Red Sox Offseason discussion

Petagine in a Bottle

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It’s too bad the Sox don’t have some sort of precedent for a team leader playing at 2B… Maybe X is just too tall?

If the Sox are signing a SS this off-season, it should be someone who is a plus defender at the position, which Semien is not from the reports I’ve seen. Get a player who can/will play 2B and sub for X on his off days. At a certain point the better defender will be obvious and the hope is that X can switch to 2B with the new SS taking over. The defense is improved and the offense remains the same.

I don’t see the point of sweating X opting out before we see what he does in 2022. He’s a mediocre year or injury away from deciding “I just can’t leave Boston, this is my home and I want to win with this team.”
I think the point of sweating is that there are a lot of good SS available this off-season and not as many next (potentially X, Turner, and Swanson). So which side has leverage completely flips.
 

OCD SS

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I think the point of sweating is that there are a lot of good SS available this off-season and not as many next (potentially X, Turner, and Swanson). So which side has leverage completely flips.
I disagree, the sweating and hand-wringing is what happens here every time someone has a good season and is on a short commitment, and then we worry about locking that player up for a longer term. X is a fan favorite, but he's not a good defensive SS and that's what we should be trying to fix this season; we can worry about replacing his offense and intangibles next off-season.

Semien improves 2B overall, but not the left side of the IF; he's a lateral move to what we already have in that he isn't improving SS defense and his contract would block X from moving to 2B. It would be similar to the puzzle with re-signing Schwarber once JDM opted in; it's hard to make all the pieces fit defensively. Now you can build an offense first team and try bludgeon your way to victory, but I think we've mostly been looking at improvements on the other side of the ball.
 

Daniel_Son

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Thinking about the need for young pitching - how about a trade for Sixto Sanchez? Dealt with a shoulder injury this season, but he should be good to go by spring training, had a great 2020, and the emergence of Alcantara, Rogers, and Lopez might make Miami more willing to move him. Marlins have big need in center field - packaging Duran + Dalbec for Sixto and Garrett Cooper (16th in OBP, 43rd in wOBA and wRC+, 46th in walk rate) seems to be pretty even in Trade Simulator. Cooper would also give them flexibility to sell high on Renfroe.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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They have Aguilar for another year, so seems unlikely. Maybe they’d swap the two even up but not sure that’s a great move.

The Red Sox don’t have a ton of great trade pieces as far as I can tell. Even if they trade Dalbec, they then need to get a1b. They don’t have any clearly blocked players with much value and they are lacking in the pitching prospects usually needed to pull of a big deal.
 

nighthob

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They have Aguilar for another year, so seems unlikely. Maybe they’d swap the two even up but not sure that’s a great move.

The Red Sox don’t have a ton of great trade pieces as far as I can tell. Even if they trade Dalbec, they then need to get a1b. They don’t have any clearly blocked players with much value and they are lacking in the pitching prospects usually needed to pull of a big deal.
They can always re-sign Schwarber and move him to 1B temporarily (because Casas will be up at some point next year).
 

Bosoxian

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have both Martinez and Schwarber on the team. It would be doable for a season I suppose, but I'm not sure what package would fetch the return that makes this fiscally appealing to
I think any signing of Schwarber means JD is gone after this year, with Casas ready to move up.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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For the price, I'd prefer not to have both Martinez and Schwarber on the team. It would be doable for a season I suppose, but I'm not sure what package would fetch the return that makes this fiscally appealing to me
I imagine the Sox will lose some leverage trying to deal JD, no? Other teams knowing that they sort of painted themselves into a corner and are asking for help? I'm sure it'll come down to how much other teams want the Sox to pick up and/or the quality of the player Bloom would be asking for in return. JD for one season at $10M is a great deal. I could imagine another team offering a mid-level RP in return for that, no?
 

YTF

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I imagine the Sox will lose some leverage trying to deal JD, no? Other teams knowing that they sort of painted themselves into a corner and are asking for help? I'm sure it'll come down to how much other teams want the Sox to pick up and/or the quality of the player Bloom would be asking for in return. JD for one season at $10M is a great deal. I could imagine another team offering a mid-level RP in return for that, no?
The biggest saving grace if the Sox try to move JDM will be the hopeful approval of the universal DH. That will expand the market for him a bit, but I would expect the Sox potentially eat some of his salary especially if they sign Schwarber first for the reason you mention. I'd love to see a guy with Whitlock/Houck type ability come back if we're going to see one of those guys being promoted. I think we see Bloom work at least one three team trade this off season, because with the right partners you can be more creative.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Paying $10M to dump JD and then $15M or so per to sign Schwarber sounds like a foolish idea that does nothing to solve the teams weaknesses. It’s like signing Jeff Reardon when you already have Lee Smith.
 

nighthob

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Paying $10M to dump JD and then $15M or so per to sign Schwarber sounds like a foolish idea that does nothing to solve the teams weaknesses. It’s like signing Jeff Reardon when you already have Lee Smith.
I mean aside from having the better hitter available to DH for the next four years.
 

sean1562

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I mean, JD's OPS this year, .867, is only slightly lower than Schwarber's second best OPS, .871, in 2019. Schwarber is a 28 year old that had a career season last year but still only played 113 games. He was great with us down the stretch but I agree. Seems silly to pay $10 mil to dump JD and sign a guy with no real defensive position to a 4 year deal worth $15 million per year especially when we need SP depth.
 

chawson

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Paying $10M to dump JD and then $15M or so per to sign Schwarber sounds like a foolish idea that does nothing to solve the teams weaknesses. It’s like signing Jeff Reardon when you already have Lee Smith.
I see it more like signing J.D. Martinez when you already have Hanley Ramirez.
 

nighthob

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I mean, JD's OPS this year, .867, is only slightly lower than Schwarber's second best OPS, .871, in 2019. Schwarber is a 28 year old that had a career season last year but still only played 113 games. He was great with us down the stretch but I agree. Seems silly to pay $10 mil to dump JD and sign a guy with no real defensive position to a 4 year deal worth $15 million per year especially when we need SP depth.
They have Martinez for one more year, they need a long term professional hitter. Letting Schwarber walk to avoid trading Martinez later in the year is pretty silly.
 

chawson

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So of 7 open spots, they filled 4… curious who they’re planning to add from outside the organization to fill it.
Doing a quick scan at some interesting MLB prospects not added to 40-man rosters today here who might have a shot at sticking on ours.

Hitters: Aaron Bracho, 2B (CLE), Livan Soto, UTIL (LAA), Shervyen Newton, SS (NYM), Josh Breaux, C (NYY), Brandon Valenzuela, C (SDP), Ricardo Genoves, C (SFG), Blake Hunt, C (TB), Miguel Hiraldo, 2B/3B (TOR)

Pitchers: Austin Cox, LHSP (KC), Robinson Ortiz, LHP (LAD), Matt Sauer, RHP (NYY), Tahnaj Thomas and Cody Bolton, RHSP, and Omar Cruz, LHP (PIT), Seth Corry, LHP and Blake Rivera, RHP (SFG)

The Royals, Giants, Pirates, and Rays all have great systems, so some of their spillover could be pretty legit. I didn’t list any outfielders because I don’t think they’d stick on our 2022 roster, but there are interesting arms that could take this year’s Whitlock role (Thomas, Cox, Sauer), useful utility guys, and a couple of good hitting catchers that might be interesting to add to our pool of post-Vazquez options.

I’m sure there are other interesting names I’m missing. Gotta think Bloom’s advanced scouting chops and all the pandemic-related weirdness will mean we’re again active here.
 

jon abbey

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Breaux is bad defensively, a team taking him that wanted to compete next year would likely have to carry three catchers all year. Sauer is hurt all the time, I guess that could change, but my guess at the Yankee Chaim will grab this year is reliever Greg Weissert:

http://origin.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=669711#/career/R/pitching/2022/ALL

Cashman knows Chaim would love to raid his unprotected pitchers again, so he protected more than anyone expected (few expected Marinaccio and no one expected Sears) but there are still some tempting targets. Matt Krook is another, NY grabbed him from TB in the minor league part of the rule 5 draft last year and he had a very solid 2021.

http://origin.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=640454#/career/R/pitching/2022/ALL
 

OCD SS

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I was thinking more along the lines of what this might telegraph for their FA plans… 2 pitchers and a SS?

Not protecting Jimenez was a bit of a surprise; do the rules Prevent them from moving him off the roster (I guess via DFA) if they need the space?
 

YTF

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MFY DFA'ed Clint Frazier, anyone thinks he's worth claiming? Fifth overall pick in '13, just just turned 27. He's been a bit up and down both offensively and defensively, but was a GG finalist in '20 (SSS as it was). Excluding JDM and Schwarber he's got enough of a track record that I think it's safe to say that he's already a vast improvement over any of the other 4th OF options that Sox presented last year. I think this could be a low cost way to fill a need. Made $2.1 M last season. Before being DFAed he wasn't eligible to become a FA until '25. Please tell me how that works for any team picking him up. Does he become an unrestricted FA upon being released?
 

jon abbey

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MFY DFA'ed Clint Frazier, anyone thinks he's worth claiming? Fifth overall pick in '13, just just turned 27. He's been a bit up and down both offensively and defensively, but was a GG finalist in '20 (SSS as it was). Excluding JDM and Schwarber he's got enough of a track record that I think it's safe to say that he's already a vast improvement over any of the other 4th OF options that Sox presented last year. I think this could be a low cost way to fill a need. Made $2.1 M last season. Before being DFAed he wasn't eligible to become a FA until '25. Please tell me how that works for any team picking him up. Does he become an unrestricted FA upon being released?
1) He was DFAd, not released, which means NY has ten days to trade him if that's possible.

2) He is a dreadful defensive outfielder, the 'GG finalist' silliness was because he played the majority of that year in the tiny Yankee RF, where he is adequate, and they calculated them mathematically that year in a 60 game season, many silly GG nominees in 2020.

3) He has health issues which have not been publicly discussed yet, possibly connected to his concussion issues from a few years ago but possibly something else. He missed the final three months last season because of these.
 

YTF

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I had a feeling that you might weigh in, thanks. I was aware of the previous concussion issue and that there was some tensions between him and the team over what was disclosed or how it was disclosed. Did not realized that he missed the entire second half of this past season. IIRC Frazier mentioned something about looking forward to the opportunity to publicly address his health issues. As per the defensive, I wondered if 2020 might be an anomaly given the SSS.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I like Crawford. A really good year is masked by a few bad performances. I was also never that high on Gilberto and suggested this past season he'd be one of the prospects I'd be ok trading. I'm assuming that's the Jimenez we are talking about, anyway. He had an ISO of .099 over 408 PA/373 AB. He also only walked 19 times in those 408 PA, compared to 86 strikeouts. He strikes me as the type of guy who is going to struggle mightily as he moves up as his speed becomes less of a factor. He hit .306/.346/.405 this year despite having a .381 BAbip.

2019: .359/.393/.470 on a .413 BAbip
2018: .319/.384/.420 on a .378 BAbip

He should hook up with Octavio Duran.

Also, would people really let Mayer prevent them from making a move if it was a good one? Seems pretty bullish.
 

OCD SS

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Also, would people really let Mayer prevent them from making a move if it was a good one? Seems pretty bullish.
Even if we’re looking at Mayer as the long term SS of the future, a reasonable development timeline still leaves plenty of time to sign one of the FA SSs on a long term deal, with the exception of Corea and Seager, who the Sox are not likely to be in on anyway.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Even if we’re looking at Mayer as the long term SS of the future, a reasonable development timeline still leaves plenty of time to sign one of the FA SSs on a long term deal, with the exception of Corea and Seager, who the Sox are not likely to be in on anyway.
I generally like your plan for SS around Xander for the short term but I’m wondering how those FA SS are going to fall into place this off-season. I imagine Correa and Seaver are going to want to hold out for as long as they can while the remaining guys will have to follow even behind them. I just don’t see Baez jumping at a 5 year 15AAV before those guys. I think it’s more likely that he will push for closer to $25M per and if he doesn’t get it, he’ll sign a one year deal, which I don’t think Bloom wants.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I didn't see it mentioned, but I only skimmed the thread. Thad Ward had TJ surgery on June 3rd of this year. Would a team be able to hide him on the DL all year if they did take him? I'm guessing Gilberto isn't selected or returned. Unless a team can hide Ward, ditto.

I could see someone taking Durbin Feltman too. He did well last season in AA/AAA and is close to ready.

Does anyone have the full list of Redsox players not protected?
 

jon abbey

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I didn't see it mentioned, but I only skimmed the thread. Thad Ward had TJ surgery on June 3rd of this year. Would a team be able to hide him on the DL all year if they did take him?
I think the rule is he’d go on the 40 man immediately, then they could IL him on day 1 of spring training, then he would have to spend all of 2023 on the active 26 man roster or be offered back.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Whereas Kutter definitely gets picked with no chance of being returned.
i don’t know about that; rule 5 guys who make it through the entire year are still pretty rare. I’m surprised the Sox still have guys like Rosario and Potts on the 40-man, although perhaps not for long. They really need stronger depth on the 40-man, last year there were times where they could have used an OF or 1B call up and literally had no one on the 40-man available .
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Seems like this should go without saying, but any agent worth his salt is going to want word to spread that the Red Sox (and all other big market teams) have "expressed interest" in their client(s). All rumors should be read with that in mind.
 

Mo Vaughn Over!

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Not sure if this is out there, but Jim Bowden(yes, I know) says the Red Sox have touched base with the agents for Carlos Correa and Robbie Ray.

https://theathletic.com/2972575/2021/11/23/mlb-trade-and-free-agent-matches-jim-bowden-on-solutions-for-each-american-league-teams-most-pressing-needs/?source=user_shared_article
Not to quell excitement, as I’d love either of these guys, but in touch with… Scott Boras? Does he not represent many top tier targets?
 

Apisith

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Just an idea, but extending Eovaldi would provide us some medium term stability to the rotation. Although his velocity dipped last year, he was really good. I’m not sure what he says if we offered to tack on 2 years at $17m per year. It would provide downside protection for him given he’s had two TJs and would give us some upside even if he never pitches as well as last year. Even looking at comps like Stroman and Gausman, they’re projected to get $18-20m per year. If Eovaldi was a FA today, he’d get something similar IMO.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Just an idea, but extending Eovaldi would provide us some medium term stability to the rotation. Although his velocity dipped last year, he was really good. I’m not sure what he says if we offered to tack on 2 years at $17m per year. It would provide downside protection for him given he’s had two TJs and would give us some upside even if he never pitches as well as last year. Even looking at comps like Stroman and Gausman, they’re projected to get $18-20m per year. If Eovaldi was a FA today, he’d get something similar IMO.
I think it’s a good idea, and he’s likely to take it….. but yeah, Serious risk with him. How long is the list of pitchers in their 30’s going as long as he’d be expected to after 2 TJS’s?
I imagine he might be alone there…