Non-Pats Coaching Carousel 2024

Oct 12, 2023
802
Doesn't the Eagles defensive personnel fit a 4-3 system much better than a 3-4? They've invested pretty heavily in the line
Carter would look good at LE in Fangio’s front, with Davis at NT. Cox, if he doesn’t retire, can play almost anywhere (and has). Sweat seems like he could play on the edge regardless of scheme and I think Vangio uses a lot of even fronts in his sub packages anyway (unless he’s gotten away from that the last few years)
 

sodenj5

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Is Fangio even a good DC anymore? Seems like the NFL has figured out his soft zone scheme.
For the short window of time when he had Phillips, Chubb, Holland, Howard, and Ramsey in the lineup, the defense was really cooking.

He did some infuriating things. He literally just watched the Bills line Diggs up against Kohou instead of Ramsey every play and refused to let them swap sides or let Ramsey shadow. Diggs killed them in the first matchup.

I would say towards the end of the year, the defense was carrying more of the load than the offense. I wouldn’t have complained if he came back for year 2, but I’m not grieving his departure either.
 

DanoooME

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So that leaves Falcons (BB?), Commanders, and Seahawks as open jobs. Seahawks may end up with someone good yet. Ben Johnson, Mike MacDonald, Mike Vrabel all out there.
 

Auger34

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So that leaves Falcons (BB?), Commanders, and Seahawks as open jobs. Seahawks may end up with someone good yet. Ben Johnson, Mike MacDonald, Mike Vrabel all out there.
There's a ton of smoke around Ben Johnson to the Commanders being a done deal basically.

Falcons and Seahawks will have their choice of Belichick, Carroll (just ATL there), Vrabel, Dan Quinn, Mike MacDonald, etc
 

Justthetippett

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Aug 9, 2015
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Raheem Morris over Belichick, Vrabel, Slowick and others is certainly an interesting choice
He seems like a good coach. His first opportunity in TB he was too young. He has the history with Atlanta. Not that surprising that they chose him over Vrabel and Slowik, I guess, but over BB is a head scratcher.
 

Ed Hillel

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So was pretty much everyone just way, way off on BB’s perceived value around the league?
I don’t personally think BB wanted the Falcons job, but he was using it for leverage over jobs that didn’t open up. Jones choosing McCarthy over BB is probably the most shocking part to me.
 

PedroKsBambino

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So was pretty much everyone just way, way off on BB’s perceived value around the league?
What's hard to know is what the discussion looked like - could be BB said "I need full control" and teams wouldn't give it....and could be that he thinks he's an asset and teams don't.
 

Auger34

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He seems like a good coach. His first opportunity in TB he was too young. He has the history with Atlanta. Not that surprising that they chose him over Vrabel and Slowik, I guess, but over BB is a head scratcher.
I live in Tampa. Raheem definitely didn't have a sterling reputation in terms of professionalism when he was down here. Lots of stories about him partying with the players...and other less savory stories
 

Ale Xander

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Raheem Morris, he of the 21-38 record?
The mind boggles

he does have 2 rings though but man
 

Auger34

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The Atlanta hire certainly gives a lot of credence to the idea that McKay is the one who really has Arthur Blank's ear and is the shadow puppet master. Let's just say it's easier to scapegoat Raheem Morris than it is to do the same with Vrabel, Belichick, and Carroll
 

BaseballJones

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Whenever you have a choice between Raheem "21-38 career record" Morris and Bill "302 wins, 6 Lombardis" Belichick to be your head coach, you're a total fool for taking Belichick.

LOLOL they deserve to go 0-17 for the next 10 years after this.
 

astrozombie

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Sep 12, 2022
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So was pretty much everyone just way, way off on BB’s perceived value around the league?
A few thoughts on that:
1. It's entirely possible that NE fans overvalued him. He's the GOAT, look at the ringz, etc. Other teams see someone who hasn't been great the last few years and is a polarizing to play for (some people love him, some people think those teams were no fun) and looks like maybe he needed Brady more than the other way around.
2. The trend these days seems to be offensive guys. BB not having Brady and being unable to do anything with Mac is probably looked upon poorly.
3. He's 71. There is definitely ageism at play. Everyone wants the next BB, who will get hired and stick around for 20 years even though that seems pretty unlikely for any coach.
4. Raheem Morris getting hired shows Atlanta... has ideas. I dont know what they are myself, but they have them.

I have no idea why the Panthers didn't jump on BB honestly. At this point, hiring BB as a quick fix/respectability guy (just like Parcells was at the end of his career) seems in play. Let him have control for a couple of years, beat Shula's record, hand the team off seems reasonable for everyone involved. And Carolina even has a QB already who theoretically still has potential.

ETA: I know the Panthers hired a coach, just surprised they didn't even talk to BB as far as we know.
 
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soxhop411

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Dec 4, 2009
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The Atlanta hire certainly gives a lot of credence to the idea that McKay is the one who really has Arthur Blank's ear and is the shadow puppet master. Let's just say it's easier to scapegoat Raheem Morris than it is to do the same with Vrabel, Belichick, and Carroll
Whenever you have a choice between Raheem "21-38 career record" Morris and Bill "302 wins, 6 Lombardis" Belichick to be your head coach, you're a total fool for taking Belichick.

LOLOL they deserve to go 0-17 for the next 10 years after this.
View: https://twitter.com/DMRussini/status/1750641076833051067

There are layers to the hiring in Atlanta. Arthur Blank was targeting the greatest coach of all time from the start. He was then open to listening to others ideas. Some internal persuasion, impressive interviews, and here we are. Belichick is unemployed. Raheem gets his shot.
you appear to be onto something
 

boca

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Speculation already that Morris will bring Zac Robinson with him for OC.
 

Auger34

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A few thoughts on that:
1. It's entirely possible that NE fans overvalued him. He's the GOAT, look at the ringz, etc. Other teams see someone who hasn't been great the last few years and is a polarizing to play for (some people love him, some people think those teams were no fun) and looks like maybe he needed Brady more than the other way around.
2. The trend these days seems to be offensive guys. BB not having Brady and being unable to do anything with Mac is probably looked upon poorly.
3. He's 71. There is definitely ageism at play. Everyone wants the next BB, who will get hired and stick around for 20 years even though that seems pretty unlikely for any coach.
4. Raheem Morris getting hired shows Atlanta... has ideas. I dont know what they are myself, but they have them.

I have no idea why the Panthers didn't jump on BB honestly. At this point, hiring BB as a quick fix/respectability guy (just like Parcells was at the end of his career) seems in play. Let him have control for a couple of years, beat Shula's record, hand the team off seems reasonable for everyone involved. And Carolina even has a QB already who theoretically still has potential.
I would bet that Bill didn't want the Carolina job. Tepper sounds like a nightmare to work for.

It seems like Atlanta was the job he was targeting because of Blank but McKay blocked that. Kind of shocking that Blank was swayed by a mediocre executive to not hire the greatest coach ever
 

astrozombie

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Sep 12, 2022
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I would bet that Bill didn't want the Carolina job. Tepper sounds like a nightmare to work for.

It seems like Atlanta was the job he was targeting because of Blank but McKay blocked that. Kind of shocking that Blank was swayed by a mediocre executive to not hire the greatest coach ever
Thats a good point re: Tepper. Not sure BB would have gone for it, but that there seemed to be no interest in even reaching out to BB seems odd. Who knows, maybe they did and it just wasn't widely reported, but it sure seems like they didn't.
And I agree, no idea why McKay was able to block this. I imagine McKay might have felt threatened with BB on board so I get that. And I imagine that Blank wants some measure of continuity, even if that is the thoroughly mediocre McKay. But that's all I got.
 

Justthetippett

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Aug 9, 2015
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I would bet that Bill didn't want the Carolina job. Tepper sounds like a nightmare to work for.

It seems like Atlanta was the job he was targeting because of Blank but McKay blocked that. Kind of shocking that Blank was swayed by a mediocre executive to not hire the greatest coach ever
If this is actually what happened with McKay, then it's a much bigger risk for McKay to back Morris than Bill. He would have let his own insecurity get the best of him. If Morris fails, Blank can easily say that's your guy, go pack your bags with him. If Bill succeeded or failed, McKay could have shared credit or deflected blame.
 

Auger34

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If this is actually what happened with McKay, then it's a much bigger risk for McKay to back Morris than Bill. He would have let his own insecurity get the best of him. If Morris fails, Blank can easily say that's your guy, go pack your bags with him. If Bill succeeded or failed, McKay could have shared credit or deflected blame.
I don't think this is how that works.

It's not a deflection thing, it's that McKay is the one that has Blank's ear if Morris is coach. He can formulate the message that he wants Blank to hear. He controls the narrative and what gets to Blank. Morris doesn't have nearly the cache to go above McKay to get to Blank, that wouldn't fly.

If BB is the coach then he has the cache and accolades to go directly to Blank and Blank would trust what Belichick has to say. McKay loses a lot of the sway he has and no longer controls the narrative
 

j-man

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If this is actually what happened with McKay, then it's a much bigger risk for McKay to back Morris than Bill. He would have let his own insecurity get the best of him. If Morris fails, Blank can easily say that's your guy, go pack your bags with him. If Bill succeeded or failed, McKay could have shared credit or deflected blame.
morris was cheaper and mckay knew him

bill best choice is jax but if they win 10 games and a playoff game they will keep their coach
 

tims4wins

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He seems like a good coach. His first opportunity in TB he was too young. He has the history with Atlanta. Not that surprising that they chose him over Vrabel and Slowik, I guess, but over BB is a head scratcher.
Go watch the mic'd up SB51 highlights. He comes off as... less than impressive.

I would bet my entire house, 401k, family, etc. that he gets fired before 4 years are up with a losing record.
 

Justthetippett

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Aug 9, 2015
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I don't think this is how that works.

It's not a deflection thing, it's that McKay is the one that has Blank's ear if Morris is coach. He can formulate the message that he wants Blank to hear. He controls the narrative and what gets to Blank. Morris doesn't have nearly the cache to go above McKay to get to Blank, that wouldn't fly.

If BB is the coach then he has the cache and accolades to go directly to Blank and Blank would trust what Belichick has to say. McKay loses a lot of the sway he has and no longer controls the narrative
What you're describing is what I think was McKay's mistake (again, if we accept that he had something material to do with the choice, which is mostly logical conjecture as far as I know). He got insecure about his position with Blank instead of bringing in the best coach. Instead of doing everything to win, which is presumably what Blank would value most, he priotized his position, which puts him more at risk.
 

Cellar-Door

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Given the quality of the decision making of the rest of the people there I'd say he should have stuck with his first instinct.
Listen when you can choose between the best Coach/GM in the history of the league or the architect of your 6 consecutive losing seasons....
 

nighthob

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The Atlanta hire certainly gives a lot of credence to the idea that McKay is the one who really has Arthur Blank's ear and is the shadow puppet master. Let's just say it's easier to scapegoat Raheem Morris than it is to do the same with Vrabel, Belichick, and Carroll
Now all we need is for McKay to bet the house on trading up to #3 to draft Atnalta's QB of the future.
 

Remagellan

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Speculation already that Morris will bring Zac Robinson with him for OC.
People can rip on Raheem Morris all they want given his record. I guess it's hard to believe a former DC could ever succeed at being a head coach after failing in his first or first and second chances at the top post. If only we knew of any such people...

I saw the above about Robinson and Conor Orr's note that Morris also may bring along Rams defensive pass-game coordinator Aubrey Pleasant as his defensive coordinator. It's possible that the Falcons brass was more excited by the possibility of investing in this trio of comparatively young talented coaches than a Belichick reunion tour with Josh McDaniels and Matt Patricia.
 

Sandwich Pick

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I don't think this is how that works.

It's not a deflection thing, it's that McKay is the one that has Blank's ear if Morris is coach. He can formulate the message that he wants Blank to hear. He controls the narrative and what gets to Blank. Morris doesn't have nearly the cache to go above McKay to get to Blank, that wouldn't fly.

If BB is the coach then he has the cache and accolades to go directly to Blank and Blank would trust what Belichick has to say. McKay loses a lot of the sway he has and no longer controls the narrative
This is basically Howie Roseman's approach to being a GM.
 
Oct 12, 2023
802
People can rip on Raheem Morris all they want given his record. I guess it's hard to believe a former DC could ever succeed at being a head coach after failing in his first or first and second chances at the top post. If only we knew of any such people...

I saw the above about Robinson and Conor Orr's note that Morris also may bring along Rams defensive pass-game coordinator Aubrey Pleasant as his defensive coordinator. It's possible that the Falcons brass was more excited by the possibility of investing in this trio of comparatively young talented coaches than a Belichick reunion tour with Josh McDaniels and Matt Patricia.
There are exceptions of course (Carroll for example but that’s a different situation given he only became a good coach after his stint in college). Belichick’s tenure in Cleveland paled in comparison to his New England run but it wasn’t a failure and his chops as a coordinator and overall coach were well beyond Morris’s

The Rams have been 15th, 21, and 19th in points allowed under Morris. The Falcons were 19th under him in 2020. The Bucs were 27th, 9th and 32nd in points allowed while he was a head coach

Trying to figure out what exactly Morris does well. He’s supposedly a defensive guy (despite his work with Atlanta as a WR coach) but he doesn’t exactly have a track record of great defenses or getting under talented defenses to perform at a high level which is the mark of a great coordinator/coach.

What separates Morris as a good coaching hire from someone like Staley, Patricia or McDaniels as failed coordinator-to-coach candidates?

but this is how Atlanta has operated under McKay. He has a type he likes for head coach and he has enough of a sample size now to think he would much prefer a coordinator promotion than a proven head coach. And given how the others have turned out, I’m skeptical that he has any sort of ability to differentiate between coordinators who can actually make that transition and guys who can’t.
 

BaseballJones

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I’m trying to imagine how this went. Imagine you’re Morris and you’re going into the job interview and you know your record is terrible and one of the other candidates is the greatest HC to ever do it. With the greatest résumé ever.

And you get the call that they’re going with you. You’ve gotta wonder just how the heck that happened.
 

mwonow

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I’m trying to imagine how this went. Imagine you’re Morris and you’re going into the job interview and you know your record is terrible and one of the other candidates is the greatest HC to ever do it. With the greatest résumé ever.

And you get the call that they’re going with you. You’ve gotta wonder just how the heck that happened.
I imagine it looked a lot like the first 10 seconds of this: View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFXTQh4yofk


(wish I could find a longer clip. IIRC, he was literally the most surprised guy in the room. Likely in the top half of "inebriated" as well...)
 

67YAZ

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Bears bring in Eric Washington as DC. Eberflus plans to retain the play calling, so Washington steps into the a pure coordination role.

Washington was with the Bears from 2008-2010 under Lovie and then 9 seasons with Ron Rivera. So Washington knows the defensive system.