Celtics vs 76ers, Round 2 Discussion

[RorschachsMask]

Celtics crunch time usage these playoffs.

Smart: 31.4%
Tatum: 20%
Brogdon: 19.4%
Jaylen: 8.6%
White: 4.8%

Tatum and especially Jaylen do not have the ball enough in crunch time IMO. Tatum is one of the best advantage creators in basketball, and Jaylen is a really good tough shot guy. The coaches need to get Jaylen more involved, but he’s also being passive and struggling to get open.

Celtics crunch time numbers.

Smart: 21 points, 7-11 (2-6) and 5-5 from the line, 4 turnovers.
Tatum: 17 points, 5-9 (2-5) and 5-7 from the line, 0 turnovers.
Al: 10 points, 4-8 (2-6).
Rob: 8 points, 4-5.
Jaylen: 3 points, 1-4 (1-3), 1 turnover.
Brogdon: 3 points 1-5 (1-3), 1 turnover.

 

[Cellar-Door]

To me, the upside of keeping Melton off the court is outweighed by the downside that this cast of characters will have an issue executing in the final seconds. In February v. the Sixers, Joe bucked his own philosophy and called a TO, they set up a play, executed, and won the game. Yes, a timeout isn't some magic automatic win button, but why not go with what's worked in the past? Give your players the best chance to succeed.

on the flip side, between the Hawks series and game 1, they had at least 4 turnovers on ATOs where Marcus or Jaylen looked at a set defense and threw it away.

There are ups and downs, there is a case for timeout (I think the best one is less setting up a good play than letting the team know he wants to play for the O-rebound chance), but at it's core the big problem with this team in late game and ATO situations is poor execution by the top 3 guys.

 

[Strike4]

I also think a coach could prevail on his team to not abandon its defensive intensity for one whole game and then 3 quarters of another game, out of 4 games total.

I think this is really the issue. The complexion of game 4 is certainly different if the Celtics hadn't let game one slip through their fingers like that. They might have already figured it out but at a certain point they don't want to be like "oh wait...that did cost us and now the season is over".

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Celtics crunch time usage these playoffs.

Smart: 31.4%
Tatum: 20%
Brogdon: 19.4%
Jaylen: 8.6%
White: 4.8%

Tatum and especially Jaylen do not have the ball enough in crunch time IMO. Tatum is one of the best advantage creators in basketball, and Jaylen is a really good tough shot guy. The coaches need to get Jaylen more involved, but he’s also being passive and struggling to get open.

Celtics crunch time numbers.

Smart: 21 points, 7-11 (2-6) and 5-5 from the line, 4 turnovers.
Tatum: 17 points, 5-9 (2-5) and 5-7 from the line, 0 turnovers.
Al: 10 points, 4-8 (2-6).
Rob: 8 points, 4-5.
Jaylen: 3 points, 1-4 (1-3), 1 turnover.
Brogdon: 3 points 1-5 (1-3), 1 turnover.

Not surprised by the numbers, as it matches 'eye test' which is that Smart, though he has been pretty solid, simply has the ball too much late. They need JB (in particular) to get more looks. Tatum's numbers reflect in part that teams load up on him---and I know Smart's reflect a bit that he gets left open. But we need JT/JB to be the primary decision makers late, with Smart only after that at most.

Smart is fearless, and that is sometimes useful. Late in games, it leads to him trying to do more than he should sometimes.

If you can do offense/defense swaps, I'd sit Smart at end and let White and Brogdon---both better shooters and more reliable late-game offensive decision makers---be the smalls.

 

[Deathofthebambino]

Celtics crunch time usage these playoffs.

Smart: 31.4%
Tatum: 20%
Brogdon: 19.4%
Jaylen: 8.6%
White: 4.8%

Tatum and especially Jaylen do not have the ball enough in crunch time IMO. Tatum is one of the best advantage creators in basketball, and Jaylen is a really good tough shot guy. The coaches need to get Jaylen more involved, but he’s also being passive and struggling to get open.

Celtics crunch time numbers.

Smart: 21 points, 7-11 (2-6) and 5-5 from the line, 4 turnovers.
Tatum: 17 points, 5-9 (2-5) and 5-7 from the line, 0 turnovers.
Al: 10 points, 4-8 (2-6).
Rob: 8 points, 4-5.
Jaylen: 3 points, 1-4 (1-3), 1 turnover.
Brogdon: 3 points 1-5 (1-3), 1 turnover.

I would push back on the passive/struggling to get open stuff with Jaylen.

It's design. He's being sent to the corner late in games (and frankly, just about every minute after the 1st quarter, when he inevitably comes out after scoring double digits) and forced to watch Tatum/Smart play a 2 man PnR game. The offense slows down. Jaylen is at his best in the open floor, catching on the move, etc., and there apparently is just no way for this C's team to do that in close games or once they have a lead. No sir, must walk that dog when up by 2 with 3 minutes to go, let that clock run, and then get into a slow developing set that ends with a Marcus or Tatum 3.

In the 4 games in this series, these are Jaylen's 1st quarter numbers:

6/7 for 14 points
5/6 for 13 points
0/3 for 2 points
5/7 for 12 points.

For the remaining 36 minutes of game time, these are his numbers:

2/3 for 9 points
4/11 for 12 points
8/15 for 21 points
5/9 for 11 points.


This is not a new issue, it's happened a LOT during the season. When Jaylen gets hot early, and then comes out for a rest, Tatum takes it upon his shoulders, and the game flow never goes back to what got Jaylen going in the first place.

If James Harden goes 6/7 or 5/6 in the 1st quarter, he is NOT finishing a game with less than 20 shots attempted. It will never happen. Doc will make sure that ball gets in his hands. This team seems to do the opposite, when someone other than Tatum gets hot, they go away from it for far too long.

And the pace, the pace, the fucking pace. When they start running, and pushing the ball, this Sixers team starts making mistakes and gets tired. We saw it last night to start the 4th. Then we get a tiny, itty bitty lead, and it's time to walk the dog, let them catch their breath and get set up and then we fall apart. Lather, rinse, repeat.

 

[MyDaughterLovesTomGordon]

On the timeout issue. I thought during the regular season the criticism of Joe was that he was unwilling to call timeouts to quell runs. I don't recall an unwillingness to call timeouts to set up end of game situations. Am I off on this?

You are. There were multiple occasions where the gamethread melted because Joe didn't call a TO in a last-second situation.

 

[MyDaughterLovesTomGordon]

I also get infuriated by the slowdowns at the ends of games where the Cs have a lead, but I don't have a good feel for how much of an outlier it is. I watch a fair amount of NBA, but Cs are probably 80 percent of games, so I can't tell if my perception that the Cs change is more drastic than most matches reality.

Is there anywhere that has stats like possessions per minute or percentage of shot clock used by quarter or something?

Intuitively, it seems like milking clock could work, as you limit the number of possessions the other team gets as they try to come back, but the math starts to get fuzzy in a hurry if it negatively affects your per-possession scoring. If shooting in the first 10 seconds of the clock, say, leads to 1.3 points per possession (or whatever), and shooting with less than 5 seconds on the shot clock leads to .9 points per possession, that 10 seconds costs you .4 points and only eliminates 40 percent of a possession...

Anyone done the math in serious fashion somewhere? I can't find anything with cursory googling.

 

[tims4wins]

You are. There were multiple occasions where the gamethread melted because Joe didn't call a TO in a last-second situation.

Thanks.

 

[Bleedred]

I'd love to know what was said in the TO before the Harden 3...I am not a basketball expert by any means but shouldn't it have just been "hey if Embiid takes a decently contested 2 we can live with that. But never in any circumstances leave the hottest shooter in the game in an effort to double team him." My guess is something along those lines WAS said, and JB still effed up.

This covers my issue too. As a JB critic, I love that he has grown every year and has played excellent basketball so far this season and this playoffs (sometimes brilliant). I've learned to live with some of the TOs he throws away as the cost of doing business with Jaylen Brown. What is just infuriating is the massive mental mistake that was that last Philly possession. JB is a notoriously poor off the ball defender and prone to losing concentration, but on that last play, I have to believe the coaching staff reiterated "do not leave the shooters." I didn't see any post-game comments, but was anything offered by JB or CJM about that fuck up or was it the same blather about just needing to be better, blah, blah, blah. Because making a mistake like that is just brutal, and there's nothing I can think of that could be offered to defend it other than, "sorry, I really fucked up." And if that's the answer, then "do better" is all you can say.

Edit: My other Celtic criticism is what everyone else is saying about playing with pace. We are the younger, more athletic, more fit, deeper, more talented team. The 2 best players on our opponent have a ton of miles on them, are older, and one of them has a bum knee. Why we are not constantly pushing the pace over and over and over is beyond me. I've seen CJM suggest it at times, but if it's not resonating, why not? This may sound like an absurdity, but I would consider playing Pritchard for 3-5 minutes a game and tell him to go as fast as he can. I trust him with the ball, his shot, his court vision, etc. If he gets hunted on defense that he's a blatant liability, take him out.

 

[tims4wins]

This covers my issue too. As a JB critic, I love that he has grown every year and has played excellent basketball so far this season and this playoffs (sometimes brilliant). I've learned to live with some of the TOs he throws away as the cost of doing business with Jaylen Brown. What is just infuriating is the massive mental mistake that was that last Philly possession. JB is a notoriously poor off the ball defender and prone to losing concentration, but on that last play, I have to believe the coaching staff reiterated "do not leave the shooters." I didn't see any post-game comments, but was anything offered by JB or CJM about that fuck up or was it the same blather about just needing to be better, blah, blah, blah. Because making a mistake like that is just brutal, and there's nothing I can think of that could be offered to defend it other than, "sorry, I really fucked up." And if that's the answer, then "do better" is all you can say.

JB basically said he screwed up. Trying to find the quote.

This may be bias against JB but I don’t get true and full accountability from the quote. “Bad read” is like when Brady think’s it’s man but it’s zone and he throws the pick first drive of SB53. There’s no read on this play. You stick to Harden like glue.

View: https://twitter.com/ByJayKing/status/1655347864720093184

 

[Bleedred]

JB basically said he screwed up. Trying to find the quote.

OK. But fuck, at that moment, in that situation, he just can't screw up. It's really not that hard to stay on the perimeter and cede the one on one matchup with embid.

 

[tims4wins]

OK. But fuck, at that moment, in that situation, he just can't screw up. It's really not that hard to stay on the perimeter and cede the one on one matchup with embid.

Agreed. See my edit.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

I also get infuriated by the slowdowns at the ends of games where the Cs have a lead, but I don't have a good feel for how much of an outlier it is. I watch a fair amount of NBA, but Cs are probably 80 percent of games, so I can't tell if my perception that the Cs change is more drastic than most matches reality.

Is there anywhere that has stats like possessions per minute or percentage of shot clock used by quarter or something?

Intuitively, it seems like milking clock could work, as you limit the number of possessions the other team gets as they try to come back, but the math starts to get fuzzy in a hurry if it negatively affects your per-possession scoring. If shooting in the first 10 seconds of the clock, say, leads to 1.3 points per possession (or whatever), and shooting with less than 5 seconds on the shot clock leads to .9 points per possession, that 10 seconds costs you .4 points and only eliminates 40 percent of a possession...

Anyone done the math in serious fashion somewhere? I can't find anything with cursory googling.

Can't speak to the math part but late game slow down is nothing unusual, although it certainly varies by team. I know HRB was making a killing on Lakers unders at one point because of how much they squeeze games to death in the 2nd half, and much earlier than 2-3 minutes left. But LeBron is LeBron—he's out there making great decisions and awesome passes after drawing the whole defense, or getting a foul, or getting a clean look for himself.

I think the process is like 75%-80% right but the other 20%-25% is losing them games, because too many times the result is a turnover, a late shot by the worst shooter on the floor, or something very contested.

I'm all for milking clock with a lead but when it is a two possession game and there is more than a minute left, you need to keep scoring first and worry about the clock second. It's easy to say "well if they'd just grabbed this rebound or defended that play better it wouldn't matter" but continuing to score is also a really good way to make those other mistakes matter less. The plan needs to be better than:

1. Milk clock
2. ????
3. Profit

 

[Auger34]

Celtics crunch time usage these playoffs.

Smart: 31.4%
Tatum: 20%
Brogdon: 19.4%
Jaylen: 8.6%
White: 4.8%

Tatum and especially Jaylen do not have the ball enough in crunch time IMO. Tatum is one of the best advantage creators in basketball, and Jaylen is a really good tough shot guy. The coaches need to get Jaylen more involved, but he’s also being passive and struggling to get open.

Celtics crunch time numbers.

Smart: 21 points, 7-11 (2-6) and 5-5 from the line, 4 turnovers.
Tatum: 17 points, 5-9 (2-5) and 5-7 from the line, 0 turnovers.
Al: 10 points, 4-8 (2-6).
Rob: 8 points, 4-5.
Jaylen: 3 points, 1-4 (1-3), 1 turnover.
Brogdon: 3 points 1-5 (1-3), 1 turnover.

@Deathofthebambino already said this but I completely disagree with passive/struggling to get open. That’s 100% play design/what Tatum is telling him to do (during the final play disaster, one of the things Tatum was doing was gesturing to Brown to make sure he stayed in the corner).

For whatever reason, whether it’s Tatum or CJM, the Celtics LOVE the 2 man PnR game with Smart and Tatum. That’s also why it’s kind of unfair to shit on Marcus for talking shots or having the ball, he’s consistently being brought into the main action

 

[RorschachsMask]

View: https://twitter.com/lissmx14/status/1655603846574481412?s=20

 

[RorschachsMask]

Celtics seconds and dribbles per touch numbers so far in this playoffs.

Brogdon: 4:32/4.29
Jaylen: 4.02/3.44
Smart: 3.92/3.19
White: 3.90/3.19
Tatum: 3.83/2.71

Brogdon definitely has a good amount of tunnel vision, missed at least 5 or 6 wide open guys yesterday.

 

[Helmet Head]

All these game winning 3s being drained by opposing teams and virtually never missing is just payback for Jimmy Butler missing the 3 at the end of game 7 last year, isn’t it? When is this debt to the basketball powers considered paid? The sting of game winning shots hit in the last 3 Celtic loses by the other team have been amazing and amazingly frustrating at the same time. Even the shot to tie at end of regulation by harden yesterday was a challenging one.

I still have confidence as the way the 6ers have won seems far less sustainable than the Celtics path to victory. That said, it would be nice win one of these type of games once in these playoffs.
.

 

[tims4wins]

All these game winning 3s being drained by opposing teams and virtually never missing is just payback for Jimmy Butler missing the 3 at the end of game 7 last year, isn’t it? When is this debt to the basketball powers considered paid? The sting of game winning shots hit in the last 3 Celtic loses by the other team have been amazing and amazingly frustrating at the same time. Even the shot to tie at end of regulation by harden yesterday was a challenging one.

I still have confidence as the way the 6ers have won seems far less sustainable than the Celtics path to victory. That said, it would be nice win one of these type of games once in these playoffs.
.

Was the last C's game winner in the playoffs game 1 vs. Brooklyn last year?

 

[astrozombie]

Dispiriting loss, especially after the nice comeback. Still optimistic, but I said the same thing with the Bruins.

 

[jablo1312]

guess w/ Brogdon its a trade-off between having maybe the most competent ball-handler (not creator, just dribbler) having the ball more and hopefully reducing your turnover % but also lowering the ceiling on the half-court offense as he's just an average passer. Although he's not exactly an asset on defense right now either. Also I know Brogdon had about the same TO% as JT & JB in the regular season but we've seen fatigue + locked in defenses force those 2 into heaps of turnovers in the past 2 postseasons. I'd say just put the ball in White's hands more but he's so much smaller then the other 4 primary ball-handlers.

 

[Helmet Head]

Was the last C's game winner in the playoffs game 1 vs. Brooklyn last year?

Pretty much. All their wins against Milwaukee were blowouts. Miami the same except for game 7, which they nearly blew after having a sizable lead if Butler drained the wide open 3. The 2 wins in the finals were blowouts. They lost a lot of close games in those series as well. This issue as been an ongoing one for this core. I know Tatum has the best close and late numbers per se but the games over the last 2 postseasons don’t bear that out in the final results. All it takes is 1 game to change a narrative.

 

[jezza1918]

Pretty much. All their wins against Milwaukee were blowouts. Miami the same except for game 7, which they nearly blew after having a sizable lead if Butler drained the wide open 3. The 2 wins in the finals were blowouts. They lost a lot of close games in those series as well. This issue as been an ongoing one for this core. I know Tatum has the best close and late numbers per se but the games over the last 2 postseasons don’t bear that out in the final results. All it takes is 1 game to change a narrative.

Should add on that other players also have an effect on the narrative as well. Because if JB doesn't leave Harden the narrative very much could've been "Down 1 with less than a minute left, Tatum nails down crucial win with a dagger 3 to put sixers on the brink..." On top of hitting some huge shots in game 3 to ice it down the stretch.
That said, I'd prefer blowout wins for my health, changing narrative be damned.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Should add on that other players also have an effect on the narrative as well. Because if JB doesn't leave Harden the narrative very much could've been "Down 1 with less than a minute left, Tatum nails down crucial win with a dagger 3 to put sixers on the brink..." On top of hitting some huge shots in game 3 to ice it down the stretch.
That said, I'd prefer blowout wins for my health, changing narrative be damned.

I keep telling Mazzulla he needs to use the “win by 20 gameplan”! This team, including Tatum, has a lot of fight in it. Their lack of focus is maddening but they fought back hard during a game that looked like its 4th quarter might not be that meaningful.

Just is a shame that Brogdon’s 3 with 2 mins to go wasn’t the kill shot. Hopefully, just like last series, they survive these end of game situations and move on. You know the rest of the league is hoping they don’t.

 

[tims4wins]

Um

View: https://twitter.com/bigdeucev2/status/1650328428149714944?s=46

 

[RorschachsMask]

 

[MyDaughterLovesTomGordon]

Man, watching the Harden shot again, Embiid travels brutally before he passes off. Like, both pivot feet move twice.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Literally halfway down. It’s as if Game 4 were cooked up in a lab to create a mecha-nut punch loss. All of the key nut punch ingredients were there.

 

[RSN Diaspora]

Accidentally gave my (Sixers fan) practice group lead the middle finger on our standing Monday Zoom when he brought up the game. Thankfully he found it hilarious, but I probably wouldn't do that again...

 

[tims4wins]

The turnovers are insane. Points / possession also very different

View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1655631421904412675

 

[Auger34]

Should add on that other players also have an effect on the narrative as well. Because if JB doesn't leave Harden the narrative very much could've been "Down 1 with less than a minute left, Tatum nails down crucial win with a dagger 3 to put sixers on the brink..." On top of hitting some huge shots in game 3 to ice it down the stretch.
That said, I'd prefer blowout wins for my health, changing narrative be damned.

The only narrative that matters is the Celtics lost the game. Every player contributed to that, yes even Jayson Tatum (the guy who peed down his leg the entire first half and had the whole final possession). Good on him for turning it around at the end but he wears the loss too

 

[jmcc5400]

Pretty much. All their wins against Milwaukee were blowouts. Miami the same except for game 7, which they nearly blew after having a sizable lead if Butler drained the wide open 3. The 2 wins in the finals were blowouts. They lost a lot of close games in those series as well. This issue as been an ongoing one for this core. I know Tatum has the best close and late numbers per se but the games over the last 2 postseasons don’t bear that out in the final results. All it takes is 1 game to change a narrative.

Game 4 against Milwaukee, on the road and down 2-1 with the season on the line, they were down 7 and outscored the Bucks by 15 in the 4th quarter. It was tied with 6 minutes left and tight into crunch time. It was an 8 point "blowout" because they executed down the stretch. In Game 6 in Milwaukee, down 3-2 with the season on the line, it was a five point game midway through the 4th before they pulled away to win by 12 - again, because they executed down the stretch. This team has it in them. We remember the failures. Acutely. But they *will* bounce back tomorrow night.

 

[jezza1918]

The only narrative that matters is the Celtics lost the game. Every player contributed to that, yes even Jayson Tatum (the guy who peed down his leg the entire first half and had the whole final possession). Good on him for turning it around at the end but he wears the loss too

oh I very much agree. My main point is that I find a lot of the narrative discussion kind of hilarious...it's so much 20/20 hindsight results based.

 

[Helmet Head]

Game 4 against Milwaukee, on the road and down 2-1 with the season on the line, they were down 7 and outscored the Bucks by 15 in the 4th quarter. It was tied with 6 minutes left and tight into crunch time. It was an 8 point "blowout" because they executed down the stretch. In Game 6 in Milwaukee, down 3-2 with the season on the line, it was a five point game midway through the 4th before they pulled away to win by 12 - again, because they executed down the stretch. This team has it in them. We remember the failures. Acutely. But they *will* bounce back tomorrow night.

Agreed, those are not blowouts and they showed a lot of resiliency in those games. I am more talking about the games tied last postseason type of game I guess. They have been on the wrong side of those more often than not. They have had kind of a bad stretch of it since the Tatum buzzer beater in Philly really. I still remain very confident in this team and if they hit one of these shots instead of being on the other side of it, watch out.

 

[chilidawg]

Literally halfway down. It’s as if Game 4 were cooked up in a lab to create a mecha-nut punch loss. All of the key nut punch ingredients were there.

Forgot about that one, I was sure it was going down. Really was an amazing game, that 4th Q. defense from Horford and Tatum was just devastating. So many clutch shots, from Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, White, Brogdon ... And then, the Tucker rebound, a couple 3's from Harden and it slipped away.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Forgot about that one, I was sure it was going down. Really was an amazing game, that 4th Q. defense from Horford and Tatum was just devastating. So many clutch shots, from Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, White, Brogdon ... And then, the Tucker rebound, a couple 3's from Harden and it slipped away.

Yup. One of those “one more stop in multiple situations and you win” type games, the absolute worst to deal with as a fan. The defense reminded me of Big 3 suffocation until one final brain fart by Jaylen. Too bad.

 

[Cellar-Door]

underrated in all the 'timeout' debates... we win this game if we make our damn freethrows.

Both teams got 22 FTs, PHI shot 86%, Celtics shot 73%... make your FTs and we win in regulation

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

underrated in all the 'timeout' debates... we win this game if we make our damn freethrows.

Both teams got 22 FTs, PHI shot 86%, Celtics shot 73%... make your FTs and we win in regulation

Preach brother!

 

[RorschachsMask]

View: https://twitter.com/JaredWeissNBA/status/1655687926271844354?s=20

 

[NomarsFool]

The Celtics' piss-poor play through 3 quarters meant they deserved to lose, but their incredible effort in the 4th meant they had a chance to steal one from the Sixers, and I'm still pissed off about it.

I will say that if you have a team that seems to struggle with BBIQ and situational awareness, that is all the more reason to call a timeout and go over the situation with them, not the time to trust them to figure it out on their own.

 

[teddykgb]

The reason to call the timeout is to orient the players to the situation and ideally draw up a play that gets you a quick high quality shot. It was essentially a 2 for 1 opportunity and they blew the option and didn’t even get a shot off making it an 0 for 1 opportunity. The play was to make a shot and scramble defend for a few seconds or foul and try to make a 3. The execution was poor but it was bad basketball conceptually

 

[dhellers]

The reason to call the timeout is to orient the players to the situation and ideally draw up a play that gets you a quick high quality shot. It was essentially a 2 for 1 opportunity and they blew the option and didn’t even get a shot off making it an 0 for 1 opportunity. The play was to make a shot and scramble defend for a few seconds or foul and try to make a 3. The execution was poor but it was bad basketball conceptually

I wonder if JM overestimates the mental acuity off his players at the end of a long game. Calling a TO would help everyone catch their breaths/ reinvigorate their brains.
And while that is also true for the defense, it is generally easier to play D running on adrenaline.

 

[RorschachsMask]

Celtics by 200 tomorrow.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

View: https://twitter.com/JaredWeissNBA/status/1655687926271844354?s=20

League wants absolutely nothing to do with making this kind of play an offensive foul.

 

[Devizier]

League wants absolutely nothing to do with making this kind of play an offensive foul.

 

[timelysarcasm]

It's also a big part of Harden's game.

View: https://twitter.com/JoshConnolly69/status/1655352904591581188

 

[RorschachsMask]

The Celtics offense in crunch time has actually been really fucking good, a 133 offensive rating. Of the teams left in the playoffs, only the Knicks have a higher clutch offensive rating, and it’s in 1/3rd the minutes.

It’s their crunch time defense that’s been the problem, is the second worst of any of the teams who made the playoffs, just ahead of the Cavs. For this series, it’s been even worse than that.

The crunch time offense has delivered, and created a ton of great looks.

 

[128]

The Celtics offense in crunch time has actually been really fucking good, a 133 offensive rating. Of the teams left in the playoffs, only the Knicks have a higher clutch offensive rating, and it’s in 1/3rd the minutes.

It’s their crunch time defense that’s been the problem, is the second worst of any of the teams who made the playoffs, just ahead of the Cavs. For this series, it’s been even worse than that.

The crunch time offense has delivered, and created a ton of great looks.

Stops have been far and far between in these tight games.

 

[Deathofthebambino]

I mean, the C's only gave up 15 points in the 4th quarter the other night. Yeah, there was a dagger 3 in there by Harden, but still, it's 15 points in 12 minutes of play.

IMO, their offense only scoring 24 when they should have been running the Sixers off the court, as they bricked and/or turned over everything in that quarter was the bigger issue. 24-15 in the 4th quarter shouldn't happen between these teams. If the Sixers only score 15, the C's should be putting up 30 minimum in that quarter, because they should be out running like its the Derby after every miss and turnover.

But nope, slow it down baby, we got a 2 point lead with 3 minutes to go.

Of course, if they don't play like complete dog shit for the 1st 3 quarters, that's not a problem either.

 

[Red Averages]

I mean, the C's only gave up 15 points in the 4th quarter the other night. Yeah, there was a dagger 3 in there by Harden, but still, it's 15 points in 12 minutes of play.

IMO, their offense only scoring 24 when they should have been running the Sixers off the court, as they bricked and/or turned over everything in that quarter was the bigger issue. 24-15 in the 4th quarter shouldn't happen between these teams. If the Sixers only score 15, the C's should be putting up 30 minimum in that quarter, because they should be out running like its the Derby after every miss and turnover.

But nope, slow it down baby, we got a 2 point lead with 3 minutes to go.

You said the same thing in the Hawks series game 5 and I showed there wasn't much of an opportunity to run. So let's see in this game how they "slowed it down, we got a 2 point lead with 3 min to go"

You know what, I'll even go back further to the entirety of the 4th quarter:
- 11:42 Harden misses a shot, Brogdon rebound 3 seconds later, Harris fouls him 4 seconds after that.
- 10:25 (yes Philly didn't get another offensive possession until then) shot clock violation. So the defense is set either way.
- 10:03 Niang misses a 3, Tatum rebound at 9:59, he passes to White who dunks it 2 seconds later
- 9:40 Harris turns it over out of bounds. Defense is set.
- 9:03 Embiid misses 3 footer, Tatum rebound is fouled 3 seconds later shooting.
- 8:42 Maxey misses a 3, TimeLord rebounds at 8:39, Tatum misses a layup 13 seconds later (maybe this was slow, but they had a layup...)
- 7:57 Harden makes a shot. Defense is set. Smart gets a shooting foul 10 seconds later.
- 7:28 Embiid misses 10 footer, Tatum rebound, Brogdon turns it over 5 seconds later
- 7:15 Embiid hits a 2. Celtics timeout. Smart hits a 3 on the other side of this timeout.
- 6:28 Sixers shut clock violation #2 of the quarter. Defense gets set. Jaylen hits a 3 on the other side of this.
- 5:33 Tatum blocks Niang's 3, Horford rebound 5 seconds later, Tatum with a two pointer 3 seconds later.
- 5:04 Horford blocks Embiid, gets control 2 seconds later, Jaylen misses a 3 12 seconds later (I guess they could have pushed more here?)
- 4:16 Tatum blocks Maxey, gets control 3 seconds later, Brogdon misses a floating jumper 14 seconds later. Should have pushed here... but wait, they got an offensive rebound and Horford got a basket so it doesnt matter.
- 3:38 Smart fouls Harden. Defense is set. Tatum gets a shooting foul at the other end, makes 1 of 2.
- 2:59 (hey we made it to 3 minutes left!!!!) Horford blocks Embiid, rebound controlled 3 seconds later, Marcus hits a 3 four seconds after.
- 2:26 Harden makes a 3. Defense is set. Oh and Brogdon makes a 3.
- 1:50 Harden makes a 2. Defense is set. Marcus misses a 3 as time expires on the shot clock yuck.
- 1:07 Harris misses a 2... but PJ tucker gets the rebound and 1. Defense is set. Marcus gets fouled at the other end and makes two free throws.
- 0.31 Horford blocks Embiid, Maxey rebounds, Harden gets a 2 with 16 seconds left.
- Celtics hold for final shot as they should and Marcus misses.

So I guess my question -- where in all of these possessions did the Celtics not push against a non-set defense? Seems to me like they had great defense for 90% of the quarter before allowing the 76ers to score on their final 4 possessions (due to two offensive rebounds.

I don't know how you could blame a lack of pushing the ball on this loss. Do you have anything to back up those claims? OT was very much the same.

 

[reggiecleveland]

I think this is really the issue. The complexion of game 4 is certainly different if the Celtics hadn't let game one slip through their fingers like that. They might have already figured it out but at a certain point they don't want to be like "oh wait...that did cost us and now the season is over".

It is the issue, and it is the team's Achilles heel. This is the double-edged sword of basketball, making it so much fun and infuriating to coach. The best defenders and offensive players are the same guy may 3/5. So you 40% of the guys on the floor you are subbing to balance O or D. Also there is the focus of the individual players and your game plan time. Despite being insanely talented on O this group is prone to bad decisions and TOs, so staying calm is a must, but that often translates into sleepy D. Toi my eyes they need to crank up the intensity and run, more take quick shots, and there will be some bad ones, but if they keep getting stops they need to heat up for one quarter to blow it open.