OBJ

[tims4wins]

So at this point OBJ seems to becoming a distraction. Does he still help the Giants win? They are 14-22 with him on the team, I believe. At what point do they shop him and cut bait? Will they? Should they? Given the NY media market I feel like they love having him on the team but at some point it has to be about team and winning...right? Going back in time, guys like Randy Moss and TO eventually left town and I don't think either of those guys was close to this level of distraction.

Am I way off base here?

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

I'd say not way off base, but a little off base at this point. With the caveat that it certainly is worth watching. I'm a hug fanboy/apologist of the dude but it's starting to wear thin on even me.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Definitely too soon but he is at risk of going down that path. But even those guys didn't wear out their welcome for several years. Beckham is an absolute bargain on his rookie deal. No chance of being traded before the time comes to sign him up for big dollars.

 

[DJnVa]

So at this point OBJ seems to becoming a distraction. Does he still help the Giants win? They are 14-22 with him on the team, I believe.

Is there something that ties that 14-22 record to him?

 

[tims4wins]

Is there something that ties that 14-22 record to him?

No, the point is that you tolerate this kind of stuff if you are getting production and winning. He is getting production but it's not helping them win.

 

[dcmissle]

Diva receiver is a thing. For every Brown and Jones, there seems to be a Dez and OBJ.

I wonder whether BB made a pact with himself to stay away from the hot stove after his Terry Glenn experience in year 2.

 

[loshjott]

 

[Kliq]

The Norman game was such a bad moment for OBJ--it let everyone in the league know that you could rattle this guy a bit and get under his skin and cut his production down. Just watching the highlights between him and Xavier Rhodes, Rhodes is really just doing little stuff; something that I'm sure most DBs do in the NFL to try and intimidate the receivers; but OBJ just can't handle that kind of attitude and his production suffers and his ensuing attitude then hurts the rest of his team--and judging by the body language during last nights game I think you can tell that some guys are really fed up with him. Still, the guy is 23 and one of the most gifted receivers to come down the pike in a long time, you don't just give up on a guy like that easily.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

I was indifferent on OBJ until last night. He throws a temper tantrum every fucking game and it's old. When he realized he had to reel in his emotions after his PI, he disappeared. If he doesn't learn how to play with a controlled anger - lowering his shoulder on Rhodes out of bounds a few plays after the PI is a good example - he may turn into Terry Glenn.

I want to like him, but fuck me if he doesn't act like a petulant child.

 

[Rick Burlesons Yam Bag]

I wonder whether BB made a pact with himself to stay away from the hot stove after his Terry Glenn experience in year 2.

Someone already posted the pic of Randy Moss, but Corey Dillon and Albery Haynesworth also say "HEYOOOOO!!!!!"

OBJ will be fine.

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

Diva receiver is a thing. For every Brown and Jones, there seems to be a Dez and OBJ.

I wonder whether BB made a pact with himself to stay away from the hot stove after his Terry Glenn experience in year 2.

Diva receiver and LSD(lead singer disease) seem to be a slight variation on the same selfish mindset.

 

[tims4wins]

Malcontents (e.g., Corey Dillon) are different than this, IMO. This is borderline mental issues.

 

[dcmissle]

Moss and Dillon were two miserable players when they sat with BB for the interview. Haynesworth lasted 15 minutes. All came at heavily discounted prices.

With OBJ the question may be whether he needs to find his personal hell in today's version Oakland -- Cleveland? -- before writing a new chapter.

This is way too easy for corners -- they bait him, he takes it, he's ineffective and disruptive. Rinse and repeat.

 

[Marciano490]

It's strange because he's had zero of the field issues, or am I forgetting something? Moss and Dillon did, Glenn was obviously slagged for not practicing or trying outside of games, but Beckham only seems to have trouble on Sunday's.

 

[Buffalo Head]

This is way too easy for corners -- they bait him, he takes it, he's ineffective and disruptive. Rinse and repeat.

He should run for president.

 

[Curt S Loew]

Diva receiver and LSD(lead singer disease) seem to be a slight variation on the same selfish mindset.

Yeah. And lineman are like bass players.

 

[InstaFace]

What off-the-field issues did Moss have? "straight cash, homey"? Smoking weed in college? I guess squirting an official with a water bottle was at least mostly off the field, but there's a long winding road between that and Greg Hardy-ville.

 

[Super Nomario]

What off-the-field issues did Moss have? "straight cash, homey"? Smoking weed in college? I guess squirting an official with a water bottle was at least mostly off the field, but there's a long winding road between that and Greg Hardy-ville.

He bumped a cop with his car once: http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/200209/25_williamsb_moss/

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

Yeah. And lineman are like bass players.

I was thinking more drummer, but same idea. Rythym section.

 

[joe dokes]

Malcontents (e.g., Corey Dillon) are different than this, IMO. This is borderline mental issues.

As much as I hate to get into that sort of stuff, my first thought was early-career Brandon Marshall.

 

[soxfan121]

Malcontents (e.g., Corey Dillon) are different than this, IMO. This is borderline mental issues.

We are becoming too quick to use this as a justification or an explanation. Doing so is a disservice to actual sufferers of mental illness.

Until proven otherwise, how about we just call stuff like this "asshole issues"? As in, Odell Beckham Jr. seems to be an asshole and definitely has trouble controlling his asshole issues on the field.

 

[Curt S Loew]

I was thinking more drummer, but same idea. Rythym section.

Drummers are more like holders.

 

[tims4wins]

We are becoming too quick to use this as a justification or an explanation. Doing so is a disservice to actual sufferers of mental illness.

Until proven otherwise, how about we just call stuff like this "asshole issues"? As in, Odell Beckham Jr. seems to be an asshole and definitely has trouble controlling his asshole issues on the field.

True, but he doesn't seem like an asshole. Like he went down the entire line of troops last night and shook all their hands.

 

[Hoodie Sleeves]

No, the point is that you tolerate this kind of stuff if you are getting production and winning. He is getting production but it's not helping them win.

This is kind of the same argument as MVPs not being able to come from non-playoff teams. OBJ isn't helping them as much as if he wasn't a diva, but he's still one of the best (and most productive) players on the team. They're 14-22 with him, but they'd have been worse without him.

When it comes down to it - the Giants' problem is that they're not a good team, and there's not much reason to expect improvement. Eli Manning is 35, and it looks like he's in his decline phase. Even with an all-world receiver, their offense is average at best, and their defense and special teams are worse. None of this OBJ's stuff matters much when you're winning, but it becomes a big sticking point when you're not.

 

[Bosoxen]

This is kind of the same argument as MVPs not being able to come from non-playoff teams. OBJ isn't helping them as much as if he wasn't a diva, but he's still one of the best (and most productive) players on the team. They're 14-22 with him, but they'd have been worse without him.

When it comes down to it - the Giants' problem is that they're not a good team, and there's not much reason to expect improvement. Eli Manning is 35, and it looks like he's in his decline phase. Even with an all-world receiver, their offense is average at best, and their defense and special teams are worse. None of this OBJ's stuff matters much when you're winning, but it becomes a big sticking point when you're not.

It's the Tony Romo phenomenon. People point to his record and conclude that the Cowboys would be better off without him. But the converse is true, they'd be a complete and utter mess if it weren't for him.

The Giants are 14-22 with him because their offensive line, running game and defense have been a mess for at least the past two seasons (and possibly because Coughlin lost the locker room), not because their diva receiver isn't winning games for them single-handedly.

 

[Rick Burlesons Yam Bag]

What off-the-field issues did Moss have? "straight cash, homey"? Smoking weed in college? I guess squirting an official with a water bottle was at least mostly off the field, but there's a long winding road between that and Greg Hardy-ville.

Ummm......he had two instances of assaulting women. One before he became a pro and one that became "consensual horseplay" in the bye week before the Pats' 2007 playoff run.

Randy moss seems to have very much cleaned up his act, but in his prime he was a flaming asshole.

 

[TFP]

Ummm......he had two instances of assaulting women. One before he became a pro and one that became "consensual horseplay" in the bye week before the Pats' 2007 playoff run.

Randy moss seems to have very much cleaned up his act, but in his prime he was a flaming asshole.

Got a link for the first one? Can't seem to find that anywhere. Only assault incident before turning pro I know of was him backing up his friend in a fight in high school against some white trash that wrote "All n***ers must die" on his desk. Cost him his scholarship to Notre Dame too.

As for the consensual horseplay incident, I don't think it's clear either way to say he definitely assaulted her or not.

Randy Moss is a fascinating and confusing and enigmatic person, but I don't think he qualifies as a "flaming asshole". The RandU 30 for 30 documentary was really interesting and worth watching if folks haven't.

 

[RedOctober3829]

OBJ saying he's not having fun and is frustrated with his role. How about less talking and antics and more trying to be a leader? He's tremendously talented but his act is tiring on the field. Players are going to bait the hell out of him until he grows out of whatever is wrong with him when players are physical with him.

 

[mwonow]

Drummers are more like holders.

No way. Drummers get chicks. Holders get ignored when they go out for pizza alone.

 

[Rick Burlesons Yam Bag]

Got a link for the first one? Can't seem to find that anywhere. Only assault incident before turning pro I know of was him backing up his friend in a fight in high school against some white trash that wrote "All n***ers must die" on his desk. Cost him his scholarship to Notre Dame too.

As for the consensual horseplay incident, I don't think it's clear either way to say he definitely assaulted her or not.

Randy Moss is a fascinating and confusing and enigmatic person, but I don't think he qualifies as a "flaming asshole". The RandU 30 for 30 documentary was really interesting and worth watching if folks haven't.

I'll find the info on the first. It was the mother of one of his first kids.

As far as the consensual horseplay incident, let's not let the ability to catch a ball really well cloud this one up. He whacked her and paid her not to talk. Which happens all too often in this sport.

 

[Rick Burlesons Yam Bag]

I'll find the info on the first. It was the mother of one of his first kids.

I was wrong about this, that was a message board rumor regarding his time at Marshall, not a fact. He only had the two incidents of violence; consensual horseplay and hitting a female police officer with his car.

 

[Marciano490]

I was wrong about this, that was a message board rumor regarding his time at Marshall, not a fact. He only had the two incidents of violence; consensual horseplay and hitting a female police officer with his car.

Which is more than enough in any sane universe. And my point was that as far as I know, there's zero off the field stuff with Beckham - Lena Dunham aside - unlike other people who had some smoke. One or two incidents qualifies as smoke.

 

[tims4wins]

Which is more than enough in any sane universe. And my point was that as far as I know, there's zero off the field stuff with Beckham - Lena Dunham aside - unlike other people who had some smoke. One or two incidents qualifies as smoke.

What is so weird about OBJ is that I can't think of any other examples of guys who are a distraction due to ON FIELD issues. It's bizarre

 

[Rick Burlesons Yam Bag]

What is so weird about OBJ is that I can't think of any other examples of guys who are a distraction due to ON FIELD issues. It's bizarre

I don't disagree with you, but possible candidates would be Vontaze Burfict and Jay Cutler as guys who can be taken out of their game quite quickly.

 

[Marciano490]

I don't disagree with you, but possible candidates would be Vontaze Burfict and Jay Cutler as guys who can be taken out of their game quite quickly.

Burfict is a good example. Cutler falls into a long line of athletes whose confidence can be shaken by poor play. Look at that asshole Blair Walsh who cost me my tease last night. ODB is more like Tyson, he gets frustrated and not only does his performance suffer, he goes whackadoo.

 

[RedOctober3829]

They haven't made the playoffs since 2011 so I think the Giants have a lot more problems than OBJ. They are trending towards irrelevancy if they don't turn it around quickly. Reese's bad drafts have put the team way behind in both depth and top end talent.

 

[BigSoxFan]

They haven't made the playoffs since 2011 so I think the Giants have a lot more problems than OBJ. They are trending towards irrelevancy if they don't turn it around quickly. Reese's bad drafts have put the team way behind in both depth and top end talent.

And Eli turns 36 in January. This franchise may be in blow-it-up mode in a couple years. Good.

 

[Curt S Loew]

No way. Drummers get chicks. Holders get ignored when they go out for pizza alone.

Three musicians and a drummer walk into a bar......

 

[Old Fart Tree]

Drummers are more like holders.

Spoken like someone who has never been in a rock band.

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

Spoken like someone who has never been in a rock band.

Or spoken like a front man. We guitarists have the utmost respect for our rythym sections.

 

[Curt S Loew]

Spoken like someone who has never been in a rock band.

It's a joke. I'm actually a drummer. You can insert any member to offend. Looks like it worked.

 

[Marciano490]

It's a joke. I'm actually a drummer. You can insert any member to offend. Looks like it worked.

True for drummers.

 

[Rick Burlesons Yam Bag]

It's a joke. I'm actually a drummer. You can insert any member to offend. Looks like it worked.

Oh. Snap.

 

[Bergs]

Or spoken like a front man. We guitarists have the utmost respect for our rythym sections.

Other guitarists, on the other hand...

 

[Michelle34B]

The New York Football Giants have lost two games in a row, and the offense has had one touchdown in the past six quarters. Odell hasn't caught a touchdown pass in five games. Odell is 23, but turns 24 on November 5th. I would say that Odell is passionate, and Monday Night Football @ Minnesota was the first game he had an overall negative outcome for the game. He dropped a touchdown pass in the first quarter of the Carolina game last year, and made the touchdown catch (along with another catch for the majority of the yards on the drive) to tie the game, but Carolina kicked a field goal on the last drive to win. Now, it is a short week following for Sunday Night Football @ Green Bay (coming off a bye week). I doubt Ben McAdoo sleeps at all this week, and is most definitely seeing his future as a Head Coach flash before his eyes.

 

[Leather]

And just think: even this guy thinks Lena Dunham is an asshole.

 

[Doug Beerabelli]

It's a joke. I'm actually a drummer. You can insert any member to offend. Looks like it worked.

Why do rocks bands have keyboardists? So there's a flat surface to place their drinks.

 

[Spelunker]

Why do rocks bands have keyboardists? So there's a flat surface to place their drinks.

Why do rock bands have singers? Because it's good for morale if everyone rallies around hating the same person.

 

[OCST]

If proof be needed that Charlie Watts is the coolest motherfucker ever:

One anecdote relates that in the mid-1980s, an intoxicated Jagger phoned Watts' hotel room in the middle of the night asking "Where's my drummer?". Watts reportedly got up, shaved, dressed in a suit, put on a tie and freshly shined shoes, descended the stairs, and punched Jagger in the face, saying: "Don't ever call me your drummer again. You're my fucking singer!"

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

Always loved that story. There's some epic buddy rich ones too, with recorded audio.