2016 PGA Tour

Papelbon's Poutine

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Oh, and I've never heard of "Secret Tour Pro" before so that's a new one for me.
He's the guy that a little while ago was claiming that Tiger needed a driver because he had to lay down all the time since his back was so bad. Then a couple days later we got video of Tiger hitting balls on a simulator. He's a joke and literally there's no reason to be convinced he's actually a tour pro, outside of his handle. As noted, his "scoops" on his twitter can easily be found on GolfWRX long before he spouts them off as "insider".
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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I guess I'm a member of a club with more wannabe assholes ...

The average weekend round at my club last year was between 4:05 and 4:10. We've tried shaming, punishing, you name it. Nothing seems to work. And when we run the infrequent stroke play tournaments, the rounds can get over 6 hours. It's insane. The slowest players are always in the championship flights - without exception.

I'm on the golf committee at my club and (along with our pro) we reach out to and work with clubs in Westchester and Putnam Counties on the issue. There are any number of reasons that cause a slow pace of play and I don't mean to trivialize it by implying that the subconscious imitation of pros is the driving factor. But watching people go through unnecessary pre-shot routines or take forever on the greens is a real thing and it makes me nuts.

At the same time, I did make it clear that if Jason Day is not out of position, he's fine. So yeah, I get it.
I guess I don't se 4:05-4:10 being a problem - especially on a weekend - so maybe that's where we aren't agreeing. Tournaments I've always ignored for time because even if it's competitive there's an "EVENT!!" component, which adds to drinking and competitiveness which don't mix but always find themselves intertwined (at least at my club).

We're in the same boat that everyone can speed shit up, but I just disagree that it's influenced by pros. And though you're not in that boat, I find it ridiculous that viewers would bitch about it.
 

FL4WL3SS

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I guess I don't se 4:05-4:10 being a problem - especially on a weekend - so maybe that's where we aren't agreeing. Tournaments I've always ignored for time because even if it's competitive there's an "EVENT!!" component, which adds to drinking and competitiveness which don't mix but always find themselves intertwined (at least at my club).

We're in the same boat that everyone can speed shit up, but I just disagree that it's influenced by pros. And though you're not in that boat, I find it ridiculous that viewers would bitch about it.
Bingo.

If you're complaining about a 4-4:15 round on the weekend, then you have unrealistic expectations. People are out there to have fun on the weekend, get away from work, get away from their families for a bit and maybe drink a little bit. Are you going to fault a guy for taking 15-20 extra minutes on the one round he gets a week? For someone that doesn't have time to practice and needs a little extra time between shots to get comfortable and not shank it into the woods? I think generally people just need to chill the fuck out.
 

Lupe Whalewatch

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The bigger issue for golfers is not the extra 30 seconds they take over their ball, it's not being prepared to hit their shot when it's their turn. Ready golf is more important to pace of play than preshot routines. This is one area I can blame the pros because they do the same shit. They should be ready to hit their shot as soon as the first guy hits because they've had all the time to prepare that it took the first guy.
This to me is the easiest way to speed things up out there-you can go through any type of crazy pre shot routine you want, just be ready to hit the ball when its your turn. I play regularly with the same group of guys at my club, and its rare for us to play in over 3 hours. I have a bit of a preshot routine, but 95% of the time I'm able to go through it while someone else is hitting. Just be ready to play your shot once its your turn, not begin any sort of routine.
 

TFP

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Additionally, I don't think golfers are imitating preshot routines of the pros. Go to any golf course and you'll see the reason most golfers take too much time on their preshot routine is not because they're visualizing their shot, but because they're either taking 20 practice swings or standing over the ball too long. I don't think the professionals have as much influence on amateurs as you think.

The bigger issue for golfers is not the extra 30 seconds they take over their ball, it's not being prepared to hit their shot when it's their turn. Ready golf is more important to pace of play than preshot routines. This is one area I can blame the pros because they do the same shit. They should be ready to hit their shot as soon as the first guy hits because they've had all the time to prepare that it took the first guy.
As you say, the biggest issue is not playing ready golf and players being unrealistic about their abilities.

Standing on a tee box and watching the group ahead of you wait to hit, while another guy sits in the cart. Then the guy hits, climbs into the cart and they drive over to the other guys ball to hit. Then they're on the green and one guy has to hit out of a bunker. So he hits, then everyone waits while he rakes the bunker, marks his ball and putts because he's still furthest from the hole. The next hole is a par 5 and even though the guy drove it 220, he's going to wait for the group ahead to clear the green so he can try to hit a 230 yd 3WD from the rough - because ya know, that time in Myrtle he pulled it off - only he duffs it, then waits for everyone else to hit, and he has to hit again. Then the next hole is a par 3 and instead of letting the guys waiting on the box play through, they pour over their $5 Nassau and re-mark their third putt for double bogey. They then stop with the drink cart girl before the next tee.

Pace of play for amateur golf has very, very little to do with professionals influence. It's more about ignorance and ego.
As someone who plays 30-40 rounds a summer on public courses, this is all very very correct. The one thing I would add on top of these points are people spend way too long looking for their ball as well. It goes into being ready to hit, but I've seen (and been part of) groups that take 10 mins looking for a lost ball. Not sure if there's even an answer for it (not going to get fore caddies out there) but it drives me up a wall.

People not playing ready golf drives me absolutely insane, I can't stand it. That includes people in my own family who are the biggest offenders too.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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As someone who plays 30-40 rounds a summer on public courses, this is all very very correct. The one thing I would add on top of these points are people spend way too long looking for their ball as well. It goes into being ready to hit, but I've seen (and been part of) groups that take 10 mins looking for a lost ball. Not sure if there's even an answer for it (not going to get fore caddies out there) but it drives me up a wall.

People not playing ready golf drives me absolutely insane, I can't stand it. That includes people in my own family who are the biggest offenders too.
The amount of times I yell at my dad for tallying up scores and chatting next to the green - as opposed to on the next tee box where there's a delay anyway - I can't begin to count.
 

TFP

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The amount of times I yell at my dad for tallying up scores and chatting next to the green - as opposed to on the next tee box where there's a delay anyway - I can't begin to count.
That's less of a problem for my brother. He's the guy who sits there and watches you hit, then drives over to his ball, spends 5 mins looking for it and calculating distance, then deciding between 2 clubs, then hitting. He literally doesn't even begin thinking about his shot until it's his turn to hit, which drives me up a wall. It drives me (and my friends) absolutely nuts no matter how many times we've told him about it.

I do know there is a social aspect to the game somewhat, I do want to spend time with my friends when out on the weekend, so it's not simply playing speed golf to hit as fast as possible and never talk to anyone. But spend that time together around the green, on the tee box, etc. Not in the fairway when everyone's ball is 50+ yards apart.

Man I can't wait to get back out on the course again.
 

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I play 30ish rounds/year on public courses. The one thing I see too many players do is read their putts from multiple angles. And I do think that's something that they try to copy from the pros. But shit, most of these guys can't read the damn putt from any angle, so it just slows things down and pisses me off.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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I play 30ish rounds/year on public courses. The one thing I see too many players do is read their putts from multiple angles. And I do think that's something that they try to copy from the pros. But shit, most of these guys can't read the damn putt from any angle, so it just slows things down and pisses me off.
There's plenty of time for the average golfer to read putts from different angles. The problem is most don't do it at an appropriate time. They wait until it's their turn to putt, while they could be doing it while other guys are chipping on, etc.

Reading your putts is actually a good thing and I don't think anyone is discouraging that. We all want lower scores. It's time management that's the issue.
 

cshea

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Day, playing today after the back issue yesterday, starts his match off with a 372 yard drive to 12 feet on 1. Makes an eagle. Okay then.

Wind blowing today. This is a tough little course.
 

cshea

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The format changes (ties) appears to have worked. Lot's still to be decided today. By my count, only 6 of 32 matches today are completely meaningless. A few players have guaranteed themselves no worse than a playoff to advance, but with the format changes it is impossible to have advanced after 2 matches so all groups are up for grabs.

Some intriguing winner take all matches today- Scott/Haas, Rory/Na, Mickelson/Reed Schwartzel/Snedeker.
 

cshea

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Casey conceded his match against Day due to illness. Day has advanced. Sucks for Jaidee who theoretically could've advanced if he won, Casey beat Day and then he beat Day in a playoff.

Scott is 1up on Haas through 16. Scott needs to hold on for the outright win to advance. Haas advances with a halved match.
 

cshea

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Na and Rory just started a sudden death playoff. Na has gone shot for shot with Rory. Very close match, and Rory made some bombs on Na.
 

WayBackVazquez

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DJ doing everything he can to lose to Oosthuisen, following Oosty into the water after losing two holes in a row to go 1 down. If he had an even middling level of mental toughness, it's crazy how good he'd be.
 

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Great way to start a Sunday. Currently they're all square through 5.

In the other match, I say this basically every time he's on TV, but I could watch Louis Oosthuizen swing a golf club all day. His smooth tempo is mesmerizing.
One of the many great Feherty lines was his description of Oosthuizen after he hit a ball into a hazard, "Even his bad shots are beautiful."
 

WayBackVazquez

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This Day-McIlroy match is some quality golf. I hope the powers that be realize after this that they should be re-seeding after each round. This should be the final.
 
And this is the problem with this tournament. So much dead time in the finals.
In the past I've pondered the idea of the PGA Championship returning to matchplay - we really ought to have a matchplay major, and the PGA doesn't really have its own identity like the other three majors - and while this issue would be the major problem with that, my solution would be to ensure there are at least 8 and quite possibly 16 golfers on the course at all times, including the final Sunday. In a normal final round telecast, nobody really complains when you show early golf from guys who aren't in contention; that helps set the scene for the leaders at the back of the field. And if everyone is playing for a lot of FedEx Cup/OWGR/Ryder Cup points, etc., there will still be tangible interest in who does what throughout the field.

I'm not sure this idea works so well in a normal World Championship-level event, as the tournament isn't prestigious enough to get people trying their best through to Sunday - we're seeing that with Rory at the moment, who seems fresh out of adrenaline in the consolation round. But maybe you could have the losers in the last 16 play each other on Sunday morning, along with the final 4, and then you have the quarterfinal losers play each other along with the semifinal losers on Sunday afternoon? That would put 12 golfers on the course on Sunday morning and 8 on Sunday afternoon.
 

TFP

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And that approach should do it. Day just cruises to the win this afternoon.
 

Comfortably Lomb

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And that approach should do it. Day just cruises to the win this afternoon.
I'm impressed. I wanted to see something big out of him to start 2016 to show he's actually in the company of Speith and McIlroy... and back to back wins does it.

Between his vertigo last year and tweaky back this week he seems to have more health issues than the average pro.
 

Blundatola

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Between his vertigo last year and tweaky back this week he seems to have more health issues than the average pro.
Well, if you're going to channel the ghost of Tiger Woods prior to every shot, you're going to have to live with the injury problems that come with the territory.
 

johnmd20

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I'm impressed. I wanted to see something big out of him to start 2016 to show he's actually in the company of Speith and McIlroy... and back to back wins does it.

Between his vertigo last year and tweaky back this week he seems to have more health issues than the average pro.
He's been dinged up in a lot of ways over the past 5-6 years. That is probably the biggest risk to his golf ceiling because it most certainly isn't his game. He's unbelievable.
 

TFP

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I already have morning tee times for Thursday, Friday, and Saturday next week followed by watching golf in the afternoon.

Next Saturday is looking pretty epic. 7am tee time, Bruins at 12:30pm, Masters at 3pm, NCAA Hockey Championship game at 8pm. Sign me up.