Pique S**ts on Your Wh*re Mother - Barcelona 2016-2017
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Cross-posting from Reddit in case anyone is interested in discussing:
Messi's positioning as a true #10 is the biggest shift in Barca's offensive tactics this season. My question is whether this is Messi's choice to drift inside, Lucho's, or both? Most here seem to assume that Lucho has made this decision and that Lucho is now struggling to figure out how best to line up the rest of the squad. However, I believe that Lucho is merely trying to placate Messi and it is Lionel who has basically said 'I am playing in the middle, everyone else can adjust'. Likely, Messi is given freedom to roam wherever he wants and there are some tactical adjustments based on where he decides to pop up. As Messi has ceased operating on the wing almost entirely, the team has struggled with how to maintain the width on this vacated wing and defend accordingly. I am on the record as saying Messi's future lies in this CAM role, but both the team and Lionel need to make some adjustments to make this work more smoothly. If Messi is going to remain a CAM with minimal defensive responsibilities, the players tasked with providing width need to be ready to help defend the touchlines. This has already started with Neymar/Arda dropping in to help the MF as well as Rafinha/Denis on the other side. However, I think another adjustment that has not been made yet is what happens when Messi takes on defenders and loses the ball.
There are 2 critical components to defending this situation - 1) where is the ball lost (i.e. on the wing or in the middle), and 2) is the goal to press or recover. In the past, when Messi attacked from the wing and lost, it was relatively easier to recover shape and/or begin pressing up the field immediately. Lately and particularly on display Sunday, when Messi lost the ball he had 4-5 players in front of him (Suarez, Arda, Denis, Gomes, and/or Roberto) and the counter was coming from up the middle in a more dangerous starting position. This caused a lot of problems, especially when Messi lost the ball from deeper positions. All of this is to say that the team needs more vertical balance and a clear philosophy for when Messi loses the ball in the middle. Personally, I would start another holding MF along with Busi (Gomes would actually be a good fit here, but Rakitic could do this ably as well, Roberto is another option). Messi needs to adjust his game as well to be more conservative in possession and particular with his dribbles. To describe the formation, it would go something like:
4-2-2-1-1
Alba-Pique-Masche-Roberto
Busi-Gomes
Denis-Ney
Messi
Suarez
Here, Denis and Ney would be tasked with helping to win the MF, but as they push wide on attack at least Busi and Gomes will be able to protect Barca when Messi loses the ball in the middle. Frankly though, I think this setup is a poor use of the squad's skills (namely Roberto and the RB situation) and Lucho is on the right track putting 3 at the back. With 3 at the back, there are more possibilities and the XI takes on a more natural fit IMO:
3-2-3-1-1
Masche-Pique-Umtiti
Busi-Gomes/Rak/Roberto
Rafinha/Arda-Denis/Iniesta-Ney
Messi
Suarez
This lineup leaves Alba out, which is unfortunate because I love Alba as a LB, but in Barca's current iteration, using 3 at the back (and necessarily protecting them with two holding MF rather than one) is doable and allows for a fluid attacking formation around Messi. Denis/Iniesta will help Messi establish possession in the center of the pitch and move the ball wide to Rafinha/Arda and Ney, Busi and his DMF partner will always be available to relieve pressure, and Suarez is the point of the spear and can combine with Messi, Ney, Denis/Iniesta through the middle, and on the wings with Ney and Arda/Rafinha.
TL;DR - Messi's positioning as a CAM is likely here to stay. In order to provide width on offense and simultaneously protect Barca up the middle on defense (particularly after Messi turnovers in the middle), another holding MF should be added to the formation. With Barca's current squad, this can be done with 3 at the back.
Messi's positioning as a true #10 is the biggest shift in Barca's offensive tactics this season. My question is whether this is Messi's choice to drift inside, Lucho's, or both? Most here seem to assume that Lucho has made this decision and that Lucho is now struggling to figure out how best to line up the rest of the squad. However, I believe that Lucho is merely trying to placate Messi and it is Lionel who has basically said 'I am playing in the middle, everyone else can adjust'. Likely, Messi is given freedom to roam wherever he wants and there are some tactical adjustments based on where he decides to pop up. As Messi has ceased operating on the wing almost entirely, the team has struggled with how to maintain the width on this vacated wing and defend accordingly. I am on the record as saying Messi's future lies in this CAM role, but both the team and Lionel need to make some adjustments to make this work more smoothly. If Messi is going to remain a CAM with minimal defensive responsibilities, the players tasked with providing width need to be ready to help defend the touchlines. This has already started with Neymar/Arda dropping in to help the MF as well as Rafinha/Denis on the other side. However, I think another adjustment that has not been made yet is what happens when Messi takes on defenders and loses the ball.
There are 2 critical components to defending this situation - 1) where is the ball lost (i.e. on the wing or in the middle), and 2) is the goal to press or recover. In the past, when Messi attacked from the wing and lost, it was relatively easier to recover shape and/or begin pressing up the field immediately. Lately and particularly on display Sunday, when Messi lost the ball he had 4-5 players in front of him (Suarez, Arda, Denis, Gomes, and/or Roberto) and the counter was coming from up the middle in a more dangerous starting position. This caused a lot of problems, especially when Messi lost the ball from deeper positions. All of this is to say that the team needs more vertical balance and a clear philosophy for when Messi loses the ball in the middle. Personally, I would start another holding MF along with Busi (Gomes would actually be a good fit here, but Rakitic could do this ably as well, Roberto is another option). Messi needs to adjust his game as well to be more conservative in possession and particular with his dribbles. To describe the formation, it would go something like:
4-2-2-1-1
Alba-Pique-Masche-Roberto
Busi-Gomes
Denis-Ney
Messi
Suarez
Here, Denis and Ney would be tasked with helping to win the MF, but as they push wide on attack at least Busi and Gomes will be able to protect Barca when Messi loses the ball in the middle. Frankly though, I think this setup is a poor use of the squad's skills (namely Roberto and the RB situation) and Lucho is on the right track putting 3 at the back. With 3 at the back, there are more possibilities and the XI takes on a more natural fit IMO:
3-2-3-1-1
Masche-Pique-Umtiti
Busi-Gomes/Rak/Roberto
Rafinha/Arda-Denis/Iniesta-Ney
Messi
Suarez
This lineup leaves Alba out, which is unfortunate because I love Alba as a LB, but in Barca's current iteration, using 3 at the back (and necessarily protecting them with two holding MF rather than one) is doable and allows for a fluid attacking formation around Messi. Denis/Iniesta will help Messi establish possession in the center of the pitch and move the ball wide to Rafinha/Arda and Ney, Busi and his DMF partner will always be available to relieve pressure, and Suarez is the point of the spear and can combine with Messi, Ney, Denis/Iniesta through the middle, and on the wings with Ney and Arda/Rafinha.
TL;DR - Messi's positioning as a CAM is likely here to stay. In order to provide width on offense and simultaneously protect Barca up the middle on defense (particularly after Messi turnovers in the middle), another holding MF should be added to the formation. With Barca's current squad, this can be done with 3 at the back.
If Roberto gets slotted into a CMF position next to Busi, he could also protect the flank behind behind Ney to go 4 across the back (his experience there would be a big plus). But really, this formation probably does get picked apart by Bayern, Real, and teams with good spacing and talent on the wings. Some version of the 4-2-2-1 I suggested above might be better against such squads. Roberto becomes a key guy if you want do a hybrid and have 4 across the back in defense, but pair him with Busi in the middle in possession.
This is exactly what transpired yesterday. Barca looked their best in quite some time, as Messi was motivated and rested. Barca was in a 4-4-2 on defense, switching to a 3-3-3+Messi on offense. For purposes of discussion, the defense lined up like this:
MaTS
Roberto-Umtiti-Pique-Masch
Rak-Busi-Iniesta-Ney
Messi-Suarez
The offense really was a 3-3-3 as Roberto pushed up into MF effectively and even up to the wing. It seems like he and Rak had real good chemistry taking turns keeping the width, although Rak did it more often. However, interchanging like that is brutal to defend and Rak clearly understood that when Roberto was further up, he was tasked with guarding the flank. Roberto looked very effective the more time he spent in the middle. I don't understand why he's come under so much criticism when it seemed obvious (to me anyway) that the problems were tactical and not an issue of skill/positioning on the part of Roberto. Messi drifted from wing to center to alongside Busi. It's not what I would have him do, but I'm convinced that Lucho is just letting him do whatever he wants at this point and is just trying to position the team around him effectively. Sevilla are on bad form right now, but they are still a top 15-20 side in Europe IMO and they were dismantled.
Next up, a weak Malaga squad before the first leg showdown with Juve.
Suarez ridiculous first goal: https://u.nya.is/nvkajy.mp4
If you're defending Barca 3v4 on the break, you're gonna have a bad time: https://u.nya.is/nmroqz.mp4
I still don't quite understand how Messi hit this one so hard at the ground...on a full volley: https://u.nya.is/avsgpt.mp4
Thanks for the tactical analysis, very interesting.
My favorite part about the Suarez goal is how fast he gets back up from landing on his back. I think he was on his feet again before the ball hit the back of the net.
My favorite part about the Suarez goal is how fast he gets back up from landing on his back. I think he was on his feet again before the ball hit the back of the net.
Oy vey, where to start? In goal, MaTS has shown vast improvement this year and I still feel pretty confident he will be the keeper for this club for years to come. HOWEVA, the second goal was bad (as someone posted in the UCL thread, force Dybala to shoot far post) and his vaunted foot skills didn't look so great today. The defense was horrendous. The first goal falls on the trio of Pique, Mathieu, and Iniesta. Mathieu pinched far too much inside and when the switch to Cuadrado came, Mathieu was already on the border of the box. This problem was exacerbated by him retreating INTO the box where he couldn't foul. As the defense shifted following the cross, Roberto and Umtiti had Higuain and Pjanic (?) covered on the far post, but both Pique and Iniesta were caught ball watching. As the CB, Pique deserves more blame, but a more aware Iniesta could've defended better too. Umtiti and Roberto had the best match among the Barca players. On the second goal, MaTS could've done better, but again Pique and this time Masche were caught ball watching and left Dybala open for an obvious pass against the grain at the top of the box.
On offense, there was just no plan. there was so little movement off the ball that defending for Juve looked easy. It's pretty telling that Barca's best chance came from a clever Iniesta run with an UNFUCKINGBELIEVABLE pass from Messi. That play aside, there were no passing triangles and the offense looked discombobulated. I mean, how many times did Iniesta have space in the midfield with all 22 players, the benches, and the entire stands 100% sure that Andres would pass the ball out wide to Ney? Granted, Ney can beat the first defender himself more than just about anyone else in the world, but that's not a real offense. Messi has a declining fucks given rate the past couple of seasons but I think it's really starting to take a toll on team morale. Yes, Messi is a wizard who can conjure pure magic in a nanosecond, but you can't tell me that Rakitic doesn't get annoyed by the fact that he gets shit while running a marathon every match and Messi is allowed to walk around with his dick in his hands. Finally, Suarez had a bad game and I think he, more than anyone, is the fulcrum for this offense. The ref was bad and let Juve get away with a lot of BS (against Suarez and Ney particularly) but, with an active and engaged Suarez, Barca is a different team.
Where this team goes from here will be interesting. I don't think they reverse this tie. Juve is too good, too organized, and too well-managed (and consequently composed) to allow for a second remontada. With the embarrassing loss to Malaga on Sunday while Madrid dropped points in a draw against Atleti, La Liga is pretty much over too. Real will need to drop more points soon to provide an opening. Lucho is gone at the end of the season, so it's very much time for the players to look inwards and decide what they want the end of the year to look like.
On offense, there was just no plan. there was so little movement off the ball that defending for Juve looked easy. It's pretty telling that Barca's best chance came from a clever Iniesta run with an UNFUCKINGBELIEVABLE pass from Messi. That play aside, there were no passing triangles and the offense looked discombobulated. I mean, how many times did Iniesta have space in the midfield with all 22 players, the benches, and the entire stands 100% sure that Andres would pass the ball out wide to Ney? Granted, Ney can beat the first defender himself more than just about anyone else in the world, but that's not a real offense. Messi has a declining fucks given rate the past couple of seasons but I think it's really starting to take a toll on team morale. Yes, Messi is a wizard who can conjure pure magic in a nanosecond, but you can't tell me that Rakitic doesn't get annoyed by the fact that he gets shit while running a marathon every match and Messi is allowed to walk around with his dick in his hands. Finally, Suarez had a bad game and I think he, more than anyone, is the fulcrum for this offense. The ref was bad and let Juve get away with a lot of BS (against Suarez and Ney particularly) but, with an active and engaged Suarez, Barca is a different team.
Where this team goes from here will be interesting. I don't think they reverse this tie. Juve is too good, too organized, and too well-managed (and consequently composed) to allow for a second remontada. With the embarrassing loss to Malaga on Sunday while Madrid dropped points in a draw against Atleti, La Liga is pretty much over too. Real will need to drop more points soon to provide an opening. Lucho is gone at the end of the season, so it's very much time for the players to look inwards and decide what they want the end of the year to look like.
I had two takeaways from the match, First, Barcelona is terribly fragile without Busquets. Their style still makes them very vulnerable and creates a lot of possibilities for the other team to attack on the break and to operate in unsettled situations against the back four plus DM. Mascherano just doesn't have the legs to cover the ground and play as a lone DM shielding that back four, especially against a team brave enough to throw players forward when opportunities present themselves. Second, Barca has largely failed to find a set of "secondary attackers" to complement the MSN/Iniesta quartet, by which I mean the fullbacks, CMs, and bench options. Its a sad day when Barcelona is fielding two fullbacks with little offensive contribution, a declining Rakitic in CM, and the best bench option to help claw back a goal is Andre Gomes. Even the best attacking quartet in the world is going to have trouble doing much when playing 4 v. 8 against an organized defense.
DUDE. What a fucking game. Did I miss where people are talking about this?!?! That was some top notch football at its best. Seesaw battle that showed why these two teams are typically considered the best in the world. First mention goes to the keepers who put on a goddamn clinic today. MaTS had 3-4 out of this world saves and Navas probably had 4-5. Both guys played out of their minds. The first thing that jumps out to me of that match is why Real was defending with 3 on the last play. Yes, Sergi made ANOTHER heroic play and got past 2 Real forward players, but there was not a damn reason not to defend with 5 at that point.
On Real's side, it was a fascinating performance. I think Ramos is a top 5, maybe 10, CB in the world, but that tackle was dumb and an obvious red. Marcelo continues to be the best LB in the world and really led a lot of the best Real attacks. Carvajal continued to be a solid RB. I don't even remember who played CB with Ramos but he was unremarkable. Casemiro is quickly becoming one of my favorite players. As he ages, he should learn how to foul more effectively and not get hisself into trouble. But, a destroyer like that with real footskills in the final third, is worth his weight in gold. The goal was just a cherry on top. I thought Kroos and Modric were both fine, but didn't have their most effective games. Modric had the one blast from distance that almost went in but I was surprised not to see Isco this game. I'm the biggest Asensio fan boi but I thought he looked overwhelmed today. He setup CRon for a couple of almost goals, and he shouldn't get knocked for that, but he wasn't as ebullient as I've seen him in the past. Bale clearly wasn't match ready and it's too bad. CRon had a bad game, he normally finishes at least one of those chances. Benz was very quiet. James gets a mention because I was shocked he got into the game ahead of Isco and Morata and he delivered in a big way.
On Barca, I thought the Casemiro goal was just lax set piece defending. Although some Real players were offside, Ramos was not, and to not recover and let Casemiro poach the back post is an indictment on the whole team. I thought Roberto continued his year of solid defending but unease in the final third. The kid looks ready to take on a MF role, so Barca should really get focused on a RB solution. I thought Pique could've done a bit more perhaps on the James goal, although he was keeping track of CRon and Busi was the one marking James. Umbeasti continues his ascent to world class CB. When the game slowed down towards the end, he got more aggressive and made some incisive passes and short runs. Alba had a MONSTER game. He was just bombing down the left and had a couple real nice recoveries too. Busi had an OK game, but really let down the D on the James goal. I thought Iniesta was passable, but really can't offer much at the highest level anymore for 90 minutes. Rakitic - what a bawse. That rocket was legendary. Off foot?!? Bawse. Paco was pretty average and didn't finish any chances or have a particularly high workrate. Luisito was out of his element yet again, but was unlucky to not put a couple of volleys in. Gomes had a couple of bad turnovers but did contribute to the final goal so better than usual from him. Was sad not to see Denis, per usual.
MESSI. MAGIC MAN MOTHERFUCKING MESSI. What else can you say about the guy? he got bloodied early on and then went on a rampage and decimated Real. His first goal was vintage Messi where he was playing on fast mode while everyone else was still on normal - PlayStation FIFA style. Did you see Carvajal go for a tackle and catch a whole lotta air. Messi really served as another MF for most of the 2nd half, so Barca still doesn't have a lot of plans as it seemed that Messi still had no real marching orders and other players looked around confused often. On the final goal though, Messi took it perfectly when anything less would've been stopped by Keylor. I filled my pants just thinking about it. Messi's celebration even felt legendary. Showing his jersey to the Bernabeu fan for a solid minute was cold blooded and he clearly relished the moment bigly.
With a game in hand and about 6 fixtures left (too tired to check), this match may not matter to the final standings (Ramos getting suspended would be a very interesting development to this end). But as Ray said on the broadcast, worry about tomorrow later, and enjoy this now. Football and Messi at their finest.
On Real's side, it was a fascinating performance. I think Ramos is a top 5, maybe 10, CB in the world, but that tackle was dumb and an obvious red. Marcelo continues to be the best LB in the world and really led a lot of the best Real attacks. Carvajal continued to be a solid RB. I don't even remember who played CB with Ramos but he was unremarkable. Casemiro is quickly becoming one of my favorite players. As he ages, he should learn how to foul more effectively and not get hisself into trouble. But, a destroyer like that with real footskills in the final third, is worth his weight in gold. The goal was just a cherry on top. I thought Kroos and Modric were both fine, but didn't have their most effective games. Modric had the one blast from distance that almost went in but I was surprised not to see Isco this game. I'm the biggest Asensio fan boi but I thought he looked overwhelmed today. He setup CRon for a couple of almost goals, and he shouldn't get knocked for that, but he wasn't as ebullient as I've seen him in the past. Bale clearly wasn't match ready and it's too bad. CRon had a bad game, he normally finishes at least one of those chances. Benz was very quiet. James gets a mention because I was shocked he got into the game ahead of Isco and Morata and he delivered in a big way.
On Barca, I thought the Casemiro goal was just lax set piece defending. Although some Real players were offside, Ramos was not, and to not recover and let Casemiro poach the back post is an indictment on the whole team. I thought Roberto continued his year of solid defending but unease in the final third. The kid looks ready to take on a MF role, so Barca should really get focused on a RB solution. I thought Pique could've done a bit more perhaps on the James goal, although he was keeping track of CRon and Busi was the one marking James. Umbeasti continues his ascent to world class CB. When the game slowed down towards the end, he got more aggressive and made some incisive passes and short runs. Alba had a MONSTER game. He was just bombing down the left and had a couple real nice recoveries too. Busi had an OK game, but really let down the D on the James goal. I thought Iniesta was passable, but really can't offer much at the highest level anymore for 90 minutes. Rakitic - what a bawse. That rocket was legendary. Off foot?!? Bawse. Paco was pretty average and didn't finish any chances or have a particularly high workrate. Luisito was out of his element yet again, but was unlucky to not put a couple of volleys in. Gomes had a couple of bad turnovers but did contribute to the final goal so better than usual from him. Was sad not to see Denis, per usual.
MESSI. MAGIC MAN MOTHERFUCKING MESSI. What else can you say about the guy? he got bloodied early on and then went on a rampage and decimated Real. His first goal was vintage Messi where he was playing on fast mode while everyone else was still on normal - PlayStation FIFA style. Did you see Carvajal go for a tackle and catch a whole lotta air. Messi really served as another MF for most of the 2nd half, so Barca still doesn't have a lot of plans as it seemed that Messi still had no real marching orders and other players looked around confused often. On the final goal though, Messi took it perfectly when anything less would've been stopped by Keylor. I filled my pants just thinking about it. Messi's celebration even felt legendary. Showing his jersey to the Bernabeu fan for a solid minute was cold blooded and he clearly relished the moment bigly.
With a game in hand and about 6 fixtures left (too tired to check), this match may not matter to the final standings (Ramos getting suspended would be a very interesting development to this end). But as Ray said on the broadcast, worry about tomorrow later, and enjoy this now. Football and Messi at their finest.
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Was thinking about Barca's year, and the MF problems. Sergi has played very well this season, especially lately. Lucho should've tried Digne and Mathieu at RB with Sergi moving into MF much earlier. As it stands now, I think most Cules expect Sergi to get a crack at the MF rotation next year.