2022 PGA Tour

Koufax

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He doesn't like golf, so no surprise there. It's all about the money for him.
 

BigSoxFan

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Rumor is Morikawa could be next. Now that would be a shocker and would really hurt.
 

BaseballJones

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It’s all about the money for all of them, yes? Play less golf, never miss a cut (i.e. work less), make a hell of a lot more money.

Doesn’t everyone basically want to work less for a lot more money?
 

joe dokes

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It’s all about the money for all of them, yes? Play less golf, never miss a cut (i.e. work less), make a hell of a lot more money.

Doesn’t everyone basically want to work less for a lot more money?
Absolutely. And the first LIV-bound golfer to admit it gets bouquets from me. Instead, the ones that have spoken up seem to regard themselves more like Curt Flood.
 

Zomp

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Koepkas press conference made it obvious he’d be joining. He was defensive right away. Morikawa’s was odd in that he hit out at the rumors and looked genuinely hurt that he was the subject of them but he stopped short in stating his intentions. The rumors of gin going are strong but so are the denials by people around him (but not from him).

Koepka going shouldn’t hurt the tour too much. He didn’t play much this year anyway. Morikawa would be tough to swallow. Schauffele less so but him too. Most who have left so far have been the “villains “ of the tour. Morikawa is well liked by pretty much everyone and has been the subject of a lot of tour social media posts.


In the end I think this ultimately leads to a compromise where LIV golfers can play on the tour and maybe they adjust their schedule to a less appealing time of year for the tour. Maybe the fall after the fed ex cup.
 

cshea

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Brooks was inevitable. He never seemed to give a shit about the Tour and I'm sure LIV signing Chase Koepka was no coincidence.

Abe Ancer is reportedly 100% off to LIV, per NLU. There's been some smoke around Hovland but his team has denied. Apparently he committed to the Travelers last week, then quietly was not on the field list the Tour releases on Friday.

Another name I heard mentioned (Justin Ray on the Fairway Rollin US Open Preview Podcast) was Joaquin Niemann. He's very, very close with Sergio.

Where's the Morikawa rumor coming from? I have not seen that yet.

It was nice having a relatively LIV free week during the Open. I think all this stuff just sucks for the fans. We can rationalize how we won't miss this guy or that guy but at the end of the day we've got a fractured profesional golf world and on one side we've got the Tour with weakened fields and player pools and on the other we've got an exhibition series backed by the Saudi's.
 

cshea

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To answer my own question about Morikawa, apparently he removed "PGA Tour" from his social media bios. Brooks did the same thing yesterday.
 

cshea

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I think the fact that these guys can still play in the majors removes the one potential significant deterrent, given that most don't seem to care about taking blood money.
It's really going to come down to OWGR. If LIV gets accepted, then there's a viable path towards LIV players playing in the Majors. If they don't, it's basically just going to be past-champion exemptions into them which only impacts a handful of the players.
 

cornwalls@6

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It’s all about the money for all of them, yes? Play less golf, never miss a cut (i.e. work less), make a hell of a lot more money.

Doesn’t everyone basically want to work less for a lot more money?
I think that’s right. But I also think when someone is blessed with rare talent, which they worked hard to develop, that competing regularly, on the best courses, against the best fields, in the toughest, truest test format, would mean something to them as well. Obviously not with many of these guys. I’m not naive enough to think the source of the money would bother them at all. We’re way past that quaint notion in our culture now. But I guess I was naïve enough to think competitive pride was still a thing. And that playing in this ridiculous joke of an exhibition format wouldn’t satisfy that. Wrong agin.
 

cshea

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Another domino is the DP World Tour (formally the Euro Tour). Right now there is a "strategic alliance" between them and the PGA Tour. If they break off from the Tour and allow LIV players to enter those events, then it's game over for the PGA Tour.
 

RedOctober3829

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Another domino is the DP World Tour (formally the Euro Tour). Right now there is a "strategic alliance" between them and the PGA Tour. If they break off from the Tour and allow LIV players to enter those events, then it's game over for the PGA Tour.
I believe I read something over the weekend that the DP tour was going to ban LIV players from playing the Scottish Open.

"According to a report in the Observer, the Scottish Open, which is co-sanctioned by the PGA Tour and the DP World Tour, will not allow the LIV Golf players to compete.

The tournament, with an absolutely stacked field, begins on 7 July at North Berwick’s Renaissance Club. It will act as part of the build up to the landmark 150th Open at St Andrews."

https://www.golfmagic.com/liv-golf/report-liv-golf-players-will-be-prevented-playing-scottish-open
 

BigSoxFan

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What could the PGA Tour do to stem the tide here? Clearly, the sternly-worded letter didn't work. You have to wonder if at some point they need to embrace it and try to have a Ryder Cup style competition between LIV and the PGA Tour, which would probably generate a ton of excitement. I know they're still trying to snuff out this league but it seems like that won't happen. Too many "names" have joined LIV. PGA Tour has to hope now that the Saudi Blood Money Tour loses its funding, for whatever reason and all these guys come groveling back. But, for now, the Saudis are probably fully on board with it given the initial success.
 

cshea

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I believe I read something over the weekend that the DP tour was going to ban LIV players from playing the Scottish Open.

"According to a report in the Observer, the Scottish Open, which is co-sanctioned by the PGA Tour and the DP World Tour, will not allow the LIV Golf players to compete.

The tournament, with an absolutely stacked field, begins on 7 July at North Berwick’s Renaissance Club. It will act as part of the build up to the landmark 150th Open at St Andrews."

https://www.golfmagic.com/liv-golf/report-liv-golf-players-will-be-prevented-playing-scottish-open
Scottish Open is a bad example since it's co-sanctioned by the PGA Tour. We'll see what they do with the regular DP World Tour Events. There were rumors they were going to let the LIV guys play in Germany this week, but I'm not sure if there's been an official announcement.
 

Ale Xander

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What could the PGA Tour do to stem the tide here? Clearly, the sternly-worded letter didn't work. You have to wonder if at some point they need to embrace it and try to have a Ryder Cup style competition between LIV and the PGA Tour, which would probably generate a ton of excitement. I know they're still trying to snuff out this league but it seems like that won't happen. Too many "names" have joined LIV. PGA Tour has to hope now that the Saudi Blood Money Tour loses its funding, for whatever reason and all these guys come groveling back. But, for now, the Saudis are probably fully on board with it given the initial success.
PGA could increase the purses, no?
 

BigSoxFan

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PGA could increase the purses, no?
In theory, yes, but aren’t all the purses just a reflection of sponsorships? Can the PGA Tour get bigger purses after losing some key household names?

The guys they’ve lost all have their warts but they’re all kind of the villains on the tour that some like to root against. Feels like we might be headed back to the early 90s period pre-Tiger and post-Jack where you had solid golfers but no real compelling characters for the casual fan to get interested in.
 

cshea

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What could the PGA Tour do to stem the tide here? Clearly, the sternly-worded letter didn't work. You have to wonder if at some point they need to embrace it and try to have a Ryder Cup style competition between LIV and the PGA Tour, which would probably generate a ton of excitement. I know they're still trying to snuff out this league but it seems like that won't happen. Too many "names" have joined LIV. PGA Tour has to hope now that the Saudi Blood Money Tour loses its funding, for whatever reason and all these guys come groveling back. But, for now, the Saudis are probably fully on board with it given the initial success.
They can't compete financially with LIV. If it's truly about the money for the players, it is probably over. I meanm the tour created PIP to try and fend off LIV and funnel more money to the top guys and keep them happy. DJ got $3 million from PIP last year with looks like loose change to the $125 million guaranteed he got from LIV. There's nothing the Tour can do to match LIV financially. And if you believe LIV's true motive is sports washing, then they don't give a shit if they loose money every year.

The Tour's best chance in that scenario is to strengthen their allegiance with the DP World Tour, lean on OWGR and the Majors to ban the LIV players, and hope to isolate LIV as a traveling exhibition series. In that case, as the years go on, LIV players will drift away from the professional scene.

They can also look to create some sort of internal elite series where the top 48-64 PGA Tour players can play a LIV-like, PGA Tour series. Some sort of build out where they take current PGA Tour stops and elevate them into this elite series while maintaining the full year long schedule, and perhaps adding a few alternate stops to keep the non-elite majority of the membership happy and playing.
 

E5 Yaz

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This sounds like a P&G question, but do you pour milk in your cereal or pour cereal in your milk?
 

cornwalls@6

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Scheffler and Thomas are the other two I would imagine the PGA is working overtime to keep. Rory, Morikawa, JT, and Scheffler gives them a very good core to mitigate some of these other defections. And would also bolster any of the majors that may decide to take a hard line.
 

cshea

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Scheffler and Thomas are the other two I would imagine the PGA is working overtime to keep. Rory, Morikawa, JT, and Scheffler gives them a very good core to mitigate some of these other defections. And would also bolster any of the majors that may decide to take a hard line.
They don't have to worry about JT. Basically the trio of Rory, JT and Rahm have pledged loyalty to the Tour. Haven't really heard much one way or another about Scheffler.
 

cornwalls@6

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They don't have to worry about JT. Basically the trio of Rory, JT and Rahm have pledged loyalty to the Tour. Haven't really heard much one way or another about Scheffler.
Hadn't heard that about JT, but good to know. Have obviously followed Rory's outspoken criticism of LIV. And yeah, Rahm is a big one too. Would be great to get a public commitment from Scheffler, as I think he is going to be a top 3 player in the word for many years to come.
 

FL4WL3SS

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Koepka make sense. He doesn't care at all about normal tour events so he might as well make more money to not care. Morikawa is incredibly surprising.

Faldo is retiring: https://www.golfmonthly.com/news/sir-nick-faldo-announces-retirement-from-broadcasting

I've liked him as an announcer. Sadly, Brandel Chamblee marches on.
Well fuck, I love Faldo.

I'm losing interest in watching golf altogether because of this LIV thing. I don't really care who pays these guys, but it's annoying to have a split league.
 

JOBU

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This sounds like a P&G question, but do you pour milk in your cereal or pour cereal in your milk?
The only time is acceptable to pour cereal into your milk is when you’re having a second bowl and it’s going into the leftover milk. Ridiculous question.
 

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat

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In fairness, Brooks scoffed at the idea last week too.
Did he? It didn’t strike me that way. I just saw him going after the media for creating drama instead of focusing on the US Open. When asked about playing somewhere else, his initial response was that there weren’t any other options until last week.
 

RedOctober3829

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Did he? It didn’t strike me that way. I just saw him going after the media for creating drama instead of focusing on the US Open. When asked about playing somewhere else, his initial response was that there weren’t any other options until last week.
He got real defensive when asked about it last week and didn't come out like Thomas, etc. did against it. I think he knew he was gone and didn't want to announce it when everybody else did because he didn't want to deal with the blowback those others got.
 

BigSoxFan

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Is there any resource that summarizes the estimated take for each guy joining LIV? Would be curious to see what a guy like Koepka could command.
 

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat

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He got real defensive when asked about it last week and didn't come out like Thomas, etc. did against it. I think he knew he was gone and didn't want to announce it when everybody else did because he didn't want to deal with the blowback those others got.
Oh I agree. I would have bet he was gone after seeing his press conference
 

E5 Yaz

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Is there any resource that summarizes the estimated take for each guy joining LIV? Would be curious to see what a guy like Koepka could command.
I'd like to see one of these guys who turns it down detail the offer they got. I'm curious at the stuff beyond the money guarantee ... because, at some point, someone pays you $100M to play for them, they pretty much can dictate what you say and do.
 

Freddy Linn

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Where it rains. No, seriously.
I'm with Jimmy Dunne. This is a good read.

https://www.si.com/golf/news/one-of-golfs-most-connected-amateurs-has-much-to-say-on-liv-and-none-of-it-positive

“I don't like it when they say they're 'growing the game,’” Dunne said. “That's crap. I don't even like it when they say 'I have to do what's best for my family.' I really wonder how many of those guys, the lifestyle that they were living was so horrible that their family needed them to do this. Just say, 'I'm at a point in my career where I (want to) make five times as much money against much weaker competition and play less.' Just tell the truth. Don't cover it with a lot of crap.”
This is all unfolding so fast, and the future is so hard to predict accurately. But the truth is that guys who grab the cash don’t really understand what awaits them. Eight-figure guarantees sound great. But they come with a price.

“I spoke to one player that has not gone but may,” Dunne said. “He was down in Florida and was thinking about it. The head (LIV) guy called him ... 'you gotta come over today, so-and-so is only going to be here from 1 to 5.' The guy says 'I can't.' 'You don't understand. We're telling you to come now.'”

He says once you sign up with the Saudis, “you're kind of with them.”

And you’re beholden to them?

“Yeah. And their moods can change.”
 

RedOctober3829

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I'd like to see one of these guys who turns it down detail the offer they got. I'm curious at the stuff beyond the money guarantee ... because, at some point, someone pays you $100M to play for them, they pretty much can dictate what you say and do.
I can justify somebody who isn't in the top 20 or 30 or someone starting out their career deciding to go there for the guaranteed money But for guys like Phil, DJ, and Koepka who have made their money and have a big enough brand to make money for the rest of their lives between playing the PGA Tour, Champions Tour, endorsements/appearance fees/global ambassador etc. I just don't see the allure. Is this LIV tour really worth risking your reputation over?
 

E5 Yaz

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I can justify somebody who isn't in the top 20 or 30 or someone starting out their career deciding to go there for the guaranteed money But for guys like Phil, DJ, and Koepka who have made their money and have a big enough brand to make money for the rest of their lives between playing the PGA Tour, Champions Tour, endorsements/appearance fees/global ambassador etc. I just don't see the allure. Is this LIV tour really worth risking your reputation over?
Agreed .. which is why I would like to see the offer that, for instance, Morikawa got