Actually, I think we're both lucky that no one thought we were talking about the (now-defunct) band.
2016 PGA Tour
- Thread starter TFP
- Start date
What do you expect to happen to someone with a grizzly on his face? He must put his head down to putt and his beard hits his neck and it throws him off.
Nice opening round by Rob. Really looking like he belongs in these events.
-2 (3 birdies and 1 bogey)
-2 (3 birdies and 1 bogey)
He follows it up with a 68 today, which puts him at -6 and T11. Looks like he had the putter working today.
Yeah, he made some bombs today. One from about 71 feet for eagle, 2 others over 30 feet and one over 20 feet. But it looks like he also three putt a couple holes, missing a couple short ones for par. All in all, nice to see him make the cut and playing well after what was basically a forced vacation for a month. Hoping for a big weekend.
Rob is teeing off shortly for his final round. Shot a smooth -1 in the horrible conditions yesterday, and goes into today -7, tied for 13th. Guys are going low early today, as the course seems to have gotten soft (McIlroy and DeChambeau (A) just shot 65, 66 respectively), so let's hope he can have a good day. A top 10 would be pretty life changing.
And he birdies the opening hole, and makes a nice 7 footer or so for par on #2. Here we go. Getting lots of early tv coverage before the leaders go out.
Bad drive on #3, but he's able to get up and down from about 30 yards out making a 4 footer for par. Looks like he's playing with David Hearn today. Heading to the par 5 4th. Birdie would be really nice.
Looks like he's making bogey after hitting his tee ball out of bounds at the par 5. Just can't make that kind of mistake. If he can just find fairways, he'll do really well, but that's a big If.
Limited sample size at this point of the season but his stats off the tee show he is relatively short and wild (however, this is consistent with what he did last year). You can't be both of those things at this level. Players don't magically get longer off the tee in their 30s so he needs to hit more fairways. It appears to be his biggest weakness right now.
It's been his biggest weakness forever. He is an incredible putter (finished in the top 5 a number of times in putting on the Web/Nationwide tour), and generally does very well with his irons, but he is slightly below average length (he's a small guy, only about 5'9, 170 if I had to guess) and he seems to be getting less and less consistent with his accuracy in recent years. When he hits fairways, he can go really low, but when he doesn't, and he has to scramble, it can get ugly in a hurry.
Well, could have been a huge day for him, but nothing wrong with a top 25. First of his career. He's made 5 of 7 cuts now, probably around $100k in earnings. Good stuff.
As of now the T20 finish has him moving up 22 spots in the FedEx Cup to 148. Very nice week for Rob.
Day, Chappell and Merritt are duking it out for the win. All are -16. Merritt has had a wild day, carding 2 doubles on the front and seemingly being out of it, then ripped off 5 straight birdies on the back. Stenson was in the mix but imploded on 16.
Edit: I lied. Chappell is -17, Merritt and Day are -16 but both have birdie putts on 16. Day has been a bit off today.
Day, Chappell and Merritt are duking it out for the win. All are -16. Merritt has had a wild day, carding 2 doubles on the front and seemingly being out of it, then ripped off 5 straight birdies on the back. Stenson was in the mix but imploded on 16.
Edit: I lied. Chappell is -17, Merritt and Day are -16 but both have birdie putts on 16. Day has been a bit off today.
Chappell bogey's 18 to post -16. Day birdied 17 to get to -17, but just sprayed his tee shot way right on 18 so par will be tough. Merritt is still alive too after chipping in to save par on 17 and hitting a good drive on 18. Getting it close on the approach will take some balls.
There is actually. If you can't appreciate the difference and can't find it in you to watch it, I'm not sure what to tell you. If you're looking for rapid fire action I think you might be watching the wrong sport.
There is a difference, but at the same time ez is correct that Day needs to find a way to speed up his routine.
Slow play is a cancer in the game, mostly because your average 10 handicapper is mimicking pros taking too damn long over the ball. People need to play faster and it begins with pros.
I say this as someone who is a huge fan of Jason Day.
Slow play is a cancer in the game, mostly because your average 10 handicapper is mimicking pros taking too damn long over the ball. People need to play faster and it begins with pros.
I say this as someone who is a huge fan of Jason Day.
He's a slow player and it's annoying as hell (for other players and viewers) and if you don't understand that, I am not sure what to tell you. This entire post above is horrendous.
I hate this talk of the pros speeding up their game. The difference between Jason Day and Mr. 10 handicapper is that there are millions upon millions of dollars on the line. Mr. 10 handicapper is playing for a post-round beer, he should fucking hurry up. Jason Day can take all the time he wants.
The networks need to do a better job filling the dead air between shots. Right now, they do a terrible job of it.
Is Day really that slow overall or are the networks just subjecting us to his entire lengthy pre-shot routine every time he steps up to the ball? I'm not sure we need to see the whole step back and do the demonic possession eyes visualization thing on every one of his shots. Do other players have a problem with his pace of play? Relatively slow tour players are usually called out on it by their peers.
That said, the broadcasts don't do a great job of filling time between shots late on Sunday when less groups are on the course.
Are you referring to the Secret Tour Pro? Because I'm unable to find any players calling him out on it, nor am I aware of him being warned or put on the clock. He isn't exactly Kevin Na, nor is he Sergio. Jordan Speith got cited on the European Tour this year, you want to rail against him as well?
His pre-shot routine isn't conducive to TV because it happens right before his shot and if the networks want to show him, they have to include it. FL4WL3SS touched on it, but the guy is playing for millions of dollars and you want him to speed up because you are annoyed?
I think some of it is perception. Day standing there and visualizing leads to dead air. I don't think he takes much longer than someone like Spieth or Fowler. Spieth is quicker once he gets over the ball, but he's also talking to Greller right up until he pulls the trigger which we find interesting as viewers and fills some of the dead air.
Secret Tour Pro
The biggest high profile culprit of slow play is Jason Day! We should call him Jason AllDay, he's that slow! F@#% me, he reminds me of that moment at the dentist when your having a root canal and any moment he will be finished and the he utters those dreadful words 'just a few more minutes then I'll be done!'
I watched him on the 17th at the BMW in November taking nine minutes over his tee shot on a Par 3! Yes, you heard that correct, NINE F&$#@% MINUTES!*
Who takes nine minutes over a tee shot? I could of played the hole, read a book, took a shower, washed my hair and got dry in that time! The game has gone beyond a joke! In total his round took 5hr 45min, just think in that time I could of (nearly) flown to New York from Europe!
There it is. That guy's the SharksOfVegas of the PGA Tour. Never tweeted anything that can't be found in a GolfWRX forum. His scoop on Tiger driving around lying down was especially fun.
If guys would play faster we could see larger fields and, correspondingly, players getting into more events. Slow play is not a victimless crime.
Why do we need larger fields and more players getting into fields?
Viewership goes up on Sunday back nine, I don't think getting an additional 20 people into the field on thursday and friday is going to matter much to the enjoyment of watching golf.
Viewership goes up on Sunday back nine, I don't think getting an additional 20 people into the field on thursday and friday is going to matter much to the enjoyment of watching golf.
So that guys who bust their ass for a Tour card can get into more than seventeen events.
Almost all of the tournaments - with the exception of a handful and outside the majors - have expanded their fields over the last few years already.
C'mon, are you guys really disputing that Jason Day is a slow player? He's had that reputation around the world for years, and people have complained about it. The guy meditates before every swing.
Lee Westwood complained about it four years ago.
Lee Westwood complained about it four years ago.
I'm not disputing he's on the slower side, but I'm not aware of him stacking up tee boxes behind him while the group ahead of him pulls away. I don't watch every minute of every tournament, but I'm also not aware of him being cited or put on the clock and I tend to think it would have happened if that were the case. Every player has some sort of routine and I think it's product of TV that his is exacerbated.
If the argument is from other players like Westwood, I'd say that every player has a different style and those that like to play quick are going to get annoyed by more methodical players. It's part of the game. If it's a legit complaint, then the Tour should address it, by all means. But Day isn't the only guy that plays on the slower side and he's not holding up the whole field. I don't see what he does any worse than Bradley and it's not to the Sergio/Na levels.
If the argument is from viewers sitting on their couch, I'd say they are being a bit ridiculous if they think he should speed up to enhance their viewing pleasure. He's not out there to entertain you, he's out there to play the game and make money. That it is televised was not his request. It clearly works for him, why would he care what we think?
As to how it relates to our own average round on the course, I don't find it relevant. There's dozens of reasons the average golfer plays slowly and I don't think very many are because they are mimicking Day. They also could be much more readily resolved if the average group wasn't so reluctant to let a group play through.
He certainly has been put on the clock. Including last year at the Masters, following which he got an individual slow play warning.
My comment wasn't really about dead air. But I do believe that amateurs ape the behavior of pros and the pace of play in the game in general has become a significant problem at clubs around the country.
I tried not to be too harsh on Day because I enjoy watching him a lot. So long as he's not out of position I have no issue with what he does.
Oh, and I've never heard of "Secret Tour Pro" before so that's a new one for me.
Agree to disagree.
Average time to play a round is way up at every club I know of. If you talk to club pros, most will tell you that a big part of it is that the "better than average" players at each club (not the scratch golfers, but the guys trying to get from a 10 handicap down to a low single digit) mimic the pros because they feel that adding something to their routine to relax them, or stalking every putt as if the Masters is on the line is the way for them to improve their game.
Was that before or after they penalized the teenaged kid?
I'm joking of course, if he gets a warning than I assume it's legit and he should speed up. But since he hasn't changed his routine, I'm assuming it hasn't happened often or common sense would make one think he would adjust, no? Either way, people here and people on the Tour complaining about it are two very different things.
Yeah, we will have to disagree, especially since the majority of people playing at most courses are not a 10 or better. There are literally at least a dozen reasons pace of play is slow that come before what you're citing, including courses reducing the amount of time between tee times so they can cram more golfers in. Of course, the pro isn't going to want to tell you that.
I would agree that slow play at public courses can't be pinned on any one thing.
My comment was specific to private courses. The average time per round is way up even as the total number of rounds continues to decline. And the factor that I've cited is a big part of that.
I really don't get the reason for the hostile tone. I love watching Jason Day play golf. But he's a slow player. How is that even in dispute?
In this particular case, Stenson and Chappell in the group ahead were warned. They were playing slow so Day and Merritt were probably having to wait constantly anyway. Might as well linger on whatever pre-shot routine works. I hate slow play myself but in the case of watching the last 9 holes of a PGA tourney, its not that big a deal.
Apologies if my tone is coming off as hostile, as it's not intended to be. I just don't think Day is anything new when it comes to amateurs thinking they are pros and pouring over every shot.
I actually don't believe slow play is as big of an issue as people make it out to be and I don't think folks imitate professionals routines as much (if at all) as you seem to think. I think slow play is confused with pace of play.
Private courses don't have a slow play issue for a few reasons: 1) members shame other members into proper pace of play and 2) the tee times aren't as stacked as on a public course. My course has a very very healthy membership and rarely do I play a round over 4:15. So mainly, I think we're talking about public courses having a pace of play issue, which ties into point #2 above - public courses pack the course with as little as 8-9 minutes between tee times. Any slight delay by one group will have a ripple effect down the tee sheet. The course wants you to think it's your slow play, but when there's 3 groups on one tee box, that's not about slow play that's about course management and pace of play.
Additionally, I don't think golfers are imitating preshot routines of the pros. Go to any golf course and you'll see the reason most golfers take too much time on their preshot routine is not because they're visualizing their shot, but because they're either taking 20 practice swings or standing over the ball too long. I don't think the professionals have as much influence on amateurs as you think.
The bigger issue for golfers is not the extra 30 seconds they take over their ball, it's not being prepared to hit their shot when it's their turn. Ready golf is more important to pace of play than preshot routines. This is one area I can blame the pros because they do the same shit. They should be ready to hit their shot as soon as the first guy hits because they've had all the time to prepare that it took the first guy.
Just to add to this - it is also the 18 handicapper standing at 250 out with a 3 iron in hand, waiting for the green to clear . The thinking of "if I hit this like that one time I hit it at the range, I can get there from here", ignoring the 49 other chunks and hosel hits (not going to use the S word).
Thank you for laying it out better than I had.
I'm also a member of a private course and I play about 40-50 rounds a year with about 10 or so being at public courses. My club isn't super stacked with members - we are just over 225 this year - but enough that Fri-Sun, anything before noon needs to go to a lottery to book a tee time and even then I'm not sure I've ever broken 4 hours on a round. That's not because everyone is a pro, it's because we book 12 minutes between tee times and as you say, private courses you're held responsible.
As you say, the biggest issue is not playing ready golf and players being unrealistic about their abilities.
Standing on a tee box and watching the group ahead of you wait to hit, while another guy sits in the cart. Then the guy hits, climbs into the cart and they drive over to the other guys ball to hit. Then they're on the green and one guy has to hit out of a bunker. So he hits, then everyone waits while he rakes the bunker, marks his ball and putts because he's still furthest from the hole. The next hole is a par 5 and even though the guy drove it 220, he's going to wait for the group ahead to clear the green so he can try to hit a 230 yd 3WD from the rough - because ya know, that time in Myrtle he pulled it off - only he duffs it, then waits for everyone else to hit, and he has to hit again. Then the next hole is a par 3 and instead of letting the guys waiting on the box play through, they pour over their $5 Nassau and re-mark their third putt for double bogey. They then stop with the drink cart girl before the next tee.
Pace of play for amateur golf has very, very little to do with professionals influence. It's more about ignorance and ego.
I guess I'm a member of a club with more wannabe assholes ...
The average weekend round at my club last year was between 4:05 and 4:10. We've tried shaming, punishing, you name it. Nothing seems to work. And when we run the infrequent stroke play tournaments, the rounds can get over 6 hours. It's insane. The slowest players are always in the championship flights - without exception.
I'm on the golf committee at my club and (along with our pro) we reach out to and work with clubs in Westchester and Putnam Counties on the issue. There are any number of reasons that cause a slow pace of play and I don't mean to trivialize it by implying that the subconscious imitation of pros is the driving factor. But watching people go through unnecessary pre-shot routines or take forever on the greens is a real thing and it makes me nuts.
At the same time, I did make it clear that if Jason Day is not out of position, he's fine. So yeah, I get it.
The average weekend round at my club last year was between 4:05 and 4:10. We've tried shaming, punishing, you name it. Nothing seems to work. And when we run the infrequent stroke play tournaments, the rounds can get over 6 hours. It's insane. The slowest players are always in the championship flights - without exception.
I'm on the golf committee at my club and (along with our pro) we reach out to and work with clubs in Westchester and Putnam Counties on the issue. There are any number of reasons that cause a slow pace of play and I don't mean to trivialize it by implying that the subconscious imitation of pros is the driving factor. But watching people go through unnecessary pre-shot routines or take forever on the greens is a real thing and it makes me nuts.
At the same time, I did make it clear that if Jason Day is not out of position, he's fine. So yeah, I get it.
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