
 

Average Reds

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 24, 2007
35,431
Southwestern CT
I’m not going to defend Miami, nor will I refute the allegation that college football is immoral at its core. (Narrator: “It is.”) But Miami didn’t “take money from its health system.” They used a small fraction of the $400 million in profits generated by that system and directed it to the athletics department.

I agree that it’s a shameful use of funds. But it won’t change a single thing in the health department.
 
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coremiller

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
5,854
I don't know about Miami's case specifically, but aren't most of the exorbitant coach salaries funded almost entirely by boosters, rather than coming out of the university general fund or even out of athletic department funds that could be used for other purposes?
 

RIrooter09

Alvin
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2008
7,266
I don't know about Miami's case specifically, but aren't most of the exorbitant coach salaries funded almost entirely by boosters, rather than coming out of the university general fund or even out of athletic department funds that could be used for other purposes?
Yes. And by all accounts Cristobal’s billionaire brother in law paid a big part in the recruitment.
 

Kremlin Watcher

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 20, 2005
5,249
Orleans, MA
I don't know about Miami's case specifically, but aren't most of the exorbitant coach salaries funded almost entirely by boosters, rather than coming out of the university general fund or even out of athletic department funds that could be used for other purposes?
Yes. At Texas, for example, the HFC is officially hired as a regular faculty member at a pay grade that matches the title (so $80-$120 k range). The Longhorn Foundation, funded by boosters, pays the rest.
 

mauf

Anderson Cooper × Mr. Rogers
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jun 22, 2008
36,114
The University of Miami’s reputation has changed dramatically for the better over the past 40 years. Some of that might have happened anyway due to the growth of the Miami area, but big-time football played a major role. It’s a bad example of the dark side of college football — with the possible exception of Notre Dame, I’m hard-pressed to name another school whose profile has been raised as effectively by college athletics as Miami’s has.
 

Ale Xander

Hamilton
SoSH Member
Oct 31, 2013
73,408
The University of Miami’s reputation has changed dramatically for the better over the past 40 years. Some of that might have happened anyway due to the growth of the Miami area, but big-time football played a major role. It’s a bad example of the dark side of college football — with the possible exception of Notre Dame, I’m hard-pressed to name another school whose profile has been raised as effectively by college athletics as Miami’s has.
USC and U of Florida too
 

mauf

Anderson Cooper × Mr. Rogers
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jun 22, 2008
36,114
USC and U of Florida too
UF has always been a respected school in state; its reputation has grown as the state has. It was considered a good school when I was applying 30 years ago, which was when Spurrier was just starting to turn UF into a good football school, so I’d say there’s little relationship between the rise of the football program and the school overall.

I’m not old enough to say how much football lifted the profile of USC — the football program has been big at least since Frank Gifford played there.
 

Awesome Fossum

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
3,910
Austin, TX
For better or worse, on a national level, most of this country knows its universities first through college football.

I went to William & Mary, which is a known commodity ... but only regionally. I now live in Texas, and basically no one out here has ever heard of it. But they know Wake Forest. They know Purdue. They know Vanderbilt. They definitely know Miami.

Brand recognition isn't everything. But if you're a school at the top level of the sport, I wouldn't take it for granted.
 

Philip Jeff Frye

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 23, 2001
10,298
Is Miami really a better job than Oregon?
The weather is certainly nicer. Cristobal is the 2nd consecutive Oregon coach to leave for the balmy skies of the Sunshine State. Hopefully he's more successful than Willie Targgart was at FSU.

By all reports, Cristobal was an extraordinary recruiter at Oregon, but there was definitely some feeling that his teams never reached their potential and that he was not a great in-game coach. They certainly never matched their early performance against OSU this year after that game.
 

67YAZ

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 1, 2000
8,831
For better or worse, on a national level, most of this country knows its universities first through college football.

I went to William & Mary, which is a known commodity ... but only regionally. I now live in Texas, and basically no one out here has ever heard of it. But they know Wake Forest. They know Purdue. They know Vanderbilt. They definitely know Miami.

Brand recognition isn't everything. But if you're a school at the top level of the sport, I wouldn't take it for granted.
As a faculty member at Loyola Chicago, our admin has been feeding us lots of statistics about how breakout athletic success drives undergraduate applications. There’s something to the brand recognition element - especially for private universities - but is minor in the overall scheme of things. Athletic success will increase applications, which can allow you to admit larger classes and/or decrease your admit rate. This might allow you to move up a spot or two on US News college rankings and maybe, but probably not allow you to push tuition increases higher. Athletic success will generate more alumni giving, but a significant chunk of that will be earmarked back into the athletic department. You sell more T-shirts (and Harry Potter scarves), but a lot of that moneys goes back into the increased athletic dept budget

Loyola isn’t going to ride it’s men’s bball program into becoming Northwestern or U of C. It’s not going to bring enough revenue or donations to raise salaries, build research facilities, land larger grants, put up more dorms, etc. All of that is a long, complex process where athletics plays a small role.

I actually did some graduate study at Miami in the early-2000s, and that shit was as crazy as you’d imagine. Football players, and to a lesser extent baseball players did whatever they fuck they wanted and had athletic dept lackeys clean up after them.

But the football success didn’t drive the academic success. It was two consecutive transformative presidents - Edward Foote from 1981 to 2001 & Donna Shalala from 2001 to 2015 - that did the lift. Foote oversaw the rise of the football program, but he made massive investments in the student residential facilities and he leaned heavily into making UM a destination for the children of the elite across Latin America. Shalala raised and invested over $800m into the medical school and hospital, turning into a hugely profitable healthcare network. Combined, Foote and Shalala took the endowment from $40m to $1b.

Shalala, in particular, spent a lot of her political capital cleaning up after the Shapiro scandal and put the football program on a strict “pay your own way” budget. Clearly, president Julio Frenk has decided that the U needs to get back into the upper echelons of college football and is willing to pay to get there. I don’t quite understand what is driving that thinking. Given the history. I’d say the risks outweigh the rewards.

Edit: Looks like John Ruiz and pricing efforts to build a Coral Gables stadium along with the Mas brothers are driving this. A new stadium on the Coral Gables high school site is insane, but Frenk wasn’t around for the Shapiro days. He probably feels he can’t say bo to all this money being offered up.
 
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cornwalls@6

Less observant than others
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
6,295
from the wilds of western ma

E5 Yaz

polka king
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,646
Oregon
Seems like an odd move for Whipple, particularly since Frost's time at Nebraska is tenuous at this point. Maybe Whipple took a look at the post-Pickett offense and decided to jump, but it just comes off as a strange decision.

Meanwhile, son Spencer had a moment in the spotlight earlier this season when COVID led to his calling plays for the Cardinals
 

Vinho Tinto

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 9, 2003
7,074
Auburn, MA
I think Nebraska is in desperate need for someone with Whipple’s resume. They never got Martinez’s production to match his raw ability. When you look at the string of close Big 10 losses, he will have a chance to make a difference for that program.
 

E5 Yaz

polka king
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,646
Oregon
I think Nebraska is in desperate need for someone with Whipple’s resume. They never got Martinez’s production to match his raw ability. When you look at the string of close Big 10 losses, he will have a chance to make a difference for that program.
I agree. Just think it's an odd move on his part
 

EvilEmpire

paying for his sins
Moderator
SoSH Member
Apr 9, 2007
17,295
Washington
Is Whipple getting a pay raise?

If he is, I don't think it is odd at all for a coordinator to move on to a higher profile program for more money. He's 64. He needed to capitalize on the work he did with Pickett.
 

EvilEmpire

paying for his sins
Moderator
SoSH Member
Apr 9, 2007
17,295
Washington
Good news for Fresno State. Jeff Tedford is coming back to be the coach after DeBoer left for Washington. Apparently after Tedford was announced, QB Jake Haener withdrew from the transfer portal. Speculation was that he might join DeBoer with the Huskies.
 

Philip Jeff Frye

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 23, 2001
10,298
Lots of press today about Oregon trying to get Chip Kelly back. Seems like one of those "you can't go home again" things that sounds good on paper but won't live up to expectations. Kelly's offense at Oregon was revolutionary at the time but now everybody is doing it, so what's his gimmick now?
 

luckiestman

Son of the Harpy
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
32,865
Lots of press today about Oregon trying to get Chip Kelly back. Seems like one of those "you can't go home again" things that sounds good on paper but won't live up to expectations. Kelly's offense at Oregon was revolutionary at the time but now everybody is doing it, so what's his gimmick now?
He did pretty good at UCLA this year, right?
 

yeahlunchbox

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 21, 2008
788
That's an interesting choice for Kelly. Do you stay in the better recruiting area or do you go for Nike's deep pockets?
 

BringBackMo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
1,330
As a faculty member at Loyola Chicago, our admin has been feeding us lots of statistics about how breakout athletic success drives undergraduate applications. There’s something to the brand recognition element - especially for private universities - but is minor in the overall scheme of things. Athletic success will increase applications, which can allow you to admit larger classes and/or decrease your admit rate. This might allow you to move up a spot or two on US News college rankings and maybe, but probably not allow you to push tuition increases higher. Athletic success will generate more alumni giving, but a significant chunk of that will be earmarked back into the athletic department. You sell more T-shirts (and Harry Potter scarves), but a lot of that moneys goes back into the increased athletic dept budget

Loyola isn’t going to ride it’s men’s bball program into becoming Northwestern or U of C. It’s not going to bring enough revenue or donations to raise salaries, build research facilities, land larger grants, put up more dorms, etc. All of that is a long, complex process where athletics plays a small role.

I actually did some graduate study at Miami in the early-2000s, and that shit was as crazy as you’d imagine. Football players, and to a lesser extent baseball players did whatever they fuck they wanted and had athletic dept lackeys clean up after them.

But the football success didn’t drive the academic success. It was two consecutive transformative presidents - Edward Foote from 1981 to 2001 & Donna Shalala from 2001 to 2015 - that did the lift. Foote oversaw the rise of the football program, but he made massive investments in the student residential facilities and he leaned heavily into making UM a destination for the children of the elite across Latin America. Shalala raised and invested over $800m into the medical school and hospital, turning into a hugely profitable healthcare network. Combined, Foote and Shalala took the endowment from $40m to $1b.

Shalala, in particular, spent a lot of her political capital cleaning up after the Shapiro scandal and put the football program on a strict “pay your own way” budget. Clearly, president Julio Frenk has decided that the U needs to get back into the upper echelons of college football and is willing to pay to get there. I don’t quite understand what is driving that thinking. Given the history. I’d say the risks outweigh the rewards.

Edit: Looks like John Ruiz and pricing efforts to build a Coral Gables stadium along with the Mas brothers are driving this. A new stadium on the Coral Gables high school site is insane, but Frenk wasn’t around for the Shapiro days. He probably feels he can’t say bo to all this money being offered up.
Fascinating post. Thank you for this glimpse into how these things tend to work. Sounds like Foote and Shalala were terrific executives.
 

doldmoose34

impregnated Melissa Theuriau
SoSH Member
sorry guys, i haven't been on for a while and yes Red I was overjoyed when I saw the news. I've been texting back and forth with some CSU writers and fans all season, I'd start by telling them we tried to warn them, just like the Temple and Gator fans tried to warn us. If you read the article where its 'alleged' that Daz called a black janitor 'BOY' and you've watched this asshole like we have you know its 100% true. I've heard that when he was at Walpole CC he acted like his shit didn't stink and pulled he do you know who I am shit on staff and members, I've also heard he pulls the same shit at an old money course down the cape (oyster harbors? but how does a clown like him get in there, he'd have to have married into it). I just wish that CSU could use that as a firing 'for cause' to stiff him on the buyout

I spoke with the father of BC's #1 recruit last year and he said that they never would have considered BC if he was still there, and this guy is a former Eagle and long time pro player, his take was the same as mine 'an overpaid gym teacher'
 

P'tucket rhymes with...

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2006
11,649
The Coney Island of my mind

canderson

Mr. Brightside
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
39,634
Harrisburg, Pa.
Hawaii should disband the program. They have no stadium. They have no facilities And they islanders seemingly don’t give a shit.
 
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grsharky7

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
1,246
Berlin, PA
Harsin's job security in doubt

They may be looking for a new coach on the Plains soon. The SEC message boards are also on fire that Harsin was having an affair with a female staffer that he brought with him from Boise. They had a disastrous signing day and apparently lot of higher ups are not happy with him. It sounds like he has been verbally abusive to almost everyone in the football building as well.
 

canderson

Mr. Brightside
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
39,634
Harrisburg, Pa.
This seems like something they've known about a while and are using it now to fire him for cause (even though he's been close to being fired before he even coached a game there this year).
 

grsharky7

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
1,246
Berlin, PA
This seems like something they've known about a while and are using it now to fire him for cause (even though he's been close to being fired before he even coached a game there this year).
Agreed. If he had beaten Bama and didn’t have that horrible slide at the end of the year, none of this matters. My question is, who’s going there right now if they do fire him? The SEC West is super loaded with the rise of Ole Miss and Arkansas being more competitive. Add in Bama, A&M, LSU, and cross divisional game against UGA and you’re looking at a losing record as it stands now.
 

canderson

Mr. Brightside
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
39,634
Harrisburg, Pa.
Agreed. If he had beaten Bama and didn’t have that horrible slide at the end of the year, none of this matters. My question is, who’s going there right now if they do fire him? The SEC West is super loaded with the rise of Ole Miss and Arkansas being more competitive. Add in Bama, A&M, LSU, and cross divisional game against UGA and you’re looking at a losing record as it stands now.
They can have Tom Herman. Seems like a hire War Eagle would make.
 

Humphrey

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 3, 2010
3,210
Harsin's job security in doubt

They may be looking for a new coach on the Plains soon. The SEC message boards are also on fire that Harsin was having an affair with a female staffer that he brought with him from Boise. They had a disastrous signing day and apparently lot of higher ups are not happy with him. It sounds like he has been verbally abusive to almost everyone in the football building as well.
ESPN had their recruiting class at #17. It's got to be more than that.