The nation's tears are still here

Ferm Sheller

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I don't even understand his point. The Bills had better starting field position all night and still lost, so we can't give Bill Belichick credit? The Pats spotted the Bills 20 yards or so on every possession and also didn't throw the ball all night, and still won.

What a dunce.
I think he's saying that it's more his own team's fault given their favorable average starting field position. Still a dunce, though.

EDIT: Also, "Judon back"
 

Captaincoop

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I think he's saying that it's more his own team's fault given their favorable average starting field position. Still a dunce, though.

EDIT: Also, "Judon back"
I'll translate: "Bill Belichick didn't outcoach me, I had a better game plan and my players let me down".

Should go over well with said players.
 

soxhop411

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I'll translate: "Bill Belichick didn't outcoach me, I had a better game plan and my players let me down".

Should go over well with said players.
Throwing his players under the bus is going to go over real well in the locker room.
 

PedroKsBambino

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I'll translate: "Bill Belichick didn't outcoach me, I had a better game plan and my players let me down".

Should go over well with said players.
That's about opposing team number 75 in the BB era who said roughly "they were just lucky" and confused preparation/planning/execution with "luck"
 

lexrageorge

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That's about opposing team number 75 in the BB era who said roughly "they were just lucky" and confused preparation/planning/execution with "luck"
It's an easy trap to fall into as a fan. I know I've caught myself a few times after a Pats loss mentioning how "lucky" the opponent got due to a bad officiating call or a dumb bounce of the ball, and I don't think I'm alone. Said the same thing about the Miami loss this season.

But a coach needs to do better. As Bill would say, the Pats executed on more plays when it counted last night, just as the Dolphins did in the opener. Note I did not say "more plays overall"; some are more impactful than others, but those are only known in hindsight. Execute on enough plays and the sum total is greater than its parts.
 

BaseballJones

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From the Bills' fans group, griping about the game. Here's one poster's take:

"I'm honestly really pissed off today because there is ZERO reason to have lost that game. ZERO.

We were the better team, we were able to throw the ball effectively and we just couldn't get out of our damn way again...dropped passes, stupid penalties in clutch situations, dropped TDs, dumb play by Allen tripping over his own player who of course gets shoved into him...

Just frustrating as hell to watch us lose this way... inexcusable."


They were the better team? (NE had more yards, more yards per play, and more TOP)
They were able to throw the ball effectively? (Allen was 15-30 for 145 yds - 4.8 y/a)

But I love the whining. LOL
 

Captaincoop

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I must have missed the dropped TDs. Does he mean the ball that was thrown to a receiver in the end zone and landed in the stands? Or the one thrown to a blanketed receiver and broken up by the DB?
 

BaseballJones

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I must have missed the dropped TDs. Does he mean the ball that was thrown to a receiver in the end zone and landed in the stands? Or the one thrown to a blanketed receiver and broken up by the DB?
He is referring to the latter. Phillips made a nice play to break it up. But in Buffalo-land, I guess that's a "drop".

Or he could have been referring to Diggs not being able to haul in the bomb from Allen in 40 mph swirling winds.
 

kartvelo

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From an old friend last night:
"Soooooooooo glad I decided about 15 years ago to never bet against Belicheat. Soooooooo nice getting every call and every clock manipulation my way "

More from him a couple weeks ago:
"Belicheat went one year without an elite quarterback, then the league let Mac Jones fall to him in the 2021 draft (fifth QB taken). It does help that 'cheat is the best head coach by far, in a league where the hc is the most important position on the team."

But, then, he's a conspiracy theorist in all walks of life. He was one of my closest work friends ever, back in the day, but he's gone full MAGA now.
 

NortheasternPJ

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From the Bills' fans group, griping about the game. Here's one poster's take:

"I'm honestly really pissed off today because there is ZERO reason to have lost that game. ZERO.

We were the better team, we were able to throw the ball effectively and we just couldn't get out of our damn way again...dropped passes, stupid penalties in clutch situations, dropped TDs, dumb play by Allen tripping over his own player who of course gets shoved into him...

Just frustrating as hell to watch us lose this way... inexcusable."


They were the better team? (NE had more yards, more yards per play, and more TOP)
They were able to throw the ball effectively? (Allen was 15-30 for 145 yds - 4.8 y/a)

But I love the whining. LOL
Yeah things aren’t going too well over at the Two Bills Drive forum today.
 

Pandemonium67

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I assume the whiner was talking about the bomb to Diggs. The swirling winds upped the degree of difficulty, but the ball landed right on his arm. Allen couldn't have placed it any better.
 

DJnVa

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I assume the whiner was talking about the bomb to Diggs. The swirling winds upped the degree of difficulty, but the ball landed right on his arm. Allen couldn't have placed it any better.
If it hit him in the arm, it was likely 15 feet to his right when it was 20 feet up in the air.
 

tbrown_01923

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If it hit him in the arm, it was likely 15 feet to his right when it was 20 feet up in the air.
It didn't seem like an easy catch, but as a novice observer, I wondered:

* how much Diggs tracked under the ball,
* where did allen intend for the ball to be
* was it lucky just to be in a position to have an opportunity to even make the play

that was the one play that stuck with me and I couldn't figure out whether it was crap the ball wasn't cought, great skill there was an opportunity to catch the ball, or just luck the ball was in the area ...
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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I was actually kind of impressed by Allen yesterday.

He's only going to get better and better and I think is going to be a formidable adversary to the Patriots for a long time.
 

Euclis20

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The throw to Diggs was Allen's best of the night, but it was indicative of how the wind was just as hard on the receivers as it was on the QBs. We see drops all the time, how often do you see a pass hit a receiver (who is looking for the ball) in his forearm? Receivers drop passes all the time with their hands, but not like this (is it even a drop if the ball never hits your hands).
 

E5 Yaz

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I was actually kind of impressed by Allen yesterday.

He's only going to get better and better and I think is going to be a formidable adversary to the Patriots for a long time.
I'm really surprised at the near absence of designed runs for him under those conditions. He's their best ball carrier
 

E5 Yaz

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The other thing I was thinking about this morning was the comparison between McDermott's press conference and Sean McVay's reaction to being shut down by the Patriots in the Super Bowl -- when he said he got taken to school, and that he had to own that and learn from it.
 

CSteinhardt

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McDermott was real mad about the formation the pats lined up in before they took the first half timeout. Anyone get a screenshot? Wondering if it actually was or more of the typical opposing coaches looking for things that aren't there.
I'm confused by this. Suppose that the offensive lines up in an illegal formation. Isn't the correct thing to do to let them snap it, then you'll get a flag (and a free play to make something good happen)? Why would you take a timeout in response to something you think is an illegal formation?
 

DJnVa

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The ball that surprised me yesterday was our 15 yard punt. I *thought*, watching the broadcast, that he crushed it. Would love any alternate angle on that.
 

PC Drunken Friar

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The ball that surprised me yesterday was our 15 yard punt. I *thought*, watching the broadcast, that he crushed it. Would love any alternate angle on that.
I did too. I thought he boomed it too high and it got caught in the wind, but the announcers said that he hit it off the side of his foot.
 

Archer1979

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The ball that surprised me yesterday was our 15 yard punt. I *thought*, watching the broadcast, that he crushed it. Would love any alternate angle on that.
That thing went up and DIED. I was watching a clip of Gunner in pre-game throwing passes to himself by throwing them straight up (with the idea that they would come right back down). They all drifted away far enough that he couldn't get to them.
 

E5 Yaz

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I did too. I thought he boomed it too high and it got caught in the wind, but the announcers said that he hit it off the side of his foot.
Yeah, they showed a replay of the ball being moved by the win on the drop from Bailey's hand to foot
 

Van Everyman

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Yeah, they showed a replay of the ball being moved by the win on the drop from Bailey's hand to foot
Which, BTW, is like a foot in length -- which should tell you not only how hard the wind was blowing but also what it was like on the actual field (not just up in the air). Wild.
 

54thMA

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He is referring to the latter. Phillips made a nice play to break it up. But in Buffalo-land, I guess that's a "drop".

Or he could have been referring to Diggs not being able to haul in the bomb from Allen in 40 mph swirling winds.
Pretty sure it's the latter; it clanged off of his arm/hand, he turned the wrong way, he was open on the play.
 

macal

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The ball that surprised me yesterday was our 15 yard punt. I *thought*, watching the broadcast, that he crushed it. Would love any alternate angle on that.
I definitely thought the same thing. I was thinking a good 40-45 yard punt, then the ball vanished, then the camera pans to the sideline 15 yards from the kicker. Obviously my eyes were tricked. Would also love to see another angle on that, or even the original angle in slow-mo. They did later show the ball coming of the punters foot to the side from a close up angle. That was when they were explaining that the wind was strong enough to move the ball during the transfer from the punters hands to his feet.
 

bakahump

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Josh Allen may be that Uber talented Rival that goes to a Conference Foe, that the lower drafted QB Mac Jones has to play for his entire Career. pundits will point out what a HOFer Allen is as he puts up great numbers, while deriding Mac Jones as a system QB. Sure doesnt look good for Mac. Cant say there are alot of examples for him to follow. Well MAYBE Bill Russell and his battles against Wilt. But not really fair to compare him to an All Time Great.
 

Cotillion

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We are right back to the "I can't believe we lost to those guys" 'we're a better team" "we outplayed them (and lost)" era of early Tom, Bill, and the Defense...
 

JerBear

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I'm confused by this. Suppose that the offensive lines up in an illegal formation. Isn't the correct thing to do to let them snap it, then you'll get a flag (and a free play to make something good happen)? Why would you take a timeout in response to something you think is an illegal formation?
Patriots called TO before the snap, poor pronoun clarity on my part. After the Patriots called timeout, the cameras cut to McDermott losing his mind on the refs standing anywhere near him.
 

lexrageorge

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Patriots called TO before the snap, poor pronoun clarity on my part. After the Patriots called timeout, the cameras cut to McDermott losing his mind on the refs standing anywhere near him.
So either McDermott wanted the penalty called despite the Pats calling timeout (which is BS), or he was taking another opportunity to berate the officials for the delay of game penalty against Buffalo a few snaps earlier (that one really seemed to set him off).
 

Over Guapo Grande

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So either McDermott wanted the penalty called despite the Pats calling timeout (which is BS), or he was taking another opportunity to berate the officials for the delay of game penalty against Buffalo a few snaps earlier (that one really seemed to set him off).
In real time, and using my horrible lip reading, I thought that McDermott was looking for a Delay of Game penalty, saying "That was the exact same thing"- the time out got called at/around 0 on the play clock.
 

djbayko

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More from him a couple weeks ago:
"Belicheat went one year without an elite quarterback, then the league let Mac Jones fall to him in the 2021 draft (fifth QB taken). It does help that 'cheat is the best head coach by far, in a league where the hc is the most important position on the team."
So now people are going to pretend they knew all along that Mac was a sure thing? And the Patriots got the NFL version of a frozen envelope.

LOL. Boo hoo
 

Van Everyman

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In real time, and using my horrible lip reading, I thought that McDermott was looking for a Delay of Game penalty, saying "That was the exact same thing"- the time out got called at/around 0 on the play clock.
McDermott's complaining about the delay of game call (which was well after the play clock hit zero) reminded me of when KC's staff was moaning in the 2018 AFCCG that the refs should have warned Dee Ford that he was lined up in the neutral zone. I get that refs often give teams heads up on these things or buffers, but give me a break. Don't let the clock wind to zero or line up 2 1/2 feet into the neutral zone, dudes.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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McDermott may or may not have had gripes, but what was clear to me was that he was close on tilt during significant portions of the game. He was spending too much time complaining and not enough time trying to figure out "well, ok, now what do we do"? He was in a one score game and seemed unable to get over fairly minor calls that did not change the ultimate situation and which were all surmountable.

Bill isn't perfect on this either. He'll get after the refs, but you always get the sense that it's part theater and always there is a purpose. I really can't remember too many occasions where he lost his cool with the refs unless he was trying to work them to make sure that something he perceived as incorrect didn't happen again.

The only times I can seem to remember him really losing his shit is where the refs have actually hindered something that he was trying to do. Like he had seen an advantage and refs blew it for him. He hates that.

I can remember a few cases where he's been really giving it to the refs and then the play clock starts and he switches back into coach mode immediately.

If there's one thing that defines Belichick it's that he is the ultimate master of situational football. Bad calls go into the computer and he figures out what needs to happen next and that's that. If there is no situational advantage to whining he's on to Cincinnati. Other than that venting can make you feel good, there is really no situational advantage to whining and it just distracts you from doing your job. McDermott was anti-situational last night.

You get the feeling that when Bill gets on the refs they seem to know that he's probably correct. It was interesting last night when he lost his shit about the initial reset to the 25 second clock on the injury on the last drive, that it took a bit of time for the side judge (or whichever ref that was) to assure him that they would fix it. That was a case of making sure they got it right and while I think it's very unlikely Vinovich didn't know the rule there, Belichick was going to make sure that the Bills didn't get an unearned 4th timeout with a play clock error.
 

E5 Yaz

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McDermott may or may not have had gripes, but what was clear to me was that he was close on tilt during significant portions of the game. He was spending too much time complaining and not enough time trying to figure out "well, ok, now what do we do"? He was in a one score game and seemed unable to get over fairly minor calls that did not change the ultimate situation and which were all surmountable.
In a radio interview, Peter king also made this point, saying to his eye McDermott looked "unhinged"
 

BusRaker

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I was at a Buffalo Bills sports bar last night, only Pats fan in the house. The tears were real, especially after the 64 yard TD run.
On a side note. I was really hoping for a 70 yard with the wind punt but neither of them really got a hold of one with the wind
 

Ferm Sheller

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I was at a Buffalo Bills sports bar last night, only Pats fan in the house. The tears were real, especially after the 64 yard TD run.
On a side note. I was really hoping for a 70 yard with the wind punt but neither of them really got a hold of one with the wind
Bailey had a 71-yarder!

EDIT: Or do you mean exactly 70? :)
 

Koufax

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It went into the end zone. The net was a mere 51 yards.
 

Omar's Wacky Neighbor

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Leaving in a bit to the studio :)
Yeah things aren’t going too well over at the Two Bills Drive forum today.
"Same story all year. Shooting ourselves in the foot in close games. "

No, last night the coaching staff was Charlie f'n Stewart, shooting themselves in the midsection and coming close to/pretty much dying to "outsmart" everyone else.

EDIT: Goodness, some of these comments are like reading TheGangGreen: Way Upstate:

"We lost to absolutely one dimensional team (( "

"Say what you want, but nothing the patriots did impressed me tonight. "

"What is preventing the patriots from basically just running this exact same gameplan against us in 3 weeks? We had 11 guys trying to stop the run, but couldn’t. If you were BB, wouldn’t you just do the same thing? "
 
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SamK

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I'm confused by this. Suppose that the offensive lines up in an illegal formation. Isn't the correct thing to do to let them snap it, then you'll get a flag (and a free play to make something good happen)? Why would you take a timeout in response to something you think is an illegal formation?
Patriots called TO before the snap, poor pronoun clarity on my part. After the Patriots called timeout, the cameras cut to McDermott losing his mind on the refs standing anywhere near him.
FWIW at the time I think Pats lined up (some heavy run formation? with a halfback and a fullback maybe??), and they let Mac start his count while he was reading the Buffalo's D adjustments. Then, Pat's called timeout just before a snap, or play clock ran out--
__My thought at the time was "Is McDermott pissed that the Pat's got a free look at his defensive adjustment to an unusual O-scheme?? Is there something illegal about using a timeout for that purpose? Is he just posturing???"
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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In a radio interview, Peter king also made this point, saying to his eye McDermott looked "unhinged"
I wonder how many times the Patriots have had an advantage because they are so deeply in other teams' heads. I do think sometimes it works against them. There have definitely been games where teams have been completely fired up to play against them and have beaten them just by sheer intensity in the regular season. It happens. But it's also the case that teams kind of put so much mental energy into the Patriots that they lose their shit.

I really sort of thought some of that would dissipate with Brady leaving and maybe it has to some extent. But once I started reading the shit about the play where Mac grabbed the player's leg I realized that it's just a Patriots thing. It has to be making teams crazy and incredibly frustrated that they are doing well and found a good QB.
 
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Kliq

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FWIW at the time I think Pats lined up (some heavy run formation? with a halfback and a fullback maybe??), and they let Mac start his count while he was reading the Buffalo's D adjustments. Then, Pat's called timeout just before a snap, or play clock ran out--
__My thought at the time was "Is McDermott pissed that the Pat's got a free look at his defensive adjustment to an unusual O-scheme?? Is there something illegal about using a timeout for that purpose? Is he just posturing???"
On the previous drive, Buffalo was called for delay of game and McDermott was super mad the refs didn't recognize that he was apparently calling timeout. So when a similar play happened and this time the Pats get the TO called in time, he went super-agro.