Tebow Time! Can't kaep him down.

Vinho Tinto

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Because he wanted to play TE for an NFL team led by his old college coach?
Agreed, this isn’t comparable to Kaep.

Tebow is Meyer’s #1 hype man. If Tebow can play a D- level for TE, he will have a real shot at making the team because of what he might do for Meyer in the locker room.
 

BaseballJones

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1. From reports, Kaep was offered a backup job and didn’t take it. I’m sure Tebow will take any salary they offer.

2. Kaep wasn’t willing to adjust. Neither was Tebow...for years he refused to play anything other than QB, which is why he wasn’t employed in the league. But now Tebow IS adjusting. Everyone always thought he might be able to play another position but he refused. Now he’s willing and thus he’s getting another shot. Note: I’m not saying Kaep should have switched positions...just that he seemed inflexible on the whole.

3. I bet there’s a huge difference between Tebow and Kaep from a “political” perspective. I put that in quotes because I think it’s about perception. Tebow has never ever been a “problem” guy. Kaep obviously is a lightning rod.

I don’t think Tebow will work out in the end, but I do think there’s major differences between the two situations.
 

Kliq

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When he was in camp with the Jets, didn't Tebow play more as a special-teamer/TE than a QB?
 

scott bankheadcase

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From that article:

The Broncos' contact with Kaepernick occurred when he was still with the Niners and before he began kneeling during the playing of the national anthem to protest social injustice and racial inequality.


There’s no indication Kap has been offered anything since his protest.
 

Kliq

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There are few sports conversations more exhausting than the conversation that takes place whenever some stiff QB is signed to a backup deal and then people wonder why QB X was signed and not Kaepernick. To be fair, Kaepernick is DEFINITELY better than Tebow, or at least he was when he last played, but I don't think the situations are comparable. I think the Tebow signing was dumb, but he's coming back to try and make the NFL as a TE because everybody knows he can't do it as a QB, and if his old college coach wasn't coaching an NFL team, it would never be happening.

Kaepernick's stance on racial inequality definitely was a factor in him not finding a home in the NFL after leaving San Francisco, and it should be held against the NFL and Goodell that they played into the right-wing-media mob, but it's time to move on from wondering why someone is in the NFL and Kaepernick is not. It isn't some big mystery.
 

cornwalls@6

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I don't think the two situations are analogous, but trying to downplay the fact that Kaep was effectively blackballed by the league is not an accurate reading of events, IMO. As noted by others, Tebow is there for marquee value, and to try and be a locker room leader for Meyer. I'll be pretty surprised however if he is able to provide much on-field value, and at some point, intangibles or not, they'll have to seriously question whether he is worth the roster spot.

edit: Or, what @Kliq said.
 

billy ashley

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Kaepernick absolutely got black balled and everyone involved in that should be ashamed. History didn't take long to prove he was right.

But yeah... it's been a bit since he was in the NFL. I suspect if a team signed him, he'd be terrible, due to the fact that's he's 33 and hasn't played a snap since 2016.

Finally, unlike Tebow, Kaepernick was a lower tier starting QB (Tebow wasn't, he was a fabulous college player who's game didn't translate as well. He's an extraordinary athlete, and there's no shame being the 50th best QB on the planet - there's just not much money in it). It's more than likely had he not gotten screwed by the league, Kaepernick's time as a useful QB would be over at this point. There was already some debate as to whether or not he was a worthwhile starter in 16.

Tebow is a publicity stunt / advocate for the current coach. That's the only reason he got an offer. If Kaepernick signed anywhere, I think that too would likely be a failed experiment.

As others have pointed out - the question shouldn't be "Why wasn't this Kaepernick?" it should be "Why on Earth would somebody sign Tebow?"
 

terrynever

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Tebow did not get an offer from the Jags. He contacted Urban Meyer and asked for a tryout at tight end. The guy just can’t give up ball and get on with his life. He’ll be cut in mid-August.
 

Fred not Lynn

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Tebow is there…to try and be a locker room leader for Meyer. I'll be pretty surprised however if he is able to provide much on-field value, and at some point, intangibles or not, they'll have to seriously question whether he is worth the roster spot.
If only there was some role a former athlete, of good character and deep knowledge of the game, but with declined physical skill could take to provide sideline and locker room leadership without taking up a roster spot.

Some sort of “mentor” or like a “life coach”, except for sports…
 

Kliq

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The thing about Tebow coming in and hyping up Meyer in the locker room is that I don't know what Tebow's credibility in the locker room would be. Most of the players were not in the NFL when he was actually a relevant player, not to mention around college football when he was an actual star. Players now probably see Tebow as this big college player who washed out of the NFL years ago, and even if he is a nice guy, they are going to see that he is only on the roster because of Meyer and thus his credibility is kind of shot when it comes to critical evaluation of the coach.
 

Cellar-Door

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Yeah, I feel pretty confident that Tim Tebow is not going to be a lockerroom leader in JAX. He can't play, never could in the NFL and he'll be known as the Coach's boy who got someone deserving cut.
 

Mystic Merlin

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It’ll be a huge accomplishment for him to stick as an H-Back with like 3-4 months of work, a position he has played a handful of practice snaps at over 15 years. TE is not an easy position to play, mentally or physically.
 

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Urban is no dummy.

Lawrence will get the second most media coverage of any player at training camp--behind a longshot h-back candidate--which is pretty unusual for a rookie QB who was number one pick overall and will probably be most welcome for Lawrence.
 

ShaneTrot

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Well, Tebow is one of the few players who played for Meyer in college that has never had a run-in with the law or murdered someone. That's a start.
 

jercra

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He's also local hero in Jacksonville having "gone" to the same high school as Mack Jones. His participation in a camp and subsequent cut will be a huge local story and will drum up excitement for a season where the team is likely to still be pretty bad.
 

azsoxpatsfan

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Urban is no dummy.

Lawrence will get the second most media coverage of any player at training camp--behind a longshot h-back candidate--which is pretty unusual for a rookie QB who was number one pick overall and will probably be most welcome for Lawrence.
I’m pretty sure this is the entirety of the plan. Take some of the spotlight off Trevor. And honestly I think it’s a pretty solid idea
 

nighthob

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From that article:

The Broncos' contact with Kaepernick occurred when he was still with the Niners and before he began kneeling during the playing of the national anthem to protest social injustice and racial inequality.


There’s no indication Kap has been offered anything since his protest.
The article, if you'd read past the point where you had your opinion confirmed, cited two other teams as having contacted Kaepernick after, the Ravens and Seahawks. But, ultimately, Kaepernick just appeared to not want to be a backup QB. Much like Tim Tebow didn't want to be anything but a QB until very recently. It worked out a lot better for Kaepernick, financially, though.
 

scott bankheadcase

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The article, if you'd read past the point where you had your opinion confirmed, cited two other teams as having contacted Kaepernick after, the Ravens and Seahawks. But, ultimately, Kaepernick just appeared to not want to be a backup QB. Much like Tim Tebow didn't want to be anything but a QB until very recently. It worked out a lot better for Kaepernick, financially, though.
I read the whole article. I'm well aware of most aspects of Kap's situation.

I was refuting the point that Denver made an actual offer for him to be a backup (which was stated). Also, there has never been any reporting that there was an offer made to him by either Seattle or Baltimore to be a backup and he refused. Just that some contact was made between their respective camps.

You might infer that was the case, but I haven't seen anything tangible that leads me to believe there was a real offer from either team.
 

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Jacksonville had an awful draft. After Lawrence they had one pick of value, Jay Tufele at 106 (84th on Arif’s Consensus Big Board). Every other pick was either fair value at best or a reach.

Arif’s consensus big board takes over 70 boards from Daniel Jeremiah, Dane Bruglar, Lance Zierlein, to even my own big board and aggregates them together for a list of the top 300 prospects. The big board is one of the best predictors of NFL success and even beats the NFL draft order in some years so don’t just take it with a grain of salt. It’s a valuable source of information.

My biggest issue with JAX was at pick 25. Instead of taking an OT/OL like Teven Jenkins or a CB like Greg Newsome they took Travis ETN. Then Utban Meyer goes on to say that ETN will be their third down back next year. So many things wrong with this: 1) ETN is not a good zone runner and he is only mediocre as a pass catcher. ETN is a fit for gap/power teams. We don’t know exactly what Jacksonville will run but Meyer’s offenses traditionally have been more zone heavy. Taking a somewhat one-dimensional back to go to a non-scheme-fit at 25 is baffling. 2) They needed OT and CB. They should have taken Greg Newsome who went one pick later to the Browns. He was scheme diverse corner who tested very well. They could have gone OT at 33 and selected Jenkins there as their LT or RT of the future. Jenkins also can play guard. 3) You don’t take a running back you don’t immediately want to start that highly. It’s not bad imo to take a running back after pick 15 or so but the reason for that is they are most valuable on their rookie contract. Taking an RB at 25 and then not planning to use him year 1 in more than a 3rd down role is a waste of resources. So fucking stupid.

Let’s wrap up this shit sandwich to go:
33) Tyson Campbell, CB, out UGA who has hardly any defensive production, a bad 3-cone and has never put it together as a corner. He was 57th overall on Arif’s board board and is another reach.
45) Walker Little, OT, Stanford was 85th on the consensus board so it is a reach but Little has the pedigree and athleticism where I can at least understand this risk.
65) Andre Cisco, S, Syracuse: the gambling man. 88th on Arif’s consensus big board so a slight reach. Personally I like safeties who don't take the cheese and give up 6 TDs but what do I know as an outsider?
106) Jay Tufele is 84th on Arif's board so good value there.
121) Jordan Smith, Edge, Ala-Birm, is 118 on Arif's board so fair value here. However edges past round 1 usually are bigger busts than other positions.
145) Luke Farrell, Ohio State, 285th on Arif's board. Reach.
209) Jaelen Camp, WR, Georgia Tech, not even on Arif's top 300 even though I liked him... reach (probably).

Jacksonville was 30th overall for their ROI via Arif's big board. Given their draft capital they had an abysmal draft. It's no surprise a shitty organization like this is picking first. At least they didn't fuck up the Lawrence pick.

Edit: here is what I would have done:

1 - Lawence
25 - Greg Newsome, CB, Northwestern
33 - Teven Jenkins
45 - Either Asante Samuel Jr or Dillon Radunz and double dip at CB or OL. Asante would give them a great inside-outside option. Radunz could play LT. Creed Humphrey could have worked too.
 

Ed Hillel

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I’m pretty sure this is the entirety of the plan. Take some of the spotlight off Trevor. And honestly I think it’s a pretty solid idea
Is it? If your Best QB Prospect in a Decade can’t handle the football media pressure of...Jacksonville, is he really gonna make it?
 

CantKeepmedown

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Old friend Ted Johnson weighs in. I don't know the fine details of Tebow's financial profile (looks like he made just under $10M last go-round and was probably paid fairly well as an analyst). But maybe Urb, outside of just wanting a positive locker room guy, is helping his old player out a bit. Obviously, he still needs to make it out of camp.


Tebow playing TE in the NFL is an insult to TE's. He needs to be on the active roster for just 3 games this year to get a credited season and become a fully vested player. Tebow has played 3yrs and needs one more year (or 3 games)of service to have lifetime benefits.
 

joe dokes

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If only there was some role a former athlete, of good character and deep knowledge of the game, but with declined physical skill could take to provide sideline and locker room leadership without taking up a roster spot.

Some sort of “mentor” or like a “life coach”, except for sports…
"Hold my beer; so I can stab you in the back with my free hand."
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PedroKsBambino

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Old friend Ted Johnson weighs in. I don't know the fine details of Tebow's financial profile (looks like he made just under $10M last go-round and was probably paid fairly well as an analyst). But maybe Urb, outside of just wanting a positive locker room guy, is helping his old player out a bit. Obviously, he still needs to make it out of camp.

Also, Tebow in Jacksonville will sell tickets. That is again of some relevance to the team this year, I'd think.
 

nighthob

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I read the whole article. I'm well aware of most aspects of Kap's situation.

I was refuting the point that Denver made an actual offer for him to be a backup (which was stated). Also, there has never been any reporting that there was an offer made to him by either Seattle or Baltimore to be a backup and he refused. Just that some contact was made between their respective camps.

You might infer that was the case, but I haven't seen anything tangible that leads me to believe there was a real offer from either team.
They contacted him about being a backup QB, you could literally have clicked over to the NFL.com article about it. He just wasn't interested. And that's fine. Maybe he wanted to be higher profile for his political work? I don't know. Also, you should probably have looked at what the article got wrong, he was contacted by Denver after his last year in San Francisco (2016), even if he was still technically under contract to the 49ers. He just wasn't interested in being a backup anywhere.

And it would have been impossible for him to start kneeling during the anthem after he was out of the league. Put another way, Denver, Baltimore, and Seattle all reached out to him after the controversy. Denver made an actual offer, Baltimore spoke to him, with no further info on whether or not they made a concrete offer. Seattle apparently couldn't agree on even a workout with him. So you might not be as aware as you're patting yourself on the back for being.
 
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Red(s)HawksFan

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Old friend Ted Johnson weighs in. I don't know the fine details of Tebow's financial profile (looks like he made just under $10M last go-round and was probably paid fairly well as an analyst). But maybe Urb, outside of just wanting a positive locker room guy, is helping his old player out a bit. Obviously, he still needs to make it out of camp.

FWIW, Johnson is wrong. They changed this in the last CBA. Now, it only takes 3 years of service time to be fully vested. Since Tebow is already at three years, he gains nothing by coming back for more.
 

scott bankheadcase

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They contacted him about being a backup QB, you could literally have clicked over to the NFL.com article about it. He just wasn't interested. And that's fine. Maybe he wanted to be higher profile for his political work? I don't know. Also, you should probably have looked at what the article got wrong, he was contacted by Denver after his last year in San Francisco (2016), even if he was still technically under contract to the 49ers. He just wasn't interested in being a backup anywhere.

And it would have been impossible for him to start kneeling during the anthem after he was out of the league. Put another way, Denver, Baltimore, and Seattle all reached out to him after the controversy. Denver made an actual offer, Baltimore spoke to him, with no further info on whether or not they made a concrete offer. Seattle apparently couldn't agree on even a workout with him. So you might not be as aware as you're patting yourself on the back for being.
OK, here's an article where Kap's camp says he was never offered a contract of any type by any team: View: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2726323-colin-kaepernick-representatives-reportedly-deny-qb-rejected-nfl-contract


Here's an article that says Kap would go to any team including being a backup QB:
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/colin-kaepernicks-agent-has-reportedly-reached-out-to-three-teams-qb-apparently-willing-to-be-a-backup/
https://clutchpoints.com/nfl-news-colin-kaepernick-fine-with-being-a-backup-quarterback/

Here's a story about the Ravens encounter that talks about why they didn't sign him (but Kap seemed willing to backup Flacco, that wasn't the issue):
https://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/bs-sp-ravens-kaepernick-griffin-0405-story.html

Here's an article about how the Seahawks passed on Kap (who was going to workout for them to be a backup to WIlson, not starter) because he indicated he wouldn't stop kneeling:
https://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-seahawks-kaepernick-morris-20180413-story.html

Do I think Kap, in the 2017 offseason, after being a starter for most of his career, wanted starter money? yes. But all this stuff about him being unwilling to be a backup QB, in my opinion, was the NFL machine putting a narrative out there for why he wasn't signed (especially since there was a lawsuit).
 

mauf

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Tebow washed out of the league because he wasn’t good enough to be a starting QB, and no backup QB is good enough to justify putting up with distractions, which Tebow definitely caused in New York. Kaepernick was in the same boat by 2019; of course, he was blackballed two years earlier, when he would have at least gotten a job to compete for a starting job under normal circumstances.

Tebow won’t be any more valuable as a marginal tight end, H-back, or whatever this year than he was a backup QB who reluctantly ran gadget plays for the Jets. I’m not sure if Meyer thinks the distraction is a feature rather than a bug for the 2021 Jaguars, or if he’s flat-out doing Tebow a favor by letting him stick on the 53-man roster long enough to earn a pension.
 

simplyeric

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Are Jacksonville’s TE’s any good? Quick research suggests that they are not exactly a top notch group.
could it be that Meyer looked at his guys and said, eh, Tebow migh play? It could really be as simple as that. What’s the downside? The media? I don’t think it’s big enough to matter. He’s not TIM
TEBOW!!! anymore, he’s just Tim Tebow?!

I hope he succeeds, and I hope he succeeds so much that we get to see ‘A Tebowing to Remember’.
 

Shelterdog

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Are Jacksonville’s TE’s any good? Quick research suggests that they are not exactly a top notch group.
could it be that Meyer looked at his guys and said, eh, Tebow migh play? It could really be as simple as that. What’s the downside? The media? I don’t think it’s big enough to matter. He’s not TIM
TEBOW!!! anymore, he’s just Tim Tebow?!

I hope he succeeds, and I hope he succeeds so much that we get to see ‘A Tebowing to Remember’.
To answer your question with a question, who do you think is a better TE--Tebow or Jake Burt the 2019 BC grad who played TE well for four years, was on the Pats practice squad last year, is 24 so at the prime of his condition, and is available to anyone who wants him.
 

BigSoxFan

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To answer your question with a question, who do you think is a better TE--Tebow or Jake Burt the 2019 BC grad who played TE well for four years, was on the Pats practice squad last year, is 24 so at the prime of his condition, and is available to anyone who wants him.
That’s 2021 CFL #1 pick Jake Burt to you!
 

simplyeric

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To answer your question with a question, who do you think is a better TE--Tebow or Jake Burt the 2019 BC grad who played TE well for four years, was on the Pats practice squad last year, is 24 so at the prime of his condition, and is available to anyone who wants him.
I have literally no clue. I mean, J-Burt must be pretty good if he couldn't break out of the Pats practice squad last year and was sitting out there on the market until he went to Canada. That kind of talent is hard to come by, and no way could Tebow compete with that!
I'm not saying that the preexisting relationship between Tebow and Meyer isn't relevant, I'm just saying that it's possible that Meyer actually thinks Tebow has a chance at playing, so why not.
 

Shelterdog

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That’s 2021 CFL #1 pick Jake Burt to you!
Which is why he was on my mind! But isn't it 99 percent certain that he's better at TE than 33 year old Tebow is? Similar size but one guy is 9 years younger who has been playing tight end for years and was playing TE in NFL practices all last year.

EDIT: Simplyeric let me ask it another way. Can you name another player in any major professional sport who was out of the sport for 9 years and came back at a different position? I'm excluding Roy Hobbs.

It's simply wild to think that Urban is saying yes, of all the former all conference TEs under the age of 26 who are just hanging out as UDFAs or free agents, the old QB is the best candidate.
 

simplyeric

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Which is why he was on my mind! But isn't it 99 percent certain that he's better at TE than 33 year old Tebow is? Similar size but one guy is 9 years younger who has been playing tight end for years and was playing TE in NFL practices all last year.

EDIT: Simplyeric let me ask it another way. Can you name another player in any major professional sport who was out of the sport for 9 years and came back at a different position? I'm excluding Roy Hobbs.

It's simply wild to think that Urban is saying yes, of all the former all conference TEs under the age of 26 who are just hanging out as UDFAs or free agents, the old QB is the best candidate.
Fair enough...I see what you are saying. I'm not suggesting that Meyer thinking "this guy...this guy is going to be a big contributor to the team!".
But yeah, when you put it that way, maybe the past relationship is pretty much it. We'll see!