2023-2024 General NBA Season Thread

Just a bit outside

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OKC had too many players and had to dump guys. They acquired Oladipo into cap room with 2 seconds and then traded him for 2 more seconds. Oladipo isn't great but he was never going to stay with OKC.
 

MyDaughterLovesTomGordon

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Watching OKC play Milwaukee. Lillard is having an off night, shooting 2 for 11. Still not sure what the Bucks will eventually look like.
Watched a little of that. My big takeaway was that Chet needs to put on like 50 pounds. Giannis moved him like he wasn't there.

Also: Anyone else getting a little "Russ moves to Denver" vibes from Dame going to the Bucks? Maybe it's just wishful thinking.
 

DJnVa

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Inside Ja Morant's 18-month downfall

The Ja Morant now mentioned in court documents and police reports, and the subject of multiple NBA suspensions, is not, according to Grizzlies insiders, scouts and Memphis business owners who interacted with him frequently, the Ja Morant who entered the league just four years ago.

Before being drafted by the Grizzlies with the No. 2 overall pick in 2019, scouting reports on the high-flying point guard out of mid-major Murray State revealed little in the way of red flags.

"Zero," said one veteran NBA scout who scouted Morant for a lottery team in position to draft him. "He was the consummate coachable teammate, a choirboy. Underrecruited. Didn't have many scholarship offers. Played with a chip on his shoulder. Glowing stuff. Nothing. There was absolutely nothing."
But some warning signs emerged early in his pandemic-shortened rookie season. Team sources said there were concerns about how frequently Morant, underage and often accompanied by his father, would go out drinking, and at some of Memphis' seedier establishments and strip clubs, including on nights before games.

Throughout that 2021-22 season, during which Morant was named the NBA's Most Improved Player, a pattern emerged whenever the Grizzlies traveled. After landing, a Sprinter Van would often be waiting at the team hotel to shuttle Morant out for the evening with friends and family, whom he had flown into that city on a private jet, according to team sources. Morant would cover their lodging and foot the bill at establishments they visited. In some instances, team sources said, it wasn't unusual for Morant to appear hungover, or to be late to team events the next day.
 

timelysarcasm

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Honestly, makes me really, really appreciate Jayson Tatum. Ja Morant is so talented and fun to watch, it will truly be a huge waste if he doesn't smarten up and stop trying to act tough. Marcus Smart and Derrick Rose feel like two perfect guys to lead that team and not sign off on any Morant BS, but he has to want to save himself. Also really hard when your father appears to be leading the confluence of hangers on and people dragging you down.

Also really weird, I interviewed Kevin Helms for a true crime show I worked on - he was a detective back then and now he's a glorified babysitter.
 

benhogan

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Honestly, makes me really, really appreciate Jayson Tatum. Ja Morant is so talented and fun to watch, it will truly be a huge waste if he doesn't smarten up and stop trying to act tough. Marcus Smart and Derrick Rose feel like two perfect guys to lead that team and not sign off on any Morant BS, but he has to want to save himself. Also really hard when your father appears to be leading the confluence of hangers on and people dragging you down.

Also really weird, I interviewed Kevin Helms for a true crime show I worked on - he was a detective back then and now he's a glorified babysitter.
That was my immediate thought. Really appreciate both JAYs, heck the Celtic's entire rotation seems like high-caliber people
 

BigSoxFan

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Honestly, makes me really, really appreciate Jayson Tatum. Ja Morant is so talented and fun to watch, it will truly be a huge waste if he doesn't smarten up and stop trying to act tough. Marcus Smart and Derrick Rose feel like two perfect guys to lead that team and not sign off on any Morant BS, but he has to want to save himself. Also really hard when your father appears to be leading the confluence of hangers on and people dragging you down.

Also really weird, I interviewed Kevin Helms for a true crime show I worked on - he was a detective back then and now he's a glorified babysitter.
Should also make people appreciate LeBron. 20+ years under the most intense media scrutiny possible and what’s the worst we can say about him? The Decision? Flops too much? A little uneducated about China/Taiwan situation?

There’s simply been…nothing, which is pretty admirable.
 

Leon Trotsky

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Should also make people appreciate LeBron. 20+ years under the most intense media scrutiny possible and what’s the worst we can say about him? The Decision? Flops too much? A little uneducated about China/Taiwan situation?

There’s simply been…nothing, which is pretty admirable.
Really quite the opposite - he has done some remarkable good with what he has earned.
 

Everetts Dinosaurs

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Apologies if this has been posted already, but I felt this was an interesting video on some emerging offensive trends in the NBA.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57KFEPCn9Sg
Thanks for posting it, really interesting and informative.
My question naturally goes to how much more often these sets are being run, what the point per play average is, and what it means about defensive sets and by extension roster construction. You’d think having a big who can quickly pivot to defending the 3 (I.e., what we saw from Timelord a fair bit) would be a helpful counter to that second play highlighted in the video.
Also seems like a really effective way to take a talent not naturally aligned with a trend within the game (3’s from bigs) and still get to a similar place (opening up open 3’s)
 

BigSoxFan

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Pending health, I'm 100% in on the hype. I also like him just taking the shoulder check from Holiday immediately after the nutmeg and completely ignoring it.
Was also a nifty pass at the end of the sequence. Kid’s the real deal. Just stay healthy and add some lean muscle like KG did. Going to be a force.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Watched a little of that. My big takeaway was that Chet needs to put on like 50 pounds. Giannis moved him like he wasn't there.

Also: Anyone else getting a little "Russ moves to Denver" vibes from Dame going to the Bucks? Maybe it's just wishful thinking.
Some may consider this a hot take but I have downgraded Lillard's impact significantly in my ratings this season. He's a year older, he's been taken out of his comfort zone in Portland, and now must adjust to being second banana in Milwaukee. I think he'll be good, I don't expect him to play near the level he has in the past....at least on a game-to-game basis.
 

slamminsammya

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Some may consider this a hot take but I have downgraded Lillard's impact significantly in my ratings this season. He's a year older, he's been taken out of his comfort zone in Portland, and now must adjust to being second banana in Milwaukee. I think he'll be good, I don't expect him to play near the level he has in the past....at least on a game-to-game basis.
i don't agree that it'll be a problem for him, but I do think it will be an adjustment for Gianni's suddenly having to be a roll man a lot of they want to go to that. he doesn't really do a lot of roller responsibility up to this point in his career.
 

chilidawg

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Some may consider this a hot take but I have downgraded Lillard's impact significantly in my ratings this season. He's a year older, he's been taken out of his comfort zone in Portland, and now must adjust to being second banana in Milwaukee. I think he'll be good, I don't expect him to play near the level he has in the past....at least on a game-to-game basis.
It's not a hot take if you have an actual, thought out, rationale. You're gonna have to try harder. :p
 

benhogan

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Some may consider this a hot take but I have downgraded Lillard's impact significantly in my ratings this season. He's a year older, he's been taken out of his comfort zone in Portland, and now must adjust to being second banana in Milwaukee. I think he'll be good, I don't expect him to play near the level he has in the past....at least on a game-to-game basis.
In addition to that, the BUCKs have a few other lingering issues
1. Brook Lopez getting a hair older/slower with no Jrue on the perimeter helping out
2. First-time Head Coach. New Staff
3. The tread on Middleton's tires are wearing thin, starting to feel like Kemba's Last Days
4. Malik Beasley on a multi-year slide

There is only so much defensive ground Giannis can cover.

5-wide Celtics are a terrible match-up for them

https://wisportsheroics.com/milwaukee-bucks-khris-middleton-annoyed-injury/
 

HomeRunBaker

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Wizards with a pre-season Poole Party

41 POINTZ for JP! when he averages 25ppg this year will he make the AS game?
Probably not. He'd still likely be behind Mitchell, Lillard, Haliburton, Brunson, and Garland in the pecking order. That doesn't even take into account Jaylen, Butler and DeRozan.
 

Euclis20

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Probably not. He'd still likely be behind Mitchell, Lillard, Haliburton, Brunson, and Garland in the pecking order. That doesn't even take into account Jaylen, Butler and DeRozan.
And 25 ppg is far from a lock to make the all-star team in today's NBA. Hell, he wouldn't even be the first Wizard in recent history to miss out despite putting up tons of empty points. Beal missed the all-star game in 2020 averaging 29.1 ppg at the break.
 

HomeRunBaker

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He may be running on fumes....but watching Chris Paul teaching Wiggins during a coaches challenge while one of his coaches and Steph Curry pay close attention is one of the games beautiful sights.

Not quite on the level of when Ricky Davis was teaching rookie Tony Allen how to take the extra dribble at the end of a quarter prior to the launch so you aren't dinged the FGA....but a beautiful sight nonetheless.
 

Sam Ray Not

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Wildly entertaining for a preseason game. 0-3 Kings, still salty from their playoff exit, were *really* going after it — Murray, Fox, Sabonis all played 32-36 minutes, Mike Brown was challenging random out of bounds calls midway through quarters, Sabonis/Fox were subbed back in with the Kings up double digits midway through the 4th, etc. Kings led by 18 late in the 3rd.

Not sure the 3-0 Warriors wanted it quite as badly, but I think when Kerr and Steph saw Coach Brown going after it, they got fired up to deprive him of it. In came Steph, Wiggs, and CP midway through the 4th. Fans got increasingly loud. Kings kept parading to the FT line (Fox is unstoppable in that regard), but 3 > 2. Steph puts up 16 points in the last 4 minutes — 13 points in the last 1:57 on 4-4 fg, 2-2 FT, 3-3 from 3, including the game winner off the bounce with Fox in his grill. Night night.

Great games by Fox, Murray, CP, Wiggs, and Saric. On the flipside, both Klay and Harry Barnes both look kinda washed. The fact that Steph was able to carry those two dudes to **140-24** record and a ‘chip over two seasons should only further burnish his legacy. #BetterThanMagic
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Pending health, I'm 100% in on the hype. I also like him just taking the shoulder check from Holiday immediately after the nutmeg and completely ignoring it.
This. The more impressive thing was taking a full body blow and not being driven off the line. Wemby must be a lot stronger than he looks.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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i don't agree that it'll be a problem for him, but I do think it will be an adjustment for Gianni's suddenly having to be a roll man a lot of they want to go to that. he doesn't really do a lot of roller responsibility up to this point in his career.
Wasn't the Middleton/Giannis PnR a staple of their championship run or am I having a senior moment? And one of the reasons MIL has not been as good is because Middleton has been a shell of himself b/c of injuries?

https://theathletic.com/863627/2019/03/14/not-so-secret-play-pick-and-roll-benefiting-giannis-antetokounmpo-khris-middleton-and-bucks/

Apologies if this has been posted already, but I felt this was an interesting video on some emerging offensive trends in the NBA.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57KFEPCn9Sg
Nifty stuff, thanks for posting.
 

Euclis20

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Wasn't the Middleton/Giannis PnR a staple of their championship run or am I having a senior moment? And one of the reasons MIL has not been as good is because Middleton has been a shell of himself b/c of injuries?

https://theathletic.com/863627/2019/03/14/not-so-secret-play-pick-and-roll-benefiting-giannis-antetokounmpo-khris-middleton-and-bucks/


Nifty stuff, thanks for posting.
I strongly believe that Milwaukee is better with Holiday and a healthy Middleton than with Lillard and an injured or unavailable Middleton. Obviously thats not something they can do anything about, but my point is that Middleton was a bigger part of their success than Holiday, and since he's been hurt they've had a REALLY hard time defending wings like Tatum, Brown and Butler. I know the general plan for them is to just outscore everyone and hope that the rim protection is enough to make their defense respectable, but it's hard to outscore everyone when you've only got two guys that can put up points in bunches. They need Middleton to be available and effective on both ends.
 

slamminsammya

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Wasn't the Middleton/Giannis PnR a staple of their championship run or am I having a senior moment? And one of the reasons MIL has not been as good is because Middleton has been a shell of himself b/c of injuries?

https://theathletic.com/863627/2019/03/14/not-so-secret-play-pick-and-roll-benefiting-giannis-antetokounmpo-khris-middleton-and-bucks/


Nifty stuff, thanks for posting.
only 8 pct of Gianni's possessions were as the roll man in those playoffs: https://www.nba.com/stats/players/roll-man?PerMode=Totals&SeasonType=Playoffs&SeasonYear=2020-21&dir=D&sort=POSS

caveats: synergy only counts these if it's the play that immediately leads to a shot, so Gianni's rolling and getting a pass and then kicking out wouldn't count here. but still just watching you can see he isn't really involved as a roll guy much
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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only 8 pct of Gianni's possessions were as the roll man in those playoffs: https://www.nba.com/stats/players/roll-man?PerMode=Totals&SeasonType=Playoffs&SeasonYear=2020-21&dir=D&sort=POSS

caveats: synergy only counts these if it's the play that immediately leads to a shot, so Gianni's rolling and getting a pass and then kicking out wouldn't count here. but still just watching you can see he isn't really involved as a roll guy much
This article from 2021 has the following stats; I have no idea if it's accurate. To me while I think your statement that he hasn't had "a lot of roller responsibility over his career" is accurate, he has done it, and he's done it well. And I presume he's going to do it better with Dame given Dame's gravity.

Coach Mike Budenholzer has also made it easier for his star forward. After Antetokounmpo ran into walls the past two years against Toronto and Miami, Budenholzer adjusted the Bucks offense this season to feature more picks and screens to free him from having to constantly face three defenders away from the basket.
During the playoffs, Antetokounmpo is setting 30.4 picks per 100 possessions, up from 19.1 during the regular season, according to Second Spectrum. This has made Milwaukee one of the more deadly pick-and-roll teams in the playoffs. Antetokounmpo is averaging 1.31 points per possession as the roll man in pick-and-rolls, ranking fourth in the league (minimum 20 possessions), according to NBA Advanced Stats.
 

slamminsammya

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This article from 2021 has the following stats; I have no idea if it's accurate. To me while I think your statement that he hasn't had "a lot of roller responsibility over his career" is accurate, he has done it, and he's done it well. And I presume he's going to do it better with Dame given Dame's gravity.

Coach Mike Budenholzer has also made it easier for his star forward. After Antetokounmpo ran into walls the past two years against Toronto and Miami, Budenholzer adjusted the Bucks offense this season to feature more picks and screens to free him from having to constantly face three defenders away from the basket.
During the playoffs, Antetokounmpo is setting 30.4 picks per 100 possessions, up from 19.1 during the regular season, according to Second Spectrum. This has made Milwaukee one of the more deadly pick-and-roll teams in the playoffs. Antetokounmpo is averaging 1.31 points per possession as the roll man in pick-and-rolls, ranking fourth in the league (minimum 20 possessions), according to NBA Advanced Stats.
yeah, the PPP jives with the NBA.com data, they just don't mention that very few of those 30.4 picks ended up with him shooting as the roll man. also not clear that those picks were pick and roll versus off ball. it is certainly possible his roll gravity attracted so much attention that they rarely had to go to it since things were opened up for everyone else.
 

Kliq

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Between Harden, Kawhi, Durant and Kyrie, we certainly have a very complicated legacy of players in that generation.
 

DavidTai

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File this under, "Not what I signed up for."

It's hard sometimes when you are asked to take a step back and your principles don't necessarily align with the teams direction.
Looks like your take is right.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nba/2023/10/19/terry-stotts-resigns-as-milwaukee-bucks-assistant-coach/71238603007/

The Journal Sentinel confirmed the decision, and a league source said that after going through the bulk of training camp and four preseason games a fit never materialized between the coaches. Stotts, 65, is not retiring and still plans on coaching.
 

benhogan

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Wildly entertaining for a preseason game. 0-3 Kings, still salty from their playoff exit, were *really* going after it — Murray, Fox, Sabonis all played 32-36 minutes, Mike Brown was challenging random out of bounds calls midway through quarters, Sabonis/Fox were subbed back in with the Kings up double digits midway through the 4th, etc. Kings led by 18 late in the 3rd.

Not sure the 3-0 Warriors wanted it quite as badly, but I think when Kerr and Steph saw Coach Brown going after it, they got fired up to deprive him of it. In came Steph, Wiggs, and CP midway through the 4th. Fans got increasingly loud. Kings kept parading to the FT line (Fox is unstoppable in that regard), but 3 > 2. Steph puts up 16 points in the last 4 minutes — 13 points in the last 1:57 on 4-4 fg, 2-2 FT, 3-3 from 3, including the game winner off the bounce with Fox in his grill. Night night.

Great games by Fox, Murray, CP, Wiggs, and Saric. On the flipside, both Klay and Harry Barnes both look kinda washed. The fact that Steph was able to carry those two dudes to **140-24** record and a ‘chip over two seasons should only further burnish his legacy. #BetterThanMagic
Great game, fun pre-season watch. That Sabonis Q4 sub was an eyeopener.

What does GS have in TJD?

wanted Brad to take him in the 2nd round
 

benhogan

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File this under, "Not what I signed up for."

It's hard sometimes when you are asked to take a step back and your principles don't necessarily align with the teams' direction.
I know it's a "players" league, but coaching does matter if it's in disarray. I expect MIL to have some HC growing pains, Budenholzer may have had his faults, but he did have a lot of NBA success with MIL/ATL.

Now take CJMs situation last year, with nobody on his staff having his back. It's kind of amazing that they made it to the 7th game in the ECF

In addition to that, the BUCKs have a few other lingering issues

2. First-time Head Coach. New Staff
BH earns his recent demerits back