End of Game Field Goal Strategy

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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This came up in the mega game thread this week about the Panthers' strategy at the end of the game. It might not be worthy of a thread, but risk-reward questions interest me so who knows, maybe it will interest others.

The specific scenario I'm interested in is when a team is losing and has the chance to win with a field goal and the other team does not have the ability to stop the clock, such that the team with the ball can kick with as little time left as it would like. And the team in possession has a time out.

The strategy almost always employed is to get the clock down to under the amount of time that the field goal will take, by kneeling, and then to kick. In other words a premium is put on leaving the other team no time. My question is whether that's sound.

I think the key to the question is that the team with the ball is losing the game. They must execute a penalty-free field goal to win. To me, teams are putting too much of a premium on making sure the other team has no time, given that penalty-free kicks are not a given. There are two potential questions: (1) should you try for a TD on a down earlier than fourth down, before settling for the kick, effectively giving yourself 2 chances to win the game, and (2) if you're going to kick, how much time should you leave?

On the first question, I think if you're losing by 1, and you can try for a TD with under 20 seconds on the clock, you go for it. Yesterday, the Panthers had the ball close to the goal line and, letting the play clock go down 40 seconds each time, could have run a play with about 18 seconds left on third down. If they score the TD, they are up 5 and can go up 7 with a two-point conversion. So, worst case scenario, the other team must score a TD in under 20 seconds with no time outs and may only be able to tie. If you don't get in the end zone, you let the clock run down.

The risks on the play are turnover, penalty, and doing something to stop the clock. I'm thinking about a straight ahead run. If you commit a penalty, it's still third down and you can still run more time on third down before you kick. But you might lose 10 yards. So, I would only do it very close the goal line. I thought yesterday was a perfect situation to try for the TD. I think the fear of a turnover is overrated. Put a premium on ball security. If you don't have a back you can trust, don't do it. If you are tied, then no, it should be kick or OT. But you're losing. Take two chances to win -- although admittedly one of those chances comes with a slight risk that the opponent goes down and scores a TD in 15 seconds. Unlikely, but it happens. More than a missed field goal? I guess that's the question. Of course, the defense can decline a penalty and the clock still stops, so now you've left about 15 seconds. I think this is the biggest risk. Still, the fact is that you're losing. Two chances to win is pretty attractive.

Second, if you do let the clock go all the way down, how much time do you leave? I think one second is a mistake. Yes, a walk off feels great. But the problem is an offensive penalty. Nobody thinks about this, but it's going to happen in a big game. I've seen it happen I think at least once, or maybe twice this year, but it was at halftime so nobody cared as much. The problem is that you only get an untimed down for defensive penalties. For non pre-snap penalties, the clock runs. If the offense committed a penalty, the points come off the board, the time goes off the clock, and the half ends. So, lining up in the neutral zone (this happened to the Cardinals at halftime of a game this year and they lost 3 points), hands to the face, holding, grabbing a facemask, anything like that -- you lose. Compare that to calling time out with 7 second left. Now, if there's an offensive penalty, but you make the kick, you get a second try. Generally made field goals are 4 or 5 seconds. If you make the kick, you force the defense to take the penalty, you get to replay the down, and most importantly you have time left to kick again after the yardage.

If you miss the kick, it's game over either way. If the play takes longer than 5 seconds, it wasn't a made kick, so you lose anyway. What's the downside? Well, it's that you give the opposition the chance to return a kick for a TD and win or tie the game. Or to go 75 yards in 2 seconds. I guess one consideration is whether you have a kicker that can kick touchbacks. If so, how often have we seen 2 second 75 yard TDs? I guess twice? How often are field goals negated by penalties? More often. We've seen a surprising number of holds on field goals this year. That would end the game if you wait for :01. But these are contested plays where the other side is trying to block the kick to win the game and so there is action on the play.

I think being so unnecessarily scared of giving the other team 2 seconds forces teams into a suboptimal play, and when it bites someone, because some moron lines up 4 inches in the neutral zone on the kick, I'm going to be here to say I told you so! (Why offensive neutral zone infractions actually are allowed to be run and aren't pre-snap penalties like false starts is an interesting question, but that's the NFL rule.)
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Depends in large part where the line of scrimmage is and who the kicker is, doesn't it? I mean if BAL is down 1 with the ball on the opponents 10, BAL is going to run down the clock and trust Tucker for the win. if the ball is at the 40, they are going to keep trying to improve their FG position.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Depends in large part where the line of scrimmage is and who the kicker is, doesn't it? I mean if BAL is down 1 with the ball on the opponents 10, BAL is going to run down the clock and trust Tucker for the win. if the ball is at the 40, they are going to keep trying to improve their FG position.
Right -- I'm talking about a fairly specific situation. That is, assume the team with the ball has decided it is content to start kneeling. So, whether it's the 20 yard line, or the 2 yard line, assume they have decided that they are content to kick. Then the question is simply: (1) do you try to score on third down even if it leaves some time, and (2) when do you call time out before kicking? I think you only consider (1) if you're pretty close.

I think there's a separate problem that teams stop trying to gain yardage too early in this situation. But put all those issues to the side. They have decided they are content to kick and want to kneel. Now what?
 

lexrageorge

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Isn't there an automatic 10 second runoff in the event of a penalty on the FG try when inside 2 minutes?
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Isn't there an automatic 10 second runoff in the event of a penalty on the FG try when inside 2 minutes?
Only if the clock was running before the snap. Also, I put in the hypo that the team kicking has a time out, which can always be used to stop a run off.
 

Mystic Merlin

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Assuming you are kicking off a stopped clock, I do think if you are in stone cold FG range that the risk of the game ending on either (1) an offensive penalty because it isn’t pre snap (too many men in the huddle or false start would be pre snap) or (2) a fumbled snap that the holder could’ve fallen on/called a TO to get another crack at the kick than, if you leave 3-5 seconds on the clock, the opponent returning a post-FG kickoff or final play for a TD (or getting an untimed down off a defensive penalty that results in a FG or TD).

I don’t have numbers to back this up, just general intuition based on watching games, so YMMV.

NOTE: I believe there would be an untimed down if there were offsetting live ball penalties unless the offense’s penalty was a personal foul and the defense’s penalty wasn’t, but this might be too fine a nuance for the purposes of your scenario.
 

ilol@u

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Right -- I'm talking about a fairly specific situation. That is, assume the team with the ball has decided it is content to start kneeling. So, whether it's the 20 yard line, or the 2 yard line, assume they have decided that they are content to kick. Then the question is simply: (1) do you try to score on third down even if it leaves some time, and (2) when do you call time out before kicking? I think you only consider (1) if you're pretty close.

I think there's a separate problem that teams stop trying to gain yardage too early in this situation. But put all those issues to the side. They have decided they are content to kick and want to kneel. Now what?
Fun topic to discuss.

I believe one of the biggest issues in the NFL in crunch time is for defenses is not allowing the defense to score a TD. We saw this in the Panthers/Falcons game, once Chubbard got the first down on the three yard line, the Atlanta defense should have let them score and get the ball back, down 6-7-8 points, with 1:50+ remaining. Instead, the Panthers kneeled it twice and kicked the game winning FG.

It reminded me of the Patriots in 2011, allowing Ahmad Bradshaw to score the go ahead TD, and getting the ball back down 4. Todd Gurley did something similar a few years ago, where the defense allowed him to score a TD. Same thing for this past Superbowl, with Philadelphia allowing McKinnon to score a TD, but he wisely took a knee.

IMO - there is a math based strategy. The chances of the field goal operation with 1-2-3 seconds: penalty occurring + chances of missing the kick + chance of fumbling the handoff + chances of a blocked kick are all <<<< over giving the ball back to the opponent down a touchdown with time remaining.
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
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Jan 10, 2004
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I again renew my one-man campaign for a rule change whereby the last player to touch the ball must make the kick. What great spectactle! Let's put the 'foot' back in 'football.'
 

Harry Hooper

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I again renew my one-man campaign for a rule change whereby the last player to touch the ball must make the kick. What great spectactle! Let's put the 'foot' back in 'football.'
I would be more interested a la rugby with the extra point having to line up essentially where the ball crossed the goal line on the TD. So after a successful plunge to the pylon, the ball is kicked maybe a dozen yards in from the sideline.


In regard to field goals, if a team made it routine practice to sprint onto the field and make the FGA quickly, I bet they could force the opposition to call TOs or suffer 12 men on the field penalties (even with officials' delay for defensive substitutions).
 
Oct 12, 2023
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The interesting thing is that it used to be more often the case when teams would keep a few extra seconds on the clock and/or kick on 3rd down instead of 4th as a hedge against a fumbled snap on the FG attempt.

now, it seems like the prevailing strategy is to use 3rd down (when applicable and already in range) to get the ball to the kicker’s preferred spot/hash mark, run the clock to under 5 and use the final time out.

what makes this noteworthy is that it seems teams are willing to take a tiny risk on offense to prevent the unlikely chance of giving up a score after they kick the go ahead FG. But with the recent neutering of kickoffs, you’re really talking about a likely scenario of 5-10 seconds for the opposing team to go from the 25 after the touchback and get into range for their very own FG or a walkoff 75 yard TD.

going for the “walk off FG” made sense when kick returns were a thing. But they’re so few and far between now that I’m not sure playing for the walk off still makes sense.