BB open to relinquishing GM duties?

Was (Not Wasdin)

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I’m hoping Bill could buy in to the concept that the new GM is the bridge from him to the next HC when he eventually hangs it up.

That actually makes a lot of sense to me. Bring in a strong GM who can be making decisions in the best interest of the mid/long term future of the franchise. Especially when you have a current GM who’s going to be gone in a couple years at most even if he’s retained.
I really hope this is where they come out (my preferred option is for BB to stay as coach with a new, real, GM). I'd like to see an experienced GM in place when it does come time for BB to stop coaching.

One of the NFL podcasts had the Bears' beat writer on a couple of weeks ago. He pointed out that the Bears have a tendency to bring in a new HC/GM at the same time, and it really hasnt worked out for them over the last 10 years (especially when it is the "first time" for one or both of them in their role). I think the Pats would be well served if they can avoid that.
 

Arroyoyo

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He is signaling he is willing to come back maybe even in a reduced role and that Kraft will have to fire him if he wants someone else as coach.

I interpeted it as BB saying "I don't care where I coach but if its not in New England I will have to be fired not traded". I don't have the quote handy but he has stated in the past that trading a coach for draft pick compensation is dumb and he probably would just refuse to go to an organization if they did so.
So he’d rather stay where he’s not wanted, in a reduced role, possibly see his kids taken off the staff by a new GM, likely endure another 4-13 type season, and completely destroy his 2025 open market value, while his kids sit in the unemployment line waiting for his contract to expire at the end of next year?

And then we assume the new team, in 2025, will give him the same sweetheart family deal he gets with the Patriots?

I read this as “I actually want to stay with the Patriots because I have a sweet deal professionally and personally here.” But if the Patriots only want him as a HC and want a GM to revamp the team, he risks losing a lot of the “personal” part of the sweet deal.

Why wouldn’t he accept a trade, with his coaching staff (and kids), to a new team now? To risk being in his mid-70’s asking another team to hire him, his kids, probably Matt Patricia, and start a rebuild effectively two years from now?

Time is not on Bill Belichick’s side, here. This isn’t a 45-year-old stud coach.
 

Curt S Loew

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Guys, you're never gonna get through to Arroyoyo.

Any logical person sees that this situation is the exact opposite of an owner who wants to retain his coach, but the coach quits. That is when trades and compensation happen.

Arroyoyo can't seem to understand that. I can't believe I read all that back and forth. Just glad you all saved me from typing it.
 

bsj

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This feels like a very tough needle to thread. IMO its about Belichick leaving his options open and creating some leverage. I do think his preference is to stay, and I suspect he is willing to CONSIDER relinquishing some duties. But I also think it needs to be EXACTLY as he would agree to. He planted this seed to indicate a willingness to get there, but in the end, it doesn't mean he WILL.
 

Ralphwiggum

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He's not going to stay where he's not wanted, for crying out loud.

If he stays with the Patriots next year it is because the Krafts want him to stay (in whatever capacity, in his current role or in some mutually agreed to reduced role).

If the Krafts don't want him here they will have to fire him because he's under contract.

That's it.
 

mauf

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I think BB calling a 7:30 press conference is more significant than what he said.

He doesn’t do this if he has a handshake deal with Kraft — whether to stay, stay with reduced duties, or leave. He’s positioning himself for a coming negotiation/PR battle.
 

tims4wins

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I think BB calling a 7:30 press conference is more significant than what he said.

He doesn’t do this if he has a handshake deal with Kraft — whether to stay, stay with reduced duties, or leave. He’s positioning himself for a coming negotiation/PR battle.
It's SOP on Mondays after a game day.
 

cshea

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I think BB calling a 7:30 press conference is more significant than what he said.

He doesn’t do this if he has a handshake deal with Kraft — whether to stay, stay with reduced duties, or leave. He’s positioning himself for a coming negotiation/PR battle.
Not sure I'd read too much into the press conference schedule. This is how they always do it. He does media early then exit interviews and de-briefs during the day with players and staff as they cleanout.
 

mauf

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It's SOP on Mondays after a game day.
This early? Wow. Can’t believe he’s been doing this all these years and I didn’t know.

Still think BB is posturing in advance of a negotiation, but I’m not as convinced when I thought an early-morning press conference is out of the ordinary.
 

CR67dream

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So he’d rather stay where he’s not wanted, in a reduced role, possibly see his kids taken off the staff by a new GM, likely endure another 4-13 type season, and completely destroy his 2025 open market value, while his kids sit in the unemployment line waiting for his contract to expire at the end of next year?
What are you talking about? If he's not wanted, Kraft will just have to fire him. Kraft's not going to keep him around and sabotage next season out of spite. It's insane. I can't believe I'm even going through this again. You are so far out in left field here that I'm questioning if you believe what you're saying yourself. Maybe take a breath.
 

cornwalls@6

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By making clear that he's under contract, and that his contract gives him full control over football operations, he's saying that Kraft will have to fire him to change that. Unless he agrees to some changes, which it looks like he may just be willing to do. Or it may just be BB saying if you want me gone, you're going to have to fire me and own it. There will be no compensation. It's not complicated.
Also has the added bonus of possibly being a passive/aggressive fuck you to one or both of the Krafts, for the leaks to Curran earlier in the season, and for the all the Glazer stuff on the broadcast yesterday, which I imagine he was informed of after the game last night. I want him back, so I hope this is real. But I suspect the bolded might be closer to the mark.
 

Ralphwiggum

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This early? Wow. Can’t believe he’s been doing this all these years and I didn’t know.

Still think BB is posturing in advance of a negotiation, but I’m not as convinced when I thought an early-morning press conference is out of the ordinary.
I'm not sure what negotiation is going to happen. I guess maybe if BB truly values staying in New England above all else and is willing to cede some control in order to remain here, there might be some kind of negotiation between him and the Krafts about what that looks like. But unless that can be done fairly quickly and amicably it just seems like a recipe for disaster heading into a very important off season.

Short of that Bill holds all of the cards here. If the Krafts have decided to move on from him they are going to have to own it and fire the greatest coach of all time. To me that's the takeaway from this morning.
 

Justthetippett

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This feels like a very tough needle to thread. IMO its about Belichick leaving his options open and creating some leverage. I do think his preference is to stay, and I suspect he is willing to CONSIDER relinquishing some duties. But I also think it needs to be EXACTLY as he would agree to. He planted this seed to indicate a willingness to get there, but in the end, it doesn't mean he WILL.
After the quotes this morning what makes you think that? For months we've been hearing he wouldn't sacrifice any personnel responsibility/power, and he just flipped that position on its head. It will have to be a situation that makes sense to Bill, and I doubt he wants to take orders from someone with a completely different approach/philosophy, but I can now definitely see him giving up final say, accepting something that's not exactly how he would do it and refocusing on different parts of the job. If it's successful he still looks like a genius.
 

Cellar-Door

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I was watching it again... the more I watch it the more I notice that he both emphasizes that someone has to have final say, that he has it, and that he relies on a lot of people.
To me that sounds less like showing a willingness to relinquish control and more (if anything) a signal that he'd be open to shaking up the front office and bringing in more voices.
 

Manuel Aristides

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After the quotes this morning what makes you think that? For months we've been hearing he wouldn't sacrifice any personnel responsibility/power, and he just flipped that position on its head. It will have to be a situation that makes sense to Bill, and I doubt he wants to take orders from someone with a completely different approach/philosophy, but I can now definitely see him giving up final say, accepting something that's not exactly how he would do it and refocusing on different parts of the job. If it's successful he still looks like a genius.
I think we're getting slightly ahead of ourselves with what BB said. I agree, it's a different direction that had been reported. There's an opening there. But he did not say precisely what the thread title does.
I was watching it again... the more I watch it the more I notice that he both emphasizes that someone has to have final say, that he has it, and that he relies on a lot of people.
To me that sounds less like showing a willingness to relinquish control and more (if anything) a signal that he'd be open to shaking up the front office and bringing in more voices.
I concur. It's a signal that he's willing to talk about it, that he's willing to discuss who the people who weigh in are. Maybe, maybe it can be read as the willingness to give up "final say" but it's far from declarative on that point. It could be a window to find a way forward, it could be posturing.

It would be lovely if they can find whatever the answer is quickly; this is a special kind of purgatory.
 
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So he’d rather stay where he’s not wanted, in a reduced role, possibly see his kids taken off the staff by a new GM, likely endure another 4-13 type season, and completely destroy his 2025 open market value, while his kids sit in the unemployment line waiting for his contract to expire at the end of next year?
Honestly, yes. I think he is settled in here and if Kraft is willing to go forward with the status quo for the one more year on the contract I think he is saying that he would be willing to go with that.

I may have jumped the gun in saying he would accept a reduced role here in NE, but it is an indication to other teams he is willing to not be the one who "buys the groceries" if he signs on somewhere with a strong GM already in place. Putting it out before his meeting with Kraft indicates to me that he might be willing to renegotiate his role here a bit (but it may be as others have pointed out it also may just a negotiating strategy going into the meeting with Kraft to indicate he won't be playing ball if they push for compensation from other teams).
 

jacklamabe65

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An interesting side element is Brian and Steve Belichick and their families. If Bill stays as the coach, no one in their immediate family has to uproot themselves, including children. He gets to bet Shula as a Patriots coach, and I am sure that ex-Patriot players might want to join him as part of the coaching staff. Another family and personal consideration: Bill's love for Nantucket. You'd be surprised how things like that might alter the way he looks at things. I would love for Bill to return as coach, let them get a new GM who will form the bridge to the future, and let Volin and company weep.
 
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johnmd20

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An interesting side element is Brian and Steve Belichick and their families. If Bill stays as the coach, no one in their immediate family has to uproot themselves, including children. He gets to bet Shula as a Patriots coach, and I am sure that ex-Patriot players might want to join him as part of the coaching staff. For one, I would love Matthew Slater to be hired as an assistant special teams coach, but I understand that he might become a counselor or enter the faith business. This is great news if it all unfolds.
He's 14 wins behind Shula and 26 regular season wins behind. It's no lock he breaks the record but 14 is obviously in play. Two more not 2023 seasons would do it.

The regular season record will require a couple of phenomenal seasons, tho.
 

CR67dream

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Short of that Bill holds all of the cards here. If the Krafts have decided to move on from him they are going to have to own it and fire the greatest coach of all time. To me that's the takeaway from this morning.
I can just see the spin now: "A guy like Arthur Smith was given 3 years of 7 win seasons with no track record of winning, and the Pats can the GOAT 2 years after a playoff run with a rookie quarterback, and after seasons of 8-9 and only one true abomination of 4-13 this year, largely because that quarterback busted. How's that for loyalty!"

And that take will really get some juice if BB ends up in Atlanta....

Before anyone comes back at me, I'm not saying that's my argument. Mac didn't bust in a vacuum. I'm just forecasting the spin.

It would be lovely if they can find whatever the answer is quickly; this is a special kind of purgatory.
Post of the thread.
 

8slim

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He's 14 wins behind Shula and 26 regular season wins behind. It's no lock he breaks the record but 14 is obviously in play. Two more not 2023 seasons would do it.

The regular season record will require a couple of phenomenal seasons, tho.
It’s weird that in a league which largely pretends post season stats don’t occur, all the talk about the wins record is focused on the regular + post season number.

I was all for letting Bill win 7-8-9 games a season and catch Shula as a Patriot. It’s only this 4 win disaster that threw a wrench into it.
 

cshea

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I know Jman has been beating this drum. If Blank is desperate, maybe there's an opening for something and even the potential for better compensation/settlement. It is a very weak division. A vet QB could make a lot of sense. He's probably perceived as a God/Demon by the fanbase for 28-3.
This assumes Bill wants to a) leave and b) go to Atlanta. My one takeaway from this morning is Bill doesn't want to leave.
 

BaseballJones

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My take:

BB doesn’t want to leave. And he’d rather stay even if it means dispensing some of his GM duties to others. so this puts the ball directly in Kraft’s court. Does he still want BB at all? Who knows.
 

Red Averages

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I was watching it again... the more I watch it the more I notice that he both emphasizes that someone has to have final say, that he has it, and that he relies on a lot of people.
To me that sounds less like showing a willingness to relinquish control and more (if anything) a signal that he'd be open to shaking up the front office and bringing in more voices.
This was my take. Likely wants to bring in more senior voices to improve the inputs to the process, allow them to set the research agenda and ultimately take more of the research away from him so he's approving/offering suggestions rather than doing the leg work. That would allow him to focus on the coaching, while still having final say, but in more of a "go, no go" vs. let me call 30 teams to get a deal done process.
 

Dogman

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Also has the added bonus of possibly being a passive/aggressive fuck you to one or both of the Krafts, for the leaks to Curran earlier in the season, and for the all the Glazer stuff on the broadcast yesterday, which I imagine he was informed of after the game last night. I want him back, so I hope this is real. But I suspect the bolded might be closer to the mark.
Are you really taking Curran's clickbait BS article as a leak from the Krafts as truth? I've read that here too. There is no evidence to support this. Two other things posted here in the last 24 hours that were also pure BS. Bill would not be on the sideline yesterday because he was sick. BB already has a deal in place to go to LAC with Chip Kelly and tOSU coach (and Mark Levy) and the Pats will somehow get LAC's 6th (now 5th) round pick.
 

joe dokes

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I'm going to guess that "relinquish" is probably too strong a word. What the goal ought to be is to have someone he can trade ideas with.

EDIT: Oops. Posted before I read @CellarDoor and @RedAverages posts.
 

CR67dream

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I'm going to guess that "relinquish" is probably too strong a word. What the goal ought to be is to have someone he can trade ideas with.

EDIT: Oops. Posted before I read @CellarDoor and @RedAverages posts.
No oops needed. We still want to hear what you (and others) think, even if it matches what others say. :)
 

johnmd20

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My take:

BB doesn’t want to leave. And he’d rather stay even if it means dispensing some of his GM duties to others. so this puts the ball directly in Kraft’s court. Does he still want BB at all? Who knows.
Man, how could you not want Belichick as coach if he didn't have to dilute his time by being the GM too?

Feels like it's best of both worlds. Just run the show, let a new voice pick the team. Bill can give all the input he wants in that instance, I would guess.

But this team does need some new voices. It can't just be more Josh McDaniels, Bill's kids, Judge, Patricia, etc.
 

Dogman

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I take Bill's comments about still enjoying coaching this team and his comments this morning that he is open to other voices and decision makers to help the team as an indication that he will be the coach in 2024.
 

Justthetippett

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This was my take. Likely wants to bring in more senior voices to improve the inputs to the process, allow them to set the research agenda and ultimately take more of the research away from him so he's approving/offering suggestions rather than doing the leg work. That would allow him to focus on the coaching, while still having final say, but in more of a "go, no go" vs. let me call 30 teams to get a deal done process.
His individual words were a bit of a salad, but my main takeaway is that he'll do what's best for the team and by bringing this up at all, that means he'd consider alternative arrangements, including on final decision-making authority. It depends who they would bring into personnel and a 100 other things, but he's showing some flexibility, which is at least different than his position was being portrayed, projected, interpreted by most.
 

Jungleland

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How do people feel about Bill having final say, but the process (and personnel) in getting to the decision point seeing a major overhaul? I’d like to believe there’s potential for a lot of improvement even if that’s the case, but I imagine there are some here for whom the final say piece is still somewhat of a dealbreaker?
 

cornwalls@6

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Are you really taking Curran's clickbait BS article as a leak from the Krafts as truth? I've read that here too. There is no evidence to support this. Two other things posted here in the last 24 hours that were also pure BS. Bill would not be on the sideline yesterday because he was sick. BB already has a deal in place to go to LAC with Chip Kelly and tOSU coach (and Mark Levy) and the Pats will somehow get LAC's 6th (now 5th) round pick.
I'll concede a little better wording would've been that maybe he suspects someone at patriot place has been talking, wouldn't be pleased about that, and that may have been a factor in his unusually detailed answers this morning. I had my doubts about the Curran piece as well, but who really knows whether it was clickbait, or a leak?
 

TC

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Lets assume BB is okay with just being the teams coach. What potential GM is going to want to come into this situation? Who's strong enough to tell BB how it going to be?
 

jsinger121

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How do people feel about Bill having final say, but the process (and personnel) in getting to the decision point seeing a major overhaul? I’d like to believe there’s potential for a lot of improvement even if that’s the case, but I imagine there are some here for whom the final say piece is still somewhat of a dealbreaker?
I don’t want him having final say anymore. That is the dealbreaker. I’m to the point a clean break would just be better than putting another band aid on it.
 

Dogman

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I'll concede a little better wording would've been that maybe he suspects someone at patriot place has been talking, wouldn't be pleased about that, and that may have been a factor in his unusually detailed answers this morning. I had my doubts about the Curran piece as well, but who really knows whether it was clickbait, or a leak?
Given the 24 years BB has been here and how little BB and the Krafts give to the media AND the "Ignore the noise" sign on the exit from the locker room, it's a certainty Curran's article is BS and pure nonsense.
 

cshea

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Do we know what time BB is meeting with Kraft today?
We don't even know that they are meeting today. Bill just said they'd sit down at the end of the year like they always do, but didn't say exactly when that'd happen. I'd imagine today will mostly be spent doing exit interviews with the players and maybe some staff meetings.

FWIW last years weird "We're bringing Mayo back and hiring a real OC" press release came out on Thursday after the final game.
 

johnmd20

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Lets assume BB is okay with just being the teams coach. What potential GM is going to want to come into this situation? Who's strong enough to tell BB how it going to be?
There are only 32 GM jobs available in the NFL. Someone will want it.
 

jsinger121

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Lets assume BB is okay with just being the teams coach. What potential GM is going to want to come into this situation? Who's strong enough to tell BB how it going to be?
This right here. It’s not going to work. We have had 24 years with 20 plus of them great to outstanding. This isn’t going to last forever. This is the time to do it with a high pick and cap space.
 

Strike4

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My take:

BB doesn’t want to leave. And he’d rather stay even if it means dispensing some of his GM duties to others. so this puts the ball directly in Kraft’s court. Does he still want BB at all? Who knows.
This is where I am, too. He's getting older and it's less work and more time with family etc. BB is a pragmatic guy.
 

Justthetippett

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Lets assume BB is okay with just being the teams coach. What potential GM is going to want to come into this situation? Who's strong enough to tell BB how it going to be?
Most of the hot candidates are young, up and comers but that doesn't mean they don't want to come in here and be the big, swinging d*ck of the operation. It's really hard to say without knowing their personalities. The bigger issue to me is who's going to garner BBs respect, and whether he could see an effective work arrangement that would make him want to stay.
 

Cellar-Door

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ATL doesn’t seem to be all that much of an upgrade from where NE is currently.
Interesting spot. On the one hand, no QB and no top 5 pick to get one. On the other hand, loaded with offensive skill players so Bill could step in and fix the defense quick. Also probably shortlist team for all the non-draft QBs (Cousins, Russ, Fields).
 

Dogman

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I don’t want him having final say anymore. That is the dealbreaker. I’m to the point a clean break would just be better than putting another band aid on it.
We.Know.Where.You.Stand.

Please stop repeating yourself over and over and over.
 

RG33

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We all know that BB is a massive fan of the history of football and NFL films etc., I feel like today’s comments give him some leeway to accept a lesser role with personnel because in his heart of hearts, he wants to break the record with the Patriots. His comments also put the pressure on Robert & Jonathan, “I’m under contract”, to be the bad guys and fire him if they want to move on. I think, as always, it was strategic, but I do think it gives him the ability to ride off into the sunset with the Patriots if the Krafts are okay with it.
 

TC

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There are only 32 GM jobs available in the NFL. Someone will want it.
I'm sure someone would want it but would that someone be someone the Patriots want? If he's you're 5th choice that would be less than ideal right off the bat. Then the question would be how do they actually work together. I can't imagine it be smooth sailing.
 
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Lets assume BB is okay with just being the teams coach. What potential GM is going to want to come into this situation? Who's strong enough to tell BB how it going to be?
I think there's an easy solution to that (although you could certainly debate that it's not an optimal situation); Kraft would have the 'final say' on all draft picks and personnel moves.

So, although it seems like an immature / dysfunctional arrangement --- the GM would just have to 'come to the old man for the final decision' if others in the organization were a challenge to a particular decision.