#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[Buster Olney the Lonely]

Come hell or high water I will be in Canton to watch his induction.

 

[Ed Hillel]

So which one of us is going to go buy a horse brush and rub down a football and test this?

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Do you think that Belichick would have done this if there was any chance there was proof that could be found? Any chance at all? I'll take it one step further: do you think that he would do this unless he was 100% sure that no proof can be found because there is no proof to be found? If you answered yes to any of these questions, your take on the man is so different than mine that I can't imagine ever finding common ground in a discussion of the matter.

  
You apparently missed spygate; your comment above is flatly irreconcilable with currently undisputed facts about the incident.  I think you're better than the above comment.
 
I am a gigantic Belichick fan, but not a fanboy about it.  The guy is the best football coach I have ever seen, and the best coach in any sport in my lifetime.  He is ferociously competitive, and tries to gain every advantage he possibly can.  I think there are a ton of grey areas in coaching an NFL team and he, like every other coach, makes calls about what is ok and not ok within those grey areas.   And I can imagine him feeling like the pre-game ball preparation is an area that he should focus on what's good for his QB and let the officials worry about the rest.  This might, he could realize (and may not realize), result in a ball that is not within legal limits when the temperature cools...but at the point he hands it to ref, it is legal.  I think he'd be ok with that---and I'm not sure that as a matter of NFL rules he's wrong about that either.  
 
I don't think he's unethical, and I think he makes better decisions about those grey areas than many, many other NFL coaches.  But I also think it's unrealistic to pretend all these calls are black and white, and it's just factually wrong to say that he's always chosen the 'legal' side of every single decision.   As totally out of proportion to the violation the Spygate media coverage was, as ridiculous as the penalty from the league was, and silly as the rule in question was, he did knowingly violate it.

 

[Infield Infidel]

I'm waiting for the transcript, but let me repeat this. 
 
I still don't believe BB was inferring that the football prep was done immediately before handing the balls over to the refs, 2 hr 15 m before game time (which is highly unlikely). I think he was trying to say that during football prep, the pressure increased by ~1 psi, so when the final inflation pressure was set by the handlers - what they thought was 12.5 was really 11.5. In other words, there was no purposeful deception being done.
 

 
Here's the quote:
 
We prepare our (foot)balls over time, and we use them in practice, and that preparation process continues right up until the balls are given to the officials prior to the game. That's when they are finalized. 

 

[Bob420]

I'm waiting for the transcript, but let me repeat this. 
 
I still don't believe BB was inferring that the football prep was done immediately before handing the balls over to the refs, 2 hr 15 m before game time (which is highly unlikely). I think he was trying to say that during football prep, the pressure increased by ~1 psi, so when the final inflation pressure was set by the handlers - what they thought was 12.5 was really 11.5. In other words, there was no purposeful deception being done.
 
Then, after sitting around, the balls go to the refs at 11.5. It's up to the refs to re-inflate them to 13 psi +/- 0.5. Then once the ball acclimates to 50 degrees, the pressure drops again by something more around 1 psi.
 
When the footballs were re-measured, it was (theoretically) not done in time for them to re-acclimate to 70 degrees, so footballs that could have gone out to the field at 11.5 and fallen to 10.5 may only h ave had enough time to warm up to (say) 55 degrees and re-inflate to (say) 11. Spare footballs sitting in the locker room through halftime would have been at a higher pressure...or maybe they were at 11.5 and the refs re-inflated them.
 
It doesn't make sense that the spare footballs would have been at 12.5 (theoretically the same as the 1st half balls) if the pressure drop from climate was only 1 psi. 
 
On the other hand,  if the pressure drop from conditions was closer to 2 psi - all bets are off and the explanation is extremely simple.
 
If the pressure drop was closer to 2 psi, the Colts footballs must either entered the game at 14.5 or their re-measurement was done under different conditions.

If ball prep other than raising the temp increased the PSI, and you did that at some point well before the testing, wouldn't the new increased PSI be the PSI and not actually 1 PSI lower?

 

[PedroKsBambino]

 
And he stated as much. It's the rubbing/friction prior to measurement. Which Bill spent a lot of time explaining as something done for tactile reasons, not PSI. But if you are implying that people on the team are messing around with ball PSI AFTER the ref inspection....well.
 
The thing about conspiracies is, somebody always talks and the truth comes out. If you watched the same press conference I did, Bill Belichick does NOT believe PSI manipulation is going on. The only way that's happening is if people on the Patriots looked Bill in the eye and lied to him. I don't see that.

 
I am not implying that.   I agree he stated as much; it's pure fanboyism that people are suggesting otherwise here.

 

[rodderick]

  
You apparently missed spygate; your comment above is flatly irreconcilable with currently undisputed facts about the incident.  I think you're better than the above comment.
 
I am a gigantic Belichick fan, but not a fanboy about it.  The guy is the best football coach I have ever seen, and the best coach in any sport in my lifetime.  He is ferociously competitive, and tries to gain every advantage he possibly can.  I think there are a ton of grey areas in coaching an NFL team and he, like every other coach, makes calls about what is ok and not ok within those grey areas.   And I can imagine him feeling like the pre-game ball preparation is an area that he should focus on what's good for his QB and let the officials worry about the rest.  This might, he could realize (and may not realize), result in a ball that is not within legal limits when the temperature cools...but at the point he hands it to ref, it is legal.  I think he'd be ok with that---and I'm not sure that as a matter of NFL rules he's wrong about that either.  
 
I don't think he's unethical, and I think he makes better decisions about those grey areas than many, many other NFL coaches.  But I also think it's unrealistic to pretend all these calls are black and white, and it's just factually wrong to say that he's always chosen the 'legal' side of every single decision.   As totally out of proportion to the violation the Spygate media coverage was, as ridiculous as the penalty from the league was, and silly as the rule in question was, he did knowingly violate it.

That's why he owned up to Spygate immediately. No one is saying Belichick isn't capable of tampering with footballs, just that if he had done so we really don't believe he would've been so adamant about following the rules.

 

[Doctor G]

The thing is, if the Colts balls didn't drop psi in those weather conditions then they were the ones that underwent human tampering.

Edit: And I'm starting to wonder about that.

They were probably checked quite a bit later than the Pats balls which were checked by 2 different guages .

 

[johnmd20]

Wow.  His rage about Spygate burns hot and deep.  That was awesome.  
 
As others have noted, there is no chance in hell any evidence exists of ball tampering.

 
Maybe because, GASP, there was never any tampering?

 

[PedroKsBambino]

That's why he owned up to Spygate immediately. No one is saying Belichick isn't capable of tampering with footballs, just that if he had done so we really don't believe he would've been so adamant about following the rules.

 
Not how I read some of the comments, but I agree the press conference reflects confidence.  That was my initial point (and why people challenging my initial point likely weren't saying what you suggest).

 

[ifmanis5]

Not at work so I don't have the verbate, but I did pull the closed caption info from CNN. Sorry, best I could do.

15:07:31     Right now, for all you watching at home, this is a live press
15:07:36     conference of Bill Belichick speaking at this moment.
15:07:38     Let's listen in. >> It's clear that I don't know
15:07:43     very much about this area. Over the last few days, I've
15:07:49     learned a lot more than I ever knew, like exponentially more.
15:07:59     I feel this is important because there's been questions raised,
15:08:05     and I believe now 100% that I have permly, and we as an
15:08:14     organization have absolutely followed every rule to the
15:08:19     letter, and I feel on behalf of everyone in the organization,
15:08:23     everyone that's involved in this organization, that we need to
15:08:26     say something, so I've talked to and gathered a lot of
15:08:32     information from members of our staff.
15:08:35     I have talked to other people familiar with this subject in
15:08:42     other organizations, and we have performed an internal study of
15:08:50     the process, and I think there's certainly other things that I
15:08:57     can do, and there's maybe other research that can be done but I
15:09:06     say I have enough information to share with you, and so based on
15:09:08     the events of today, I feel like now's the time to do it rather
15:09:16     than wait. I know this is an impromptu
15:09:19     thing, but that's just the way it worked out.
15:09:21     First of all, let me start with the process.
15:09:25     As Tom explained on Thursday, I think the most important part of
15:09:31     the football for the quarterback is the feel of the ball.
15:09:36     I don't think there's question about that, and the exterior
15:09:40     feel of the ball is not only critical, but it's also very
15:09:44     easily identifiable. When I feel a football, I can
15:09:48     feel a difference between slippery and tacky.
15:09:52     I can feel the difference between the texture of the ball
15:09:55     of how -- what degree it's broken in.
15:09:58     Put five balls out there, which ball is broken in the most and
15:10:01     the least, that's easy to identify.
15:10:05     That is the essence of the preparation.
15:10:09     We prepare our balls over time, and we use them in practice.
15:10:14     That preparation, process continues right up until the
15:10:18     balls are given to the officials prior to the game.
15:10:22     That's when they are finalized. If I could use that word.
15:10:27     I would say that in that process I have handled a dozens of balls
15:10:40     over the last week. The balls are easy to identify,
15:10:46     but the pressure of the balls is a different story.
15:10:49     It's much more difficult to feel or identify.
15:10:52     So the focus of our pregame preparations for the footballs
15:10:57     is based on texture and feel, and I think Tom went into that
15:11:03     extensively on Thursday, and he, obviously, could go through it a
15:11:08     lot better than I can because he's the one that touched them,
15:11:11     but that's the heart of the process.
15:11:16     So we simulated a game day situation in terms of the
15:11:22     preparation of the footballs and where the footballs were at
15:11:26     various points in time during the day or night as the case was
15:11:30     Sunday, and I would say that our preparation process for the
15:11:35    footballs is what we do, all right, I can't speak for anybody
15:11:40     else. It's what we do, and that P
15:11:47     process we found raises the psi approximately 1 pound.
15:11:54     So that process of creating a tackiness, a texture, a feel --
15:12:01     whatever the feel is, it's just a sensation for the quarterback,
15:12:06     what's the right feel, that process elevates the psi
15:12:14     approximately 1 pound based on what our study shows, which was
15:12:18     multiple balls, multiple examples in the process as we
15:12:22     would do for a game. It's not one football.
15:12:27     When the balls are delivered to the officials locker room, the
15:12:31     firsts were asked to inflate them to 12.5 psi.
15:12:37     What exactly they did, I don't know, but for the purposes of
15:12:43     our study, that's what we did. We set them at 12.5.
15:12:49     That's at the discretion of the official, though, regardless of
15:12:53     what we ask for, it's the officials' discretion to put
15:12:57     them where he wants. Again, that's done in a
15:13:01     controlled climate. The footballs are prepared in
15:13:03     our locker room. They are delivered to the
15:13:07     officials' locker room, a controlled environment.
15:13:11     It's whatever we have here is what we have there.
15:13:13     When the footballs go out on the field into the game conditions,
15:13:17     whatever those conditions are, hot and humid, whether it's cold
15:13:21     and damp, where's it's cold and dry, whether it's whatever it
15:13:27     is, that's where the footballs are played with, and that's
15:13:30     where the measurements would be different than what they are,
15:13:35     possibly different than what they are in a controlled
15:13:38     environment. That's what we found.
15:13:40     We found that once the balls, the footballs were on the field
15:13:45     over an extended period of time, in other words, they were
15:13:50     adjusted to the climatic conditions and also the fact
15:13:58     that the balls reached and equilibrium without the rubbing
15:14:04     process that after that had run its course and the balls reached
15:14:10     an equilibrium, the bams were down approximately 1.5 square
15:14:16     inch. Bringing the balls in after the
15:14:18     process and retested them in a controlled environment as we
15:14:22     have here, then those measurements rose approximately
15:14:30     one-half pound per square inch, so the net of 1.5 back to a half
15:14:34     is approximately 1 pound per square inch to one and a half.
15:14:40     Now, we all know that air pressure is a function of the
15:14:45     atmospheric conditions. It's a function of that.
15:14:49     So if there's activity in the ball relative to the rubbing
15:14:56     process, I think that explains why, when we gave them to the
15:15:01     officials, and the officials put it out, let's say 12.5, that
15:15:07     once the ball reached its equilibrium state, it was closer
15:15:13     to 11.5, but that's, again, that's just our measurements.
15:15:16     We can't speak specifically to what happened because we are
15:15:21     not -- have no way of touching the footballs other than once
15:15:26     the officials have them, we don't touch them kpecht for when
15:15:29     we play with them in the game. But it's similar to the concept
15:15:33     of when you get into your car and the light comes on, and it
15:15:37     says low tire pressure because the car's been sitting in the
15:15:40     driveway, outside, overnight, and you start it up, drive, and
15:15:43     the light goes off. It's a similar concept to that.
15:15:49     So atmospheric conditions and true E quill librium of the ball
15:15:59     is critical to the measurement. At no time was -- were any of
15:16:04     the footballs prepared anywhere other than in the locker room or
15:16:11     in an area close to that. Never in a heated room or heated
15:16:15     condition. That's absolutely never taken
15:16:19     place to anyone's knowledge or recollection, and I mean, that's
15:16:23     just -- didn't happen. When you measure a football,
15:16:28    there are a number of different issues that have -- that come
15:16:33     up. Number one, gauges, there are
15:16:36     multiple types of gauges, and the accuracy of one gauge
15:16:41     relative to another is -- there's variance there.
15:16:44     We're talking about air pressure, all right?
15:16:48     So there's some variance there. Clearly, all footballs are
15:16:55     different. So footballs that come out of
15:16:57     the similar pack, a similar box, a similar preparation, each ball
15:17:04     has its own unique characteristics because it's not
15:17:09     a manmade piece of equipment. It's a piece of skin.
15:17:14     It's a bladder. It's stitching.
15:17:17     It's laces. Each has its own set of unique
15:17:21     characteristics so whatever you do with that football, if you do
15:17:24     the same thing to another one, it might be close, but there's a
15:17:30     variance between each individual foot
15:17:36     football. It is not measured during the
15:17:39     game. We have no way of knowing until
15:17:40     we went through this exercise that this is really taking
15:17:46     place. So when we hand the balls to the
15:17:49     officials, the officials put them at whatever they put them
15:17:55     at, say it's 12.5, that's where they put them, and then the air
15:17:59     pressure at that point from then on until the end of the game, we
15:18:05     have no knowledge of. It's never been a concern.
15:18:08     So what is a concern is the texture of the footballs, and,
15:18:13     again, that's the point that Tom hit on hard on Thursday.
15:18:23     We had our quarterbacks look at a number of footballs, and they
15:18:26     were unable to differentiate a 1 pound per square inch difference
15:18:33     in the footballs. They were unable to do it.
15:18:36     On a 2 pound differential, there was some degree of
15:18:43     differentiation, but certainly not a consistent one.
15:18:45     A couple ones they could pick out, but they were wrong on some
15:18:50     of the other ones that they had, so you're welcome to do that
15:18:54     yourself. I can tell you from all the
15:18:56     footballs I handled over the last week, I can't tell the
15:19:00     difference if there's a one pound difference or half pound
15:19:06     difference in any of the footballs.
15:19:11     Again, anyone who has seen us practice knows that we make it
15:19:17     harder, not easier to handle the ball, and our players train in
15:19:25     conditions that a lot of people would recommend that benot drive
15:19:31     in. That's what they did.
15:19:35     They are a physically and mentally tough team that works
15:19:41     hard, that trains hard, that prepares hard, and have met
15:19:44     every challenge that I put in front of them.
15:19:49     I know that because I work them every day.
15:19:53     This team was the best team in the afc in the regular season.
15:19:57     We won two games in the playoffs against two good football teams,
15:20:03     best team in the post season, and that's what this team is.
15:20:07     I know that because I've been with them every day.
15:20:10     I'm proud of this team. I just want to share with you
15:20:17     what I learned over the past week.
15:20:19     I'm embarrassed about the talk of the amount of time I've put
15:20:22     into this relative to the other important challenge in prompt of
15:20:30     us. I'm not a scientist.
15:20:32     I'm not an expert in footballs. I'm not an expert in football
15:20:37     measure measurements.
15:20:38     I'm just telling you what I know.
15:20:41     I would not say I'm Mona Lisa of the football world as she was in
15:20:47     the car expertise area, all right?
15:20:56     At no time was there any intent whatsoever to compromise the
15:21:00     integrity of the game or gain an advantage.
15:21:02     Quite the opposite. We feel like we followed the
15:21:06     rules of the game to the letter in our preparations and
15:21:11     procedures, all right, and in the way that we handle every
15:21:17     game that we competitively played in as it relates to this
15:21:21    matter, all right? We try to do everything right.
15:21:23     We air on the side of caution. It's been that way now for many
15:21:31     years, anything that's close, we stay as far away from the line
15:21:34     as we can. In this case, I can say that we
15:21:40     are as far as I know and everything that I can do, we did
15:21:43     everything as right as we could do it.
15:21:47     We welcome the league's investigation into this matter,
15:21:50     but we think there's a number of things that need to be looked
15:21:53     into on a number of levels, but that's not for this
15:21:58     conversation. I'm sure it'll be taken up at
15:22:01     another point in time, and this is the end of this subject for
15:22:05     me for a long time. Okay?
15:22:08     We have a huge game, a huge challenge for our football team,
15:22:12     and that's where that focus is going to go.
15:22:15     I've spent more than enough time on this, and I'm happy to share
15:22:19     this information with you to try to tell you some of the things
15:22:22     that I learned over the last week, which I've learn the way
15:22:26     more than I ever thought I would learn.
15:22:31     The process, the whole thing is much more complex and -- I mean,
15:22:44     there's a lot of variables I was unaware of.
15:22:47     It sounds simple. I'm not trying to say we're
15:22:48     trying to lands on the moon, but there's a lot of things here
15:22:51     that are a little hard to get a handle on, and, again, there's a
15:22:55     variance in so many of these things.
15:22:59     All right. So, take a couple questions, and
15:23:01     then I'm moving on. >> Did the NFL share be you the
15:23:07     pregame documented -- >> You have to talk to the NFL
15:23:11     about anything they did or didn't do.
15:23:14     >> You don't know if they documented it?
15:23:16     >> Look, Tom, we could sit here and talk about some of this
15:23:20     stuff for two hours, all right, you want to ask the league any
15:23:25     questions about what they do or don't do, ask the league.
15:23:28     I'm telling you what I learned, and the study that we've done,
15:23:31     and the experience that I've had over the last few days in
15:23:34     looking into this matter. That's all I can tell Ya.
15:23:38     I'm not a scientist. I'm not a league official.
15:23:52     >> I told you what I think. That's what I think right there.
15:23:55     >> Do you think the super bowl has been compromised at all?
15:23:58     There's a lot of game planning --
15:24:00     >> I spent a lot of the weekend game planning, yeah.
15:24:12     We addressed it. >> Well, I think, look, you can
15:24:31     take the atmospheric conditions out of it because if the balls
15:24:35     are measured in the same atmospheric conditions, then
15:24:40     it's a nonfactor. Measure a ball in the controlled
15:24:42     condition like this and measure a ball, and let's say the night
15:24:46     we played Baltimore, there's no way they are the same.
15:24:51     You take that ball and set it outside and the ball becomes
15:24:55     acustomed to the climatic conditions and temperatures,
15:24:57     there's no way it's the same. Take it out, bring it in, let it
15:25:02     sit for kx amount of time, it probably is the same.
15:25:05     No, that's not the issue. Although, depending where balls
15:25:08     were measured and how they were measured, that's another
15:25:12     discussion. No, the situation is the
15:25:15     preparation of the ball caused the ball to be artificially high
15:25:21     in psi when it was set to the regulation -- regulated level,
15:25:26     and then it reached its E quill librium later on, two hours into
15:25:33     the game, whatever it was, that that level was below what was
15:25:37     set in this climatic condition. I think that's exactly what
15:25:42     happened. I think anybody who wants to do
15:25:44     those experiments should go ahead and do them themselves.
15:25:47     Don't take my word for it. I'm telling you, like, we have
15:25:52     not -- we're trying to get to the answer to this, and that's
15:26:00    what we have. >> I'm just -- guys giving
15:26:14     signals out in front of 80,000 people, okay?
15:26:16     We filmed him taking signals out in front of 80,000 people like
15:26:21     there were a lot of other teams doing at the time too.
15:26:23     Forget about that. If we were wrong, then we've
15:26:25     been disciplined for that. >> Clearly not trying to do
15:26:28     everything you can to stay on the sidelines.
15:26:30     >> Guy's in front of 80,000 people.
15:26:35     80,000 people saw it. Everybody on the sideline saw
15:26:37     it. Everyone sees our guy in front
15:26:40     of 80,000 people. There he is.
15:26:41     So it was wrong. We were disciplined for it.
15:26:44     That's it. We never did it again.
15:26:46     We're never going to do it again, and anything else close,
15:26:49     we're not going to do either. >> I'm talking about what you
15:26:52     said, the -- >> We always do.
15:26:54     We always have. I mean, anything that's remotely
15:26:58     close, we're on the side of caution.
15:27:01     >> Coach, it was talked about today, did you have science
15:27:04     people help you with the investigation?
15:27:06     >> We talked to a lot of people. >> How much time it you spend on
15:27:17     it. >> I don't know.
15:27:18     I didn't log it. >> Can you clarify what you
15:27:20     found with your investigation -- >> I didn't look.
15:27:22     I came in here Thursday, and I told you that I did not have any
15:27:26     answers. I just -- I'm very confident in
15:27:30     the things we've talked about, the study that we did, the going
15:27:34     through with a fine tooth comb for everything.
15:27:37     I'm 100% confident on everything that I told you.
15:27:40     That's what I believe. That's what I know.
15:27:41     That's what it is. I'm as transparent as I can be
15:27:44     on this one, period. >> Is that a yes, that you feel
15:27:48     relieved by what -- >> Look, I did what I did.
15:27:52     No, I'm not using those adjectives.
15:27:55     I told you what I did. That's what it is.
15:27:58     >> Is there one thing you did to cause it to rise 1.5, the heat
15:28:04     -- >> It was never put in front of
15:28:06     a heater, I just said that, Tom. >> Whatever you do to prepare
15:28:10     the ball -- >> You rub it, you get the
15:28:13     texture the way the quarterbackments it.
15:28:14     >> Trying to establish it -- >> I just said that, Tom, and I
15:28:20     said in no time was the ball ever put in a heated
15:28:23     environment. >> Okay.
15:28:24     You rub it vigorously? >> We rub it to get the ball to
15:28:28     the proper texture. Yes.
15:28:31     I mean, I don't know. What's vigorous?
15:28:35     What's not vigorous? We're not polishing fine China
15:28:38     here. It's the proper texture that the
15:28:42     quarterback wants to grip it. Does that stimulate the ball to
15:28:49     rise to some sort of psi? I say, yes, it does.
15:28:53     >> I'm curious, what do you do to go forward?
15:28:58     Air on the side of caution? >> Well, that's another --
15:29:00     you're getting into another whole area here.
15:29:03     You're getting into another whole area relating to the next
15:29:07     game. Yep?
15:29:07     game. Yep?
15:29:11     why, exactly why this whole process was done for that very
15:29:18     reason. And I don't know the answer to
15:29:19     that question, but that's a very important question.
15:29:23     Yes? Okay.
15:29:24     All right, thank you. >>>

 

[CR67dream]

That's why he owned up to Spygate immediately. No one is saying Belichick isn't capable of tampering with footballs, just that if he had done so we really don't believe he would've been so adamant about following the rules.

Yes, and as I suspected, no further discussion in the matter is going to lead to any meeting of the minds, so I'm not going to waste any more time debating it.

 

[Comfortably Lomb]

 
Ballghazi is about ethics in sports journalism.

 
That's the truth and the real story here.

 

[bankshot1]

To simplify this, asking Walt Anderson, "Did you inflate the Pat balls to 12.5 in your pre-game inspection, as per their request?, would seem to be an important question.
 
1) a no answer would lead to why, or did you gauge the ball?
 
2) a yes answer, would then put in on the NFL to figure out if the balls were tampered with, or it was a natural deflation

 

[SumnerH]

 
I still don't believe BB was inferring that the football prep was done immediately before handing the balls over to the refs

 
He wasn't inferring anything.
 
He states that "the preparation process continues right up until the balls are given to the officials prior to the game."

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

This just gives me an excuse to post this:
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHqBPw5HYDU

 

[rodderick]

 
That's the truth and the real story here.

Well, some recent movements have started for less, that's for sure.

 

[Al Zarilla]

 
Buying some Uggs?

Ha. Right now I'd rather buy something Belichick pushes. Maybe a new line of pressure gauges will be out?

 

[simplyeric]

I'm 20 pages behind TWENTY? Holy shit.

(And yeah I already watched the presser)

 

[Hoya81]

 
i so badly need this on a shirt

http://store.barstoolsports.com/products/the-bad-guys-black-tee

 

[NWsoxophile]

I hope someone is conducting another little investigation to find out exactly how this totally stupid issue of deflated balls got reported to the league. I think this was both calculated and frivolous, did additional damage to the reputation of the franchise, and created a firestorm large enough to cause BB to divert significant attention to it during a critical period of preparation for the biggest game of the year. I'd really be interested to know the origins of this scandal.

 

[Sea Bass]

They just tried to interview Ben Volin on ESPN News but the stewardess started yelling at him so he had to hang up.   HA HA HA HA!

 

[Bob420]

I wouldn't be shocked to see the NFL ask them to demonstrate and reproduce the prep work that goes in all the way up until the balls are submitted and see how they get the temporary increase of 1lb.

That seems like the only thing the NFL can get them on. If it is something like scrubbing the balls to heat them, maybe something like not in the spirit of the game.

 

[Kull]

 
I am not implying that.   I agree he stated as much; it's pure fanboyism that people are suggesting otherwise here.

 
I'm still not sure what YOU are suggesting. Here's your statement:
 

Just to say it....
 
I wouldn't in the slightest rule out that Pats actually do play around with the ball PSI...and also that they are aware it's impossible to prove because of the physics involved.
 
Again, this is all about proof.

 
Since you aren't talking about illegal PSI manipulation (i.e. after presentation to the refs), all that's left is manipulation prior to. And we've heard multiple comments from Bill and Tom that the organization prefers balls at 12.5. So i's hardly a surprise that they "manipulate" a standard Wilson ball in order to get it to that PSI. Is that what you are talking about?
 
On the other hand if you are suggesting there's some sort of alternate manipulation going on, something intended to achieve some value other than 12.5, please come out and tell us exactly what that might be.

 

[Corsi]

Barstool selling these already
 

 

[jacklamabe65]

I'm waiting for the transcript, but let me repeat this. 
 
I still don't believe BB was inferring that the football prep was done immediately before handing the balls over to the refs, 2 hr 15 m before game time (which is highly unlikely). I think he was trying to say that during football prep, the pressure increased by ~1 psi, so when the final inflation pressure was set by the handlers - what they thought was 12.5 was really 11.5. In other words, there was no purposeful deception being done.
 
Then, after sitting around, the balls go to the refs at 11.5. It's up to the refs to re-inflate them to 13 psi +/- 0.5. Then once the ball acclimates to 50 degrees, the pressure drops again by something more around 1 psi.
 
When the footballs were re-measured, it was (theoretically) not done in time for them to re-acclimate to 70 degrees, so footballs that could have gone out to the field at 11.5 and fallen to 10.5 may only h ave had enough time to warm up to (say) 55 degrees and re-inflate to (say) 11. Spare footballs sitting in the locker room through halftime would have been at a higher pressure...or maybe they were at 11.5 and the refs re-inflated them.
 
It doesn't make sense that the spare footballs would have been at 12.5 (theoretically the same as the 1st half balls) if the pressure drop from climate was only 1 psi. 
 
On the other hand,  if the pressure drop from conditions was closer to 2 psi - all bets are off and the explanation is extremely simple.
 
If the pressure drop was closer to 2 psi, the Colts footballs must either entered the game at 14.5 or their re-measurement was done under different conditions.

 
Wonderful troll. Carry on.

 

[ifmanis5]

Here's what I hate about all the media reports I just saw: All the reporters exclaim 'It was like a science class in there! but then they don't actually report any of the science that was described. Probably they don't understand it and/or are told to not over explain things since it would take too long and the viewers would tune out anyway. So what we're left with is context-less summaries that never adequately tell the story. Not just in this item but the same is true for just about all news reports. The only deep dives you see are on the PBS NewsHour which nobody watches.
 
Michael Holley on with CNN now. Maybe we'll see an improvement here?
 
EDIT: CNN also talking to BC physics professor.

 

[djbayko]

If ball prep other than raising the temp increased the PSI, and you did that at some point well before the testing, wouldn't the new increased PSI be the PSI and not actually 1 PSI lower?

 
Belichick was inferring - being careful not to say anything directly - that the refs might not have increased the PSI.  This is the whole purpose of his "We asked for them to increase the pressure to 12.5 PSI.  What they did, I don't know." statements.
 
If they have hard evidence that the PSI was increased to 12.5 by the refs, then they always have the atmospheric conditions to fall back on.  As a package, the NFL has been handed an out if they want it.  They will have egg on their face at the end of the day no matter what they do, so they might as well put it to bed.
 
I also love Belichick inferring that something needs to be done about how the league handles [potentially baseless] claims.  I have my popcorn ready.

 

[Ed Hillel]

Barstool selling these already
 

 
Better hurry and order before they're pulled by WWE.

 

[rodderick]

I wouldn't be shocked to see the NFL ask them to demonstrate and reproduce the prep work that goes in all the way up until the balls are submitted and see how they get the temporary increase of 1lb.

That seems like the only thing the NFL can get them on. If it is something like scrubbing the balls to heat them, maybe something like not in the spirit of the game.

The are allowed to manipulate the ball as they please before the game, there's no way they could be penalized for rubbing the footballs too much, come on man.

 

[Doctor G]

How many of the Colt balls actually got used in the first half? The half time was what in this game a bit longer than 15 minutes, did they measure the Patriot balls first giving the Colt balls a chance to warm up more? Were the Colt balls filled to 13.5 psi? The Colt balls were supposed to be within guidelines but were they down from their initial measurement? Were they ever measured at all prior to the game? Peter King there are all kinds of possible explanations.

if the Colts are interested in permanently establishing themselves as losers of the worst kind they can do a rebuttal press conference. Seems like a can of worms they wouldn't be interested in opening.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

SoSH view count race:

• Most viewed SoSH thread: P&G's photo gallery: (22225 replies / 2263657 views)
• Most viewed Pats thread: Ballghazi thread: (7962 replies / 682980 views)
• Most viewed Sox thread: Theo's compensation (1440 replies / 669745 views)

Yes, this thread has now passed by the most viewed thread on the main board. Thanks BB!

 

[PseuFighter]

wow; tremendous fuck you press conference.

 

[Byrdbrain]

I hope someone is conducting another little investigation to find out exactly how this totally stupid issue of deflated balls got reported to the league. I think this was both calculated and frivolous, did additional damage to the reputation of the franchise, and created a firestorm large enough to cause BB to divert significant attention to it during a critical period of preparation for the biggest game of the year. I'd really be interested to know the origins of this scandal.

I don't have a serious issue with the initial complaint. If that is allowed to play it's course then there would never have been this shitstorm. The reason there is this shitstorm is the "unnamed source" who placed the late night call to Kravitz. That is what blew everything up and made this what it is.

 

[ifmanis5]

CNN: The NFL said they're only investigating the Pats balls so that means only the Pats probably cheated. I mean...

 

[shawnrbu]

Barstool selling these already
 

 
Is WWE receiving royalties?

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

For all the concern about the team's prep, isn't this week essentially a bye week? They've got another week to focus and prepare.

And I think that's exactly why Belichick did this today. So the moment the team gets on the plane to AZ, its 100% about Seattle.

 

[bankshot1]

IMO the big take away was that the Pats asked Anderson to inflate the ball to 12.5psi. What did he do?

 

[ifmanis5]

For all the concern about the team's prep, isn't this week essentially a bye week?

No. The game plan is usually installed this week. The Seahawks did the same. Once you get to Arizona it's usually just practicing the game plan. They are potentially behind in terms of prep.

 

[Reverend]

I know My Cousin Vinnie is the movie of the day, but I think I know what we're really watching:

1. Elite unit;
2. Accused of crimes they didn't commit;
3. Must engage in some weird tech/sciency stuff to;
4. Defeat their foes who are incompetent as they are mean spirited;
5. Have been through this before and will probably go through it again.

 

[soxfanSJCA]

I though BB was transcendent, and i am so so proud to be a Patriots fan.
 
He didn't do this presser for all the dumbfounded dipshits that were not going to change sides.
He did it for ME, the person with legitimate questions.
 
I have no doubt. i did not doubt BB or TB before, but now i really don't doubt anyone in the entire Patriots organization top to bottom.
Thank you so much Bill, unless they drag your ass out, please never look back until you are once again holding up another Lombardi

 

[Corsi]

holy shit Rodney Peete is massive

 

[ifmanis5]

Jim Daopoulos actually making sense right now. Rodney Peete also making good points.

 

[Helmet Head]

SoSH view count race:

• Most viewed SoSH thread: P&G's photo gallery: (22225 replies / 2263657 views)
• Most viewed Pats thread: Ballghazi thread: (7962 replies / 682980 views)
• Most viewed Sox thread: Theo's compensation (1440 replies / 669745 views)

Yes, this thread has now passed by the most viewed thread on the main board. Thanks BB!

In 5 and a half days. Unreal. It's one of the oddest/dumbest things I have ever followed, yet I can't look away. This thread certainly made my work week go by a lot quicker. It also caused me to be incredibly unproductive at the same time.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Jim Daopoulos actually making sense right now. Rodney Peete also making good points.

 
Is Daopoulos' point that we really don't know?  

 

[snowmanny]

 
Is Daopoulos' point that we really don't know?  

It's that you need the actual numbers to draw any conclusions regarding Colts vs Pats ball psi.
 
Edit: or have any theories 

 

[Steve Dillard]

Basic fundamental question?  Whose responsibility is it to make sure the ball is 12.5?  The team or the refs?  Everyone nationally seems to say it was Belichik's job, so that submitting a non-12.5 psi ball is trickery. 
Belichick's answer isn't "we do a lot of things that could change the psi up to 12.5 for inspection."  It's "we don't give a crap about psi, and leave that to the refs."
 
 
http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/5_2013_Ball.pdf
 

The Ball must be a “Wilson,” hand selected, bearing the signature of the Commissioner of the League, Roger Goodell.
The ball shall be made up of an inflated (12 1/2 to 13 1/2 pounds) urethane bladder enclosed in a pebble grained, leather case (natural tan color) without corrugations of any kind. It shall have the form of a prolate spheroid and the size and weight shall be: long axis, 11 to 11 1/4 inches; long circumference, 28 to 28 1/2 inches; short circumference, 21 to 21 1/4 inches; weight, 14 to 15 ounces.
The Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications. A pump is to be furnished by the home club, and the balls shall remain under the supervision of the Referee until they are delivered to the ball attendant just prior to the start of the game.
 

Seems Belichik is basically saying we focus on prep of surface, don't really even care about the psi.  Says its the refs job.
 
 

When the balls are delivered to the officials locker room, the
15:12:31     [refs] were asked to inflate them to 12.5 psi.
15:12:37     What exactly they did, I don't know, but for the purposes of
15:12:43     our study, that's what we did. We set them at 12.5.
15:12:49     That's at the discretion of the official, though, regardless of
15:12:53     what we ask for, it's the officials' discretion to put
15:12:57     them where he wants.
 
 

 

[geoduck no quahog]

 
Wonderful troll. Carry on.

 
WTF? Get your head out of your ass and reply to the post if you've got issues.

 

[snowmanny]

If psi is so important, shouldn't the refs set the inflation higher when the outside temperature is substantially lower than room temperature?

 

[djbayko]

Basic fundamental question?  Whose responsibility is it to make sure the ball is 12.5?  The team or the refs?  Everyone nationally seems to say it was Belichik's job, so that submitting a non-12.5 psi ball is trickery. 
Belichick's answer isn't "we do a lot of things that could change the psi up to 12.5 for inspection."  It's "we don't give a crap about psi, and leave that to the refs."
 
 
http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/5_2013_Ball.pdf
 

The Ball must be a “Wilson,” hand selected, bearing the signature of the Commissioner of the League, Roger Goodell.
The ball shall be made up of an inflated (12 1/2 to 13 1/2 pounds) urethane bladder enclosed in a pebble grained, leather case (natural tan color) without corrugations of any kind. It shall have the form of a prolate spheroid and the size and weight shall be: long axis, 11 to 11 1/4 inches; long circumference, 28 to 28 1/2 inches; short circumference, 21 to 21 1/4 inches; weight, 14 to 15 ounces.
The Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications. A pump is to be furnished by the home club, and the balls shall remain under the supervision of the Referee until they are delivered to the ball attendant just prior to the start of the game.
 

Seems Belichik is basically saying we focus on prep of surface, don't really even care about the psi.  Says its the refs job.
 
 


 
This implies that the ref inspection is the final step in Quality Control, and they are responsible for getting it right.