The Not Soon Enough 2023 NBA Free Agency Thread!

PC Drunken Friar

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You definitely want Luka since it just takes one Summer of working out to make him a decent enough defender.

Unless Trae goes through a pre-pubescence growth spurt he's always going to be a liability on D.


I still like Reaves (or DLo) as the 3rd scorer on that team.

RUI will come back to earth when someone other than Santi Aldama is guarding him;)
Luka ain't going to do that.
 

FanRoy

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I think you all missed the point of his original comment. He's not arguing Trae is better or has more potential. He's simply noting that he enjoys watching Trae play more than Luka. One is a diminutive dynamo, lighting it up from anywhere on the court he wants to, and creating a ton of exciting plays for both himself and others. The other pounds the ball into the sand and just tries to bully 5 other defenders (while everyone on his team watches) until there's a foul or he's scored. I will note, Trae seems to be *trying* on defense. He doesn't do a great job staying in front of his man, but he deflected/swiped at the ball multiple times after intentionally allowing a player to drive by him. When you think about it, it's kind of topsy-turvy Semi redux. One stays in front of his man but doesn't make a play on the ball, the other allows the defender by him but makes an attempt on the ball. You can call it lazy defense, but it's disrupted C's players more than once.

Luka is a better player and obviously has a higher ceiling, but Trae indisputably plays a more aesthetically pleasing and exciting (to my neutral eyes, anyway) brand of basketball, that also happens to be more relatable. Whatever you think of their skills, who would you rather play with in a game of pick up?
 

Auger34

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I think a lot of people would have some contention with the idea that Trae tries on defense
 

lovegtm

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What do the Hawks do with Trae now? On the one hand, I thought he showed a lot more defensive intensity the last couple games, making him more playable in a 16-game setting. Obviously he is an elite offensive talent, once he figures out a defense over the course of a couple games.

On the other hand.....this is about as high as you're ever going to be able to sell. He looks great because he hit a ton of 3s, but he's shot meh/poorly on not-even-that-high volume the last couple years. In terms of strength and build, he is who he is at this point.

If Quin's evaluation before the series (and probably after game 2) was that they needed to move on, do you really let two games change that?

If I'm the Hawks, I think that the list of potential suitors just got a lot bigger, and more responsible organizations like the Nets could be in the mix now. If Durant picks (or similar) are on the table, I'd think hard about moving Trae.
 

the moops

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If Durant picks (or similar) are on the table, I'd think hard about moving Trae.
There is no chance that anywhere near Durant picks are available for Trae. I mean, I guess there is always some dumb team, but even those dumb teams gotta realize that Trae is a few tiers down from KD.

I think if they sell, it isn't for picks (or at least not picks as the main package). I could see a semi disgruntled older star coming back if they deal him. Thinking a player like LaVine or similar
 

TripleOT

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The Hawks and Trae were more dangerous when he had three point snipers like Huerter and Gallinari. All they had to do is more Collins for a glue guy who could play defense, and they could have built off their playoff success. Instead they went for Murray and stayed with Collins and mortgaged their immediate future.
 

lovegtm

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Hand the keys to Maxey?
I guess that, and then try to move Harris in an allThePickz deal that gets real talent into his salary slot.

Edit: forgot that their picks are encumbered through 2028 because of paying OKC to take Horford and then the Harden/Simmons trade.

Yeah, Philly is pretty screwed right now.
 
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NomarsFool

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BTW, when are the Celtics going to get some ring chaser love? Given their level of consistent success, seems like there should be some veteran role players that would choose to come to Boston on the cheap, but that doesn’t seem to have really happened much. Exceptions would be Blake Griffin and, in a different way, Horford’s extension is definitely a factor of Boston’s status. But, it seems like some of the other contenders get a constant stream of ring chasers every year and Boston really hasn’t as much.
 

lovegtm

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BTW, when are the Celtics going to get some ring chaser love? Given their level of consistent success, seems like there should be some veteran role players that would choose to come to Boston on the cheap, but that doesn’t seem to have really happened much. Exceptions would be Blake Griffin and, in a different way, Horford’s extension is definitely a factor of Boston’s status. But, it seems like some of the other contenders get a constant stream of ring chasers every year and Boston really hasn’t as much.
Whom are you thinking of that would have made a difference, from this year's ring-chasing buyouts?

Kevin Love would be behind Muscala on the Celtics' depth chart; there's no way he'd have come, and he'd never play if he did.

I don't think any of the remaining teams, including LAL, really have ring-chasing vet types. Griffin is the closest.
 

Caspir

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When Embid gets traded to the Heat for Bam, Herro and picks, we can get our hatred fully aligned. I think he asks for a trade after next season because the team has peaked and can’t break through.
 

BigSoxFan

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When Embid gets traded to the Heat for Bam, Herro and picks, we can get our hatred fully aligned. I think he asks for a trade after next season because the team has peaked and can’t break through.
We’ll see what kind of physical condition Embiid is in after next season. I would not be mortgaging my team’s future to get a 30+ year-old center with durability concerns, no matter how good he may be. Philly is truly screwed here.
 

lovegtm

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We’ll see what kind of physical condition Embiid is in after next season. I would not be mortgaging my team’s future to get a 30+ year-old center with durability concerns, no matter how good he may be. Philly is truly screwed here.
I think a team like Miami would make that bet, bet on their conditioning staff and culture, and have a good chance of being right.
 

BigSoxFan

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I think a team like Miami would make that bet, bet on their conditioning staff and culture, and have a good chance of being right.
Maybe. Butler is getting old so if the Celtics can knock them off, maybe they get a little more desperate. But I also don’t think Philly will have any appetite to trading Embiid. This is the same ownership group that refused to trade Simmons until his value absolutely cratered.
 

HomeRunBaker

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BTW, when are the Celtics going to get some ring chaser love? Given their level of consistent success, seems like there should be some veteran role players that would choose to come to Boston on the cheap, but that doesn’t seem to have really happened much. Exceptions would be Blake Griffin and, in a different way, Horford’s extension is definitely a factor of Boston’s status. But, it seems like some of the other contenders get a constant stream of ring chasers every year and Boston really hasn’t as much.
Give it time. Most veterans in this stage of their careers choose to team up with stars they have had a connection with over the years. Up until recently, and maybe continuing now to a degree, this group was considered very young so the natural fit wasn't there. Blake's positive experience won't go unnoticed around the league imo so be careful what you wish for. Like could you really handle Draymond replacing Grants role in our rotation?
 

Van Everyman

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BTW, when are the Celtics going to get some ring chaser love? Given their level of consistent success, seems like there should be some veteran role players that would choose to come to Boston on the cheap, but that doesn’t seem to have really happened much. Exceptions would be Blake Griffin and, in a different way, Horford’s extension is definitely a factor of Boston’s status. But, it seems like some of the other contenders get a constant stream of ring chasers every year and Boston really hasn’t as much.
Isn’t the answer “Once we win a title”? Ring-chasers generally are looking to win a ring, not actually help them get over the top.

If the Celtics win this year, I suspect we’ll start seeing guys accept a lesser role with Boston to increase their chances of getting some of that sweet, sweet hardware.
 

PedroKsBambino

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I guess that, and then try to move Harris in an allThePickz deal that gets real talent into his salary slot.

Edit: forgot that their picks are encumbered through 2028 because of paying OKC to take Horford and then the Harden/Simmons trade.

Yeah, Philly is pretty screwed right now.
I agree they are in a tough spot.

What I'd consider is how they build around an Embiid-Maxey core and what they can put next to those two. Do you keep Harris, or is he flipped somehow for a different type of asset (acknowledging he has neutral value at best, and for many teams negative?) Can you get an asset of out Harden in any way - not clear Houston would/needs to help you accomplish this? Is there a 'sign and trade later' Harden scenario Morey can pull off?

I agree Embiid becomes a flight risk because what I see here is a 48-52 win kind of team without a lot of upside other than small chance Maxey goes supernova. All the past asset squanders and bad decisions crush them. Then again, I've been lower than most on Embiid so I guess i kind of just feel like this is and has been a 'nowhere' situation anyway
 

lovegtm

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I agree they are in a tough spot.

What I'd consider is how they build around an Embiid-Maxey core and what they can put next to those two. Do you keep Harris, or is he flipped somehow for a different type of asset (acknowledging he has neutral value at best, and for many teams negative?) Can you get an asset of out Harden in any way - not clear Houston would/needs to help you accomplish this? Is there a 'sign and trade later' Harden scenario Morey can pull off?

I agree Embiid becomes a flight risk because what I see here is a 48-52 win kind of team without a lot of upside other than small chance Maxey goes supernova. All the past asset squanders and bad decisions crush them. Then again, I've been lower than most on Embiid so I guess i kind of just feel like this is and has been a 'nowhere' situation anyway
Pretty sure Houston has the cap space, which makes this brutal for Philly.

Honestly I don't even think Harris is that bad, and if you can't upgrade him, the best thing is probably to lean into him doing more offensively. That team seems pretty capped as a 1st or 2nd round out, however.
 

Smokey Joe

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I guess that, and then try to move Harris in an allThePickz deal that gets real talent into his salary slot.

Edit: forgot that their picks are encumbered through 2028 because of paying OKC to take Horford and then the Harden/Simmons trade.

Yeah, Philly is pretty screwed right now.
Never underestimate Morey’s ability to take a bad situation, and by sacrificing every scrap of a teams future, building a team that will look good and be a second round exit.
 

lovegtm

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Never underestimate Morey’s ability to take a bad situation, and by sacrificing every scrap of a teams future, building a team that will look good and be a second round exit.
That's my point though: he already kinda did that, and they don't have future 1sts left to deal, except (I think) 2030. Swaps, I guess.
 

Smokey Joe

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That's my point though: he already kinda did that, and they don't have future 1sts left to deal, except (I think) 2030. Swaps, I guess.
But they will reach their primary goal of Daryl Morey still being employed.
 

Cellar-Door

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Saw this discussed somewhere recently when they were talking about buyouts in the new CBA... but basically the impact ring chaser market has started to dry up. One argument is that there are a lot of teams who can argue for being contenders, and so say PJ Tucker, he can command 3/33M from a PHI and feel like they might compete, instead of a smaller deal with GS/BOS/MIL.

Though also you could argue we got one of the better ring chasers on the market in Gallo, he just got hurt.
The days of basically 2-3 teams being dominant and above average vets taking huge discounts feels over, it's mostly guys who are full MLE taking small MLE deals.
 

lovegtm

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Saw this discussed somewhere recently when they were talking about buyouts in the new CBA... but basically the impact ring chaser market has started to dry up. One argument is that there are a lot of teams who can argue for being contenders, and so say PJ Tucker, he can command 3/33M from a PHI and feel like they might compete, instead of a smaller deal with GS/BOS/MIL.

Though also you could argue we got one of the better ring chasers on the market in Gallo, he just got hurt.
The days of basically 2-3 teams being dominant and above average vets taking huge discounts feels over, it's mostly guys who are full MLE taking small MLE deals.
Lol, I forgot about Gallo. Between him and Blake, the Celtics got two of the better ringchasey guys out there; it just was a very, very shallow barrel to scrape from, as you said.
 

PedroKsBambino

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Now that we're through two playoff series...

I am not sure Gallo would have played much even if healthy. What do we think Gallo would have been vs philly in games 6/7....8-10 minutes of offensive juice, if that? Grant is a better all-around player and much better defensive player and didn't even see the court. Hauser didn't play.

I was a fan of Gallo and saw the fit, but Brogdon's great play and consistency (generally) of the top 7 likely made Gallo a bit player even if he were available. He'd have been a gigantic addition to last year's team but not so much this year at least thus far. We'll see what happens against tough Heat D, where he might have had a bigger role
 

benhogan

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Now that we're through two playoff series...

I am not sure Gallo would have played much even if healthy. What do we think Gallo would have been vs philly in games 6/7....8-10 minutes of offensive juice, if that? Grant is a better all-around player and much better defensive player and didn't even see the court. Hauser didn't play.

I was a fan of Gallo and saw the fit, but Brogdon's great play and consistency (generally) of the top 7 likely made Gallo a bit player even if he were available. He'd have been a gigantic addition to last year's team but not so much this year at least thus far. We'll see what happens against tough Heat D, where he might have had a bigger role
Anyone that is concerned with Hauser's defense should be terrified by the thought of 34yr old Gallinari on the back of 2nd knee surgery.

This season Celtics' have plenty of shooting/scoring from its ancillary players. DG is salary filler at this point (if he re-ups this summer)
 

OurF'ingCity

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Now that we're through two playoff series...

I am not sure Gallo would have played much even if healthy. What do we think Gallo would have been vs philly in games 6/7....8-10 minutes of offensive juice, if that? Grant is a better all-around player and much better defensive player and didn't even see the court. Hauser didn't play.

I was a fan of Gallo and saw the fit, but Brogdon's great play and consistency (generally) of the top 7 likely made Gallo a bit player even if he were available. He'd have been a gigantic addition to last year's team but not so much this year at least thus far. We'll see what happens against tough Heat D, where he might have had a bigger role
I always saw Gallo as more of regular-season guy who can come in and give the starters rest while scoring in bunches against mismatches against the other teams' bench players. But, yeah, I doubt he would be getting heavy minutes in the playoffs if he were healthy.
 

lovegtm

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It's funny that Danny got raked a bit here for helping the Lakers, but he got a decent pick, and the Lakers got DLo and Vanderbilt, who have been almost unplayable in the WCF.

(Although Darvin Ham takes "unplayable" as a challenge, I guess.)
 

TripleOT

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It's funny that Danny got raked a bit here for helping the Lakers, but he got a decent pick, and the Lakers got DLo and Vanderbilt, who have been almost unplayable in the WCF.

(Although Darvin Ham takes "unplayable" as a challenge, I guess.)
Isn‘t the most important part of that trade the Lakers being freed from having to play Westbrook?
 

benhogan

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It's funny that Danny got raked a bit here for helping the Lakers, but he got a decent pick, and the Lakers got DLo and Vanderbilt, who have been almost unplayable in the WCF.

(Although Darvin Ham takes "unplayable" as a challenge, I guess.)
Vanderbilt at $4MM/yr is a nice rotational defender (so Bron can go comatose on D) for 2 seasons.
I definitely thought Rui was a nothing burger, but he played pretty well for the Lakers (credit to @HomeRunBaker )

DLo is the absolute worst. Austin Reaves played him off the court. I'm just hoping somebody pays up for Hillbilly Kobe, Laker fans will lose their collective minds.

"Trader Danny" may have had his most lopsided year ever. He just offered a Masterclass on how to rebuild on the fly, without having to tank.
 

Auger34

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Vanderbilt at $4MM/yr is a nice rotational defender (so Bron can go comatose on D) for 2 seasons.
I definitely thought Rui was a nothing burger, but he played pretty well for the Lakers (credit to @HomeRunBaker )

DLo is the absolute worst. Austin Reaves played him off the court. I'm just hoping somebody pays up for Hillbilly Kobe, Laker fans will lose their collective minds.

"Trader Danny" may have had his most lopsided year ever. He just offered a Masterclass on how to rebuild on the fly, without having to tank.
It’s funny because I completely agree with you that Danny had a fantastic year but I think you could argue he also made the worst trade of the year.

Bogdanovic for Olynyk and Saben Lee looks pretty damn bad in retrospect (especially with the emergence of Walker Kessler)
 

benhogan

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It’s funny because I completely agree with you that Danny had a fantastic year but I think you could argue he also made the worst trade of the year.

Bogdanovic for Olynyk and Saben Lee looks pretty damn bad in retrospect (especially with the emergence of Walker Kessler)
Minnesota owns that title ;)
Mavs had a rough year, not sure what they do with Kyrie

Bogdanovic had a nice season. What would Bojan net in a trade?

Kelly is cheaper, maybe Danny wanted to save $$$ to take contracts + picks (RWB/Laker pick)
 

HomeRunBaker

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Totally expected regardless of where he ends up. I'd have to assume returning to Toronto is part of a mutual plan.
 

Euclis20

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With Nurse going to Philly (and the Sixers having some cap space, though not quite a max slot if Harden leaves), is that a potential destination for FVV?