2021-22 NBA Off-season Thread

[PedroKsBambino]

Honestly, watching the Bucks-Nets, it’s Giannis’ passing that stands out as his weakness to me. Teams can sag but he still beats that defense more often than not. But when he gets in trouble he usually rifles a pass that puts his teammates out of position. They also seem to be out of the play a lot.

That said, he is still awesome, has a good title shot this year, and I would trade everything but Tatum for him.

I believe it was in this thread earlier that HRB and I were asking the question whether you can build a great offense around Giannis, and above is one of the concerns. He's an outstanding player, offensively and defensively, but he has real limitations too. It would be really fascinating to know how much they have tried to get him to diversify his game---has had worked on a traditional post game? Have they thought about more PnR stuff? etc. The drive and sort of dish game just doesn't look like a top-tier approach in the playoffs.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Giannis has also never played with anyone better than Kris Middleton. Giannis aint the problem.

 

[OurF'ingCity]

Putting aside his stats I really can't root against Giannis (unless he's playing the Celtics) because it would have been so easy for him - indeed, it would have been the expected move - to force his way out of Milwaukee and team up with another superstar, but he didn't do that. For that reason alone I am rooting for him to succeed.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Putting aside his stats I really can't root against Giannis (unless he's playing the Celtics) because it would have been so easy for him - indeed, it would have been the expected move - to force his way out of Milwaukee and team up with another superstar, but he didn't do that. For that reason alone I am rooting for him to succeed.

Yeah, he seems grounded in a Tim Duncan kind of way. Hard not to root for him.

 

[lovegtm]

The quality of posts in the Port Cellar over I don't know, maybe the past 18 months, has gone significantly downhill. I know the Celtics season was miserable, but it feels like just a few serial posters constantly pushing the same thoughts/agendas and a bunch of people overreacting to recent results. Giannis had a fantastic series if you look at the stats (and his team won) and if you look at the posts surrounding the series and you would think he laid an egg. Maybe I've just gotten more ornery, IDK, but I've personally become significantly less engaged in the forum as it has sort of devolved into sports-talk radio, with the same callers bringing up the same points.

I'm excited for more galaxy-brain analysis about how Giannis shooting 30% on wide-open 3s is a Good Thing, Actually. And constant citing of points/rebound/assist lines is the cutting analysis I'm here for.

(Side note: the idea that criticizing Giannis and the Bucks is recency bias is kind of hilarious, given that they've had the exact same problems 3 years running and happened to luck out this year when 2 of the other team's 3 stars completely fell apart physically.)

 

[Jimbodandy]

There's a case to be made that our obsession with high percentage long range shooting is myopic, when you look at the teams still dancing. Sure, a healthy Nets and Lakers would be there instead, but I'm not sure why the results don't indicate to people that there is more than one way to skin a cat.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Agreed---I certainly think it is not the 1980s anymore, but it is also true that there are models other than the recent GS Warriors model that work too.

The Lakers show this is true---they play a lot bigger even in the playoffs than many want the Celtics to

 

[Cesar Crespo]

I'm excited for more galaxy-brain analysis about how Giannis shooting 30% on wide-open 3s is a Good Thing, Actually. And constant citing of points/rebound/assist lines is the cutting analysis I'm here for.

(Side note: the idea that criticizing Giannis and the Bucks is recency bias is kind of hilarious, given that they've had the exact same problems 3 years running and happened to luck out this year when 2 of the other team's 3 stars completely fell apart physically.)

Him shooting 30% isn't good for the short term. The hope is it's good for the long term. If Marcus Smart stopped shooting 3s after his first 4 years (321/1094, .293), he'd be much worse off because of it.

All teams have problems and there is a reason why all of us wanted the C's to make the playoffs when Jaylen was healthy. Injuries happen. I also don't really see how Giannis is the problem at all in Milwaukee. He hasn't played with the best of teams or a real number 2. Giannis is also 26 years old. The fact he hasn't won it all yet isn't that shocking.

Plus one could easily argue the Bucks were incredibly unlucky last year and that Covid derailed their season. And winning any title in the pros involves lucking out a bit.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Agreed---I certainly think it is not the 1980s anymore, but it is also true that there are models other than the recent GS Warriors model that work too.

The Lakers show this is true---they play a lot bigger even in the playoffs than many want the Celtics to

Being bigger and longer is a huge advantage as long as those bigger and longer players are players who can switch and shoot. Although Anthony Davis is a far worse 3 point shooter than I remember him being.

 

[DJnVa]

View: https://twitter.com/barstoolsports/status/1407746541176172548?s=21

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

Putting aside his stats I really can't root against Giannis (unless he's playing the Celtics) because it would have been so easy for him - indeed, it would have been the expected move - to force his way out of Milwaukee and team up with another superstar, but he didn't do that. For that reason alone I am rooting for him to succeed.

Agree with this. And though I don't watch many Giannis games, from the ones I do see, he plays as hard as anyone in the NBA.

 

[DJnVa]

My guess is Harden backs out because of hamstring. Boooker backs out after his team makes it to the finals and goes late into the summer

Harden out, Jerami Grant in.

 

[Euclis20]

Agree with this. And though I don't watch many Giannis games, from the ones I do see, he plays as hard as anyone in the NBA.

Yup, and in my mind his issues are similar to Westbrook's. They are both physically and athletically dominating in fast paced games and they play with a level of effort and intensity in the regular season that's really unheard of for a couple of all-NBA guys. In the playoffs, everybody's effort goes up a level and everything down the stretch slows down and turns into half court battles in which their weaknesses are highlighted. They are fun to watch and easy to root for for all of these reasons, but they ultimately can't seem to up their games in the playoffs the way you usually have to to win a title.

 

[cardiacs]

 

[RedOctober3829]

ESPN says Pacers are hiring Rick Carlisle to a 4-year contract.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Again? I mean, it was awhile ago.

 

[Cellar-Door]

View: https://twitter.com/espn_macmahon/status/1408094380485922817

Carlisle REALLY doesn't want the Mavs to be better without him

 

[cheech13]

View: https://twitter.com/espn_macmahon/status/1408094380485922817

Carlisle REALLY doesn't want the Mavs to be better without him

Was Kidd one of the myriad of players that hated Carlisle? Can’t quite tell if he’s throwing shade here or just being cute.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Was Kidd one of the myriad of players that hated Carlisle? Can’t quite tell if he’s throwing shade here or just being cute.

They are actually close. Kidd played his most games under Carlisle.

https://clutchpoints.com/mavs-news-rick-carlisle-at-a-loss-for-words-after-news-of-jason-kidds-firing/

 

[radsoxfan]

Kidd is the perfect recommendation.

There are reasons on the surface it makes sense and could be genuine, but also will almost certainly make Carlisle look like a good coach in retrospect.

 

[DeadlySplitter]

"The Dallas Mavericks are closing in on the hiring a new GM and Jason Kidd has emerged as a strong frontrunner to be hired as head coach, sources tell @espn_macmahon and me." - Woj

View: https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1408196737974497284

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Shouldn't they hire a GM who should than hire the coach? That just seems backwards to me?

 

[cheech13]

Shouldn't they hire a GM who should than hire the coach? That just seems backwards to me?

That would make sense, but given the way it is worded I think the new GM and coach are either a package deal or on the same page. Let’s be honest Cuban is the actual GM there and who ever they bring in will be GM in name only. It’s probably just going to be a promotion for Michael Finley.

 

[jon abbey]

That would make sense, but given the way it is worded I think the new GM and coach are either a package deal or on the same page. Let’s be honest Cuban is the actual GM there and who ever they bring in will be GM in name only. It’s probably just going to be a promotion for Michael Finley.

View: https://twitter.com/espn_macmahon/status/1408215143272615939?s=20

 

[jon abbey]

View: https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1408234349506404355?s=20

 

[ifmanis5]

KD is so extremely online.
View: https://twitter.com/KDTrey5/status/1408470472581394440

Once again, I don’t even talk like this…plus I don’t have a relationship with Jackie for us to have in depth conversations about my intentions as a basketball player. I get she plays an opinion based sport but she framed this like we are friends. We are not..

 

[Sam Ray Not]

I still like KD for all his flaws, but anyone on the other side of a conflict with Jackie MacMullan (mild as this one seems to be) can eff off.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Shouldn't they hire a GM who should than hire the coach? That just seems backwards to me?

The Dallas infrastructure is different than other organizations in how Cuban is so hands on. I did see a quote from Mark stating that those candidates he has spoken to are on the same page as he is in regards to Kidd. What that really sounds like is that the new GM will be Cuban’s yes-man like other GM’s have or are when employed by a hands on owner.

 

[Kliq]

I still like KD for all his flaws, but anyone on the other side of a conflict with Jackie MacMullan (mild as this one seems to be) can eff off.

Hmmm...Jackie's entire career is basically going to games/practices/shootarounds and talking to the players and coaches. KD is kind of playing her off like she is Skip or Stephen A., seems kind of suspicious. Not a great fight to pick if you are KD.

 

[Mystic Merlin]

I don’t think her statement suggest she feels she and Durant are friends, like, at all.

 

[lexrageorge]

I had no problem with KD's post until he did the "framed this like we're friends" nonsense, because she clearly did not (and everyone knows it), and he used that to simply take a shot at her for no real reason.

 

[Tony C]

What a weird dude he is. This is totally inconsequential, but...doesn't KD have better things to do than pick lame internet fights?

 

[Tony C]

having randomly clicked on the KD link, it led me randomly to this, too:

https://cavaliersnation.com/2021/06/25/jalen-rose-says-team-usa-lacked-courage-to-have-only-black-players-kevin-love-is-on-the-team-because-of-tokenism/

gotta say -- fully agree with Jalen that Love being on the team is a joke. I'd like to think it's not tokenism, but honestly really hard to see any other reason for Love's presence. If he had any dignity, he'd turn down the invite.

 

[Humphrey]

having randomly clicked on the KD link, it led me randomly to this, too:

https://cavaliersnation.com/2021/06/25/jalen-rose-says-team-usa-lacked-courage-to-have-only-black-players-kevin-love-is-on-the-team-because-of-tokenism/

gotta say -- fully agree with Jalen that Love being on the team is a joke. I'd like to think it's not tokenism, but honestly really hard to see any other reason for Love's presence. If he had any dignity, he'd turn down the invite.

Having Love on the team is a separate issue from having an all Black team given that the last several Olympic teams were all Black save for the other team Love was on (and at that point he was more than good enough to earn that one). Why would that suddenly be an issue in 2021?
And, peripherally, Ayton is not a US citizen. https://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2021/06/22/suns-big-deandre-ayton-ideal-team-usa-2024-summer-olympics-paris/5307682001/

 

[OurF'ingCity]

I’m guessing it’s just because Love is (a) available and (b) Team USA needs size. He’s also a seasoned veteran on a team with a ton of young players.

If I were Colangelo/Pop I’m not sure I would have made the same decision, but calling it tokenism seems like a stretch.

 

[bankshot1]

Listening to the Jackie Mac BSG podcast, her comments about KD seemed innocent and pretty complimentary about him as a person. Not sure why KD went off on her, and questioned her integrity. The power dynamic is sort of one-way, and he could freeze her out, but unless she's totally full of shit, which seems way way way out of character, I hope she blasts the shit out of him.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

My guess is that this doesn't even register on the scale on which MacMullan operates. I suspect she's heard far, far worse in her career.

 

[bankshot1]

For a HoF journalist, who seems to be a straight shooter, have her integrity questioned by the game's biggest star has to sting. Unless she fabricated her convo, she must be pissed.

 

[Conigliaro's Potential]

Need a white guy on the Olympic team? K'Von the Ginger Mamba is available, and white enough to fill several quotas.

 

[EvilEmpire]

I choose to interpret KD's comment a different way. If Jackie reported it, it is almost certainly from someone close to KD. The source could be lying, sure. But if it is true, a reason KD might react that way isn't because it is a lie, but because his feelings on the Nets have soured and he's already thinking about his next team and doesn't want to have that statement thrown in his face when he decides to leave the and join the Knicks.

 

[jmcc5400]

The Dallas infrastructure is different than other organizations in how Cuban is so hands on. I did see a quote from Mark stating that those candidates he has spoken to are on the same page as he is in regards to Kidd. What that really sounds like is that the new GM will be Cuban’s yes-man like other GM’s have or are when employed by a hands on owner.

The history of the Dallas infrastructure being so hands on (https://www.si.com/nba/2018/02/21/dallas-mavericks-sexual-misconduct-investigation-mark-cuban-response) makes it particularly gross that the Mavs would hire someone with Kidd's history of domestic abuse.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

KD is so extremely online.
View: https://twitter.com/KDTrey5/status/1408470472581394440

Once again, I don’t even talk like this…plus I don’t have a relationship with Jackie for us to have in depth conversations about my intentions as a basketball player. I get she plays an opinion based sport but she framed this like we are friends. We are not..

The actual quote is in the tweet below. I'm sure it's pretty normal for reporters to do what JMac did - frame things like they actually have access to the person - but funny that KD would come out and shoot it down so directly.

View: https://twitter.com/TheJManJBT/status/1408364782919454721

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

I don’t think her statement suggest she feels she and Durant are friends, like, at all.

No but her statement suggests that she had a personal conversation with KD, and KD is saying that they didn't have one.

 

[bankshot1]

I listened to the relevant section of the Jackie Mac podcast again (last 12 minutes FYI) and its possible that KD is pissed about the semi-psychoanalysis Jackie does on KD
"(paraphrase) he's searching for something he's never going to find, an inner peace, joy that's just never going to happen for him, I wish that weren't true, but that's my personal opinion....

seems like a lot to say, if you never talked to the guy

 

[Cellar-Door]

I think it's pretty simple.... Jackie Mac has talked to KD, probably many times. She's extrapolating from that to build a profile of KD and guessing what he's thinking. It pissed him off because they don't really have a relationship and certainly while they have "Talked" not about the kinds of things or in the depth that he feels she can legitimately claim any insight into how he thinks or feels. He feels like her saying "in talking to him" she is using superficial conversations about games and basketball to lend weight to her own wild conjecture.

Jackie Mac is really good on a lot of things, but like a lot of sportswriters, she also makes grand pronouncements about player mentality and thought process based on very little other than guesses about guys and uses access as a way of propping up those statements as if they came from things they were told by the player, rather then their opinion.

 

[JohnnyTheBone]

I still like KD for all his flaws, but anyone on the other side of a conflict with Jackie MacMullan (mild as this one seems to be) can eff off.

Jackie really soiled herself during Deflategate. I used to admire her, but she lost me forever with her reactionary hot-take idiocy in the midst of those heady times. She is on the wrong side of history there, and has to wear it forever. The real scandal is what the league perpetrated against Brady and the Patriots, and she was too blind to see it.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

I’m guessing it’s just because Love is (a) available and (b) Team USA needs size. He’s also a seasoned veteran on a team with a ton of young players.

If I were Colangelo/Pop I’m not sure I would have made the same decision, but calling it tokenism seems like a stretch.

The debate is silly imo. Love checked off several boxes in that he has international experience, he’ll be available for day one of practice (important since many won’t yet be there), and his game is suited for international play. Why does the talk sound like Love shouldn’t even be in the league? He was injured and returned to an awful situation for his game playing in Cleveland with two young guards. The last game he played this year he dropped a 30/14. I have no problem with Love on the team.

 

[benhogan]

The debate is silly imo. Love checked off several boxes in that he has international experience, he’ll be available for day one of practice (important since many won’t yet be there), and his game is suited for international play. Why does the talk sound like Love shouldn’t even be in the league? He was injured and returned to an awful situation for his game playing in Cleveland with two young guards. The last game he played this year he dropped a 30/14. I have no problem with Love on the team.

I agree. All-Star/USA exhibition teams are a silly debate. BUT Kevin Love is pretty pedestrian now. I know you were interested in adding KL to the C's last season but the dude is cooked. No defense & doubt he'd be a top offensive option when on the floor, so what value will he provide? cheerleader/towel waver? picks up Pops dinner and wine tab?

The team would be better off with a defense-first 5 (behind Bam). I could easily name a dozen players I'd take ahead of him and would rather give the spot to a younger more deserving player.

If a token white guy is necessary (which is silly) Joe Harris would provide more value from 3.

 

[Rook05]

I love watching KD, and what he did this year after the achilles is remarkable. He’s just an absolute freak, and I hope he has a great run after his crap luck.

But the only person that can make KD be happy and at peace with whatever his career goals is KD. The man is so completely thin skinned that it’s hard not to see it as anything other than some serious insecurity issues. Listening to him shit all over the “blog boys” in one of BS’s podcasts was the first glimpse of it for me. He just has to react to everything. I’m sure it’s part of what fuels him, but jeez, dude, it’s not like people are arguing where he slots in the top 50 all time—people are comparing him to Jordan and LeBron!

I’m frankly tired of his bitching. It should be beneath him, and often comes across as punching down.

Of course, I’m willing to forget reverting if he shanks Kyrie in the off-season.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

I love watching KD, and what he did this year after the achilles is remarkable. He’s just an absolute freak, and I hope he has a great run after his crap luck.

But the only person that can make KD be happy and at peace with whatever his career goals is KD. The man is so completely thin skinned that it’s hard not to see it as anything other than some serious insecurity issues. Listening to him shit all over the “blog boys” in one of BS’s podcasts was the first glimpse of it for me. He just has to react to everything. I’m sure it’s part of what fuels him, but jeez, dude, it’s not like people are arguing where he slots in the top 50 all time—people are comparing him to Jordan and LeBron!

I’m frankly tired of his bitching. It should be beneath him, and often comes across as punching down.

Of course, I’m willing to forget reverting if he shanks Kyrie in the off-season.

How do any of us know he isn't at peace already? Some people just like to bitch.

And that's kind of what KD is bitching about. Everyone is trying to be KD's shrink.