He would do a complete 180 on my opinion of him if he sacked up and did it. Is it possible he's been hiding his time and the bullshit of Tuesday was just kind of the straw that broke the camels back?
#DFG: Canceling the Noise
- Thread starter nattysez
- Start date
I mean, as BB himself had to explain to that dolt reporter who kept asking him the same question today (read Mr. Kraft's transcript), Bob Kraft specifically asked, in his statement, for nobody in the organization to comment on the matter.
That's not as dramatic, though.
Edit: in response to DrLeather
That's not as dramatic, though.
Edit: in response to DrLeather
This battle is over, anyone attempting to engage other fans in rational discussion over this is a masochist. Just post or say the equivalent of the gif of Tom Brady counting his rings and move on to another year of watching excellence on the field. New will either have the opportunity to watch one of the GOATs play 16 plus games or the chance to overcome this ridiculous handicap and still win one for the middle finger.
I admit that I took the public messaging at face value on this one. Can anyone point me to a good objective criticism of the Boutygate investigation? Given how Deflategate has unfolded, I'd like to better educate myself on that scandal.RedOctober3829 said:
I keep hearing people saying that Tagliabue overturned Goodell's findings and point to this as proof that the investigation was a sham. However, from the limited research I've done, that doesn't seem to be the case. Tagliabue didn't rule that nothing happened. He merely overturned the suspensions for the players, under the logic that it was management who was accountable.
I imagine there is a lot more to it than that, and I'd like to know what it is.
But it's not about that in this case, it's about this:Myt1 said:
How people feel about the Pats is based on emotion. It's a hatred so strong that most are even willing to forget what an incompetent idiot Goodell is and go with the hate instead. If you dig into any details about Spygate of Deflategate you end up at the same place as the above; 'well, I just don't like them and the coach is a dick.' I've heard that a million times. It comes down to emotion, not intellect with the perception of the Pats.
Sports are, essentially, the only zero sum game that exists in the world. When Tom Brady leads the Patriots to four championships, that's four championships your team, by definition, cannot get. Every game the Patriots win is a game another team loses. It's very unlikely that fans of other teams will take the Patriots' side on anything, nevermind something like this.
Filling in some Steeler fan friends about the whole Mort thing this morning and they were stunned, gave them the link from Sally Jenkins column, and just really went into detail about this whole thing. They were pretty receptive and even said they didn't realize how much smoke there was to all of this crap. To this point they were typical Steeler fans who insisted TB12 must have done something, but now they are not so sure. They thought the whole Mort thing is very damning.
Traveling for yesterday and co-workers located in Chicago started giving me the "Cheatriots" routine. Both intelligent people who were clearly paying attention at a high-level, but weren't up on all the details. Both stated that something had to have been going on because "11 of 12 footballs we under-inflated by 2lbs." When I set them straight, they were shocked....for a few minutes before stating that the Pats "always cheat" and citing videotaping of Rams Super Bowl practices.
I quit.
I quit.
I don't think the NFL set out to "get" Brady.crystalline said:
Rather, I think this whole thing is best explained by the series of articles written by Sally Jenkins.
The NFL botched the handling of this potential misdemeanor from the start and rather than backing down and admitting its mistake, the NFL continued to double, triple and quadruple down. Brady became a convenient victim given that he's the QB, the player most likely to benefit from deflated balls, and had that flurry of calls and texts with Jastremski in the wake of the Mort lies, which showed a consciousness of guilt, in the NFL's warped eyes. That Brady would not settle on the NFL's terms likely emboldened them and with the fight on, they keep charging.
But it's hard to believe that they set out specifically to tarnish him in the first place. Why would they?
That said, whether they set out to do it or ended up there is now kind of immaterial. And in a league with more than a few epic morons and dangers to society, Kraft's question about why they made Tom Brady the poster boy for bad remains on point. Not that we needed another example, but they keep coming:
http://nypost.com/2015/07/30/jets-sheldon-richardson-arrested-for-fleeing-cops-at-143-mph/
Great. Now reduce that into a 3-8 word sound bite, and someone tweet it at Simmons.TheoShmeo said:
drbretto said:
These are the mouth-breathers that the NFL knew they would get hook, line and sinker with the "destroyed phone" PR stunt.
crystalline said:
Someone who knows something about poker can distill it into a poker analogy about going all in on a bad hand because they misread their hand it'd be more likely to get his attention.
Theo, considering that Brady indicated the the NFL never even made an offer, how do you define settling "on the NFL's terms?"
Good point.Average Reds said:
There were reports that they would have settled at one or two games if Tom admitted culpability but Tom says that's not true.
So who the hell knows.....
I don't necessarilybelieve this either considering there were so many reports that they were negotiating.Average Reds said:
riboflav said:
This.
If there was a vendetta, BB was the target. I'm not convinced there was,however. I'm more inclined to think this was a clusterfuck from the get/go, and RG refused to back off even in the face of inconclusive data.
The shield, you know.
Brady has said those reports are false. An NFLPA official has stated unequivocally that those reports are false. The NFL has remained silent and allowed the leaks to speak for themselves. Much like they did for months with the incorrect report on the deflation levels.HomeBrew1901 said:
I guess anything is possible, but I'm comfortable believing that Brady is telling the truth and the reports are false.
It's a PR battle man, I take everything that everyone says publicly with a grain of salt because they all want to make themselves look good.Average Reds said:
What evidence have you seen that Brady is fighting a PR battle? He's held one press conference back in January and put out a statement at the end of the appeal.HomeBrew1901 said:
I guess it's easy to simply dismiss everything as fluff rather than to apply a bit of critical thought.
Tom is clearly fighting a PR battle, as well he should be and not that there is anything at all wrong with that.Average Reds said:
Witness the immediate statements of Donald Yee after every development, Tom's own FB post and the likely coordinated statements of Robert Kraft.
Riiiiiiiight,Average Reds said:
Don Yee is coming out on his own behalf immediately after the Wells report, that wasn't part of a PR battle.
Schefter reporting that Brady came off as completely sincere after the hearing with Goodell, that was leaked by Pash/Kensil too right?
The NFLPA for months telling anyone who would listen that they were going to court if Brady wasn't fully exonerated.
The NFLPA stating that Brady wanted to negotiate but the NFL refused to.
Don Yee coming out after the cell phone debacle.
Nope no PR there, what was that about "critical thought"?
He should be defending himself, I'm not saying he shouldn't be, but let's not pretend he isn't fighting a PR Campaign of his own to fix his image across the league and with sponsors at the same time.
dcdrew10 said:
Alternataely, it's like they are continually splitting pairs of fours at blackjack.*
Not only are they screwing up their own hand, they're messing up everyone else at the table too**
*(I don't really play blackjack much, but the intertubes tell me to never split fours)
**(I know it doesn't really work that way)
HomeBrew1901 said:
And yet in your previous comment you state how you don't believe they weren't negotiating because of all of the reports stating such. Your posts are idiotic and obnoxious because you're very biased and pretend not to be, so please stop.
This was very obviously a smear campaign against the Patriots and Brady. I have no idea why the NFL would want the negative publicity (although to this point, it has worked out for them it seems) and I have no idea when it started (i.e. was it actually a sting operation from the start or did the NFL just mishandle a minor infraction?) and my guess is that we will never know who was involved and why.
Personally, I don't think Brady did anything illegal (i.e. told anybody to deflate balls AFTER they've been inspected) and if the balls were actually deflated (big if) then it was done by the DoritoDinks alone because Brady went nuclear on them after the Jets game (when the balls were over-inflated by the refs) and told them to make sure it never happened again.
I'm obviously biased and could be wrong, but after all of the misinformation from the league and the fact they found nothing, I'm just going with the most likely scenario.
As someone who actually works in PR, I can tell you with great clarity that Brady is not fighting a PR battle. He's adopted a defensive strategy designed to correct what he sees as egregious errors and not much else. (And IMO, this is a bad choice. You either commit to silence or commit to a full PR battle,)
The NFL and NFLPA are absolutely engaged in a PR battle.
The NFL and NFLPA are absolutely engaged in a PR battle.
Want to pick up some pro bono work?Average Reds said:
I'm sure you can get $10 per SOSH poster to rehabilitate Brady. It works for physicians.
Also, what would you do if you were representing Brady?
C4CRVT said:
Steelers (and a contingent of their fans) are generally saying "Told You So" about Goodell's power trip. Personally I'm on record here as Belichick being basically a cold war era CIA station chief in terms of his information warfare and deciphering opposing signals. I've never given a shit about the pressure in the footballs. I've always considered Goodell a tone deaf myopic asshole, and he should have been canned instantly over the Ray Rice debacle. I doubt the Rooney family is pushing Goodell to uphold the suspension for competitive reasons, though that could easily be naive.
I don't work in PR.Average Reds said:
But Donald Yee's statements after each event and accompanying road tour with media outlets sure seems like a public relations effort to me. Whether Yee is correcting errors or not, it seems to me that he is trying to shape public opinion. Said differently, the only purpose in correcting errors is to set the record straight so that the public understands the actual story as opposed to the NFL's twisted version. Or is that wrong and is there an actual, meaningful difference between correcting the record and shaping public opinion?
Tom's FB post was, to me, along the same lines as Yee's statements.
And to apply it to our discussion, the NFL wants us to believe that Tom could have been done at 1 or 2 if he would just fess up. Tom likely wants us to believe that's not true.
TheoShmeo said:
I'm sure A-Reds won't mind me chiming in on his behalf...
Anyway...I think he's talking about the difference between a "PR Battle" and "making some statements to the public".
I'd imagine a PR Battle would involve radio or TV appearances, at the very least.
Of course they are designed to influence the public. But they are not part of a PR war precisely because there is no strategy; they are being reactive rather than proactive.
A PR campaign is thought out and executed in multiple layers and through multiple channels. The NFL is doing this quite well. Brady and Yee have been mostly silent with the exception of reactive statements. Which is why I give Brady's claim more credibility.
A PR campaign is thought out and executed in multiple layers and through multiple channels. The NFL is doing this quite well. Brady and Yee have been mostly silent with the exception of reactive statements. Which is why I give Brady's claim more credibility.
Here's the relevant part of Jones' comments:
I'm still hoping for an embarrassing slapdown from Berman that makes Goodell look really bad.
It certainly hurts Goodell if Kraft is no longer willing to carry Goodell's water with other owners. Of course, we don't know whether Kraft is merely talking a good game or whether he will change his behavior in the future.
I'm still hoping for an embarrassing slapdown from Berman that makes Goodell look really bad.
Perhaps I'm simplifying but I would guess the reason ARS is saying Brady isn't engaged in a PR battle is that he has done next to nothing proactively to shape public opinion – everything he and Yee have done is from a defensive standpoint (ie, to correct the record, etc.). That's not how you wage a PR campaign.
To be honest, that alone is one of the signs I take that Brady has nothing to hide – he seems to be operating from the belief that the facts will come out and "the truth will set him free." If I had to guess, that's also probably why ARS thinks Brady's making a mistake here – because even if he's not engaging in a PR campaign, the other actors absolutely are and, as the Mort tweet demonstrates, spin can end up becoming "facts" if it is allowed to go unrefuted.
ARS, apologies for putting words into your mouth...
Edit: Tho it appears that I was OTM and that we both agree here.
To be honest, that alone is one of the signs I take that Brady has nothing to hide – he seems to be operating from the belief that the facts will come out and "the truth will set him free." If I had to guess, that's also probably why ARS thinks Brady's making a mistake here – because even if he's not engaging in a PR campaign, the other actors absolutely are and, as the Mort tweet demonstrates, spin can end up becoming "facts" if it is allowed to go unrefuted.
ARS, apologies for putting words into your mouth...
Edit: Tho it appears that I was OTM and that we both agree here.
crystalline said:
Glampers may have lost Kraft, but among the other owners he's likely moved 3 or 4 fence-sitters over to the "Roger is awesome" column. The Panthers owner, for example.
I agree 100% that Tom has more credibility. For every reason.
Whether Brady's effort is reactive, proactive, half-assed or something else, the NFL and the scumbag Commish have literally no credibility in my eyes.
That said, I'm confused by the differing accounts regarding the negotiations. It seems logical that the NFL would have offered 1 or 2 with an admission of guilt, and that Tom's side is saying that the NFL never countered is surprising. Maybe there is no actual disagreement in that the NFL offered the above, Tom countered and the NFL never replied to that counter.
Whether Brady's effort is reactive, proactive, half-assed or something else, the NFL and the scumbag Commish have literally no credibility in my eyes.
That said, I'm confused by the differing accounts regarding the negotiations. It seems logical that the NFL would have offered 1 or 2 with an admission of guilt, and that Tom's side is saying that the NFL never countered is surprising. Maybe there is no actual disagreement in that the NFL offered the above, Tom countered and the NFL never replied to that counter.
So when Florio reiterated when his gig with NBC was renewed that he received complete editorial freedom wrt his website, he was truth telling.
Florio is running riot -- and I love it. And he is probing THE most sensitive areas from a media partner stanpoint -- like how SAS was played and is an NFL tool.
I love it.
Florio is running riot -- and I love it. And he is probing THE most sensitive areas from a media partner stanpoint -- like how SAS was played and is an NFL tool.
I love it.
Yea he is old. And he might even be senile but As a former player I bet Richardson is as sick of this bullshit as the rest of us. I bet he remembers playing with Sponges and Rocks for footballs. Of course thats just my opinion of how Richardson might be feeling. Which like yours doesnt mean a tinkers dam.
The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing
Not necessarily evil.....but apt. Up until about 6 months ago RK was doing nothing....although he must have suspected the ineptitude of the Head office.
The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing
Not necessarily evil.....but apt. Up until about 6 months ago RK was doing nothing....although he must have suspected the ineptitude of the Head office.
Theo, do you know Brady personally? You almost always refer to him as Tom, which I find odd, unless you have a relationship with him, even if tangential. I'm not criticizing, I'm just curious.TheoShmeo said:
I agree with Average Reds (and Wetzel) that TB has been on defense. But it occurs to me somebody got John Dennis riled up about Kensil this week, and that it is probably the Patriots trying to do better at PR now that Robert is
pissed off again. I'm guessing the organization is now mounting a counter-campaign against the NFL. The midday show on EEI has been all about Mort/Kensil.
It is remarkable how different this process has been from, say, the Rose investigation by Dowd/Giamatti/Fay Vincent--those were honorable guys with ethics. Contrast with Roger/Vincent/Kensil.
pissed off again. I'm guessing the organization is now mounting a counter-campaign against the NFL. The midday show on EEI has been all about Mort/Kensil.
It is remarkable how different this process has been from, say, the Rose investigation by Dowd/Giamatti/Fay Vincent--those were honorable guys with ethics. Contrast with Roger/Vincent/Kensil.
By the way, these owners still "support" Goodell. He makes them lots of money.
— Jim Trotter (@JimTrotter_NFL) July 31, 2015
These owners said the case is a bad look for NFL and never should've gotten to this point. Reiterated Kraft point: lawyers too involved.
— Jim Trotter (@JimTrotter_NFL) July 31, 2015