Alex Van Pelt named Patriots OC
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TC McCartney is the grandson of legendary Colarado coach Bill McCartney. His father is the late Buffaloes QB Sal Aunese.
Indeed. CLE did win 11 games in 2023, obviously the Patriots ... did not.
And with .. who? PJ Walker, Dorian Thompson-Robinson, Deshaun, and Flacco???
Been back-reading some Cleveland press on this, mainly Terry Pluto. Seems like the Browns GM is a fan of constantly shaking things up, and they'd just fired the DC and STC the year before. The stuff with Watson appears to be the issue here; they hired Dorsey because they were apparently intrigued that he was the quarterbacks coach the year Cam was superhuman.
Given that Stefanski prefers to call the plays, firing the offensive coaches was seen as a need for a sytem change to get more out of that albatross contract, despite the offensive success this year
I didn’t say I thought of him often.
Huh. I probably conflated Alex and Brad over the years
Point Van Pelt!
Judging coordinators on anything other than superficial results (on which there are numerous intervening variables) is super difficult from the outside. That said, the results are good, the QB results with the exception of Watson are very good, not getting along with Watson is not just a feather in his cap but likely on Watson who by all accounts is a prima donna, and I'll add that the Brissett as a transitional QB is intriguing.
the key for u guys if can mayo keep u top 10 in def while this new guy can get u 15-20th feglar can moan and bitch all he wants if mayo can win 7-8 games next year its a good start
your 1st goal shouild be beat the jets
i am happy ne coach will have a name on madden
your 1st goal shouild be beat the jets
i am happy ne coach will have a name on madden
Yeah Stefanski who normally called the plays for Cleveland was stuck at home because of Covid. On the bright side, the Browns blew out the Steelers.
I'm oddly relieved that he’s so tenured…even with limited calling experience. Former player status may have appealed to Mayo as well.
For sure. One of the posters I remember hanging in the room I shared with my brothers was one titled "Big Blue Wrecking Crew" with Lawrence Taylor, Harry Carson, Brad Van Pelt, and Brian Kelly in their uniforms and hard hats posed around construction vehicles.
Checks a lot of boxes for me.
Experience in multiple systems under multiple coaches and brings a network
Played QB
External hire
Great culture guy
They went outside on offense and ST and kept defense in house.
This is all making sense, and it’s far more exciting to me than Nick Caley.
Experience in multiple systems under multiple coaches and brings a network
Played QB
External hire
Great culture guy
They went outside on offense and ST and kept defense in house.
This is all making sense, and it’s far more exciting to me than Nick Caley.
True, but on the flip:
Deduct 5 points...still ahead of the game.
And, more on point, I like that he's between "hot new thing" and retread. Seems to me a guy with a lot of experience, a good track record, and neither seems stuck in the past or a hot flash who lacks a breadth of experience. I like that "just right" middle ground.
Caley scared me with his dearth of experience coaching QBs, much less calling plays, especially given how green the rest of the top coaches are. So I’m totally fine with an experienced hand that has a great relationship with the presumptive top football ops dog, Wolf.
Also pretty reassured that he should be able to leverage his presumably extensive network to fill out a staff.
Also pretty reassured that he should be able to leverage his presumably extensive network to fill out a staff.
This is why it would be fine to hire Lucy as the OC, but don’t let her anywhere near special teams.
Cleveland absolutely was a defensive juggernaut but it feels like they left nothing on the table on offense. Their run D was stout but the Browns own rushing attack gained fewer y/a on the ground than they allowed because their run game was mid at best and they didn't have many weapons overall.
Maybe it was all Watson and Flacco. But it feels like the coaches did a good job on offense overall given the pieces they had. Their record overall is impressive when you look at all the players they lost.
Maybe it was all Watson and Flacco. But it feels like the coaches did a good job on offense overall given the pieces they had. Their record overall is impressive when you look at all the players they lost.
Over the last several months, you shit on BB every chance you got. He's gone. Since he's been gone, you've sucked some Patriot dick on every move made.
Time to own up and put a stake in the ground. You're psyched BB is gone. And you've been very positive on Mayos moved. Stand behind it with some vigor.
Totally agree with you here. I’m tired of the bill haters who wanted him gone so they could dream of amazing names of up and comers and so far we’ve gotten only pats related coaches or guys who are unproven but not among the amazing names being tossed out since last November on this board. And this goes for the front office too where it looks like the same guys in place today are the same guys in place last year. The bill haters like to move the goal posts and revise what they were saying in support of firing him in the fall.
I’m agnostic on the new hirings. I hope they do great obviously. I’m dumbfounded by the stagnation in the front office after reading so much here about why that was the most important area to overhaul. And yet those who wanted a nationwide search for an GM are suddenly quiet.
To clarify none of these posts are @ me, correct? Just asking because they immediately followed my post on AVP.
FWIW, I am certainly no Bill hater and I was agnostic about him leaving. But I accepted it when it was apparent it was over.
FWIW, I am certainly no Bill hater and I was agnostic about him leaving. But I accepted it when it was apparent it was over.
He didn't in Cleveland, Stefanski did. But he did call the plays in the playoff game Stefanski missed due to Covid in 2020. So that's something I guess.
I do like the idea of bringing in a veteran QB whisperer to work with whoever they pick at 3 (assuming they go QB). It's not an overly exciting hire but I like that they went outside the organization at least.
I'm looking forward to posters that are smarter than me explaining what differences we should expect to see in the offense by implementing a West Coast system.
Brad Van Pelt, Brian Kelley, Harry Carson, and Lawrence Taylor?
My first game I watched as a young kid was a Giants game so I just stuck with them. CBS was on our house on football Sundays more than NBC. No rhyme or reason.
Great line backing group.
FWIW, Bedard characterizes Van Pelt as an old-school west coast offense coach, which is not what the Pats seemed to be looking for (McVay tree new school OC, which is what most of the candidtaes they interviewed had experience with). (He also knocked the Krafts for, apparently, sticking with BB's lean organization system of fewer coaches, front office types, and analytics guys than most other NFL teams. But he seems to have fully transferred his 2023 frustrations with BB over to the Krafts, so I am not sure how much weight to put on him.)
Van Pelt is also not known for being the play caller, which he has done relatively little of for an experienced OC.
But Van Pelt is known for getting along with players and for being able to connect with QBs - see his success in Cleveland with many QBs, including old friend Jacoby Brissett.
There was also a ton of dysfunction in the offensive room last year, and the relationship between coach and QB was dysfunctional.
So, as much as they are trying to change the Xs and Os aspect of the offense, I think they are trying to rebuild the room even more.
What will be interesting to see is where they go as to filling out the offensive coaching staff. Van Pelt is outside the BB extended universe, so he will likely have ideas about what he wants in a staff. If they are looking to go in more of a McVay direction, that should show up in the offensive coaches.
I also think they are planning for going into 2024 without drafting a QB at 3, and <gulp> they may be readying themselves to have MacZappe. Face it, they would trade Mac if they could get a couple of used kicking balls and a conditional 7th for him, but that is not happening. I would not be shocked at all if they draft MHJ or trade down for tackles, draft a non-day 1 QB in the lower rounds, maybe sign a cheap veteran, and go into camp with a competition for the starting job.
Van Pelt is also not known for being the play caller, which he has done relatively little of for an experienced OC.
But Van Pelt is known for getting along with players and for being able to connect with QBs - see his success in Cleveland with many QBs, including old friend Jacoby Brissett.
There was also a ton of dysfunction in the offensive room last year, and the relationship between coach and QB was dysfunctional.
So, as much as they are trying to change the Xs and Os aspect of the offense, I think they are trying to rebuild the room even more.
What will be interesting to see is where they go as to filling out the offensive coaching staff. Van Pelt is outside the BB extended universe, so he will likely have ideas about what he wants in a staff. If they are looking to go in more of a McVay direction, that should show up in the offensive coaches.
I also think they are planning for going into 2024 without drafting a QB at 3, and <gulp> they may be readying themselves to have MacZappe. Face it, they would trade Mac if they could get a couple of used kicking balls and a conditional 7th for him, but that is not happening. I would not be shocked at all if they draft MHJ or trade down for tackles, draft a non-day 1 QB in the lower rounds, maybe sign a cheap veteran, and go into camp with a competition for the starting job.
One might also surmise from this situation that while BB agreed with the approach, this manner of investment was driven also in large part at the ownership level. Never understood why it was always assumed that BB was the one with tight pursestrings as a matter of principal when it wasn't his money.
I like it. This guy was a QB, has a long history at working with QB's. We're most likely going to have a rookie QB.
Also has coordinator experience with a track record that's not horrible.
I feel better about this than bringing someone in with hype but no real resume.
For now.
Also has coordinator experience with a track record that's not horrible.
I feel better about this than bringing someone in with hype but no real resume.
For now.
I see no reason at all to think that hiring Van Pelt would indicate drafting a non-QB in the first round.
Are we sure he is still following the West Coast offense? Will Levis was #1 in intended air yards per att last season, #2 was Flacco, #4 was Watson. From what I remember watching and hearing they were running a lot more PA and taking deep shots which is not consistent with WC offense.
With Bedard, the assumption should be that he views the 53 year old Van Pelt as "old school", and anyone younger as "new school" without going much deeper. If Mayo hired one of those "new school" guys, Bedard would be questioning why there is no "experienced" coach on Mayo's senior staff.
If they hired someone Bedard likes then that would probably be a worse sign. He's just writing contrarian articles for the sake of it. AVP may yet bring in some of these young risers, as mentioned.
He must have had a good personal interaction with Mayo. From what we know, there's no history there. How they work together is obviously as critical as anything.
PA and deep shots are perfectly consistent with a WC offense, they are key parts of the system whether you're using the Bill Walsh system or have more Coryell influence
Here is something Walsh wrote (I think early 90s?) about Play action.
http://www.westcoastoffense.com/bill walsh article 2.htm
i think people get caught up in the short passing portion of WC offenses and forget that is there to open up deep throws. Also, WC has a ton of variations, so it's really mostly terminology and a few core concepts.
And they shouldn't be. It's early in the process and they should be looking at all options.
I remember hearing years ago, back when AVP was playing quarterback for Pitt, that he was Brad Van Pelt’s son. But that seems like something you’d be readily able to confirm on the internet, which I wasn’t able to do, so maybe not.
Pretty sure he isn't, Brad Van Pelt had 2 kids, Bradlee was an NFL QB. Brad would have been what... 18 when AVP was born... possible certainly, but have to imagine that sites that mention his kids (Bradlee and Justen) wouldn't pass over AVP.
By "Sticking with" did he mean "while BB was here" or does he mean "going forward." If it was the former, I don't want the owner telling BB how many assistants to hire; if it was the latter, we dont know the size of Mayo's staff yet, do we?
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yeah I don’t see how hiring Van Pelt gives us any information at all on what they want to do at QB other than having a guy who has a lot of experience coaching QB’s. Which could be spun as “he’s here to fix Mac” or “he’s here to mentor Daniels/Maye”
the only thing I would guess is that a Brissett reunion as a backup/mentor/bridge is perhaps slightly more likely but even that is really a stretch (i.e. I think Wolf would be interested in Brissett regardless of OC because Brissett is an obvious choice for that role)
To be fair, Flacco and Watson (especially Flacco) are really best utilized moving the ball vertically and Stefanski was calling the plays
The lack of playcalling experience doesn't bother me. This is not a team that is likely to contend this year, so AVP has an opportunity to develop in this role without the stakes being tremendously high from the start. I also think that his reported demeanor as a good guy and team player will be very valuable to a young HC like Mayo.
At some point we'll stop making these comparisons right? I love ya, but everyone here knows where we are and where we were. What's this adding?
That means you have the person it was directed at on IGNORE. You can't see who he's responding to.