16 Days in January—Determining Trade Deadline Activity
- Thread starter RSN Diaspora
- Start date
I was going to say this is nuts, but I think Jaylen lucks out a bit that he is listed as a guard. If he was frontcourt, I think he would have zero chance
Rookie Head Coach is pressing with heavy vet minutes. Straight from the Cellar
Guess Bullpett must be a coaching savant to have figured that out
Sengun has looked legit from Day 1
Kemba signing, the gift that keeps on giving...
This fake trade brings to mind a completely unrelated question. A Schroeder for Jalen Smith trade was floated at one point. Do any of the CBA experts know the implications for Smith's bird rights given that he had his option declined by Phoenix?
I ask because I wonder if there is the framework of a "Beal demands a trade to Boston" trade, I always assumed that Washington would try to unload that extremely bad Bertans contract.
Something like Horford, Richardson, Schroder out, 1sts to Washington for Beal and Bertans. With maybe Schroder to PHX for Smith and Richardson to CHI for a package centered on Coby White, and those players going with Horford and firsts to Washington.
Not a CBA expert but when I looked at this, because PHO did not tender him, they are prohibited from re-signing him above a certain amount (I think it's any amount over the tender iIRC). That restriction would apply to any team that acquired him.
Someone I'm sure will correct me if I am misremembering.
why would anyone really care about Jalen Smith? especially the Wizards who have Gafford/Bryant. I imagine they would rather have DS
It's immaterial, they can just take DS if that makes the fake trade better. Lol, we've had many "trade DS for a guy on a rookie deal" fake trades, I'm just basing it on one that floated around the forum previously. That said, people said "Why is Cleveland acquiring Markannen, they have Kevin Love and Jarrett Allen and Evan Mobley" and stuff like that.
If Smith turns into a player, you can trade him, or you can trade Thomas Bryant if Smith fits your updated non-Beal timeline. I realize this forum is smarter than actual NBA organizations, but multiple teams have run two big lineups in recent memory (including the Celtics!)
Houston isn’t trading Jalen Smith unless there are off the court things going on like him hanging out with Z-Bo’s old posse. They sure as heck aren’t trading him for an expiring contract lol.
That’s what I get for logging in at 2am while watching the Australian Open. Carry on.
The question wasn't really pointed at you and all the fake trade stuff is just a fun exercise (hence your legit question about his contract). Dennis Schroder will have more value to a contender than a 3rd/4th string center on an expiring/busted rookie deal.
As far as 2BIGZzz, it's semantics. Playing 2 or 3 or 4 TALL players together is fine if your roster is built that way and the TALL players have the skills/pace of a wing on defense/offense. In theory, Al Horford would be that guy. 35yrd old Al isn't anymore IMO. Keeping Al and Rob fresh by having them share the 5 might help team productivity in the short-term while looking out for their health over the long NBA season. In addition to that playing them together also forces the use of your 3rd Center, Enes Freedom. Which isn't a great idea, if your defensive identity is switch everything.
But you know these NBA organizations are run by infallible rocket scientists and experienced Head Coaches. Far be it that any of us mouth breathers question their wisdom under any circumstances, on a forum built to discuss such topics
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Al would be more like that guy if he just stayed in the right corner (although he might trip over Romeo when he was in the game
) as, according to this article:[while Al is] converting 28.4 percent of his three-point attempts [], he's 11/23 (47.8 percent) on his long-range looks from the right corner, per NBA.com.
That's a small sample size, but it suggests he should be taking more shots from there and fewer from above the break, where he's 30/122 (24.6%). Horford's only taken four field goals from there in the last four games, and he's 2/4.
Among Al, RL, and GW, the Cs have the right corner covered.
Ha, I was just looking at Horford's Corner3% the other dayAl would be more like that guy if he just stayed in the right corner (although he might trip over Romeo when he was in the game
[while Al is] converting 28.4 percent of his three-point attempts [], he's 11/23 (47.8 percent) on his long-range looks from the right corner, per NBA.com.That's a small sample size, but it suggests he should be taking more shots from there and fewer from above the break, where he's 30/122 (24.6%). Horford's only taken four field goals from there in the last four games, and he's 2/4.
Among Al, RL, and GW, the Cs have the right corner covered.
Love that right side of the floor/Romeo chart you posted before.
whatever helps spread the floor now that Tatum is the Downhill Rim Maestro
It's interesting that Horford's ineptitude from behind the arc doesn't get more discussion. He's really fallen off a cliff this season. Career .356, this season .284. It's even more stunning because I would hazard a guess that every single attempt would be considered "wide open".
Unfortunately, with Williams and Horford on the floor there is just no spacing because teams do not cover them at all near the 3 point line.
Unfortunately, with Williams and Horford on the floor there is just no spacing because teams do not cover them at all near the 3 point line.
not quite all, but about 3/4 of his 3s are wide open, he's shooting 30% on them.
I think it's getting a bit less attention in part because a bunch of really good 3pt shooters have also fallen off cliffs (Tatum, Beal, Lillard notably).
Anyone who's interesting in Jalen Smith should wait until the offseason because any team acquiring him would be at a huge disadvantage contract wise.
OK, you made me look. Collated Horford's shooting splits from various spots on the court for last four years from NBA.com. From eyeballing the numbers, it sSeems like he is shooting non 3Ps basically around career averages. He shooting right corner 3Ps much better on a small sample size but he is quite low on above the break 3Ps.
If he was up to 37% on ATB 3Ps, he'd have made something around 25 of them instead of 10. 15 3Ps = 45 points = about a point a game. So if JT and Al alone were shooting to career norms, the Cs would probably be 2+ ppg better and they'd definitely be in the top 4.
I don't have time to check whether his shots in the past have been more or less open than his shots this year but it's hard to imagine that Al could have been left more open in the past than he has been this year.
But as the SI article says, he's 2-4 on ATB 3Ps in recent games so maybe he's about to go on a tear?
Restricted Area
In The Paint (Non-RA)
Mid-Range
Left Corner 3
Right Corner 3
Above the Break 3
FGM |
FGA |
FG% |
FGM
%AST |
FGM
%UAST | |
| 2021-22 | 50 |
70 |
71.4 |
66.0 |
34.0 |
| 2020-21 | 46 |
77 |
59.7 |
65.2 |
34.8 |
| 2019-20 | 110 |
158 |
69.6 |
64.5 |
35.5 |
| 2018-19 | 148 |
206 |
71.8 |
79.1 |
20.9 |
In The Paint (Non-RA)
FGM |
FGA |
FG% |
FGM
%AST |
FGM
%UAST | |
| 2021-22 | 43 |
80 |
53.8 |
65.1 |
34.9 |
| 2020-21 | 36 |
70 |
51.4 |
44.4 |
55.6 |
| 2019-20 | 40 |
111 |
36.0 |
47.5 |
52.5 |
| 2018-19 | 73 |
143 |
51.0 |
54.8 |
45.2 |
Mid-Range
FGM |
FGA |
FG% |
FGM
%AST |
FGM
%UAST | |
| 2021-22 | 17 |
39 |
43.6 |
76.5 |
23.5 |
| 2020-21 | 24 |
61 |
39.3 |
58.3 |
41.7 |
| 2019-20 | 70 |
157 |
44.6 |
64.3 |
35.7 |
| 2018-19 | 93 |
170 |
54.7 |
84.9 |
15.1 |
Left Corner 3
FGM |
FGA |
FG% |
FGM
%AST |
FGM
%UAST | |
| 2021-22 | 5 |
17 |
29.4 |
100 |
0.0 |
| 2020-21 | 3 |
7 |
42.9 |
100 |
0.0 |
| 2019-20 | 4 |
15 |
26.7 |
100 |
0.0 |
| 2018-19 | 4 |
9 |
44.4 |
100 |
0.0 |
Right Corner 3
FGM |
FGA |
FG% |
FGM
%UAST |
FGM
%UAST | |
| 2021-22 | 11 |
23 |
47.8 |
90.9 |
9.1 |
| 2020-21 | 1 |
11 |
9.1 |
100 |
0.0 |
| 2019-20 | 6 |
22 |
27.3 |
100 |
0.0 |
| 2018-19 | 2 |
12 |
16.7 |
100 |
0.0 |
Above the Break 3
FGM |
FGA |
FG% |
FGM
%UAST |
FGM
%UAST | |
| 2021-22 | 30 |
122 |
24.6 |
96.7 |
3.3 |
| 2020-21 | 52 |
134 |
38.8 |
92.3 |
7.7 |
| 2019-20 | 89 |
246 |
36.2 |
97.8 |
2.2 |
| 2018-19 | 67 |
182 |
36.8 |
100 |
0.0 |
NBA.com - stats / players (find Horford) / Tracking + Shots Dashboard.
NBA.com stats are a little hard to navigate at first but there's a ton of information if you know where to look.
None of these are the same though.
We wanted Sengun, but ultimately didn’t chose him.
We had Strus, didn’t want him, let him go.
We didn’t want Bane at all.
So since today is "Marcus Smart is eligible for trade" day....
Eric Pincus (BR national writer) mentioned that the three guys the Mavericks are looking hard at in deals are: John Collins, Jerami Grant, and Marcus Smart.
I don't see an obvious trade fit honestly, Brunson makes some sense for BOS, but he's a FA and reportedly asking for 4/80, and he might get it from DET. Kleber? I guess you could look at adding Al in and Porzingis coming back, but I'm not sure either team is interested in that, Celtics probably don't want to lock in that Porzingis deal, and DAL finally has him playing well and are looking at the 4 seed in the West.
Eric Pincus (BR national writer) mentioned that the three guys the Mavericks are looking hard at in deals are: John Collins, Jerami Grant, and Marcus Smart.
I don't see an obvious trade fit honestly, Brunson makes some sense for BOS, but he's a FA and reportedly asking for 4/80, and he might get it from DET. Kleber? I guess you could look at adding Al in and Porzingis coming back, but I'm not sure either team is interested in that, Celtics probably don't want to lock in that Porzingis deal, and DAL finally has him playing well and are looking at the 4 seed in the West.
Collins game has been everywhere. Report just out today that Atlanta turned down Collins & Reddish for Simmons. He seems almost certain to go. Smart mentioned in multiple trades as well which indicates something is up. My rule of thumb at deadline is to ignore noise of a player heading to any individual team…..but when multiple teams are mentioned with the player it’s a strong sign he’s on the move.
Would you trade Smart for Devonte Graham? Perhaps need NOLA to add in a swap or lesser of their pick supply?
This part I disagree with. I think Brad is willing to talk about anyone whose name doesn't start with J (unless it ends with "osh Richardson") and is even willing to deal any of them if the return is right. So the talks are happening. I'm sure Brad has his price for Smart but I dpn't expect any team to meet it.
Philly Inquirer story said that ATL entertained Collins, Reddish, and 1st round pick for Simmons but ended discussions when PHI tried to include Harris: https://www.inquirer.com/sixers/ben-simmons-sixers-kings-tobias-harris-tyrese-haliburton-trade-rumors-20220119.html?utm_source=t.co&utm_campaign=edit_social_share_twitter_traffic&utm_medium=social&utm_content=&utm_term=&int_promo=.
Hard pass.
or uhann Begarin. Though I'd rather they keep him and I doubt he has much value around the league.
Probably not. I don't like his size/defense, he has Kemba abused in the playoffs vibes. Maybe if they added someone like Herb Jones?
He could easily be a throw in as part of a larger deal. Otherwise, not going anywhere.
Funny you say that as my self-description of Devonte is a poor man’s prime Kemba.
https://theathletic.com/3090086/2022/01/25/celtics-at-the-trade-deadline-logical-fit-for-a-dennis-schroder-deal-building-around-the-jays-and-other-roster-moves/
More Hollinger on the Celtics trade deadline. in short, he just sees more salary dumps comings and nothing to improve the team. One option is dumping Schroder for basically nothing from the Cavs:
More Hollinger on the Celtics trade deadline. in short, he just sees more salary dumps comings and nothing to improve the team. One option is dumping Schroder for basically nothing from the Cavs:
Basically the message is prep to be disappointed, the Celtics aren't going to do anything positive for the season because they are focused on financials.
Pangos and Davis can join Bol and Dozier at a retreat in Montana while awaiting Brad’s phone call as to when their plane ticket to Boston will be sent.
Schroder for nothing would seem really stupid. I know they need to get under the tax, but I would think they could get the little amount they need in a smarter way.
I find myself agreeing with Hollinger here where he and King note that while the Celtics could use shooting.... they need someone to run the offense more. They have some shooters on the bench (Richardson, Pritchard, etc.) but that the biggest way to improve the shooting would be to get better shots, particularly for Tatum.
It's not that little anymore, it's almost $3M since it suddenly looks like Brown might make his unlikely incentive. Yes they could probably get OKC to eat 2 deals for cash and 2nds, but I get his point, which is.... if the market for Schroder is soft, and you're stuck on the treadmill, why trade something you could trade later in the 2nds, instead of trading something that has no value to you beyond this year and getting something small back.
Edit- I don't think Schroder for a 2nd and tax avoidance is a particularly good trade, but I also recognize that unless you really think that Schroder has a major impact on your ability to get deeper into the playoffs (I don't) or you can get something of real value for him, you consider it, because you aren't likely re-signing him ($ and fit issues), and you can't use him in a S&T.
Here is the problem. Al has to be the guy setting the pick at the top of the key, while everyone else stands in the corners (I call this the Celtics patented, PnR with a big, while everyone else sticks their thumbs in their butts). Then two defenders leave Al alone, they double the ball handler and Al gets a perfect look at the brick mansion he's been working on this season.Al would be more like that guy if he just stayed in the right corner (although he might trip over Romeo when he was in the game
[while Al is] converting 28.4 percent of his three-point attempts [], he's 11/23 (47.8 percent) on his long-range looks from the right corner, per NBA.com.That's a small sample size, but it suggests he should be taking more shots from there and fewer from above the break, where he's 30/122 (24.6%). Horford's only taken four field goals from there in the last four games, and he's 2/4.
Among Al, RL, and GW, the Cs have the right corner covered.
Yes. This play was great for the C’s during Al’s first run here because he was hitting those wide open shots.
From an optics standpoint, trading Schroder just for tax reasons looks worse than if they trade him for some asset - no matter how small.
Just to clarify, that Hollinger/King piece from the Athletic is essentially those two throwing trade ideas against the wall and not actual trades being discussed by teams. Its no different than all of the fake trades we post except that they know who *might* be available.
That said, its actually somewhat encouraging that we aren't getting a lot of sourced reports on trades. Maybe there isn't a lot to report on but it definitely feels like transactions go more smoothly when the sides aren't negotiating through agents/media.
That said, its actually somewhat encouraging that we aren't getting a lot of sourced reports on trades. Maybe there isn't a lot to report on but it definitely feels like transactions go more smoothly when the sides aren't negotiating through agents/media.
I guess? I feel like we have plenty of league average-ish wings on this team.
Not exciting from where I sit. Seems like he'd just be competing with Josh Richardson for minutes and while maybe a different skill set, not really an upgrade. Would also push them further into the tax and would require more moves.
I was thinking the same thing. Last offseason we kinda cornered the market on league average guys.
